BS: Give em shit, Canada

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 02:20 PM

BB, I am chilled out. Dickey started many weeks back slagging Canda, never made clear that what he said was directed at the Canadian government--left it open that he meant all Canadians. So, IMO he should go fuck himself. I despise him and will continue to do so. It's not hatred as one might know it; it is, rather, an intense dislike for someone who started a war intentionally. Please spread the admonitions around evenly. I know I am causing trouble with this. Thing is, I didn't start the trouble. So leave it at that, will you? Thank you.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 08:54 AM

Peace regularly goes out of his way not only to make it clear that his animosity to the US administration does NOT extend to the American people generally, but to express his fellow-feeling for Americans ...

Whether he's over-reacting here, I don't know; honestly, I can't be bothered looking back through the thread to form an opinion (I have been following it, but the thought of reading through it all again makes me feel sad and weak and like I need to lie down. And I'm already half-prostrate in my easy-chair).

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: beardedbruce
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 08:38 AM

Peace,

Chill out.

There are attempts here every day to slag the US, but we are supposeded to take it as constructive critiscm. Perhaps one should expect others to treat one's country as one treats the other's.


8-{E

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 02:08 AM

Wow. YOU are a genius.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 01:53 AM

Yeah, that's where shit comes from.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 01:14 AM

Fuck off, asshole.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 01:07 AM

Tell me where Canadian shit comes from.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 12:59 AM

You ain't seen the half of it yet.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 12:57 AM

Two mean sprited people.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 14 Apr 07 - 12:46 AM

"I could but I will not because such a thing is mean spirited and I am not a mean spirited person."

Bullshit you're not. Look back on your posts. And fuck you for your remarks about my country. You want to slag my country's government, I will help you do that. You slag Canadians, and as far as I am concerned, you can kiss my ass, yesterday, today and tomorrow.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 03:38 PM

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 03:02 PM

"you are knowingly quoting misinformation" That is your assertion.

On Feb 7 you were informed that they were citizens and given a source but after two nonths you still insisted I was wrong. Can I accuse you of knowingly quoting misinformation and therefore a liar?

I could but I will not because such a thing is mean spirited and I am not a mean spirited person.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 02:51 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 02:25 PM

As you know, from the first post, I was referring to Harper's remark.

"Now I understand that the United States has requested that Canada not push the United States to amend its records for Mr. Arar.

Canada fully understands, appreciates and shares the United States' concerns about security.

However, this government – the government of Canada – has every right to go to bat for one of its citizens when the government believes a Canadian is being unfairly treated by another country."

In regard to the five Iranians. Yes, when you post old information that has already been refuted, you are knowingly quoting misinformation. Its either a lie on your part or you are just lazy.

I think you are both lazy and a liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 02:07 PM

The circles are caused by your refusal to answer. You drum up excuses for not answering and try to discredit the person that asks.

If I were to say such a thing it would be a lie. If you say it it does not matter because it was said 2 months ago.

For example the US military said an Iranian visited the 5 Iraninas detained by the US in Iraq. Then they corrected it
"On Wednesday, US military spokesman Major General William Caldwell told reporters that a team from the International Committee of the Red Cross met the five detained Iranians and that one of the visitors was "an Iranian."

But on Friday, the military clarified that no Iranian had been in the ICRC team that visited those held.

"The ICRC committees that visited the five Iranians detained in Irbil on two occasions did not contain an Iranian national," military spokesman Lieutenant Colonel Christopher Garver said in a statement.

"One of the two committees contained an individual who speaks Farsi and lived in
Iran, but he is a British citizen by birth.""

You said that was a lie.

I don't think you have the facts you need to direct other people to give shit to America and you ignore similar behavior by the Canadian Government. If you read the Arar report you will see that things were hevilt redacted for security reasons.

While I can't say it is true, I think it is possible that The Canadian officials directed that Arar be sent to Syria. If not. why wouln't they ask for him to be sent to Canada. If they did ask for him to be sent to Canada and the US refused they would certainly say so.

