BS: Getting out of teaching

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: JeZeBeL
Date: 20 Nov 07 - 06:16 AM

The OU is different....believe me.

You don't need to teach degrees, you can teach basic courses, and there's not a lot of paperwork involved really (otherwise my mum wouldn'#t have time to do it!!!)

People don't care what they get most of the time in the OU, as long as they pass. The students who study with the OU often just want to better themselves, or are doing courses paid for by their employers, so they're more than willing to take advantage of what is provided to them.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 20 Nov 07 - 04:45 AM

There's also the OPen University who are always looking for tutors, and you have the added advantage of teaching people who want to study.

Trust me, Higher Education isn't any better. Maybe the OU gets a different type of motivated student (possible) but Universities are filled with 'clients' (they pay to study, we're told they are our customers) demanding their 2.1 and constant spoon feeding (the government's aim to out 50% of the population into Higher Education is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard).

Add admin, pastoral duties and the constant pressure to bring in hundreds of thousands of pounds in research grants and HE is a pretty horrible place to teach as well. And we don't have the holidays... :)

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: JeZeBeL
Date: 20 Nov 07 - 04:27 AM

I went to a talk last night, it was by Gervase Phinn.

I'm currently finishing my degree part time and fully intend, come hell or high water, to become a teacher.

I understand that there is a load of bureaucratic crap that goes on in the profession, but for 19 years, since I decided I wanted to go down the road of teaching, he is the first person to NOT tell me not to do it.

He freely admits that it's hossible for teachers now, and I see it day in and day out with my partner who teaches year 1/2. He's only just finishing his first year and it's taking it's toll on him already.

But no matter how much rubbish he has to deal with day in and day out and how stressed he gets, he's ademant that he still wants to teach (albeit in a different country!!).

I understand that you feel that you want to leave teaching but there are always more pleasurable ways of teaching.

Supply teaching is always a good option, at over £100 a day, you get to pick and choose which days you work. There's also the OPen University who are always looking for tutors, and you have the added advantage of teaching people who want to study.

How about a basic skills tutor.....my mum loves it.

I will be a teacher one day, I have the luck of going in with open eyes rather than rose tinted spectacles fortunately.

But one thing, I'd like to say how much of a wonderful man Gervase Phinn is, to encourage someone to teach even in this day and age of bureaucracy and paperwork and targets and statements and everything else.......what a brave man!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 20 Nov 07 - 02:17 AM

I have watched a disturbing trend lately.

It used to be that schools operated as a team. It was a horizontal process with the principal being a member of the team and problems were solved cooperatively and consensus was the goal. This, of course, required consultation.

Now, the trend is towards a top-down management style. This has had devastating effects on the morale of teachers. Teachers no longer have any energy for creative or innovative ideas because they are so busy trying to meet the criteria set by the principal.

This has resulted in the recruitment of bosses with narcissistic personalities. They seem to care nothing for the quality of instruction. Their goal is to look good in the eyes of the district. They seem to spend a great deal of time developing useles but 'glitzy' school goals and even more time monitoring teachers to make sure that their goals are being followed by teachers and students alike. Anyone who dares to question anything the principal says is in for a great deal of harassment, regardless of educational rationale.

Teachers have been reduced to factory workers and the students are nothing more than an assembly line product. Gone are the days of teacher autonomy. Say hello to standardized tests and teachers that are just doing their job.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 11:59 PM

Anyone who saw the lady on the PBS News-Hour who is taking over the Washington DC school system might be motivated to get out of teaching.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 09:09 AM

Exhibit A: the 2000 election

Exhibit B: the 2004 election

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 08:01 AM

"I believe that Aldous Huxley saw it coming in "Brave New World" with a class of people who really don't have a clue when it comes to, ahhhh, actual thinking..."


               Of course, we can't have people who think; they might vote for the wrong candidates.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Penny S.
Date: 18 Nov 07 - 12:26 PM

Sorry Michael, but the job is not what people went in to do. I retired last term, one year after I could, but I certainly would not want to have stayed on. My year leader is going this term, well early. Year leading, assessment coordinator (no extra planning time), gifted and talented (no extra time) teaching a whole new literacy and numeracy framework. And, by the way, the Y5 literacy framework is predicated on unfunded computers available to all the children in a year group for every literacy hour. Meanwhile, in a nearby evening class, the lecturer of adults in inspected by the Child Education Department with demands for individual learning plans for each of the paying customers. Who don't want them.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Nov 07 - 10:48 AM

Yeah, I agree, paula...

