Playing Guitar with Arthritis

Subject: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,Alley
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 04:43 PM

The "C" chord on the guitar is easy--for anyone else. Having arthritis in the first finger of my left hand makes the "C" chord a b----! I don't like expressing myself that way, however, it seems that I am at my wit's end. Does anyone else out there in "Mudcat World" have this problem? Had a music lesson today, and it was difficult for me to go from "G" to "C". No, I am not a beginner. I've been taking lessons for well over two years. Instead of getting better, it's getting worse. The "C" chord is the only one that gives me trouble. Thing is, you can't avoid it completely. The more I practice, the more painful it gets. Sure would hate to give up the guitar since I enjoy it so much. Just wonder how others, in the same boat, are dealing with it. Thanks for listening.   Alley

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Cruiser
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 04:58 PM

Although I do not have arthritis I exercise my fingers before playing a lot. They are basic stretching exercises and the first one includes doing "push-ups" with my index finger, similar to when you were a kid and did finger puppet movements (at least I did). I even saw a book on Mel Bay once about finger exercises for instrumentalists. I bet you can find something on the web. I also use a finger exerciser and I will post what it is called later. My exercises have all been as preventative measures and not restorative, so they may not help.

I also rub wintergreen isopropyl rubbing alcohol on the joints and the tips of my fingers before playing and sometimes afterwards.

Just a poor lame joke (sorry I could not resist):

Instead of playing guitar with Art Hritis play guitar with Art Thieme (a legend on Mudcat)

Good luck and continue to exercise and warm up before playing.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 05:00 PM

well, instead of playing C with arthritis, try a plectrum ... (sorry)..now that the smart-ass remark is out of the way -

...yeah the older I get the harder it is to make the chords. I have exactly the same problem...index finger on left hand is a little stiff and I notice it more when I try to bend it to catch the C note on the 2nd string (or G7 chord - same problem)... fortunately for me after a few minutes it seems to limber up and the pain and stiffness go away.

I wish it were the same for you. Sorry I don't have any answers, I posted only to commiserate with your condition. There will be many folks along shortly with all kinds of suggestions I'm sure - the age of most everyone around here falls on or along the "onset of arthritis" curve. Best to you.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Wesley S
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 05:04 PM

I'll assume you've seen your doctor about this. So far I havn't had the problems you're dealing with but I guess it's just a matter of time.

I'm guessing that the finger that's really giving you trouble is the C on the A string. If so I'd be tempted to just touch the string without any pressure - and mute it. At least you would hear the other strings. Not a good solution - but it's the best I can think of. Listen to your doctor of choice.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: The Sandman
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 05:06 PM

Well start taking cider vinegar and cod liver oil and glaucosamine tablets. I have it in the top of my left middle finger, get a gripmaster and keep exercising your fingers,dont stop playing,if you plsy in d major you wont have to use c major chord much.and piano type finger exercises,resting three fingers on a flat surface and move the fourth one and do this with all your fingers in turn.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Cruiser
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 05:29 PM

Another suggestion is to use barre chords where your index finger will be straight and flat against the fingerboard and no bending is required.

Captain Birdseye got the exerciser name correct: Gripmaster. I have the blue Light Tension and the red heavier tension ones. I bet the blue model would be just right because it is the repetition that matter for warming up.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: jonmac
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 05:39 PM

