Children and religion

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Oct 06 - 09:08 PM

Oh, I see...

Well, there are quite a few Gods and Goddesses in various traditions that do symbolize attributes of character. This is the case in Hinduism, the Greek and Roman pantheons, and a number of others. The Aztecs and Mayans also had different gods to represent various things...such as a god of war, for example.

Then you have the monotheistic religions where a great many attributes are assigned to one ruling God...while various saints and Angelic figures under that God tend to specialize in certain attributes that stem from that one God. Oddly enough the Judeo-Christian faiths claim to have only ONE God...but...they really have two! The "good" God...God/Jehovah. And the "bad" God...Satan...who is, of course, seen is "smaller", so speak, than the "good" God.

This is just plain silly, in my opinion. A transcendent One God either encompasses everything...or he/she/it doesn't. You can't have a dichotomy in a one-God system.

But that's just my opinion... ;-) It's worth slightly less than a pinch of salt in the grand scheme of things.

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: BuckMulligan
Date: 07 Oct 06 - 08:42 AM

I recommend that you don't even try to wrap your mind around the concept of "trinity." (I can't)

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Oct 06 - 02:04 PM

The concept of a trinity is fine with me....for this reason: We live in a physical world of 3 dimensions. I think that has much to do with religious notions of the trinity, which again is symbolic. A static object (like a stool or an airplane, for example) needs at least 3 legs to stand on. A family is a trinity: mother, father, child. Material things exist in a trinity: solids, liquids, gases. Is it at all surprising, given these things, that people would theorize a triune aspect to God as God relates to Creation? Not to me it isn't.

All numbers have significance in sacred traditions. If you posit the idea of God at all...then you are assuming that everthing derives from God, including numbers. You begin with "1"...a seamless unity (before the Big Bang?). The one divides itself into "2", and you have light and darkness...which means you can now see opposites! Major occurrence! The light and darkness interact, and you have progeny....(that is, physical things come into existence)...and there you have your worlds of 3 dimensions.

That's one way of interpreting it.

The ancient Hebrews had the odd idea of taking the trinity (Father, Mother, Child) and officially editing out the female portion and turning it instead into an indeterminate, genderless thing called the "Holy Spirit"! Heh! They must have been VERY patriarchal indeed. I think they went astray there with their symbology. God, to be God at all, must combine the masculine and feminine aspects in an equal fashion.

My opinion, again... ;-)

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: BuckMulligan
Date: 07 Oct 06 - 04:25 PM

actually there are at least four dimensions (duration) and string theory postulates many more, possibly an infinitude of dimensions available in the physical world. I don't think the holy spirit is really a hebrew concept, is it? What amazes and amuses me is the sophistical gymnastics the "church fathers" (Athanasius particularly) indulged to justify a multiplicity of deities in a "monotheistic" cult. It's a "mystery" indeed.

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Oct 06 - 04:38 PM

Yeah, there's the 4rth dimension of time, as you say. It's a bit different, because it isn't tactile or physical in nature. There may yet be further dimensions. The Hindus also believe that there is one transcendent God or Divine which is inclusive of all and is inexpressible, and then they have pantheons of gods and goddesses and demons and so on under that...all of which represent various parts of the whole.

I haven't read Athanasius, so I can't comment on that.

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: Mrrzy
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 02:42 PM

Back to the thread: what about not getting children vaccinated, or not letting them learn real science? The Intelligent Design movement in particular (FYI, this is the latest American christiofascist attempt to get creationism taught alongside if not instead of evolution in science classes) has me very worried. Not to mention the latest mumps outbreak here at UVA...

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 03:33 PM

Oh, I've got some books here about the dangers and historical misuses and screwups of vaccination that would put you in a total nervous collapse, Mrzzy. ;-) You have not even BEGUN to worry yet.

Subject: RE: Children and religion
From: GUEST,winterbright
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 10:41 PM

I've only just tuned into this and don't have time to read through all the dialogs. However, as a religious educator (Unitarian Universalist), I often recall a story about someone showing their garden to a guest who believed that children should be left to determine their own religion when they were "old enough". The garden was thickly overgrown with weeds. "I'm just letting the garden determine for itself what it wants to be without imposing my thinking on it," was the host's statement.
The point of this (which I hope I haven't garbled with imperfect quoting) is that if parents don't influence their children, then everyone and anyone with whom they come in contact WILL!
Children will most likely decide for themselves what they believe as they grow up, no matter how they were raised. Their beliefs may change over time. But we need to give them something to work from, otherwise they are fair game for anyone who tells them "I know The Way."
One of the things I love about being a "UU" is that no-one in our (widely varied) churches will tell you what you have to believe. It is up to the individual to seek truth and meaning for her/himself. It's not for everyone - but it works for some of us.
The hardest thing, though, for me to get across to the kids I work with is that we need to respect the beliefs of others - even if we disagree with them. Most churches do not tell their children that.

That's all. I may or may not not get back to this thread again, but I sure appreciate the forum format.
Pat G.
Brunswick, ME