Though I have not taught uin a long, long time I do know many teachers who are completely frustrated with the National Curriculum because it is so test driven... And what is being taught places too much emphasis on rote memory verse critical thinking...

I believe that Aldous Huxley saw it coming in "Brave New World" with a class of people who really don't have a clue when it comes to, ahhhh, actual thinking...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: paula t
Date: 18 Nov 07 - 09:03 AM

I became a teacher in 1982. Since then I have seen the role change completely. I entered the profession because I enjoyed working with young people and felt strongly that I wanted to to help them to achieve their full potential- regardless of background etc.

I don't want to be a full time teacher any more.I still enjoy working with young people.I love being in the classroom - but years of the "National Curriculum" and constantly moving goalposts has drained me.Every politician and tabloid newspaper editor has an opinion about how to teach. That's o.k. in itself , but when their theories carry more weight than those trained and doing the job it is terrifying.

Today I heard that David Cameron has yet another bright idea. He wants every child to be "able to read" by the age of 6.What precisely does he mean? Who will decide when you can call a child a "reader"? He is going to replace the key stage 1 tests with a "reading test" ".Which one? What precisely will it test? Will he test the mechanical ability to read words, or the understanding of what is read? Where will the love of reading be taught as we all try to "tick the boxes" yet again? .

When I first started teaching , there were many options for students in years 10 and 11 who wanted to study "non academic " subjects. My first school offered pupils courses in car mechanics, building, carpentry , childcare - the list was almost endless.This vanished when the National curriculum emerged because it was felt that academic subjects were more important . Teachers argued strongly that for many young people this would be meaningless.We were ignored.The equipment, facilities and expertise were thrown in the dustbin - at great expense.Now some bright spark has "found out" that many young people are opting out of education and it is all the fault of teachers and schools for not offering a broad enough curriculum.It has been "discovered" by some highly paid advisor that these young people need vocational courses. we will need to train teachers, buy equipment and facilities.........

I sympathise with the view of the originator of this thread.I,too,feel torn between working with people I care deeply about, and being associated with the politics of the role.The use of education as a political football is totally unacceptable. I love teaching and remind myself constantly of those precious moments throughout the day which make the job special. However, the day is rapidly approaching when I won't want to be associated with the processes and ideology taking over our schools.When will we let children be children, and teachers teach?

Good luck for the future Desperate Dan. I know it is a hard decision to make.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Yet another GUEST
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 08:28 PM

Just do it. I was teaching full time for 6 years, the last 3 as head of department, and decided I had to to get out before I became wedded to a job which had drained me of all passion for my subject. OK, I had some freelance work to see me through any uncertain times, but this was worth less than 20% of my salary as a teacher. When my teacher's salary finished I had a couple of uncertain months (with a mortgage to pay) and although I registered with several temp agencies they found me the sum total of zero work. However, I am now working in a field related to my degree and subject that I love. I am challenged and very busy, but with no stress, earning three times what I earned as a teacher, and I'm still freelancing too. I now have 24 days holiday each year, but don't have any issue with this. Fair exchange. I found my work not through an agency but simply through spending very many hours being proactive looking for something suitable. Many former colleagues thought I was mad to take such a huge risk, and maybe I was, but I believe that the long notice periods required prevent teachers from discovering just what great opportunities there are outside of the classroom.

Good luck. Just do it, and once you've taken that brave deicision, don't just take the next job that comes along. Make space for the right opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Bobert
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 07:45 PM

Yeah, looks as if Bruce M. Baillie, if this is a real person, might have made a couple or three mis-steps in his or her intro to Mudville...

Purdy, ahhhhhhh, stupid, to be blunt...

Plus, why is it always cleaning toilets???

I like cleaning toilets, myself... I like takin' them apart and fixing' 'um... Especially old ones that you can't buy no more... I have 12 old toliets just awaitin' me right now... Gonna take my pressure washer down and clean all the bowls and tanks and then rebuild 'um to use in the old hotel I'm restorin'... Ol' toilets is cool... Plus, they actually flush right 'casue they got them big tanks... No sissy 2.2's that you gotta flush 2 or 5 times to get 'um flushed... New toidies ain't cool... They just ain't... Sorry if yer a new toidie freek but they jus' don't compare to the real deal...