"...But buried deep, in most stories at least, is what the public isn't seeing. Sprinkled throughout the public version of the report are more than 50 sets of three asterisks. Each set represents an omission -- a decision by the government that the hidden words could damage Canada's national security or foreign relations.

And those are only the visible cuts. O'Connor had already stripped the public report of any material he thought represented a threat to national security. That material was bundled together with the public report to create a second, private-eyes only, document.

But the government demanded O'Connor go further. Before the public document was released, officials made 53 additional cuts..."

http://thetyee.ca/News/2006/09/22/ArarReport/

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: GUEST,Ding dong
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 10:58 AM

If you keep feeding him he will keep coming back.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 02:00 AM

My post from Feb. 09 - "It appears that they may, in fact, be citizens. It was my understanding that they were landed immigrants. In any event, there cases are being investigated separately from Arar's and hopefully we will find out why the Canadian government felt justified in sending them to Syria."

You do like to go around in circles, little Dickey! That was over 2 months ago. Did you know that perseveration is a sign of arrested mental development?

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 13 Apr 07 - 01:32 AM

Dianavan: Are they Canadian citizens or not? Maher Arar says they are. Amnesty international says they are.

"Mr. Almalki, a Canadian citizen, holds a high school diploma from Lisgar Collegiate and an engineering degree from Carleton University. His five children -- he has another due in January -- have grown up in Ottawa. He wants answers for them and for Canadian Muslims like them."

http://www.canada.com/ottawa/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=09fc9e93-5de7-4e3f-8a3e-1c12ef67f3fb

"CBC News has learned that Muayyed Nureddin - a Canadian citizen"

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2004/01/14/nureddin040114.html

"Ahmad El Maati is a Canadian citizen, originally from Egypt"

http://www.cbc.ca/thecurrent/2006/200612/20061213.html

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 12 Apr 07 - 01:19 AM

You're right, Peace. He's come full circle and is just spinning his wheels.

Later...

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 10:56 PM

As I said . . . .

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 10:55 PM

Dianavan:
"Dickey - How many times do you have to be told that the incident of the three others (aside from Arar) is now before the courts and that they are not Canadian citizens. You are comparing apples to oranges."

Maher Aarar website:
"Unfortunately this has already happened to three other Canadian citizens: Abdullah Almalki, Ahmad El-Maati and Muayyed Nureddin. The similarities between their cases and mine are striking. We were all detained at the same branch of the Syrian military intelligence, tortured by the same people and asked questions that would be of interest to Canadian police and security agencies. It is my hope that the government acts on its promise and holds an independent review of their cases, as recommended by Justice O'Connor in his report."

Evidence Grows That Canada Aided in Having Terrorism Suspects Interrogated in Syria
By CLIFFORD KRAUSS New York Times

"OTTAWA, Sept. 14 - A judicial inquiry here is turning up evidence that Canadian police and intelligence agencies solicited and used information that was obtained from at least four Canadian citizens Leading rights campaigners say they are dismayed by evidence of what they characterize as a Canadian policy of condoning the torture of citizens while pressing for human rights in other countries...
The evidence raises all sorts of troubling questions," said Alex Neve, secretary general of Amnesty International Canada. "The concern is, do we have a Canadian version of the notorious American practice of extraordinary rendition?"..."

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 03:39 PM

Kinda like feeding the monkeys at the zoo - you know you're not supposed to, but it's too much fun to resist!

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 02:43 PM

Dickie is the ultimate shithead. Why keep feeding him?

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 02:29 PM

The trouble is, meself, they might have trouble crossing the border.

They might be shipped to Syria and tortured because the guy who signed as a reference on their rental agreement may have been raising funds for Hezbollah or some other 'terrorist' organization.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 02:17 PM

There go another bunch, on skates this time - heading south!

