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BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest...
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Subject: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Bobert Date: 14 Apr 06 - 10:48 AM Well, well, well... Don't look too good for Donnie these days with 5 retired generals, most if not all, havin' served in the Iraq War sayin' that Rumsy is arrogant, won't listen to folks and has made a slew of bad decisions... So, the only question remaining is when will Bush accept his resignation? ______________________ Terms of contest: This ain't Cook County so only one vote per player... No changin' yer vote, either... That's the rules... _______________________ Prize: Other than the satisfaction of havin' Rumsy gone there is going to be a fabulous, yet undisclosed, prize... Sho nuff is... _______________________ I am now turnin' the contest over the the Wes Ginny Slide Rule so that I can ponder the situation and make my prediction... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Arne Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:24 AM I vote: "Never". Dubya won't allow it; it would hint that those foul and malicious rumours that things aren't just wine and roses in Iraq and that things didn't go exactly as planned may just have a hint of truth to them. That we can't allow. "Never give up, never surrender" says Commander Tagga... -- umm, sorry, Commander Codpiece. Cheers, |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: ard mhacha Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:24 AM Bobert, the latest BBC News has the count now at 6 Generals in opposition to Rumsfeld`s blundering in Iraq, why didn`t they consult us on this Site and we could have supplied that information a long time ago. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Ebbie Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:24 AM I listened to those generals last night and it seems an extraordinary situation to me. On the one hand we have the president who considers loyalty to be a higher good than competence and who NEVER admists a wrong decision or appointment; on the other we have high-credibility people agreeing that one of the president's appointments is wrong. It would seem impossible for the president to ignore their opinion. i have no idea of when Rumsfeld will be cut loose but it would seem inevitable. And when he's gone, surely that will initiate conversations about who else needs to go. I have great hopes for it. I love it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Arne Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:26 AM Not to mention, Dubya doesn't want to interrupt him while he's planning out the Iran invasion.... Cheers, |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Wolfgang Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:36 AM No changin' yer vote, either You have already given your vote, Bobert, long ago, and you have been wrong. Wolfgang |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:43 AM While I can appreciate there is a high entertainment value to the political theatrics of all this, the longer this war drags on the deeper my despair over the cost in human suffering as a result of it becomes. I read the piece in Time by the Lt. General (who bizarrely claimed to be a 60s counter-culture career military man), and there was plenty of machismo "sacred obligation to our military men" talk, and not one mention--not ONE mention--of the cost of this was to the Iraqi people. They don't figure into the equation now, they didn't when the planning was going. THAT IS DEEPLY DISTRESSING AND DISTURBING. So what the fuck. The generals are as knee deep in blood as the chicken hawks. They are all one and the same to me, and I ain't letting 'em off the hook this easy. War crimes trials for the lot of them. The whole god damn Pentagon. Shouldn't be called the Defense Department. Should be called the Offense Department. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: number 6 Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:58 AM I'll 'spoil' my vote ... reason being it's way too late regardless as what he does ... And as Guest mentioned ... these generals are as knee deep in blood as the chicken hawks ... also, I suspect the most recent 'general' to take to the podium isn't complaing about Rumy being in the way for the road to peace, but probably has his own hidden mandate for the solution of the Iraq mess. At this point ... it's not when Rumy will resign that's in question, but when is it going to end. sIx |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 14 Apr 06 - 12:03 PM Probably around January, 2009. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Bobert Date: 14 Apr 06 - 12:16 PM Wolfy, That was the ol' contest!!! This is the new 'n improved contest... (((grin))) Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 14 Apr 06 - 12:27 PM The other thing that truly pisses me off, is the depressing irony of it all. The fact we invaded a largely secular country, and drove it's population at gunpoint into what has become a country-wide concentration camp ruled by fanatic religious fundamentalists and despotic tribal warlords, making a tidy profit on their criminal enterprises. Creating bold new frontiers in the War on Terror (tm) to be sure. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: number 6 Date: 14 Apr 06 - 12:42 PM How can one accept a 'prize' from this contest .... my concience would bother me ... the weight of knowing there are 2,300+ sons and daughters of Americans killed and God only knows what the actual figure is of Iraqi casualties. The prize for me would to have the war end, an end to the anguish, the end to the tragedies .... Rumy if he continues or resigns or is fired th fact is it is totally irrevelant at this point in history. sIx |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 14 Apr 06 - 12:54 PM Amen to that, sIx. Anyone who doubts that ought to be forced to watch the documentary "The Fog of War" until they "get it". For good. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Peace Date: 14 Apr 06 - 12:56 PM "Rumsfeld Resignation Date . . . ..." Not fu#kin' soon enough. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: number 6 Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:00 PM "The Fog of War" ... good point Guest. Excellent documentary too. I wonder if people will ever 'get it'. sIx |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: number 6 Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:03 PM People get too wrapped up in the politics that their vision gets 'fogged' from viewing the human tragedy that results from 'the politics'. sIx |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:07 PM ACtually, I expect Rummy's resignation very soon. But I also realize it will solve nothing. It is just time to start the political election cycle bloodletting in earnest. Bush simply will not change course. We WILL see the Middle East version of the fall of Saigon on TV occur eventually. It is simply a matter of when. War winning, nation building--all a deluded, horrific machismo warrior worshipping cult folly. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Donuel Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:14 PM He will not resign until Saddam Hussein's head is finally on a stick. That could be as soon 40 days. see picture. http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/americangothic.jpg |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:16 PM Here is my prediction: Rumsfeld will be replaced in the same way that Libby was replaced. By a clone. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Ebbie Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:26 PM I am startled - Joe is involved in this? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST,dianavan Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:29 PM A resignation is not enough. He'll just emerge somewhere else and probably do just as much damage or more. A resignation is the easy way out. I'd rather see him prosecuted and sentenced for war crimes. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: number 6 Date: 14 Apr 06 - 01:31 PM Lets end the war first ... than initiate the witch hunt for war criminals. sIx |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST,petr Date: 14 Apr 06 - 02:03 PM I agree with Arne, Rumsfeld will never go, because he and Cheney are the team that are most responsible for implementing the neo-conservative (or Radical Nationalist - Chomsky prefers to call them) agenda. Rumsfeld should have been fired right after the 'freedom is messy -stuff happens' comment, and certainly after the Abu Graib scandal. To fire him now would be to admit a mistake - and thats not part of this Administrations vocabulary. Bush (as well as Blair) will forever go on insisting that the war was the right thing to do, as to admit otherwise would be a collossal mistake with blood on their hands, as it was a gift to Al Qaeda and Iran. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: katlaughing Date: 14 Apr 06 - 02:43 PM I agree with Arne and petr. To rid himself of Rumsfeld, Bush would be admitting wrong-doing...I don't think he has the Reality-Based Personality to deal with that Truth! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Little Hawk Date: 14 Apr 06 - 05:17 PM Nope. Sorry. I am not willing to date Mr Rumsfeld in order to secure his resignation. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Ebbie Date: 14 Apr 06 - 10:11 PM Little Hawk, I suggest that you resign yourself to it. The world demands it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Bobert Date: 14 Apr 06 - 10:24 PM Yeah, this isn't about politics... It's about humanity... He has to go... If he doesn't then he will kill off the Republican party and perhaps the USA in route... He and his bud, Cheney, are war criminals... The world knows it... I mean, just look at the guy... Check out the way he dresses and his the way he wears his hair... There's Nazi written all over this guy... The world don't need no Nazis in positions of power... If Bush is to intimidated by The Donnie then he should quit as well... Rumsey's departure is long overdue.... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: katlaughing Date: 14 Apr 06 - 10:54 PM In a way I hope Bush sticks to his guns, no pun intended, as the longer he holds out the worse it will be for the GOP come election time, now and in 2008. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Anonny Mouse Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:32 PM Bobert--I predict never. For all the reasons mentioned by them who also think "never." When has Dubya EVER not been blinded by his own huberis and admitted an error in judgement? Rummy leaving would "stain" him. And then there's Rummy himself--he's like Bush: never wrong, always smugly confident. Only way I see it happening is if the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, and 75% of congress stomp their way into the Oval Office and basically DEMAND IT. I wish...but I don't THINK so. --El Mouso |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:41 PM I think Rumsfeld will go. He will have to be sacrificed at the altar of public opinion, because Bush hasn't fired anybody for the war Iraq yet. In order to turn the poll numbers around, he needs to offer the American public a BIG sacrificial lamb who is tied directly to the war. The public won't settle for anything less than heavy political bloodletting, now that the war is going so badly. That can only be Rumsfeld at this point, 'cause it ain't gonna be Cheney. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: number 6 Date: 14 Apr 06 - 11:53 PM "It's about humanity... He has to go..." ... in reality what difference will it make .... Cheney/Bush will not relent on their warpath, their still in control .. whomever succeeds Rumy might be a 'nicer' guy in the public relations sense, but the mandate is still in the hands of the powers that be. The only way this war and it's inhumanity will end will be when The 'powers that be" are gone, and the only way that will happen is if the U.S. populace organizes in such a way and determination that changes the direction Washington is heading by the next elections ... albeit it warhawk Republicans, or warhawk Democrats or warhawk whatever. Or in reality .. the way the U.S. is going, it will just burn itself out into a 2nd world nation ... and that is probably sooner than one likes to beleive or even conceive. sIx |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Azizi Date: 15 Apr 06 - 12:32 AM Rummy leaving soon is too late for many people. Click http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/4/14/17917/1298 for a powerful, emotionally charged photo-dairy by occams hatchet {Fri Apr 14, 2006 at 02:09:17 PM PDT}. The diary is titled "The New Ozymandias." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Elmer Fudd Date: 15 Apr 06 - 01:13 AM Maybe someone could set up a date for him with Monica Lewinsky? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Bobert Date: 15 Apr 06 - 07:56 AM Too late for that, Fuddster... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 15 Apr 06 - 10:35 AM George will never let him resign - he knows that if they don't hang together, they will hang seperately. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 15 Apr 06 - 10:43 AM "the worse it will become for the GOP come election time...." Then what, Kat? Do you really think the Dems will do much different? (and don't answer with 'well, it couldn't be worse' because things can always get worse) And if you stop to contemplate the grand scheme of things, the war in Iraq that occupies so much of the time of so many of the people here is just one small item on the overall agenda. Immigration, welfare reform amd also a very good economy and home ownership percentage per capita that has never been equaled. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Ron Davies Date: 15 Apr 06 - 10:46 AM All the posters who say Rumsfeld will never resign are right. Supposedly he has already offered twice, and been turned down. And the reason, as others have said, is obvious--by accepting his resignation, W would be admitting that the war in Iraq is wrong, wrong from the start, and is going disastrously. He and Rumsfeld have been joined at the hip in pursuing it------from the very start. W's only chance to salvage anything from the disaster for Bushites now shaping up in the fall is to persuade his base, which is disgusted in him for a host of reasons, to come out for Bushites in November anyway. And they would never accept the sacrifice of Rumsfeld--for the reasons already cited. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 15 Apr 06 - 10:49 AM ...and "Nazis written all over this guy". Only in America can someone say that while the 'drool' is running down the side of their chin. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 15 Apr 06 - 10:51 AM They will accept the sacrifice of Rumsfeld if Dubya puts in someone else they like, and who won't do anything any differently as happened when Andrew Card and Scooter were "replaced". At this point, Republicans are even willing to sacrifice Lame Duck Dubya, just to get re-elected. The House could swing either way this year, so if the chorus of protest over Rumsfeld gets loud enough, you will see him go. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Teribus Date: 15 Apr 06 - 10:52 PM Never within the term of this Administration. Don't you lot feel a bit foolish going over this on a direct copy thread about exactly the same subject initiated in 2004 |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: GUEST Date: 15 Apr 06 - 11:26 PM No Teribus, because this is quite a rare event. Section 888, Article 88 of the military code prevents active military from speaking out against the Secretary of Defense or the Commander in Chief. Part of the checks and balances between the military and it's civilian leadership, supposedly. While retired military aren't bound by the "Contempt towards officials" article (as it is also known), it is very rare that they speak out like they did this week. And even rarer still, two of the retired generals were active duty in Iraq. And even rarer than that, the retired general who wrote the article for Time magazine (former Director of Operations for the Joint Chiefs) said he was also speaking on behalf of active duty generals. This is A Very Big Deal. And a Very Big Blow to the Bush administration. Many Republicans in Congress are going to be making waves to get Rumsfeld out now, because this is not only a serious breach of military tradition, but Pandora simply will not go back in the box. This isn't one of those "respectfully agree to disagree" honor among gentlemen sorts of rows. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 16 Apr 06 - 12:20 AM "Never within the term of this Administration." I agree with you totally Teribus, as I said, and for the reason I said. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: CarolC Date: 17 Apr 06 - 12:55 AM Sort of thread drift (but maybe not)... Can anyone guess who this is? http://www.geocities.com/squeezemusette/Who.html The picture has been doctored a bit, but I haven't added anything that wasn't already there. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Peace Date: 17 Apr 06 - 01:11 AM Looks like a real dick whoever he is. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Peace Date: 17 Apr 06 - 01:30 AM "Retired General Wesley Clark, a Democratic candidate for president in 2004, on Saturday joined six other former generals in urging Rumsfeld to resign. Army Major General Charles Swannack, Army Major General John Riggs, Army Major General John Batiste, Marine Corps Lieutenant General Greg Newbold, Marine Corps General Anthony Zinni and Army Major General Paul Eaton, all retired, also have called for Rumsfeld to be replaced." from here. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Donuel Date: 17 Apr 06 - 10:17 AM We must hang together or we will surely hang seperatly. To let go of Donald would put the Neo con plans, past and future, at grave peril. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: Ebbie Date: 17 Apr 06 - 11:16 AM It always amazes me how different the two halves of our heads are. (I gather that this one is Cheney). It just doesn't make sense to me, even though various people have tried to explain it to me. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Rumsfeld Resignation Date Contest... From: CarolC Date: 17 Apr 06 - 12:14 PM Here's the other one... http://www.geocities.com/squeezemusette/Who2.html Yup, it's Cheney. The first one is the right side of his face, the second one, the left side of his face, both from the same origianl picture. Here's the original... http://www.geocities.com/squeezemusette/cheney2.JPG |