Now back to the subject at hand... Just had to get my toilet rant outta the way...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Peace
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 07:07 PM

"If you're finding teaching so hard why not try cleaning toilets for a living? for what, shall we say a quarter or less of you're current salary?"

I have done both. I dislike that you presuppose that people who clean toilets are the worst end of the labour spectrum.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Peace
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 07:00 PM

"'Those who can DO, those who can't teach!'"

That adage is such a lot of crap. It fails to account for those who both can and do teach.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 06:55 PM

amen!

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Helen
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 06:08 PM

Bruce Michael Baillie,

You admitted yourself you wouldn't teach. Admit this: if you have a vocation, a calling to teach and the situation in which you are teaching is unbearable then the pain and frustration of not being able to achieve what you set out to achieve is immeasurably unbearable. The decision to leave teaching is never, never taken lightly, but sometimes, to save our sanity, our health and our souls we have to leave.

Don't, please don't, look at it from the outside and cast judgements. If you yourslef chose not to teach why judge people who gave it a go and who are now in personal, emotional, psychological and spiritual conflict over not being able to achieve their noble aims of teaching?

Helen

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Bruce Michael Baillie
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 05:14 PM

If you're finding teaching so hard why not try cleaning toilets for a living? for what, shall we say a quarter or less of you're current salary? How does that sound? Teaching isn't that bad a job, I'm not saying I'd do it myself I admit a lot of the kids out there are little bastards. But, YOU wanted to do it, so stick at it. If you try other professions you'll find there are a lot of people out there who hold to the old adage, 'Those who can DO, those who can't teach!' Stop whining and remember why you went into the profession in the first place. Don't give up!

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Bobert
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 08:26 AM

I'm sure this will shock some folks here in Mudburg, but upon graduatin' from college I taught 5th/6th combination for 2 years... I loved the teaching... I hated the paper work and the administration... So I quit and took a job teaching G.E.D. in the Richmond City Jail at an "in house" (haha) drug rehibilitation program... That job also had me teaching at a half way house and, well, things kinda evolved over many years and I ended up the "save-the-world" phase of my life as a "social worker"... Not sure how that all happened???

But I burned out at age 38 and knew that "saving-the-world" would have to take a back seat to, ahhhhh, making a living...

...and looking at the skills that I had honed over some 17 or so years as a teacher/social worker the one profession that seemed to be a natural was-----(insert drum-roll here----)...

...sales!

Yes, D.Dan, sales... Think about what types of thngs you are doing now... Aren't you, in essence, selling... Teaching and selling aren't that much different except in sales you are paid better (if you are half way decent) and while there is paper work it's not so much that it will choke you half to death...

Now should you consider sales, here's the beauty of your situation... You have a job now... You have an income... So you have *time* to do an inventory of your interests... This is important 'cause it gives you an opportunity to figure out your passions... When you figure that out then you'll know what it is that you would be successfull selling... I mean, if you are now an avid golfer, you might want to go to work as a sales rep for a company that makes and/or distributes golf clubs, etc, etc...

I know this sound bizarre, D. Dan, but give it some thought... Also, keep in mind that companies won't slam the door on you if you bring to them your skills... Throw in a little passion for the product and, guess what??? You'll find that a lot of companies will have an interest in hiring you...

That's my 2 cents worth of advice... Just think about it...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Jeanie
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 08:06 AM

There's lots of good advice in this thread. I left full-time teaching after 3 years in the job because I realized I didn't want to do it for the rest of my life. Nothing to do with *teaching* - like Desperate Dan who started this thread, I loved and still love *teaching* - it was everything else that went with it that I couldn't stand.

As others have advised here: look for ways that your subject training can lead you into a line of work. My degree was in modern languages and I went straight into export work and from there into translating.

You can use the first step out of teaching as a time-filler (and temporary cash earner) before moving into something else. As Weelittledrummer has said, ask yourself "What is it that I would really LOVE to do, given the opportunity ?" - then give yourself that opportunity by setting about doing it - maybe part-time, unpaid, to test the water, so to speak. Even if it turns out never to be part of your paid work, you will have the happiness of spending part of your life indulging in wherever your passions lie.

