BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!

Subject: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Tootler
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 12:17 PM

They did it again! Came back from 3-0 down on aggregate to win 4-3 to get to the UEAFA cup final.

That means both European cup finals have an English team in.

Great Stuff

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 12:24 PM

With four Englishmen between them. ;o) Seriously, well done Smoggies. Now win it.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Tootler
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 02:27 PM

Oops! It should be UEFA. can someone amend the subject line, please.

and PinkLad, that is pretty much the story of English if not European football these days. At least there are some home grown players. Chris Riggot and Stewart Downing are both local lads.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: fat B****rd
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 02:45 PM

Yeah !! Well done The Smoggies.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 02:53 PM

I watched the game (on tv). Amazing comeback (again),          brilliant! Congratulations.

Hope you win the final.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 03:01 PM

As a Spurs fan,I'd like to join in the congratulations.

Sounded like a brilliant come-back.

Best of luck in the final - the opposition is only 11 other blokes, and football's a funny game.


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 03:45 PM

That'd be congratulations to Boro and not to Arsenal, I take it, autolycus...

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 04:33 PM

Two English teams?, Arsenal team will field an all foreign selection, Campbell is now only a bit player, and`Boro field 4 or 5 English, the Premier League is a no go area for young English footballers.
The big money clubs don`t have to rely on their nursery sides, out comes the Cheque book and a ready made star takes the place of some young hopeful.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 05:02 PM

Not half, McGrath. Mind you, I've honestly only ever been pro Spurs and not anti anybody. And it's great for football that Boro have the chance of a trophy. For the same reason, good luck to Accrington Stanley. Now there's a comeback,


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Apr 06 - 06:55 PM

Is it possible to be pro-Spurs and not anti-Arsenal? My son was at a match on a day Spurs won, and the biggest of the day was when they announced that Arsenal had just lost a match.

Accrington Stanley, that's another matter. Onward and upward.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Terry K
Date: 29 Apr 06 - 01:36 AM

ard mhacha - so you resent foreigners coming over here and taking the jobs that you think the British should have - aren't you in the wrong thread?

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Folkiedave
Date: 29 Apr 06 - 04:01 AM

Can I just point out that Sheffield United have won promotion back to theirr rightful place in the Premier league with mainly English and a number of home-grown players.

Come on you Blades............

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Apr 06 - 10:08 AM

Maybe Terry misses ard macha's point.

If the team of a club based in England, such as Arsenal, is composed virtually entirely of players from other countries who are temporarily playing for the club, it is a bit absurd for it to be represented as in some way representative of England.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 29 Apr 06 - 11:05 AM

McGrath you know the old saying, tis folly to be wise etc, it is amazing that you had to explain my point, further proof the top six clubs in the Premier League haven`t an English Mansger, need I say more.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 08:09 AM

Yes Mcgrath, I'm living proof that it's possible to be pro Spurs and not anti-Arsenal.

I never did get into an anti stance. Maybe because, after the Spurs, I supported good football and the ref becoming one myself.


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Terry K
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 10:29 AM

And no, Terry does not miss the point, he is far, far more clever than that. It was an opportunity for a tongue-in-cheek dig at those who castigate anyone who questions the uncontrolled influx of foreigners in other areas of working life. Duh, think it through guys.

Back to the point, what's all this shite about Arsenal and Spurs doing in a thread that was started to applaud a proper team?

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 11:41 AM

Today, Celtic has a northern Irishman, a southern Irishman, a Bulgarian, a Czech, an Englishman, a Welshman, a Japanese and two Poles in their team - are they a Scottish team?

Yes, fantastic achievement 'Boro and hope you win the final.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 02:19 PM

I keep reading this title as Born in the UEAFA Cup Final! Slight difference......

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 02:37 PM

The words 'glasses', 'need', 'you' and 'do' spring to mind.


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 02:45 PM

Scotlands National team have never been lower, and that is to be expected when almost every team in the top division are comprised of non-Scots.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST
Date: 01 May 06 - 06:27 AM

It's true that there are many top English sides that consist almost entirely of foreign players but,despite having been heavily involved in the foreign transfer market themselves, Middlesbrough do boast a fantastic youth programme, evidenced by last Saturdays game against Everton, when there were eight young academy players on the pitch. All these home-grown young players have a bright future in English football and, whilst it can take years for the investment in a good academy to bear fruit, Middlesbroughs'commitment to their youth policy is now beginning pay dividends.
As a lifelong Boro fan I'm still a little numb at our European success. It was the same after our Carling cup win. I'd travelled all the way back from Cardiff before it started to sink that we'd actually won!!