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 01:59 PM

Saud Arabia: woman selected to hone her leadership skills in US

25-04-2006

By Maha Akeel

JEDDAH, Arab News — A Saudi woman has for the first time been chosen to participate in a US State Department program that seeks to offer an opportunity for women leaders to interact with Fortune 500 companies.

Soha Aboul Farag is a banker with 17 years of experience. She was chosen out of ten candidates from the Western Region to participate in this one-month program. She will join 25 others from around the world in the program that kicks off on April 30 in Washington...."

http://www.muslimnews.co.uk/news/news.php?article=10956

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Donuel
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 01:52 PM

On Little Mosque on the Prarie I heard a funny line

father: you look like a protestant in those clothes!
daughter: Dad, you mean prostitute.
father: NO I meant Protestant.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 01:47 PM

Life's funny for Muslim mom
By Joey Bunch
Denver Post Staff Writer
Article Last Updated: 05/18/2006 03:31:16 AM MDT

Castle Rock - Rubi Nicholas' life is a sitcom waiting to happen: a working mom, a stay-at-home dad, two precocious kids, a Muslim family trying to fit into a white neighborhood in a post-9/11 world.

She would be the star, of course, but the TV deal would bring America's newly crowned "funniest mom" a new set of co-stars..."

http://www.denverpost.com/frontpage/ci_3835288#

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 01:24 PM

Watch out down there! I just saw a tobaggan-load of Muslims coasting full-tilt toward the border!

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 01:23 PM

U.S. Muslim Women Weigh Anti-Islam Firebrand
Run Date: 07/16/06
By Brenda Gazzar
WeNews correspondent

LOS ANGELES (WOMENSENEWS)--Wafa Sultan believes she turned a new page in Islamic history with just six words.

While debating an Islamic sheikh on an Arab news network last summer, and growing incensed at being repeatedly interrupted, the feisty Syrian-born writer and activist said she had no choice but to scold him sternly in Arabic: "Shut up! It is my turn."

"It is by itself a message to Muslim women," a passionate Sultan tells Women's eNews during a meeting in the brightly colored living room of her home near Los Angeles. "It is time to stand up and tell your men shut up . . . because you have been making decisions for me for 1,500 years."

The 48-year-old brunette with a commanding voice has sparked intense interest in the West for her outspoken criticism of Islam, the world's second largest religion.

While Sultan's focus on women's issues has received less attention in the West, she considers it one of her top priorities. Sultan argues that women in the Middle East are hostages to their religion and culture and believe they are less than men. The most bothersome thing, she says, is that "they are slaves, but they believe they are free."

Sultan--who describes herself as simply a secular human being--says she hopes to become the "savior" of Muslim women.

But few Muslim women would welcome such a rescue attempt, says Sabiha Khan, a 28-year-old Muslim woman who recently finished a five-year stint as the spokesperson for the Council on American-Islamic Relations of Los Angeles. Khan says that while Sultan may have captured the attention of Western media many Muslim women consider her mistaken and irrelevant to their community.

"I don't believe I am less than a man," says Khan. "I am not a slave. I am a very educated Muslim woman who believes in her religion with all her heart." Millions of Muslim women feel the same way, she added...."

http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm?aid=2834

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 01:16 PM

Saudi Woman Joins NASA

The first Saudi Arabian citizen to work for NASA in the United States is a woman, reported the Kuwaiti paper Alseyassah July 18. Machael el-Shamemre, 22, just graduated from Florida Institute for Technology in Melbourne, Fla., with a degree in astronomical engineering. Shamemre will work in a team producing a rare and precise weather satellite for meteorological information.

"I will do my best in order to show the world that the Saudi Arabian woman is capable of doing a great job in different fields of work for her strong will and her ambition," Shamemre said. "I want the girls of my country to know that nothing can stand in front of their success as long as they want to prove themselves within their traditions and their religion."

http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm?aid=2834

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:55 PM

Michigan County Pool Allows Muslim Girls to Cover Up While Swimming
Himadree Himadree, Delhi, INDIA

Perhaps this is for the first time ever in Michigan that a girl from Muslim community has led to a change in the general laws of the recreation centre.