There are OTC preparations that are said to help creaking joints - mainly fish oils etc. (taken internally!). Gentle stretching exercises might help - but take it gently - too vigorous and you'll set yourself up for some painful weeks!
Practically I can only suggest that you try very hard to relax your hands when you are playing ... I know that I had a great deal of trouble with my hands when playing which I put down to holding the instrument badly (which shouldn't apply if you're having lessons) and to gripping to tightly / tensing my fingers. Once I'd mastered playing with my hands "relaxed" the pain vanished - and my playing improved!
Otherwise - don't use the particular chord shape - capo up and use different shapes - not sure it'll actually help though - and it will probably upset your teacher! If you're using steel strings - transfer to nylon.
Strengthen the fingers ... my teacher had me playing every note on the instrument to strengthen and increase flexibility ... don't know if it would help you ... I played (string/fret)
6/1,6/2,6/3,6/4,5/1,5/2,5/3,5/4,4/1,4/2,4/3,4/4 etc up to 1/4 - then slide up one fret and then play down 1/5,1/4,1/3,1/2,2/5,2/4 etc - then slide up a fret - play up etc.etc. until you reach the twelfth fret - then play the sequence back to the start again. Can be down as a slow meditation listening to the notes - or as a speed exercise! Whatever else it'll give your left hand a damn good work out ... but as ever - proceed with care and do stop if it starts to hurt!

Good Luck - pain killers are of dubious value and should be avoided when playing as they may tempt you to push too hard!

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 07:43 PM

Or try some other tunings...

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Cruiser
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 07:48 PM

Guest:

Please give us some examples that are specific to alleviating his condition while fretting the fingerboard.

Thanks

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Bobert
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 08:11 PM

Hey, help is on the way...

About 5 years ago I was havin' lots of pain in my right thumb and as an acoustic blues player that ain't good... I had the x-rays and all an' was diagnosed as sufferin' from arthritis in the "thumb base"...

Treatment, you ask??? A danged cast to imobilze the joint for 2 weeks... And then, maybe surgery... So, I did the cast and then slowly went back to playin' guitar... It took a couple of weeks an' I was back where I had been before the cast but...

...a few months later the pain came back and I went to the internet and read everything I could... I even posted a thread here on Mudcat an' got more info and here is what will work:

1. Salmon oil: 3000 mg per day

2. Glucosamine: 3000 mg per day

3. Chondroitin Sulfate: 2000 mg per day

4. Methylsulfonylmethane (MSM): 100 mg per day

Now if you go to www.vitaminworld.com you can purchase one pill that has #2, #3 & #4 in it and 2 a day plus the salmon oil will work!!!

I know...

My right thumb is my music and I am now 100% pain free!!!

I promise you that this will work...

Bobert

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Cruiser
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 08:27 PM

Joint Soother

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: bobad
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 08:32 PM

I've played with them Ritis boys and I'm telling you Art is the baddest of the lot.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Kaleea
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 08:58 PM

I've been playing Guitar since I was about 13, have taught Guitar for many years & YES!! I have lots of arthritis in my hands & fingers. Achey, painy, swollen, tight, cramping hands, fingers, & wrists. It can really hurt!
First, let me suggest (as above) that you ask your Dr. about a good medication to help reduce the inflammation. Some are helped by using a hot pad--yes, on your hands, or even running very warm water over your fingers. Please bear in mind that everyone's location & amount of arthritis can be different, so what works for others may not work for you. Some exercises can help one, & make it much worse for another.
   What you need to do is attempt to use less of the movement which is causing wear & tear of the joints, etc., which are inflamed. With arthritis, muscles are not the issue--inflammation, usually on joint areas, is the problem. While we do need our finger muscles working, I wouldn't run right out & get a finger exerciser too quickly, as that is for muscles, not arthritis. It's also possible that you might be able to have a physical therapist help you. Ask the therapist about a Guitar-style finger exerciser to see if it will help or not. (It was not good for me to use.) I have actually taken my Guitar & Autoharp (the instruments that hurt me the most) with me to the physical therapist for assistance with movement. The physical therapist, who also played Guitar, changed the way he had fingered G for 45 years after seeing my hands in action.
If you are hurting from changing the G to C chords, I'm wondering about your posture, the exact position of your elbow (not down on your leg!!), wrist, and fingers, as well as how you are fingering the G. Be sure to tell you teacher about this problem. God help you if your teacher is a kid who has never known joint pain.
G to C is much less irritating on my old bones because I learned how to play the G chord thus: (no index finger!) middle finger on 6th string, ring finger on 5th, pinky on 1st. (point your index finger to the heavens) In the beginning, your pinky muscles may complain, but they'll get strong pretty quickly, & most people have less inflammation in their pinkies than the other fingers. To change from the above fingered G to C, the hand does not have to bend & turn the wrist a different direction, thus drastically reducing painful movements! I always try to conserve movement, and not hold any one chord position too long.
To change from G to G7, just lift pinky & place index finger on 1st string, 1st fret. This G fingering is really much less movement (& wear & tear on joints), although some of my big, burly male Guitar students with large hands have, over the years, complained that this is hard, as they may have learned it the other way. When I compare my short stubby hands & fingers to theirs, they usually realize that if I can do it, so can they!
   Barre Chords have always been more painful for me to play, especially in recent years. But I do it anyway, cause I figure if I stop, there's no going back.
   When I play in bands, or by myself, I try to change instruments frequently so that I am using different movements, & not grinding the same old joints all the time.
I'm also interested in what others are doing to try to send ol' arthritis packin'! Good luck!