C-flat

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 01 May 06 - 07:04 AM

Fair play to `boro, I hope the boys come through, but I can`t help thinking that if `boro have a few million to spare it will go on a decent foreign player.
I seen a `boro side which included Roberto Ugilino, goalie, and Lindy Delephena a Trinidadian, away back in the late 1940s, this side also included the great Mannion and Hardwicke, that`s going back, and from memory I think the only trophy they had won up until the League Cup was the Amateur Cup away back in 1904?, a trophy would take the bare look of the sideboard.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 01 May 06 - 07:34 AM

I also hope 'Boro aren't to be a feeder for any of the bigger clubs.


Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST,C-flat
Date: 02 May 06 - 08:50 AM

I hope so too Ivor, but I suppose the point is that if Man U or Chelsea come courting our young talent then at least it's home-grown, rather than imported talent. Boro get a handsome pay-off, the young lad gets to play at the highest level and the English game, at grass-roots level, gets an encouraging boost!
Everyone's a winner!!
In fairness I don't have too much of a problem with foreign players earning their living here, it's been common in the rest of Europe for long enough, and I've had the pleasure of seeing the likes of Zola, Bergkamp and Juninho up close. The truth is that many clubs just follow the pack and either don't bother looking at what's on their doorstep or won't make the investment in establishing an academy to bring them on to the next level.

C-flat

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 02 May 06 - 03:58 PM

C-flat (love the name,BTW, haven't thought what I might be),


I nearly totally agree. My only jib is about Boro. Yes they get a goodly sum, but it'll remain hard for them to win/keep winning stuff for their fans if, like all feeder clubs, they keep losing top players.

Dave Mackay (the 60s Spurs wing-half) said back then, any one of half the top division, at the start of the season, had a chance of winning the league. THAT'S how it should be. The current chase between Spurs and Arsenal for 4th place is going to the wire and much more exciting than who was going to be champions this season. Who wants a foregone conclusion? Not my idea of competition. Similar applies to the Liverpool/Man U. fight, and whether Portsmouth can stay up. (Chelsea deserve to be champions, and that's a different matter)


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Wolfgang
Date: 02 May 06 - 05:08 PM

(If I wouldn't have come too late to this thread I might have been tempted to explain Terry's post to McGrath)

Long, long time ago, when I was very young, there was criticism when any German team had more players from outside of the town (or at the least from very close by) than from inside the town. A team from Frankfurt was expected to play with mostly Frankfurters (or from the surrounding villages). Then the demand was that at least most players came from Hassia (that part of Germany where Frankfurt is situated).

It is interesting to see that it looks right if a London club has out of London players but it is worth a comment if they also come from out of England and not only from out of London.

Wolfgang (backing none of the two finalists)

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST
Date: 03 May 06 - 04:28 AM

Autolycus (Ivor), I absolutely agree, and in fairness to Boro and the chairman, Steve Gibson, we're trying hard to keep our best players, but the difficulty in the past has been the lack of success. It's no good holding on to players who want to be away to a club where they're guaranteed medals.
Playing for Middlesbrough will never have the same kudos as Man.U., Liverpool or Chelsea but at least we've been able to offer European football of late, and success in the final will give our profile another massive boost which will, hopefully, give the players something to think twice about when the big clubs come calling.

Wolfgang, in the past English football was the same, drawing on the surrounding population for it's talent. The fact is that the whole population was far less mobile then, often living and working in the same town all their lives. Footballing didn't offer anything like the financial rewards it does now, so the motivation came as much from wearing your home-team colours as the pay cheque.
Whilst that may sound infinitely more preferable than the guns-for-hire present situation, the truth is that the bigger urban conurbations would always have the advantage over small towns like Middlesbrough in the same way that the rich clubs today have.

The current Chelsea tactics of buying success isn't new to football. In the 1950's Sunderland broke the players pay-barrier to attract the best talent from around the country and became known as the "Bank of England" club. There were financial scandals over illicit payments and back-handers were rife.
Sound familiar?
Interesting to note that the "Bank of England" went bust soon after!
Roman Abramovitch, take heed!

C-flat.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 03 May 06 - 07:50 AM

It wasn`t a case of Sunderland going bust, they bought some very ordinary "stars", I seen them in 1957 with some of these big money buys, the following year they were relegated with a team containing the bulk of their bought rubbish.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 03 May 06 - 02:03 PM

Wolfgang, - I'm afraid getting players from outside your area goes back a long way in England. Players were being trasferred even before the football league began in 1888. There were Scotsmen playing for Spurs by the turn of the century.