14-year-old Jumanah Saeedeh is just like any another teenager. She likes doing everything like her peers but the only difference is that she is a Muslim girl and likes to wear the hijab.

A student of seventh grade, one day Jumanah went for a field trip along with her classmates to a public swimming pool. Since she believed in the rituals and practices of Islam religion, she wore fully covered dress and she dived into the pool donning her hijab.

Nevertheless, Jumanah's action was rebuked by the park supervisor, saying that is was against the policies: she can't swim in her 'street clothes'.

At that point, the young girl couldn't retaliate but soon she approached the influential Muslim leaders, and a civil rights attorney.

Ultimately, this girl won her game as for the first time ever a public pool changed it laws so that it can accommodate more girls like Jumanah who want to adhere to their religious sentiments even while going for a dive..."

http://www.themuslimwoman.org/page/7/

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:53 PM

Just like the Mexicans do.

And all this stuff was posted by Muslims so they must not be to worried about alleged abuse by the US.

Exclusive swimming pools for Muslim women in the U.S.

This might come as a surprise to everyone but it is a 'dream come true' for Muslim women across United States. Recently in New Brunswick NJ., exclusively for the Muslim women community, the Cook/Douglass Recreation Center pool threw open its swimming pool.
Large number of women along with their daughters are flooding the recreation center every Sunday. They come down all huddled with their swimsuits and other accessories, with a stylish gym bag hanging down their shoulders...."

http://www.instablogs.com/tags/muslim-women/3/

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:32 PM

Thanks, meself. "...life is much, much better for Muslims in the US than in Canada!"

I was wondering what Dickey was trying to say.

I suppose I could cut and paste more articles about the number of Muslims being tortured and held without charge by the U.S. but what's the point? Dickey is quite sure that the U.S. treats Muslims better than Canada does.

But, of course, the world knows differently.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:26 PM

That proves it: life is much, much better for Muslims in the US than in Canada! Thank you, Dickey, for the trouble you took with the cut-and-paste.

Don't let the word get out, though, or all our Muslim citizens are going to be sneaking across the border to get out of this frozen gulag and into the Land of the Free.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:19 PM

I left out one souce for the last post: http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?c=Article_C&cid=1170877836397&pagename=Zone-English-News/NWELayout

Canadian Muslims Face on Campus Racism

By IOL Staff

CAIRO — Canadian Universities are failing to accommodate the needs of Muslim students or tackle the chilly climate of discrimination they face, according to a new report by the Canadian Federation of Students (CFS).

"It's clear that every day Muslim students face both overt and subtle forms of Islamophobic discrimination on Ontario campuses," Jesse Greener, CFS Ontario Chairperson, said in a press release accompanying the report.

The 29-page report asserted Muslim students are the target of incidents of hatred and discrimination on campus.

Some Muslim students were called a terrorist and accused of being associated with Taliban and of carrying a bomb, it said.

The CFS, which is comprised of more than 500,000 students across Canada, said that hijab-clad students were more often targeted with incidents of hatred.

One Muslim student said her veiled friend was pushed into a busy street and called a "stupid Paki."

In another incident one University of Toronto Muslim student had a flyer for a rally in support of Denmark in the cartoon controversy shoved at her in a washroom.

When she threw the flyer out, she was then told to "Go back to [your] f---ing country and bomb it."

In another incident, a Pakistani students association at George Brown College was asked in an e-mail whether funds raised for earthquake relief were really for terrorist training.

Other Muslim students reported being called "witches," "ninjas" and "nuns."

The CFS report said that many Muslim students continue to feel "under the microscope" since the 9/11 attacks.

Insensitive

The report also said that Canadian universities continue to fail to meet the religious needs of Muslim students.

"A general 'failure to accommodate' was the most frequently identified problem by Muslim students in many facets of campus life," said Ausma Malik, Task Force member and student at the University of Toronto.