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Stewart
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 09:35 PM

The above advice (Kaleea) is very good. I also have mild arthritis in the thumb of my left hand. I play fiddle as well as guitar and recently experienced pain in my wrist and thumb. I had physical therapy for the past several weeks - my PT was also a guitar player. Stretching, heat and cold treatments, and muscle strengthing were part of the regime. Also an X-ray confirmed the mildly arthritic thumb joint. Now it is much improved, but I have to recognize the limitations in my wrist and hand movement and avoid any extremes that elicit pain. Also avoid overuse, and use a cold pack after practice if pain appears. Later, heat improves the circulation and healing. You really have to learn to live with these limitations and not push to extremes. I'm now much better and can play without pain if I don't push it.

Good luck. See uour doctor and work with a good physical therapist.

Cheers, S. in Seattle

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: leftydee
Date: 08 Aug 06 - 05:04 PM

try tart cherry juice. 4 oz (2oz x 2)mixed with 8 oz water. Yeah, I know, it sounds nuts.... thats what I thought too, but it really helps me. That with some hot water soaks followed by cold water (repeat a couple of times )and a couple of ibuprofen now and then and I'm back to playing every day. My thumb was so bad that i could not play barre chords. Now I play with only minimal discomfort on occasion. The cherry juice is $14 / bottle but well worth it

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: The Sandman
Date: 08 Aug 06 - 05:48 PM

The last comment is not daft , I suffer from gout but control it via diet. one thing that is particuarly effective for me is lemon juice, it is acid but it turns into alkaline in the body, gout is related to arthritis, it is an excess of uric acid in the body. and has a similiar effect, e g, stiffness of joints. cherries are another fruit that help to alleviate gout. ORANGES are bad for arthritis as are coffee and tea taken in excess.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,van lingle
Date: 08 Aug 06 - 06:12 PM

Anyone tried Grape juice with Certo (pectin). You can read about it at Healthcentral.com? I've been using it for a few days now. One table spoon pectin to 8 oz. grape juice. Someone told me Dr. Gott suggested it. More later. vl

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,vl
Date: 08 Aug 06 - 06:18 PM

Should have mentioned that that is my daily ration. Other recipes at the site.vl

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: The Sandman
Date: 09 Aug 06 - 07:08 AM

thanks BOBERT,andGUESTVL.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,Alley
Date: 09 Aug 06 - 11:40 AM

Just want to thank each and every one of you who took the time to give me advise about dealing with arthritis. I love playing the guitar even though I'm not that good. I've been taking lessons for three years, and should be much better than I am. I have been practicing base runs with the "C" chord hoping to conquer this very difficult reach. I guess I should be grateful that my left index finger is the only one that gives me trouble. Thanks again.

Alley

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: PoppaGator
Date: 09 Aug 06 - 12:19 PM

My arthritis in my hands was so bad that I quit playing for several years, and was only able to starrt up again after discovering, and starting to treat myself with, liquid glucosamine with chondroitin ~ this stuff. The makers of Syn-Flex contend that glucosamine (which promotes flexibility in arthritic joints) enters the bloodstream much more effectively when taken in liquid form than in tablets or powder form. I don't know about the science, but I can give the product my personal endorsement: "Works for me!"