My own passion was for theatre. I did some training and over the years have earned a living doing various combinations of freelance translating, drama and teaching - yes, back into those once dreaded educational establishments, but in a very different situation - i.e. I choose where, when and for how long - and that way, I have the thrill and delight of working with children that drew me to want to be a teacher in the first place.

In a nutshell: with a little bit of courage, it is possible to make the break from full-time teaching and, by a roundabout way, create for yourself a situation where you can become the kind of teacher you always wanted to be, but which the system tried to stifle.

Wherever your subject specialism may lie, there are loads of companies these days going into schools giving, for instance, science presentations. This ad comes from this week's edition of "The Stage": "Actor/Teachers Required for sponsored science workshop tour. The tour will visit secondary schools throughout the UK during the spring term. Competitive fees and all travel and accommodation paid." There are loads of Living History companies, too. Museums, theme parks, country/wildlife centres....all need people witha teaching background. Pay is maybe not so good, but what the heck ? Having got the experience working for one of these companies, there is nothing to stop you then branching out on your own, freelance.

All the very best,
- jeanie

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Diva
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 07:42 AM

and good luck Guest

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Diva
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 07:41 AM

Friemd of mine has finally taken early retirement after about 30 years and has never looked better or felt better, her stress headaches have gone.....she has the option of doing supply a in a school a bit nearer home but is enjoying her time so much she really doesn't wamt to go near another school.

The one option for me having gained my degree was NOT going to be teaching in a school, i would not have the temprement, first time one of the wee darlings gave me a bit of lip I'd hang them out the window........which I believe is not allowed.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 05:06 PM

There is always an alternative. The trouble is that you may only realise what is was, years later.

I once worked in a school, which was so hated by the staff - they formed an escape committee, like in Colditz. A jokey thing - but very black humour.

Personally I got out of teaching because my wife was ill and I had to take care of her.. As I remember there was no concern for my plight expressed by my union at the time - no interest in my situation. You are very much alone. When your career drops off in your hands like a broken door handle - you, yourself; have to sort out the mess - no one else.

In retrospect - thirty years later, I would urge the following:-

1) do your qualifications partially qualify you for something else - or entry into some other kind of training.
2) as a teacher, you have worked with far more independence than most other workers - that is a really rare quality. Look for it in your new employment.
3) What do you want to do?
4) What are you good at? If you want to be something you haven't the qualities to be, look further.
5) Most important of the lot. Don't close your mind to ANYTHING. Its better to have a go at something, when you have a bit of choice in the matter - rather than having to try something when you HAVE to succeed. But don't use that bit of slack you have to be lazy. Try different things - you may surprise yourself . I did - by becoming a successful old peoples entertainer. Something I would never have guessed in a hundred years that I could do.
6) Open up some lines of credit now, while your credit rating is good - who knows whats going to break down. Get credit cards with BIG credit ratings.
7) Try doing some things to earn money in your a spare time. Learn about yourself - what jobs you like doing. If the teaching suffers - to hell with it - they broke your heart first!
8) Join Friends Reunited - have a few leisurely dinners with old college friends. See if they've made better career calls that you have - be prepared to listen and to learn.

best of luck mate!

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Helen
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 05:04 PM

Guest, 16 Nov 07 - 01:08 PM,

I was teaching in Australian TAFE (Technical & Further Education) colleges for about 5 years. (This was the penultimate stepping stone to getting out of library work. This process has taken me over a decade, but I've had some interesting jobs in the mean time.) The vast majority of TAFE teachers are casual and only work during the 36 teaching weeks of the year, and have no sick leave, annual leave or any other conditions, and absolutely no job security, so after a few years of this I was desperately trying to get something more permanent and significantly less stressful.

I had email alerts set up with internet job search companies and one morning at 7 am while eating a quick breakfast before heading out for an 8 am class I dashed off a job application for a training position at a government agency. As it happened I landed squarely into a very bad bullying situation and got the chop 10 days later, but I argued for them to give me some work as an admin officer in the department. That lasted 3 months, and was surprisingly interesting. (Note: not clerical work but administrative processing). It required my full range of skills: communication, customer service, planning, organising, analytical problem solving, etc. After that I was given a bit of temporary (labour hire agency) work here and there and then a couple of months after leaving the government department I was given temporary agency work at the Registry of Births, Deaths & Marriages. What a great job!! I loved it and the small, friendly team of people were among the best people I have worked with, ever.