"From a lack of appropriate foods on campus and inadequate prayer space to inflexible academic policies that are often at odds with religious obligations, Ontario's Muslim students often face a fundamentally different learning environment than other students."

The CFS report said that Canadian universities failed to recognize Muslim holidays, provide halal foods or suitable prayer rooms.

It pointed out that prayer rooms in many institutions are too small, overcrowded or located in inconvenient spots.

Muslim students complain that they were forced to perform ablutions in public washrooms because their university didn't provide washing facilities by the prayer rooms.

"In the absence of prayer space, Muslim students who pray in stairwells or library carrels fear harassment and even assault."

The report said that female students complain of not being able to use pool or gym facilities because there were no women-only hours or because windows made the classes visible to the public.

Muslim students also reported feeling "alienated" at orientations and social events that are often fuelled by alcohol...."

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?c=Article_C&cid=1173695229366&pagename=Zone-English-News/NWELayout

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:19 PM

What is your point, Dickey?

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:15 PM

Canada's Muslims The Question of Integration

By Dr. Mohamed Elmasry President, The Canadian Islamic Congress

In light of the arrest of a group of young Muslims in Canada, the president of The Canadian Islamic Congress, Dr. Mohamed Elmasry, discusses the role of his organization in promoting the process of integrating the Muslim community.

The Muslim men arrested in Toronto recently are innocent until proven guilty. But if any of them is proven guilty in a court of law, then I hope and pray that Canada's Muslims will not be found guilty by association.

But then the question will be why a few Canadian Muslim youth were trying to make a political statement using violence instead of the peaceful means available in a liberal democracy like Canada.

To my knowledge, there is no academic research done in Canada or any other Western country to address the social aspects of this problem. The Canadian Islamic Congress (CIC) urged the federal government in 2003 to allocate research funding to academia to do the needed research in partnership with the community, but we were turned down.

Today the government spends on the policing side of the problem but zero dollars on well-documented university research.

Tired of waiting for the government to fund research, the CIC launched 2 years ago its "smart integration" project using its limited resourses.

Minorities are usually consciously or unconsciously excluded from full participation in the life of the country. As a result, they become self-conscious social units sharing a sense of belonging to a group that sees itself as distinct from society's dominant majority...."

http://www.islamonline.net/English/Muslim_Affairs/Americas/PoliticsEconomy/2006/06/01.shtml

For US Muslim Girls, Hijab No Obstacle

By Sahar Kassaimah, IOL Correspondent

WASHINGTON — For many Muslim girls in the United States, hijab is no obstacle whatsoever to enjoy their lives, but rather a source of strength, pride and a tool to spread correct information about much-stereotyped Islam.   

"I've been wearing my hijab for more than five years; since I was a fifth grader and I believe nothing has changed between me and my friends or classmates after I covered my hair," Huda Rabia, a Californian tenth grader student, told IslamOnline.net Friday, February 9.

"In the beginning they were all curious to know what this scarf is and why I am wearing it. They had tens of questions but after I answered all of them, they never asked me about it again."

During the few recent years, a debate has been raging in the West about Muslim women's right to wear hijab in public.

Describing it as a religious symbol and not an obligatory dress code as Muslims believe, France has triggered the controversy in 2004 by adopting a bill banning the hair veil in state schools.

Shortly afterwards, other European countries, chiefly Germany, followed the French lead.

But in the United States, it is a different story.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:01 PM

It was not an attempt to hijack a thread and as you know when it comes to the Middle East, Israeli concerns cannot be ignored.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 02:12 AM

You hijacked another thread by inserting the Israelis for no damned good reason. Take a pill and relax.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 02:08 AM

Peace - Are you trying to hijack this thread?

What has this to do with Maher Arar?