I have a bit of a problem with my left index finger, too, but my problem is at its worse in my two pinkies. I can't completely bend either one into my fist; fortunately, I don't use the right pinky at all in my playing; however, I use the left pinky a lot but fortunately have found ways to make it work despite the chronic stiffness and soreness.

There are two basic approaches to dealing with arthritis: painkilling vs promotion/restoration of some degree of flexibility. As noted above, reliance on painkillers alone is not much help for someone striving for continued high-level performance of the joints in question, and indeed creates risk of further damage by masking pain that would otherwise prevent you from making your problem worse. Restoration of flexibility is the way to go; you can always supplement this approach by occasionally taking a few ibuprofins or aspirins or whatever ~ preferably after playing or otherwise overworking your arthritic fingers, not before.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,Alley
Date: 10 Aug 06 - 08:47 AM

Poppa Gator, What do you mean by "restoration of flexibility"?

Alley

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,weerover
Date: 10 Aug 06 - 09:35 AM

Didn't realise guitars could get arthritis...sorry!

I have arthritis as well but only my knees are significantly affected - so far. After breaking the little finger of my left hand years ago it remains slightly deformed and stiff and makes most chords a little awkward, but I never was much of a guitar player anyway. Good luck Alley, keep practising and hope some of that good advice works.

wr

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: The Sandman
Date: 10 Aug 06 - 10:44 AM

Glucosamine sulphate is more effective if its taken with curcumin, which can be found in turmeric. it is important to take glucosamine SULPHATE. rather than just glucosamine. fresh ginger is also helpful for arthritis.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: SharonA
Date: 10 Aug 06 - 07:01 PM

Alley, you could try this alternate C chord which may be easier on your aching index finger:

Index finger on 5th string, 3rd fret
Middle finger on 4th string, 5th fret
Ring finger on 3rd string, 5th fret
Pinky finger on 2nd string, 5th fret
Do not strum or pick the 6th string. Dampen the first string with the top of your palm (at the base of your index finger) so that it will not vibrate when you are strumming the chord.

(Basically, it's the 3rd-fret C barre chord without the barre-ing part.)

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,van lingle
Date: 10 Aug 06 - 08:19 PM

One alernative fingering for 1st position C is:

Middle finger on 3rd fret of 5th string- C
Index finger on 2nd fret of 4th string -E (or you can leave this one open and damp with the pad of middle finger if it gives you pain)
Open 3rd string-G
Ring finger on 3rd fret of 2nd string-D
Pinky on 3rd fret of 1st string-G

This C with added 9th can be heard on the Byrds' version of Wasn't Born to Follow and a bunch of other folky type tunes usually in conjunction with a G chord that is formed by moving the ring finger down to the 6th string,third fret- G, and the index finger down to the 5th string string, 2nd fret- B. Although it usually is heard starting on the G chord and then going to the C. It gives things a different kind of texture and you can also throw in a few hammer-ons on the bass strings. Good luck. vl

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Genie
Date: 10 Aug 06 - 11:51 PM

When I cut off the tip of my left pointer a few years ago, I was forced to learn some barre chords to play C and as an alternate way of playing G, etc.   Necessity was the mother of long overdue invention for me, as I had convinced myself (for decades) that I was physically incapable of playing barre chords.   Now I often play C that way just 'cause it sounds nice higher up the neck.

I also switched the fingers I was using for A, E, and some other chords. So now I vary that, depending on what chord I'm going to next.