Out of that I landed a temporary contract at a related office to the first gov't dept - with full pay & conditions - Yay!! - which dried up after 9 months, then I was asked back to Births, Deaths and stayed there for almost a year - back on agency money - the pay is peanuts with no conditions and no job security. Then I landed a permanent job back at the first government department, which I was only able to get because I had 2 years of solid government experience by then.

It's been a long saga, but my point is that by taking on temporary labour hire agency work I was able to get work in areas of interest, build up my experience and my credibility in that type of work, and then work my way towards a permanent position.

What I am doing now is issuing speeding fines from speed cameras, which probably sounds dull, but I absolutely love it. It uses almost all of my skills, even my visual skills in analysing images, and it is a great team of people to work with, and the government pay & conditions are unbeatable in any non-profit sector work.

After being a casual teacher, driving from campus to campus, with no office space, having to carry my lunch and tea-making things around with me, not having contact with other teachers except on a random basis, the little things I appreciate the most are working in one office with my own desk, having a place to store my files, having access to a refrigerator and tea-making facilities in the next room, and having a great team to work with. The pay and conditions are fantastic. This week I took my first paid annual leave in 11 years.

So I went from fearing desperately that I was going to die in my library job, to fearing desperately that I would never get out of casual work, to landing in a great job, just by believing that my library and teaching skills could be transferred into other types of work - and acting on that belief.

To me, everything I learned and everything I did as a high school English teach, a librarian and a TAFE teacher translate perfectly into every one of the other jobs I have done.

A further comment: I found that trying to get work with training companies was extremely frustrating. It depends more on who you know, rather than what you know. Learn to market your skills, even in the area of getting teaching work in adult training colleges. My marketing skills meant the difference between eating and not eating, some weeks.

A friend of mine is currently attempting the death-defying feat of leaving casual TAFE teaching. She repeatedly tells me that my "escape" is inspirational. It took tenacity, endurance, a belief in myself and my skills, research to identify a wide range of possible jobs, marketing skills to get the work, and identifying useful resources and people, like the woman who re-wrote my CV and gave me hints on the exacting, very specific, and very gruelling process of applying for government jobs. The list goes on. And it took quite a while for me to find where I wanted to go. If you have specific interests rather than a very broad range of interests like me, then it might be easier for you.

My starting point, way back in 1993, was to start a course of study in an area which interested me. That was a good, solid beginning to my escape from the library because it gave me a chance to use my skills and apply them in a new area of study, and to get credibility and proof that my skills were transferable. It helped me to focus on something worthwhile outside of work and to focus on the positive, and help me to stop dwelling on the negative of my situation at work. It gave me hope. It was a stepping stone.

Try developing a career goal and a plan. Decide what information you need to progress in each stage of your plan, and identify resources which you can use to help you gain information or to move forward towards your goals. There are plenty of online testing sites and career planning resources - most of them free - which helped me to narrow down my choices of what I wanted to do, or to reinforce my belief in my work strengths, personal strengths and qualities, and my skills.

Go for it! And keep us posted on your progress, or check in here and help us to keep you feeling positive and optimistic. If you are a member here you can PM me, if you want.

Helen

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 04:09 PM

There are two references above to DODDS (Department of Defense Dependant Schools). If no one had mentioned it yet, I was about to. The system operates elementary, middle, and high schools for dependent children of American military personnel on bases all over the world, outside the US.

My brother and sister-in-law teach in the DODDS system. It's a pretty sweet deal, but I don't think job openings come up too often. It's worth looking into, just in case you can find an opportunity.

Pay is determined by averaging the going rate at the five highest-paying school districts in the US. Also ~ and very importantly ~ housing is provided as an additional "benefit" (i.e., teachers do not pay rent or mortgage out of their paychecks.) You can live in military housing on base if you wish, but you can find a place in the local community and Uncle Sam will pay the rent ~ or the mortgage! That's right, the government will buy you equity in real property in some foreign country, and when you transfer or retire, you can sell your house and keep the proceeds.

I know that the days and months for which classroom time is not scheduled do not necessarily means that teachers "work less" than the rest of us. Moreso than students, teachers have to do a lot of "homework"; that is, they have to put in many hours of preparation, bureaucratic paperwork, etc.,. in addition to the time spent "on duty" in the classroom.

