BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Sawzaw
Date: 15 Oct 10 - 10:43 AM

Salt LAke Tribune

"Rep. Jim Matheson signed a letter to the White House on Tuesday requesting a personal meeting to urge Obama to "reverse a decision" by Interior Secretary Ken Salazar to cut next year's CUP funding...

...said he would be happy to help the White House find wasteful spending elsewhere, while insisting that the CUP must be finished for taxpayers to see a return on their spending.The law is explicit: cutting this funding won't save taxpayers one dime, since the federal share is paid back with interest by Utah water users, If no water is delivered, then Utahns won't have to pay, and hundreds of millions of dollars will have been wasted."

Federal taxpayers already have pumped $450 million into the project, money the delegation argues would be paid back if the government continues to fund the six-unit project, which eventually will bring water from eastern Utah's Uinta Basin to the Wasatch Front's Bonneville Basin.

So far, the project has funneled water as far as Strawberry Reservoir. A final segment would bring it through a massive tunnel to a finished pipeline linking it to a water-distribution network along the Wasatch Front."

We need turtle tunnels not water tunnels for humans. Only turtle tunnels save or create jobs.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 07:51 PM

Oh, bull, LH....

The right has had control of the media since they convinced the FCC to allow one company to own 1100 radio stations...

Who owns these stations, LH??? Poor people??? Middle class working people??? Black people??? Muslims??? Liberals???

Get real!!! You ain't runnin' for no office so you can get that Melba Milk Toast crap and stuff it... It's 100% Prime Bullshit...

There was a time in the 60s and 70s when you cold have argued that point and maybe had a leg to stand on... These days the media is owned 100% by the corporatists who don't like regs... That means they don't like liberals...

Like I said, "Get real"... Come on over the bridge to the millenium... It won't hurt...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 05:25 PM

You don't have to be either "a socialist" or "a capitalist", you just have to be a free thinking human being who is flexible enough to see the good in both socialism AND capitalism, and to see how to use both to create a decent and prosperous society.

The Right and the Left will forever bitch about how the media are mainly serving the purposes of the other side. And the media take delight in reinforcing those divisive attitudes, because it fuels conflict, causes controversy, and that draws in more listeners. People are attracted to controversy.

The media in the USA, however, are on average so much farther to the Right than the media in Canada or western Europe, that for someone to complain that they are serving "the Left" verges on the utterly absurd. ;-D Be that as it may, people believe what they wish to believe, don't they? And that depends mainly on their past cultural background, not their powers of reason or objectivity.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 05:11 PM

Hey, if being a socialist is not having yer danged credit card hit every time you rive out of yer driveway, havin' a cop stop someone from robbin' you, having fire department put out yer fire then count me in...

In other words, "Privatize this!!!"

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 04:29 PM

...the mainstream media is biased to the left.

Ah, Douggie, you old asshole, you - you mean like Fox news and the Wall Street Journal perhaps?

The shibboleth of the "Left Wing Media" tho dear to the hearts of the mindless right since Tricky Dick Nixon is complete and utter bullshit.

But what else would one expect from ol' Douggie-boy?

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: DougR
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 04:02 PM

Donuel: You are welcome.

Pdq: You answered your own question: because the mainstream media is biased to the left.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 03:48 PM

By the way, when it comes to owning the means of production in a country...that is, the factories, the mines, and the utility plants, I would be in favour of most of them being owned privately. By "most", I mean probably at least 95% of them. I do, however, think it is wise if the largest public utilities, such as Hydroelectric power, for example, are publicly owned and regulated...or at least partially so, so that people can choose either one or the other.

In Canada, for example, we have a publicly owned broadcasting outlet (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation - CBC) alongside thousands of privately owned radio and TV stations. People can choose to listen to one or the other or both. When they choose CBC radio (which many do) they get a radio program with NO advertising, and with all kinds of wonderful information and art programs and great music that you CAN'T get on the privately owned stations, because it's not deemed profitable enough! This is a very good alternative for listeners, and people can choose for themselves what they like to listen to. That's democracy!