I still find the old fingering for C troublesome a lot of the time because of arthritis in that same finger and in my left pinkie, but I can switch positions off and on, so my fingers don't get as tired.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,slowhand2
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 03:51 PM

I too developed arthritis in my index finger which started around the age of 44 or so after playing guitar professionally since I was 12. It's very frustrating and initially I tried many so called 'cures' and ended up wearing a copper bracelet which seemed to relieve the most pain for a couple of years. After the pain got worse I started on Glucosamine with chondroitan and that seemed to relieve it for a few years but now the pain has gotten considerably worse and the 'heberdens node' on my index finger has increased it's size and become painful to touch. I am now 52 and still playing professionally but aside from taking advil, using aspercream on the joint, still wearing copper and taking Glucosamine I'm not sure how much longer I'll be able to keep playing. For me it's not a matter of chords (which I can play relatively pain free), it's the dexterity and movement required for the complex guitar solos I have to frequently play in a night. I once booked for surgery on it but cancelled after being told there was a great chance of limited use of the finger after. Anybody got any ideas?

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: PoppaGator
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 04:38 PM

Wish I had an idea or two for you; I have problems of my own.

When I first joined Mudcat a while ago ~ almost exactly 4 years ago, when I was age 54 ~ I had just begun taking glucosamine/chondroitin and enjoying very positive results, and was happily redicovering the guitar after a couple of years when arthritis had caused me to quit completely.

In the meanwhile, I've been thought a lot of changes: a bout with cancer, a year of displacement thanksa to Hurricane Katrina, and various personal and family problems I choose not to discuss at the moment. Through it all, being able to play my instrument has been a great comfort, if not every single day, certainly as a periodic "excape" or exercise in creative self-preservation. Also, just within the last year, I've begun to "play out" (perform) for the first time in many years ~ just a monthly one-hour set at the moment, but begun with a definite intention to gradually build up towards actual paying employment, hopefully developing a source for supplemental income after retirement.

Now I'm having great doubts, because despite my continuing glucosamine regimin, my fingers are getting worse and worse.

My right hand is relatively OK ~ only the pinky is crippled, and I don't use that anyway. My picking/strummoing technique is not affected at all.

It's the left that's giving me fits. I need to use the pinky on this hand, and it hurts bad; the top joint of my left index finger is pretty painful, too. In my case, it is a matter of making chords; not so much a failure of the strength needed to hold the strings down as an inability to control positioning while exerting pressure. In other words, it's harder than ever for me to avoid damping strings that should be left open and free to ring out. I may eventually have to quit standard tuning completely and take up slide guitar!

Not long ago, I posted some blowhard opinion about choosing to restore flexibilty (via glucosamine) as opposed to simply killing pain (with NSAIDs). Now I need both; when I want to play, I take a couple of advils or aspirins even though I continue to take my glucosamine/chondroitin complex in ever-larger doses.

Worst of all, now I have to wonder how long it'll be before even this jacked-up therapy loses the battle with nasty old Arthur Eyetis.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 04:49 PM

personally I like standard tuning and drop d,.but could I suggest you consider DADGAD OR DADEAEor other open tunings

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: PoppaGator
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 05:24 PM

I love standard tuning; maybe it's just an aversion to retuning, but even though I've learned a few open-tuning pieces, with and without slide effects, I rarely practice and never perform them.

I love the blues, and the sound of slide guitar (which I can produce passably well), but somehow I find it boring to play. Go figure.

With the prospect of completely losing the use of half of my left-hand fingers, however, the time may well come when the only way I'll be able to play is as a slide-guitar player. Crippled as my left pinky might become, it should still function as an essentially dead hook on which to hang a slide.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,Ian cookieless
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 05:36 PM

Alternative open tunings *can* mean, if this is what you need, less work on the left hand (presuming you're right handed) and some beautiful non-standard chord voicings. You could experiment with open G (bottom to top: DGDGBD), G6 (DGDGBE), or open D (D.A.D.Fsharp.A.D). Good luck.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: PoppaGator
Date: 26 Apr 07 - 06:15 PM

You're right, Ian; even without the slide (which is the ultimate "crutch" for eliminating strain on the left-hand fingers), alternate and open tunings often create opprtunities to play with fewer fingers and easier fingerings than standard.

I can play a few basic slide-blues riffs in open G and open D (or E), just enough to bore myself to death through a few repetitive choruses of basic 12-bar blues.