Curiously, when Spurs did the 'Double in '60-'61, they had Scots, Welsh and Irish players and at the time,I thought nothing of such things. They were Spurs players.

I think very highly of one - club players.

C-flat. I look forward to a time when more teams have ambition, and hold on to players IN ORDER to win stuff. I'm already a bit disheartened when I hear of moves by Chelsea, Man.U.,etc. for Spurs players currently, and have begun to feel what it might be like to support a club that just gets players ready for the big guns.

Really, teams drawing just on local talent is a pipe-dream now that the dogs of capitalism hasve been let loose in football. Which is stuffed full of mercenaries.

I don't know how long it'll be before fans drift away when it's obvious that the team names are arbitrary - we're close.


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 03 May 06 - 02:19 PM

Billingham Synthonia have all local lads. The local populace doesn't turn up in droves to watch them because the footie is crap. Xenophobia seems to go out the window when it comes to quality football.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 03 May 06 - 02:21 PM

To get back to basics, 'Boro have done exceptionally well to reach the EUFA final (as my team Celtic did in 2003). Unless they win it, as a "provincial" club, it's something they may never equal. Holding onto their manager may be more important than holding onto players.

As regards foreigners, there's no plot. It's about quality. Home players, like young players, will make the grade, if they are good enough.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 04 May 06 - 01:49 PM

Correct Tim, it is the same with Managers, for some reason, Scots Managers have always been to the fore and now it is foreign managers in England, any reason?.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Tootler
Date: 04 May 06 - 02:39 PM

And since the last two posts, Steve McClaren has just been appointed England Manager. That means the UEFA cup final will be his last game with the Boro and the Boro are now searching for a new manager.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 05 May 06 - 01:56 PM

I really do think England would be a better place if people ignored association football.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 05 May 06 - 04:51 PM

Big Tim - I think it too simple to say it's all about quality.


   These days iy's mostly about money.


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 06 May 06 - 04:27 AM

Ivor, why spend money on foreign players if there are enough home players of sufficient quality? The answer is think a reflection of our (UK) society. Huge numbers of our kids are lazy and obese and never take part in sport. When I was a kid, we played football every spare minute. Our people aren't hungry any more, many of the foreign players are. (It's the same in other sports, especially in UK athletics, which is currently disappearing down the tubes).

Anyway, good luck to Bora in the final.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Terry K
Date: 07 May 06 - 02:35 AM

Spot on Tim. One of the biggest influences has been the revolution in education, putting all the emphasis on academic results in the core curriculum, and making headmasters into managers of the finances of their schools. What this has done is to make the heads concentrate all the money into the areas where they are accountable by results, and sport is no part of that. So there are many schools selling off their playing fields to finance e.g. a new maths department and so on. Bloody government again!

cheers, Terry

(come back John O'Rourke and give us a goal!)

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 07 May 06 - 02:19 PM

Not bloody government, bloody governments. The selling-off of playing fields began in the 80s.

   Yes, if there's not enough talent here clubs will look abroad - I agree.

   And another reason there's not enough talent here is that, because money has become a central concern in football, clubs don't have the time (time is money) to nurture and develop talent in players; they want or should I say need results fast.

   And Boro not being able to hold onto talent they have is obviously not about talent, it's about money, the money the plAYERS DEMAND AND THE MONEY THE BIG CLUBS HAVE. (Caps by accident)


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Terry K
Date: 08 May 06 - 02:53 AM

I'm not sure you can point to many local lads who have been lost to the big clubs - part of Boro's success has been brought about by buying cheaply players who are near the end of their careers. Maybe the downfall of the academy will prove to be that, but I don't recall many young locals who were sold to big clubs recently. How far back do you want to go - Gary Pallister (albeit born in Ramsgate), Geoff Butler, Brian Clough .....

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST,Transporter
Date: 08 May 06 - 03:34 AM

Not long now
Blue skies

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 08 May 06 - 04:06 AM

Boros best player of all time?. surely the son of a Connaught man, Wilf Mannion.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 08 May 06 - 07:05 AM

Bobby Murdoch?