If you want to talk about Iranian human rights, start a thread about it. I doubt if you'll find anyone who disagrees.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:37 AM

"Governments committing gross violations of human rights routinely send representatives to council sessions to stifle criticism or denounce the actions of states with far better records. For example, Iran sent the man responsible for the torture and murder of Zahra Kazemi, a Canadian-Iranian journalist, to represent it at the council's inaugural session last June, and this week it sent Foreign Minister Manouchehr Mottaki, the person responsible for organizing the December Holocaust-denial conference in Tehran. "

from

http://www.stljewishlight.com/commentaries/288569735362733.php

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:32 AM

Then they were pardoned.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Apr 07 - 12:04 AM

Canada did give 'em shit and two Iranian intelligence agents who had interrogated Kazemi were charged with complicity in her death. The Teheran prosecutor's office released a statement reading in part, "The charges levelled against the interrogators, who are said to be members of the Intelligence Ministry, are announced as complicity in semi-intentional murder."

You'll have to dig a little deeper, Dickey.

Try to stay on topic, you ugly pervert.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 10 Apr 07 - 09:58 PM

I thought it had to do with Canada giving shit. Does Canada give a shit?
Maybe Canada should be giving Iran shit instead of having their citizens urging people to give shit to the US.

"INDEPTH: ZAHRA KAZEMI
Iran's changing story
CBC News Online | Updated November 16, 2005

Iranian-Canadian photojournalist Zahra Kazemi died in Iranian custody on July 11, 2003, almost three weeks after she was arrested for taking pictures outside a prison during a student protest in Tehran.

Two days later, Iran's official news agency reported that Kazemi had died in hospital, after suffering a stroke while she was being interrogated. On July 16, 2003, the story changed. Mohammad Ali Abtahi, Iran's vice-president, conceded that Kazemi died as a result of being beaten.

Later, the Iranian government would charge an Iranian security agent in Kazemi's death. He was acquitted of a charge of "quasi-intentional murder. In July 2004, Iran's judiciary said the head injuries that killed Kazemi were the result of an "accident."

The case stayed under the radar screens of most Canadians until March 31, 2005, and the stunning revelations of Shahram Azam, a former staff physician in Iran's Defence Ministry. He said he examined Kazemi in hospital, four days after her arrest.

Azam said Kazemi showed obvious signs of torture, including:

    * Evidence of a very brutal rape.
    * A skull fracture, two broken fingers, missing fingernails, a crushed big toe and a broken nose.
    * Severe abdominal bruising, swelling behind the head and a bruised shoulder.
    * Deep scratches on the neck and evidence of flogging on the legs.

Azam left Iran in August 2004, saying he was seeking medical treatment in Finland. He later went to Sweden and got in touch with Kazemi's son, Stephan Hachemi. With the help of Canadian lawyers, Hachemi helped Azam and his family get to Canada. He was granted landed immigrant status as a refugee sponsored by the government of Canada.

After Kazemi's death, Hachemi demanded that Iran return her body to Canada for burial – but Iran refused. He has also been critical of the federal government, saying Ottawa did not do enough to help his mother. He has demanded that Canada take the case to the International Court of Justice.

Spring 2003:Kazemi leaves Canada for Iran.

June 23, 2003, 5:40 p.m.: Kazemi is arrested while taking photographs outside Evin prison in Tehran during student-led protests. She is later taken into custody and interrogated by police, prosecutors and intelligence officials for 77 hours.

June 27, 2003, 12:20 a.m.: Kazemi is admitted to Baghiatollah hospital in Tehran.

July 3 or 4, 2003: Iranian officials inform Kazemi's family that she's been hospitalized.

July 7, 2003: Officials with Canada's Foreign Affairs Department visit Kazemi in hospital, the first of three such visits before her death.

Kazemi dies in Tehran hospital while under guard.
» CBC STORY: Canadian arrested in Iran brain dead after beating

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/kazemi/

Dianavan: Why don't you grab a camera, visit Iran and bring us back some photos of their wolderful system of government?

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 10 Apr 07 - 04:23 PM

You're really grasping at straws these days.