Beyond that, I have a "repertoire" of exactly three songs in open D, each with a very different "sound" from the other two, and only one of them utilizing the slide. They are, all three, much easiler on the left hand than most anything I play in standard:

~ Mississippi John Hurt's "Payday," a blues-ish country folksong that is not "Delta" style, not played with the slide, and not in 12-bar format.

~ The Paul Brady arrangement of "Lakes of Pontchartrain," which has a sort of "DADGAD-like" Celtic sound. (I'm still having trouble playing and singing this at the same time. Brady capos up four frets; I have trouble vocalizing the high notes even with no capo at all.)

~ A slide-guitar version of the old spiritual "Twelve Gates to the City" that I learned from the great master Fred MacDowell way back when I had the opportunity to meet him back in 1968. It's not in 12-bar form, and is definitely not "devil's music" blues, but it shares a very sharp and eerie sound with the bluest of hard-core Delta blues.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: The Sandman
Date: 27 Apr 07 - 06:34 AM

re your version of lakes of pontchartrain,try paying it in drop d,but have your bottom note c,g c f a d.the whole guitar down a tone,the high notes will be easier.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,Robin
Date: 29 Oct 07 - 12:35 AM

try rubbing alcohol mixed with fresh lemon juice

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Jim Krause
Date: 29 Oct 07 - 12:46 AM

The "C" chord on the guitar is easy--for anyone else. Having arthritis in the first finger of my left hand makes the "C" chord a b----! I don't like expressing myself that way, however, it seems that I am at my wit's end. Does anyone else out there in "Mudcat World" have this problem?

Yes, I have some minor difficulty with the C major chord, too. And that was what led me to seek medical treatment. In my case I was finally diagnosed with psoriatic arthritis. I'm still seeing a rheumatologist [sp?]. I hope you'll be doing better soon.

Jim

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: van lingle
Date: 29 Oct 07 - 11:40 PM

Jim, I had surgery on my lefthand thumb about 2&1/2 months ago and haven't been able to play much in standard tuning with all it's barre and multi-finger chords. I've found in DADGAD,which has been mentioned up the page a few times, I'm able to play lots of interesting 3,2 even one finger chords and there are at least a couple of options for a 1st position C that doesn't involve the index finger.Good Luck.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Mr Red
Date: 30 Oct 07 - 04:36 AM

try rubbing a little neatsfoot oil on your hands. A little goes a long way - and let it dry a while. For the cost of the oil it is worth a try. I have seen one person who hadn't played for a couple of years succeed for a tune or two. Get the sort that is packaged for horsey things which has a nice smell - the raw stuff doesn't.

It is a Black Country (UK midlands ish) trick and I suspect it was discovered by ostlers. Regular applications of course.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,Todd
Date: 27 Mar 08 - 11:10 PM

I just turned 50. I played bass since 5 and professionally for 30 years, and I rip. I retired and went from playing bass to playing lead guitar. Since then (2 years ago) I've had problems and they're getting worse. My knuckles get so bad I must stop playing for a couple days. String bending takes a real toll! Bass playing has little string bending and mostly is just pressing down on the strings. I end up getting the claw hand and it hurts bad to pry open my hand suddenly. I call it the curse! Exercises just puts more wear on the joints. I tried stuff called Oscal, but it didn't help. I also used some creams to no avail.

I'm going to try the Syn-Flex mentioned above in a post. http://www.easysource.com/synflex/syn_info.htm It seems to have a lot of ingredients mentioned by others.

I'll reply in a month or two and let yall know if it helps.