Again, as you see, I am not speaking in "all-or-nothing" terms when I speak of socialism. All-or-nothing approaches are usually detrimental to a society, in my opinion, and they are usually embraced by political fanatics, not by democratically motivated individuals.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 03:33 PM

What you are speaking of is "all-or-nothing" socialism, Amos, and it is precisely that interpretation of the word that I object to, Amos. I believe in a system that embraces both socialism and capitalism, using each in the areas best suited to them, and doing so through a democratic and representative form of government with a strong set of civil rights enshrined in law. That is basically the system already in place in most of the western world, the only problem being that the major banks and major corporations are not being properly regulated at present, and they have a degree of influence which they should not have over public policy. They also OWN the mass media outlets!

Words are tricky. Words can be used to confuse and misdirect. The only way to avoid being misdirected by a word such as "socialism" is for the one using the word to be allowed to fully explain exactly what he means when he's using it. And that requires a patient listener, right? I have explained what I mean when using it.

Are most TV watchers patient listeners? Is patient listening being encouraged by the mass media? Are patient explanations given proper air time?

I think you know the answer to those questions! ;-) "No."

Obama is a very patient explainer, but he's talking to a public that is mostly unaccustomed to patient listening, because it requires far too much mental effort! On top of that, Obama's sitting in the belly of the beast there in Washington. Because of that, I fear that he is very restricted in what he can really do, despite having the best of intentions.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Sawzaw
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 03:03 PM

Please use "socially compassionate" in a sentance.

Mugger on the street: "Please be socially compassionate and hand over your wallet before I blow your fucking head off."

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Amos
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 02:03 PM

Let's not get all loosey goosey about the word socialism, LIttle Hawk. There is a world of diffwerence between socialism as the word is used to describe the form of government, and the word as used to describe the socially compassionate attributes of a republican form of government. The key difference is the ownership of themeans of production, which in a democratic republic is private ownership. A socialist country owns the factories, mines, and utility plants.



A

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Sawzaw
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 01:59 PM

"when it is done for the good." Who decides that? Which tribe?

News flash to Bobert: Link TV bills itself as being untainted by corporations. They regularly air the "documentary" movie about how evil corporations are.

Boss Hogg is a Democrat, on yer side.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 12:38 PM

And the public libraries. And the conservation areas and parks.

All achieved through taxation. All achieved by socialism, without which it is simply impossible to even have a modern and functioning society.

We (at least in the USA) need a new understanding of a few basic words in the language. "socialism" is one of them. The word socialism is constantly misused by American politicians and pundits for propaganda purposes in order to scare people who have, it seems, little or no idea of what socialism actually is. It's not an all-or-nothing proposition. It is a normal social thing that takes care of certain societal necessities that can't be taken care of in any other way.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 12:38 PM

Be more than happy to "listen" to people who have real thoughts, LH... But if all they are doing is regergitating bumper sticker policy position propaganda, count me out... You can't have a discussion with someone who is eat up ignorant...

"We want our country back", "Obama is trying to take our guns", "We want freedom" are ***not*** policy positions...

PDQ's rightie stats about "deficits" are not helpful because they are crafted by paid statisticans to to twist information into soethging it clearly isn't...

I mean, I'll talk policy as long as we are dealing will facts rather than bullshit... I can smell right winged corporate bullshit a mile away...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 12:24 PM

also the roads, water, schools, police, fire department, center for disease control and 4th of July parties.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 12:22 PM

sawz
kudos for the change in tone and reason, be it from understanding or a pill.

Doug R.
thank you for paying for my common defense, mortgage, handicap disability, food and energy needs.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 12:15 PM

Being manipulated is not an evil when it is done for the good.

The most glaring examples of manipulation like Glen Beck and all the talking heads of FOX ranges from amateurish to expert.

Colin Powell held a little vile in front of the UN in an act of wrold wide manipulation.

Making policies that hide the truth or limit expression are examples of evil manipulation. Also:

Tear, Redefinitions, rewriting history, opposite facts, frosting an issue with religion, emotional outbursts and repetition repetition repetition are the calling cards of right wing manipulation.

Humor and facts are the basic manipulation tools of the left. What is missing from this approach is the emotional outburst and repetition.

As a hypnotist I would suggest ramping up repitition and emotional presentations and even factual fear to the hilt.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 10:57 AM

Yes, I know well of that gridlock of which you speak, Bobert. I also know that it will never end.... (smile) ...because that's the way people are. Most really prefer talking to listening. While someone else is talking, they are not really listening to him or her, they're working on the next thing THEY are going to say instead. They're listening to the voice in their own head rather than to the other person, and that makes them unreasonable. This is true in 3-D life too.