What has this to do with Maher Arar?

btw - Do you like Martins? Live in Chicago? Play banjo?

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: Dickey
Date: 10 Apr 07 - 02:56 PM

"THE IRANIAN GOVERNMENT ARE LIARS"

"PARIS, 26 July. (IPS, with reports from Nicholas Read and Petti Fong of the Vancouver Sun) The family of Keyvan Tabesh, a young Iranian shot and killed by a Port Moody police officer on 14 July, expressed shock at the attitude of the Iranian government trying to use the incident as a mean to cover up the death of Ms. Zahra Kazemi, the 54 years-old Iranian-Canadian photojournalist.

On Friday, Iran's Foreign Affairs Minister Kamal Kharrazi said that his ministry has launched an immediate probe into the killing of the young Tabesh and injuring a friend, Amir Aqa'i by the Canadian police.

Family members say they had no idea the Iranian government was going to use the death of their 18-year-old son and brother to deepen a diplomatic incident with Canada.

"We were surprised", said Keyvan's sister, Rita, in an interview from Burnaby. "We never talk to the government".

"The problem is between Keyvan's family and the police", she said softly, but with emotion. "It is a social problem, not a political problem".

Keyvan, 18, was shot by a Port Moody police officer when he approached the officer with a machete in his hand.

Amir, who has recovered from his wound, was not available to comment Thursday, but his father, who declined to give his first name, said he agreed with the Tabeshes that what happened to his son was a matter for Canadian, not Iranian, authorities.

"The Iranian government are liars", Aqa'i's father said. "This is not Iran's business. This happened in Canada, not Iran and It's a Canadian problem, not an Iranian problem".

Aqa'i said he and his wife were "very, very upset" when they heard the news about the Iranian government involvement. "You have to know we will solve this problem in Canada", he said. "We love Canada".

But Kharrazi stressed that Iranian foreign ministry would employ all its capacity and implement all diplomatic instruments to clarify the bitter incident and safeguard the rights of all Iranian nationals.

Tehran had also accused Ottawa to order the press not to report the "murder" of the young Iranian. The Foreign Affairs spokesman had said that the "horrifying killing" has created "fear and horror" among the Iranian community in Canada.

The Tabeshes, arrived in Canada on 2000 and are landed immigrants with family members still in Iran.

Kharrazi, reported by the official news agency IRNA, returning the table against Canada, said that Iran found incomprehensible the comparisons made by the Canadian department of foreign affairs between the deaths of Zahra Kazemi and Keyvan Tabesh.

Iranian jurists and observers noted that Iranian statements concerning the killing of Keyvan was "quite similar" to those used by Ottawa with Tehran in the case of the death of Ms. Kazemi while in the custody of the authorities.

Canada recalled its Ambassador from Iran following the burial of Ms. Kazemi in her hometown of Shiraz, in southern Iran, in spite of demands by her son, Stephen Hachemi and the Canadian government to have the body transferred to Canada for autopsy.

The Foreign Affairs Minister further stressed that the preliminary and hasty comments made by Ottawa officials in this regard was not a clear explanation but rather a justification for the indefensible act of Canadian police in murdering the Iranian national.

Asked why Tehran waited more than a week to raise the issue with the Canadians, Kharrazi accused the Canadian government for having failed to carry out its diplomatic duty to immediately notify the Islamic Republic of the incident.

"Noting that Iran was waiting for clear and convincing explanations in this regard, Kharrazi voiced his ministry's insistence upon having detailed, speedy and just investigations into the bitter case and having the person or persons responsible for it tried and punished", the Agency quoted the Minister.

Ken Taylor, a former Canadian ambassador to Tehran between 1979 and 1980, said the Iranian government's call for transparency is "outrageous".

"It's total mischief and absolute nonsense to try and link the two cases together", said Taylor, adding "It weakens their own case by taking this step".

Taylor said the police investigation into the Port Moody shooting is going to be transparent and will follow a set of procedures because the course of justice in Canada is subject to rules of law.