However, it cannot be denied that teachers have more flexible work schedules than the average 9-to-5er. When school shuts down for the summer, or for a two-week hiatus, teachers are free to travel ~ and DODDS teachers are especially well-positioned to do so. My brother and his wife have spent Thanksgiving weekend touring Turkey rather than eating turkey, they've spent Christmases with the Vienna Boys' Choir, etc. (It's worth noting that the DODDS schools observe US holidays ~ obviously ~ which means that some of the days-off are normal workdays in the area where a given base resides.)

The bureaucracy is undoubtedly as bad, or nearly so, as that found at any stateside school, but the kids are generally better behaved, since their entire environment always involves a degree of discipline. They don't know anything different, and are therefore relatively manageable in comparison to their stateside/civilian peers.

It's also worth noting that DODDS teachers, as civilian employees of the military, have the same educational opportunities as military personnel, including a full selection of correspondence-type university courses. My brother essentially married into the system: he had only one year of college credit when they got married. As his wife's "dependent," he was able to take courses, fairly quickly qualifying to student-teach and then to become a full-fledged teacher, and now has both bachelor's and master's degrees.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Bill D
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 01:35 PM

guest: not to detract from your concern and problem, but you MUST use some identifier/name, even as you remain anon.

call yourself "frustrated" or whatever, but use a name.

Subject: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 01:08 PM

I have lost all desire to enter a classroom only to be abused by a 14 year old, while my admin. does nothing.

After teaching for 7 years, I have tried everything to create a positive classroom environment, but have failed to do so. Not because there is anything wrong with me as a teacher, but because I am powerless. Truly powerless.

In my case, I don't see a way out right now, but I need an exit paln and have started working it out. Perhaps real estate, but I'm not sure. The only thing I am sure of is that I need to leave the "profession."

I also think that teachers who need to leave must think about changing direction and move into a completly separate field of work. Use your degree and start over; it seems to be the only way to avoid the mess that education is. I like many have a mortgage... and the idea seems out of reach, but think of the person you will have become after another 25 years of abuse. I can't imagine it myself.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,pattyClink
Date: 09 Feb 07 - 11:13 AM

Dan, much sympathy and I realize you don't want to discuss the problems of teaching but find some new path, so I'll spare you my education theories.

There are sizeable numbers of midlife people re-tooling into medical fields around here. If you live near any medical centers, you might research the possibilities. Your organizational skills could be of great use in hospitals and clinics. You might need to pursue a degree in hospital administration.

There are also 'allied health' degrees which basically train you, often over 2 years, for a specialty such as respiratory therapy, or being the tech who does echocardiograms, x-rays, etc. etc. You might like working with patients permanently or you might use that as your transition to learn about patients & medical stuff and then transition to administration.

Anyway, education is a mess, so I hope you can find a better place. Other fields also have their frustrations, but not nearly as much sheer stupidity as the classroom teacher faces.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: SharonA
Date: 08 Feb 07 - 04:22 PM

Dan, I sympathize with your plight. Both of my siblings are in the American education field (elementary school level), and both have been teachers (one still is, the other has migrated to the administrative end of things and is a principal). Whenever the family gets together, I hear an endless stream of complaints about the ways in which the field has changed for the worse, thanks to local, state and national government bureaucracy.

Recently my brother who's been a teacher for close to 30 years told me that he would not recommend to anyone that they enter the field now. This really surprised and impressed me since I've never before known him to be without any enthusiasm for teaching.

It's a very sad state of affairs. So much for "no child left behind" -- the government leaves every child behind when it leaves teachers behind.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Schantieman
Date: 08 Feb 07 - 03:07 PM

Now that's a thought, Geoff. Might pick your brains about that at Miskin (if we have time in between mumming and port/cheese parties).

I'm trying to get out myself after 26 years. Singing and sailing are two things I can do - but I suspect neither is very lucrative. But lucre isn't everything I suppose.

S

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 06 Feb 07 - 08:40 AM

"Half the teachers are due to retire" - what are the odds that Blair or whichever slime bag follows him will suddenly produce reports stating that classes of 60 plus students is the best environment for them to learn, so we don't need to replace the retired ones?