I have come to a point where I can regard all that with a certain amount of equanimity and be fairly much at peace with the fact that there are always going to be a lot of soreheads in this world, and that other people are NOT necessarily going to see something the way I see it, and there's not much I can do about it.

(shrug) Okay. That's life. Why let it drive me crazy? I will try to get along with people in any case, state my view, and accept the fact that others may see it differently...without letting that turn them into my personal "enemies". If I can manage that, then I save myself a lot of stress, right? Having enemies doesn't help me in any way.

The reason most people defend their views so strenuously is simply this: their views are part of their own personal identity, and they are very quick to defend their personal identity. If you go to the heart of their personal identify you will find that they, like you, genuinely do want a better and happier world for humanity. But they are usually focusing on it from some other angle, depending on their personal history and background which has shaped the way they see things.

In other words: "Peace, brother!"

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: pdq
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 10:50 AM

Oh, by the way, the 2010 Fiscal Year ended on 30SEP2010 and, using correct (not doctored) accounting, the National Debt rose...

                                                                                           $1.6411 trillion

That is for one year!!!

Reagan took eight years to run that much red ink and the biased news media have bashed him for that mistaket for the last 25 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: pdq
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 10:23 AM

Presidents are held accountable for deficits on their watch.

For Reagan, that would be from 30SEP1981-1OCT1989.

That period shows an increase in the National Debt of $1.8 trillion

Billy Clinton is held responsible for his eight years which covered 30SEP1993-1OCT2001.

That period shows a rise in the National Debt of $1.4 trillion

The main difference is that Clinton's minions get away with calling a $1.4 trillion dollar defecit an $81 billion surplus. Can somebody explain how that is allowed to go unchallenged in the mainstream news media?

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 08:19 AM

You are speaking for yourself, LH, and not someone who has has been raised on propaganda... Our generation may be the very last one that was taught/allowed to think... Thinking kinda comes naturally to us but is foreign to kids being brought up in a highly propagandized world where rote memory is being pushed over critical thinking in our schools...

So, yeah... On one hand you are correct but on the the other perhaps giving too much credit to those who you admit "aren't really aware they have the power" to make the changes necessary to bring about "justice and fairness"...

As for this forum, I have tried over and over to discuss policies and ideas and been met with "prove this" or "sources please" and when I engage on that request the threads get bogged down into disputes over stupid stuff that is no longer about policies or ideas but one right winged blogger's, who BTW may be getting paid by Boss Hog to do nuthin' but twist stats, views after anothers... This seems to be a purdy predictable way that those here on the right deal with policies and issues that they have no interest in discussin'...

These diversionary tactics seem to always produce the same gridlock...

And seems that they are always initiated by the same people with the same agendas...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Oct 10 - 05:06 AM

Well, there are many Boss Hawgs, Bobert, not just one. It's a complex situation. There are a very large number of these grossly manipulative advertisers out there working for a very large number of huge commercial concerns, and their collective influence on our governments and lawmakers is massive. It's dominating the agenda, it's dominating the media, and it's dominating most people's lives.

As Sawzaw points out, people have the power in their own hands to defeat these entities by not letting themselves BE manipulated, but most people aren't really aware they have that power...or they're too distracted...or they're too lazy and self-indulgent to take up the potential power they have and use it...or they're just confused.

It's time that people here on this forum...and in society in general...stopped letting themselves by maneuvered into an "us and them" mentality and driven to these polarized opposite positions that the media concocts (like "liberal" and "conservative", for instance)....and actually listened to one another's deep concerns for a change rather than demonizing and attacking one another and hurling personal insults.

Agreed?

We are not stereotypes. We are not the monsters that we carry around in our political anxiety closets.

We really DO essentially all want the same basic things. We want people to be happy and prosperous. We want people to be safe and to get good health care. We want truth in advertising and honesty in government. We want employment in good jobs for those who need work. We want justice and fairness. We want transparency. We want the truth.

Agreed?

Let's try, for goodness sake, to understand and respect one another instead of letting ourselves by constantly manipulated into hating and dismissing one another by the few greedy marketing forces at the top of the power pyramid whom you characterize as "Boss Hawg".

