Ancient Egyptian music - where is it

Subject: BS: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: GUEST,Donuel : your grateful
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 08:41 AM

I have begun composing a short piece for cello, guitar and percussion with backgrounds and Indonesian instruments via my Triton and computer.

It encompasses in a mediative fashion all the great religions starting with the Gita , Tantric Bhuddism, Judaism, Christianity , Aztec, Islam ...

What is missing is ancient Egyptian music , be it Pharoic or Aegnotin Sun God music.

The 5,000 year old song of songs is a fine guide post for Jewish themes which may have much in common with the mono theistic Egyptian sun god worship but I can not be sure.

Since the Egyptian religion is the root for 3 of the 4 major religions today I would like to get it right.

I could listen to the soundtrack of Joseph Campbell's Mythos again for some ideas but I am struck by my ignorance of the music of the great Egyptian Pharoes.

Did they notate their music??????????

Subject: RE: BS: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Purple Foxx
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 08:55 AM

Guest Donuel, The site www.greenwich.ca evidence htm may be of some interest.
The music it deals with is Assyrian rather than Egyptian but it may serve as an interesting/useful "Leaping off" point.
I have a friend who has made postgraduate study of Egyptology & I will speak to her & report back.
Good luck

Subject: RE: BS: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Leadfingers
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 09:00 AM

How come a music question is BS ??

---

Agreed.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: BS: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: GUEST,Donuel
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 09:03 AM

98% of all my posts exist here. I'm just keepin it in the family I know.

Subject: RE: BS: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 09:05 AM

Yer SLOW Leadfingers!

Subject: RE: BS: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Purple Foxx
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 09:14 AM

Apparently The University of Michigan Library have musical papyri.
However the Egptians evidently didn't notate music until the Graeco-Roman era.

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 01:55 PM

D. J. Grout & C. V. Palisca, 1988, 4th Ed., "A History of Western Music," begins with the Greek heritage. No mention of Egyptian music. I believe Purple Foxx is correct.

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 04:18 PM

I'll do some checking with my brother, Donuel. I have seen sistrums at the Egyptian Museum in San Jose, CA. I also have sheet music from the 1930's when the the "Last prayer of Akhnaton (I breathe the Sweet Breath)" was put to music. The words were translated by Dr. Alan Gardiner, originally by Amenophis IV, Pharoah of Egypt, 1358 B.C.

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: akenaton
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 05:34 PM

Coptic Music is believed to have links to the anceint Egyptians.
Coptic script being used to decipher hyroglyphs on the Rosetta Stone.
The singing of Coptic Hymns today apparently sounds like the music of Ancient Egypt.
More info
Ake

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: akenaton
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 05:37 PM

Link

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: GUEST,M.Ted
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 07:39 PM

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: GUEST,M.Ted
Date: 26 Mar 06 - 07:43 PM

An interesting area for speculation. I tend to agree with the idea that music of the present contains the elements of what has gone before, but I don't know how accurately you can reconstruct--good luck!

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 27 Mar 06 - 06:07 AM

Please let us know when we can hear this- I'm fascinated!

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 27 Mar 06 - 06:23 AM

Michael Atherton released a CD "Ankh - the sound of ancient Egypt" in 1998. It was inspired by an exhibition "Life & Death in the Land of the Pharaohs" from the National Musuem of Antiquities in Leiden, The Netherlands which came to the Australian Museum in 1998.

Michael is a composer & academic & ex-folkie, tho his membership of The Larrikins doesn't seem to be mentioned in the following Professor Michael Atherton, University of Western Sydney

google search on "Ankh - the sound of ancient Egypt"
This came from one of the sites brought up by this search. 'The CD recordings, Ankh - the sound of ancient Egypt (1998) and Melismos - music of ancient Greece (2003), deserve special mention as a realisation of music performed on original instruments'

from the website of the company that released the CD

I've owned this album for a few years now & love it.

sandra

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Kweku
Date: 27 Mar 06 - 06:33 AM

ancient Egypt had so many things in common with Ethopia.so I suggest that you take a close look too at Ethopian music.the ancient map of Ethopia covers Egypt,and Ethopia is one country in Africa which has managed to preserve much of their history and culture,in its original form.

we in Ghana,had the origins of our music from there.and since we come from that area,then there must be some similarity.eg. we have "adowa" dance which is also the same as ethopian adowa.

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Charley Noble
Date: 27 Mar 06 - 07:58 AM

It's such a broad question really. Are we talking about the music to entertain the elites; music havng to do with religious ceremonies; village music having to do with marriage, funerals, other rites of passage, not to mention work chants?

With regard to the work chants, you better believe that a team of workers wouldn't have been hauling up a large stone block for a pyramid without chanting, and probably the overseer complained that they were singing rude lyrics! There were probably similar chants for launching boats.

When I was working as a teacher in Ethiopia, 45 years ago with the Peace Corps, the work chants were still alive and well in that small rural town. I still have recording of ones used by teams of workers as they hauled up huge banana trees for transplanting; they sounded very much like a halyard shanty in a weird minor key complete with hitches and yips, and my students replied to my request for translation "But, Sir, they're not singing the right words; they're being very rude!" They used similar work songs for lifting the huge center post for supporting their lovely round houses.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: katlaughing
Date: 27 Mar 06 - 09:53 AM

There are sound sample of the above-mentioned CD at Amazon. Thanks for telling us about it, Sandra.

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 28 Mar 06 - 06:29 AM

thanks for the link to amazon, I was interested in the reviews. Some loved it, some didn't, I might take it to work tomorrow & lend it to my classical guitarist colleague & see what he thinks of it. Dunno if I'll lend it to my Death Metal playing colleague as he hasn't returned my Arlo Guthrie CDs yet.

sandra

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Purple Foxx
Date: 02 Apr 06 - 04:31 AM

Refresh.Any developments?

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Rusty Dobro
Date: 02 Apr 06 - 01:39 PM

Sailing off Aswan in a felucca, our Nubian boatmen worked to a 'call and response' chant which was highly evocative of Mississippi Delta work songs, (and also seemed a distant cousin to some British football chants!). The Nubians consider themselves to be direct descendants of the ancient Egyptians, and are extremely secretive about their language, actively discouraging outsiders (including 'regular' Egyptians) from learning it. I cannot imagine that these songs have changed a great deal over the millennia, but of course state and religious music must have been very different.

The tomb of Rameses IV in the Valley of the Kings clearly depicts two harp players, so perhaps there's a starting point there.....

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Rusty Dobro
Date: 02 Apr 06 - 01:46 PM

Whoops! As you all knew, that should have been Rameses III.

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: Purple Foxx
Date: 02 Apr 06 - 01:52 PM

Yes,yes we were all cognisant of that RD.ahem

Subject: RE: Ancient Egyptian music - where is it
From: GUEST,AJOJEDA
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 11:54 AM

I think I have a remarkable unusual clip of a woman channeling a spirit singing in front of a coffin at the Met museum in NY (and reading quite fast text written in hyeroglyphs in some other coffins). This is a true funeral chant i believe. I wish i knew an expert in this field.
What a delicate subject!

AJ
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