Having worked as a supply teacher, I have a lot of contempt for the English school system.

I'm busy training to become a driving instructor. There seems to be work there.
Quack!
Geoff.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,DODDs Teacher
Date: 06 Feb 07 - 08:08 AM

I work for a DODDs school overseas. Yes the pay is MUCH MUCH better. But the working conditions are all the same. I am just as burnt out and looking to leave the teaching job behind.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 05 Feb 07 - 12:14 PM

Eanjay - 'Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach'. Oscar Wilde (I think, maybe....). Nonsense - there are a lot of people who can't in commerce and industry, and I'm obliged to work with a few.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: dianavan
Date: 05 Feb 07 - 12:11 PM

Cruiser - You're right. That cliche is misleading to say the least. In fact, I know plenty of people who are experts in their field who would not know how to teach their skills or manage a classroom. Just because you know how to do something doesn't mean you know how to teach it.

Good teachers are far and few between. The teachers that survive seem to be the ones who make the principal look good and/or suck up to the parents. Then there are those who spend most of their time on fancy bulletin boards, intended to impress others. In the biz these people are referred to as 'glitz queens'. It means their program and their methods are superficial without having any substance or meaningful content.

If there is laughter in the classroom and the students are motivated to do their best, nothing else matters. Its too bad that its the superficial that are given all the credit.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 05:42 PM

I've never heard that cliche before.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Cruiser
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 05:38 PM

There were some social problems when I attended school from 1955 through 1971, but something has gone completely awry with the educational system in the USA. Some of my colleagues who are college professors have expressed concern regarding the lower quality of the students they instruct compared to earlier times.

I do think we need to return to excellence in education, higher academic standards, and discipline in the classroom.

I was a decent kid, but I got my share of swats on the bottom with a paddle in the principal's office, beginning in the 1st grade and ending as an 8th grader. As I reflect back on those times, I deserved what I got and I am glad I had the "direction" I received.

I had the utmost respect for my teachers, even the very few I did not like. I had profound respect for my instructors in Army Boot Camp even though I was much more educated than they were. However, I learned more about life from them that was just as valuable, and in some ways more valuable, as academic knowledge.

I would suggest you find some way to stay in teaching in whatever capacity you can. One of the worse falsehoods about teaching is the cliché: teachers are teachers because they cannot do anything else.

Good luck Dan

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 02:27 PM

I'm sure you're right Sooz. but lets face it there are a hell of a lot of unhappy bunnies down that particular burrow.

This chap seems very unhappy. If that's the way he feels, he's better off doing something else.

I can think of a lot of things that would have helped me be a better teacher in retrospect. If the job doesn't fulfil you though, how ever good a job you make of it, or how ever easy the job is for you - it really isn't for you.

I personally had no choice, when Denise got ill she was entirely dependant on me - she literally couldn't move with arthritis for nearly ten years till they thought she was old enough to do joint replacement surgery. I just had to stay home and take care of her. Being a musician and guitar teacher came out of that situation. Couldn't think of anything else - I often wish I'd thought harder!

This guy would be better off looking around and thinking hard what he WOULD like to do. Perhaps this is his chance to do it.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 02:24 PM

You'll be a sad loss to teaching Sooz - you are the epitome of everything a teacher should be, and without any of the usual vices! :-)

You're sufficiently enlightened to realise how privileged you've been to influence so many young lives, and to know and acknowledge that teachers aren't the only ones who work hard!

I'm also privileged - to be able to call you a friend - and I seriously hope the 'next phase' will still involve performing and organising in the Lincolnshire area!
S:0)

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: MaineDog
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 02:20 PM

Folkiedave,

Try tutoring at a local college. You get motivated adult students, and almost no paperwork.

And which earth are you on?

Sorry, I reside on the third planet from the sun.

I relate my wife's experience as a community tutor in Maine. Her students were mostly adults who had returned to college after som work, having realized that they need a degree to get a good job. Students who were having trouble with algebra, or statistics, or other undergraduate math, were referred by their advisors to tutors for help. She would meet one-on one with such students and help them, The paperwork was a single sheet checklist for each session, and the pay was far better than minimum wage.

Perhaps it is not so good elsewhere.

MD

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Miss
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 01:55 PM

Better for those remaining in the profession - Oh dear Sooz, I wasn't very clear.