Peace

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,iancarterb
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 01:59 AM

Personally I swear by the glucosamine (which I started taking for a bad knee and realized it didn't take so long to warm up) and warming up with SLOW scales, and the gripmaster is good too, but I have a friend who swears by (presribed) ONE aspirin a day to keep under control the arthritis he's been holding off for 20 years.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: banjoman
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 06:39 AM

There's always a way to get round most problems. I had surgery on both wrists a couple of years ago to combat?? Carpal Tunnel Syndrome which caused me very painful problems both with guitar and banjo. Didn't do that much good but I believe that if you have some mobility in a joint, then keep using it or you may lose it.Lots of the advice above re medication/ embrocation etc is good, but keep playing. I find that adapting my banjo style to using just thumb and one finger of right hand meant I can keep playing. I also tune my guitar to open tuning so I can play using less fingers - very much in banjo style.
Keep plaing and good luck.

Pete

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: mattkeen
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 07:25 AM

You could try playing in an open tuning (G or D probably) and also try using different chord inversions so that you are not using the same shape all the time.

I am interested in the Gripmaster type idea - I don't understand how this could help me as the arthritis I suffer from is basically "rust" made worse by repetitive strain. So how does more working of the joints help? Genuine question, not trying to be a smarty pants

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 10:22 AM

I've had one guitar lesson in my life. The teacher knew that I just wanted to be sure that I wasn't doing anything harmful to myself, having been self-taught.

When I told him that I had trouble with the C chord he said, 'You're not supposed to play C on the guitar.' Now this was a man with tremendous skill. I decided he knows what he's talking about.

'You're not aupposed to play C on the guitar.' The guitar was not designed with that chord in mind. What relief that brought me!

He did point out a helpful thing - the index finger can swivel sideways and towards the thumb, so that it's possible to press a string with the side of the finger alongside of the fingernail.

My fingers are so skinny this isn't much help, but to someone with more flesh on the fingers, this could be helpful.

===
Here's another approach. Play an Am chord. Now lift your ring finger. You have a C chord on the highest four strings of the guitar. Often, this is all you need to get by.

====
I play early music and Celtic music with a group of friends. When I come across a good tune in C, I enter (or download) it into Noteworthy Composer and change the key. It's better for the guitar and the flutes, makes no difference to the harps, and is okay for recorders.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: DonMeixner
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 11:11 AM

I don't have arthritis in my hands as yet. I expect to in time but just now I am free of that issue. I do have some partially frozen joints due to scar tissue as a result of a table saw injury. These scars limit my extension as well as retraction in the index middle and ring fingers of the left hand.

I was a full length guitarsist for years after the injury but in the last 2 or three my limitations have become worse. I have discivered the key of "G" and the capo. G D Em D7 Am A A7 B7 are all compact chords that span two frets and except for the G are in two frets and no more than three adjacent strings. The required C chord is less an issue tthan others when capoed. The Bm is a problem but playable or when possible I subsitute a D major and in many cases this works fine.

The problem I addressed was which was more important to me. Playing the guitar or singing and communicating a song.

Don

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Bearheart
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 01:21 PM

Speaking as a massage therapist and musician, I have dealt with problem from both perspectives (though I don't play guitar).

I have found the Blood type diet and related information very useful.

For Blood type Os and Bs especially, but also for some other folks, gluten from grains can be very damaging to the joints as well as often causing celiac problems. According to my uncle's doctor (who was treating him for shingles), 40% of all people of northern European ancestry are gluten intolerant. there are substances in certain foods called lectins which cause damage to various tissues in the body and they are Blood type specific. Glucosamine is effective for joint problems because it blocks the lectins that affect the joints. But if you reduce or eliminate wheat (the main culprit for most people) you aren't putting the lectins in your body to begin with. As someone else said, coffee is another substance that exacerbates the problem.

I discovered this almost 10 years ago. At that time I was beginning to get severe arthritis in my left elbow. About 6 months after it started, I quit wheat, corn, and coffee cold turkey.In two weeks I was painfree without taking anything for it.

I am now 54 and aside from the effects of a severe injury to my right thumb joint which is aggravated almost daily by my massage work, I am not suffering to speak of at all. I still avoid those substances most of the time, and I occasionally take glucosamine, and I sometimes do hand stretches (which as someone already mentioned, are very beneficial). However, I am able to do lots of vigorous gardening work and all the other stuff I do (living in the country and being pretty self-sufficient.) I really believe my eating habits have made all the difference for the strength and health of my hands.