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 08 May 06 - 12:46 PM

To mention Murdoch in Middlesborough in the same breath as the great Wilf you would be in danger of meeting the same fate as the Hartlepool monkey, good as the ex-Celt was he wouldn`t have lived with the great Mannion.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 08 May 06 - 04:57 PM

You forgot to add, in your opinion.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 09 May 06 - 04:27 AM

Sorry Tim, and on behalf of the all of the old Ayrsome Park veterans, their opinions also.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST
Date: 09 May 06 - 10:39 AM

Terry - I just mean, don't clubs like Boro lose any players who look good, to bigger clubs?

   Rather than being able itself to capitalise ?


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST
Date: 09 May 06 - 10:42 AM

These posts are coming out as guest cos I'm posting not from my own comp.


   Ivor (Autolycos)

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: C-flat
Date: 10 May 06 - 03:22 AM

If we win tonight we're on the road to becoming one of the "bigger clubs"!
COME ON BORO!!

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Gedpipes
Date: 10 May 06 - 01:44 PM

Only an hour to go

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 10 May 06 - 05:34 PM

poo

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 10 May 06 - 06:53 PM

Hard luck to any supporters out there, just saw result. Don't follow the sport, but know it meant a lot to you. You did well getting this far, will be something to build on. Great for the club's young fans, gives hope.
Well done.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 May 06 - 08:56 PM

But didn't the Sevilla fans and the players do a splendid celebration - dancing round in a ring, and waving coloured hankies, and singing their hearts out. All they needed were a few melodions, and they could have passed as the biggest Morris side in the world.

Shame for Boro though. That was definitely a penalty.

Now to look forward to Barcelona doing the same to Arsenal next week...

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: C-flat
Date: 11 May 06 - 03:19 AM

Just a small town in Europe..........

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Shiplap Structure3
Date: 11 May 06 - 03:26 AM

Anyone win?

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Gedpipes
Date: 11 May 06 - 06:09 AM

Thanks Divis
Ged McElwee

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: autolycus
Date: 11 May 06 - 06:15 AM

What Divis said so well.

   Many commiserations from a Spurs fan.


   Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Mr Red
Date: 11 May 06 - 08:10 AM

<PEDANT> the football team may be called "the Boro" but the town is spelled

MIDDLESBROUGH

its on the FC logo </PEDANT>

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Gedpipes
Date: 11 May 06 - 08:22 AM

Quite right Mr Red and what a wonderful town it is.
Blue skies

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 11 May 06 - 11:55 AM

They couldn't have lost their manager at a worst time. I think this knocked the stuffing out of them. They didn't really look up for it, neither did McClaren. What a pity.

I blame the English media. They hounded Big Phil, this pressurised the FA, then they started hounding Steve. How could he possibly concentrate on matters in hand? In normal circumstanaces, Middlesbrough might have lost or won against Seville, but there's not four goals between them, either way.

However, congrats to Sevilla. I visited this beautiful city in January and loved it.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: ard mhacha
Date: 11 May 06 - 03:37 PM

Seville were by a long way the better side, had they taken all of their chances `boro could have been humiliated, their forwards were too fast and clever for a `boro defence that had little to offer but crude tackling.
The difference in class could be seen in a `boro team which finished in 14th place and a Seville team which could finish in fourth place in the Spanish League.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST,Jock McStrap
Date: 11 May 06 - 03:47 PM

Football as it should be played, that was how I saw it, and all of this was coming from Sevilla,thay had very pacy forwards which had a ponderous Middlesborough defence in trouble throughout.
Middlesborough did well to reach the final while beating some poor teams on the way, they can be satisfied to have gone so far.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Big Tim
Date: 12 May 06 - 02:35 AM

Yes, 'Boro played badly. Why? Surely all the fuss aurrounding McClaren had some effect.

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: GUEST,turkey
Date: 07 Dec 06 - 11:44 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Tom Hamilton frae Saltcoats Scotland
Date: 08 Dec 06 - 07:38 AM

Celtic are still in Europe, the champions league

(Celtic are a Scottish club)

(for people born outside Britian)

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Tom Hamilton frae Saltcoats Scotland
Date: 08 Dec 06 - 07:40 AM

I'm a Protestant, Celtic were mainly a Catholic club, and Rangers a Protestant club.

I just don't like football

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Tom Hamilton frae Saltcoats Scotland
Date: 08 Dec 06 - 07:41 AM

Sorry

I'm a Born Again Christian so I'm neither Catholic nor Protestant

Subject: RE: BS: Boro in UEAFA Cup Final!
From: Paul Burke
Date: 08 Dec 06 - 08:30 AM

I'm an atheist, but a Catholic atheist. Does that mean I have to support Hamilton Academicals?