The trend for teachers leaving the profession is not sustainable. So I hope conditions of service continue to improve - proper availability/support for technology, less bureaucracy etc etc. So many of our County Advisors are near retirement - what will a new breed bring? So few apply for Headships too.

I maintain optimism, especially for my son who has recently started teacher training.

So I hope that lessons will be learnt from the last ten years to lessen demands and keep teachers in posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: Sooz
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 12:57 PM

I'm one of those teachers who will be retiring quite soon, Miss, and I wondered what you meant about that making it better for those of you remaining in the profession.

I'm looking forward to retirement (some days more than others) but I wouldn't chose another career if I had my time over again. Memories of the youngsters I've helped both academically and personally will follow me into the next phase of my own life.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Miss
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 12:19 PM

Dan - I am not sure which country or phase you teach in, but in the UK, there will be a great percentage of teachers retiring in the next ten years giving me hope that it will be better in the future for those remaining in the profession. I have felt some easing of unnecessary paperwork and unrealistic expectations on my time, due to change of Head and my own expectations of myself.

I have taken time out of teaching and long since returned to the classroom. I have kept a balance in the last 10 years by always learning something out of school - computer courses, another language, music etc. You have to make time, be with different people and allow personal development.

Do you love teaching enough to feel it is your 'vocation'? I know one can scoff at that old fashioned idea, but if it is, could you change direction -

- change school
- go on a Local Education sabbatical abroad to refresh and bring creative ideas to our practice?
- aim to teach within a specialised field - EBD, Deaf, Autistic etc
- workshadow a friend in The Real World for a few days to see if it would suit you.
- work less than full-time to allow you to focus on developing new skills with a view to leaving teaching completely.

I daresay you have reflected on all the above and I wish you the best - back to my STP where I must note the LT for the SEN and EAL, include AFL, CTG and ICT opps.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Mr Sunshine
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 08:46 AM

GUEST,yvonneyerunderpants: Did you really have to apologize? I was working up to some deliciously sarcastic response ... guess I'll have to save it for my memoirs ("At this, I finally raised my head from my work-in-progress. I turned to her with an arched eyebrow. '"Foetal", not "fetal"?' I said. To my shame, I'm afraid that I could not subdue a snigger. Her eyes flashed fire." - Watch for A Life of Sunshine at Amazon.com).

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,yvonneyerunderpants
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 07:50 AM

Mr Sunshine and maeve you have shone a ray of sunshine on the mind of an ignoramus. Apologies and good luck in your future endeavours.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: maeve
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 07:16 AM

""foetal" Mr Sunshine, not "fetal"

Regional and cultural differences are reflected in the accepted alternate spelling, GUEST,yvonneyerunderpants.

Dan-

I'm leaving, too. I am ready to have my skills and talents put to good use while maintaining mental,physical,and emotional health. What will I do? Work our land, tutor, buy and sell antiques, hire out as a gardener, grow even more of our food, write, illustrate...

We're simplifying, clearing our debts and getting rid of culch as a beginning, and we'll continue to do whatever God puts into our hearts and hands to do. Take heart: make the changes needed for you to be productive, healthy, and fully involved in living. We have found that the real and apparent reduction in monetary security can be part of a better life. I wish you courage and joy in your journey.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,yvonneyerunderpants
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 06:36 AM

"During the spelling lesson"

"foetal" Mr Sunshine, not "fetal"

Dear me! Teachers!

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Arnie
Date: 04 Feb 07 - 12:38 AM

I have the answer Dan - become an Ofsted Inspector!! Then you can make everyone else miserable instead....

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Mr Sunshine
Date: 03 Feb 07 - 10:38 PM

"During the spelling lesson??"

???

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: dianavan
Date: 03 Feb 07 - 08:00 PM

Try reading, TAEA - Dan didn't say the students were a problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,yvonneyerunderpants
Date: 03 Feb 07 - 06:31 PM

During the spelling lesson??

Subject: RE: BS: Getting out of teaching
From: GUEST,Mr Sunshine
Date: 03 Feb 07 - 06:00 PM

Wish I could help you, Dan. I've been trying to find a way out for twenty years ... for the same reasons ... now I'm taking a year off; in another few years, I'll take another year off ...

Remember: if worse comes to worse, there's the fetal position, under the desk ...