Also as a side note, aspirin and iboprophen have lots of bad side effects for most everyone, especially if taken on a long-term basis.
If you want to help yourself with the pain, topical herbal preparations are your best bet-- Tiger Balm and such-like. If you experiment you'll find something that works.

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: David C. Carter
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 01:34 PM

You might like to try this:

3rd finger on 6th at 8th poss.
2nd finger on 5th at 7th poss.
2nd finger deadens the D string.
G is played open.
4th,or pinky on 2nd at 8th possition.
Top E played open.

Good luck

David

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: Escapee
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 03:05 PM

My answer doesn't actually address your question head on, Alley, but you might consider a banjo. At least the way I play, it requires less force from the left hand and the neck is much smaller. With the standard G tuning, there are simple one-finger barre chords all over the neck. I have occasional flare ups, but I just take more pills for a while. Not a good long term strategy,as has been wisely pointed out. Good luck with it.
Fair winds,
SKP

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: PoppaGator
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 04:23 PM

I can trace my own degeneration over the last couple of years, reading through this thread. I brought my knobby old fingers back from the dead 8-10 years ago when I discovered glucosamine, and bought myself several years of regeneration. I fact, I had quit playing my guitar completely, and was able to pick it back up.

Now I've been playing pretty regularly, almost daily at home, and have even begun to play "out" after a 35+ year layoff. However, my fingers are giving out again, especially the left pinky. It won't band backwards anymore, which means that a basic favorite barre chord is now absolutely impossible for me: the Bb (114441) and inversions up the neck.

What really sucks is that many aspects of my playing are much better than ever, my musical understanding, and even mind-to-hand coordination. But there some things, an ever-increasing number of things , that the hands just can't do any more. I guess it's like what happens to athletes around age 35-40 -- the will and know-how are still there, probably better than ever, but the body just breaks down.

I went to a doctor not long ago; she had nothing to say except to keep on taking the glucosamine and to pop NSAIDS as necessary. (Nothing I wasn't already doing.) I had hoped that there would be some kind of steroid or something that might help. I'd take it, wihtout hesitation, assuming the cost would not be prohibitive. After all, we're not talking about cycling ~ no authority is going to drug-test me after a good performance. Well, not for steroids, anyway...

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: GUEST,Chicken Charlie
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 06:37 PM

Realizing that GuestAlley may not check this thread, given that it started in ought-six, I have two suggestions:

Medically, I second the glucosamine idea, although it's been getting mixed reviews here on Mudcat.

Musically, I suggest trying an alternate tuning like open G, which is
DGDGBD. Majors are straight barres, which still takes some effort but the forefinger will be straight and you can lay the middle finger over it and press with both. (G is open; C is across 5; D is across 7)

Sixths and sevenths can be pinkied on to the high D string two or three frets above the barre; like 777779. If you want more chords in that tuning, buy yourself a simple banjo chord chart, because standard-tuned banjo is also an open G. (I use that idea myself, not because of arthritis, but because I can then play songs scored for banjo on my guitar or my dobro, and get a better sound.)

If you play in a minor key a great deal, then tune the B down to Bb:
B-G-D-G-Bb-D. But remember if you want to play a major chord while in that minor tuning, you have to finger the B-string one fret above where you otherwise would.

If your voice is such that you're in C most all the time, you could tune to an open C, which could be E-G-C-G-C-E. If you go that route, you're on your own for chord forms, but if you chose to pursue that avenue, I'm sure you can find forms somewhere.


CC

Subject: RE: Playing Guitar with Arthritis
From: peregrina
Date: 28 Mar 08 - 09:59 PM

Newtone strings has special extra low tension strings. Each string can be tuned to the same tuning with less tension than the usual tension reuired for that note/gauge.
Thus to play any given note or chord requires less pressure. They say somewhere that all their strings require less tension, but these extra low tension ones are described part way down the guitar section of their website.