Rejecting Iranian claims, Canadian Foreign Affairs Minister Bill Graham expressed Saturday the hope to see the Iranians carrying "same thorough and open" investigations in the case of Ms. Kazemi as the Canadians are offering in the case of the late Keyvan.

Canada's Foreign Affairs Ministry spokesman Reynald Doiron invited Iran on Friday to send observers to Canada to oversee the police investigation into Tabesh's death.

"We are ready to offer them complete and unfettered assistance in communicating with the authorities", he said.

Rita and Keyvan's father, Nasser, a surgeon, both said Keyvan's death was not the business of the Iranian government, and they didn't want what happened to him to be used for political purposes. "We don't want the government to use our family", Rita said. "We just want to know why the police killed our brother.

"We just want justice for our son," said Nasser. "We are not a political family. We are living in Canada now and we want justice in Canada".

Keyvan's mother, Forough Jabalameli, has been quoted as saying her son did not know he was being confronted by a policeman because the officer was dressed in civilian clothes and driving a vehicle without police markings.

Pari Sa'idi, a spokeswoman with the Iranian-Canadian Community of Western Canada, said the Iranian government's comments are in direct retaliation for the Canadian government's demand for answers in Zahra Kazemi's death.

"This is bullying and the Canadian government should not buy it. They're covering their crime. Whatever happened here will be thoroughly investigated", she said Thursday.

Sa'idi, who left Iran in 1985, said she remains too fearful to return to visit her family. Relatives and friends still living in Iran tell her the country remains a virtual prison. "You can close your eyes, shut your mouth and go back to see your family. And if you do see something or say anything they don't like, they'll torture you", she said.

"The Iranian government's suggestion that the investigation into the Port Moody shooting may not be transparent shows poor knowledge of how the Canadian justice system works", Inspector Chris Beach, who is in charge of the Vancouver Police Department's major crimes section told journalists.

Port Moody Police Chief Paul Shrive said the homicide investigation is continuing into Tabesh's shooting and witnesses are still being interviewed. "The attempts by any individuals whether in this country or outside to put any political spin will just not be entertained by us", he added.

The unidentified officer who fired the shots joined the force two years ago from the RCMP and has 25 years of policing experience. He is on leave.

Police say Keyvan had earlier struck another vehicle with a machete and that the police officer followed the car in which he was riding into the Port Moody cul-de-sac where the shooting occurred."

http://www.iran-press-service.com/articles_2003/Jul-2003/iran_canada_relations_26703.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 16 Feb 07 - 02:11 AM

"Canada's Charter of Rights and Freedoms forbids Ottawa from deporting anyone to a country where that person may face torture."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/15/AR2007021502172.html

"But under Canada's "security certificate" program, the government can detain and deport immigrants without filing charges and without providing them or their lawyers with evidence if they are deemed a threat to national security."

Three who have been detained are now free on bail. One of them is under what amounts to house arrest.

Lets hope that all of the detainees will have their cases reviewed and that the U.S. will follow suit.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: GUEST,Dickey
Date: 13 Feb 07 - 10:41 AM

When one country notifies another that there is a suspected terrorist entering their country, do thay just leave it at that?

Wouldn't they say something like "let us know when you get him" or "hold him for questioning" or something of that nature?

There must have been some instructions given along with the information. What were they? If the Canadians did not want him "interrogated" in Syria Wouldn't they have said so?

In the unlikely even that there were no instructions given, it would mean "we don't want him in Canada" and/or "do whatever you usually do with suspected terrorists".

These details are absent.

Subject: RE: BS: Give em shit, Canada
From: dianavan
Date: 13 Feb 07 - 10:32 AM

"Apparently they wanted him sent to Syria to be Interrogated there."

I'm not so sure about that but, even so, at least there has been an apology and compensation for Arar. Which takes us right back to the refusal of the U.S. to amend its records which is how this thread started.