Don't let them win by turning us against each other and causing us to waste our energy in personally attacking each other when we all truly want a better life for humanity.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 10:47 PM

Just about all media these days is corporate pablum... When we first started broadcasting, for instance, there was an attitude that we all owned a share of the public airwaves... And we had strict rules on how they could be used... The corporations back then were motivated less by profit and more by the joy of broadcasting... We actually had a Federal Communications Commission, which was supposed to be an apolitical oversight board and things worked fine until one day Boss Hog woke up and said, "Hey, if I just could own a lot of these licensed broadcasting stations I could consolidate labor" and make more money"...

Well, long story short, Boss Hog also figured out that if he owned enough of these broadcasting stations that he could use them to manipulate public opinion??? And his buddies likes that, too, because they could use Boss Hogs media to manipulate public opinion on lots of different fronts...

That is what we have today... Boss Hog has packed the FCC with "Yes-men" and consolidated most of the media within a small circle of himself and his buddies and they have never had it so good...

Heck, when the Dixie Chicks made a comment about Bush wanting to invade Iraq it was the very next day that Boss Hog had his manipulated masses breaking Dixie Chick records in streets all across the country?!?!?!?....

I mean, what ever happened to "all" of US owning those airwaves and the days when those airwaves were used to entertain us and inform US rather than propagandize US???

The "liberal media" is the BIGGEST of all the BIGASS LIES... It doesn't exist... It is just part of Boss Hog's distraction to keep US from seeing just how much control he has of the entire deal... It is a smokescreen... It is pure bullshit...

Until media is returned to the people this is what we are going to have... Corporate ownership of the discussion, the ideas, the agendas and purdy much everything...

I mean, yeah... It's great to try to teach kids kids to do right but it's an uphill battle as kids are being bombarded with the corporate fight song from birth... The corporations want kids to get credit cards... They are "profitable"... Hey, if a couple hundred thousand kids drop outta college because they are buried in debt every year, so what??? Right??? That's what Boss Hog want's US to think...

We are being fed a steady diet of what Boss Hog wants stuck in our brains... Not a whole lot different from the steady diet of shit that Boss Hog wants Us to eat... Kinda explains why we have the highest obesity rates in the industrialized world...

Well, our brains ain't far behind in obesity... Not mine, thank God, but the population on the whole has some very defective thinkerators...

BTW, that "jerk" on TV, Sawz, is one of the thousands of Boss Hog's corporation propaganda peddlers...

Almost the entire media is made up of Boss Hogs shills...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Sawzaw
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 10:21 PM

PS:

I saw a jerk on Link TV giving a lecture on using tribalism to get what you want. I wonder if he gets paid for that? I wonder if Link TV is a corporation?

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Sawzaw
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 10:13 PM

"Whatever pill that you took to get there you should continue taking... *grin* "

Ain't no pill. It is being able to see through the bullshit and the way we are being manipulated.

People say the corporations are controlling people to buy what they want them to buy. People have control over the corporations by buying what THEY want to buy. You are tired of manufacturing shifting to China? Don't buy the Chinese stuff.

People need to be taught how to see through the advertizing that manipulates them like in first grade. Buy a happy meal get a toy. Eat froot loops. Wear Barney socks. Then the dumbass parents buy it to keep JR happy.

If people didn't fall for the advertising, it would not work and the advertizing would go away. So you get them in the pocketbook. Lawyers and lobbyists can't work around it. Crooked politicians can't get around it. They would have to provide what we want not what they make us think they want.

Yes, we have perfect control but not the willpower like overeating, smoking, drinking too much and spending more than we make.

I often ask my wife, a teacher Why don't they teach kids about stuff like the credit card trap and how credit card companys lure young people in and try to keep them under their 18%+ fees for everything they buy. She can't answer because they are busy teaching them other, more important stuff so they can pay that 18%.

To me, how to avoid being manipulated is the most basic thing we need to know

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 09:38 PM

The entire argument comes down to how the wealthiest country in the world creates a moral and civilized society... Do we do it with "govern"ment??? Or do we do it by letting the corporations, driven exclusively by profits, run the show???

Those are the two choices...

Of course, the corporations are spending hundreds of millions of dollars trying to create enough of a smokescreen so that this question can not be framed in such a simple manner...

But that's what this is really all about, folks...

Nuthin more and nuthin' less...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: pdq
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 06:22 PM

This article does a reasonable job of explaining...

                                                                                    The Myth of the Clinton Surplus

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:57 PM

1959 to 2010... 51 years.

Let me see.. How many years of that did the Republicans control the Congress? And how many did the Democrats?

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:43 PM

A tax on sugary drinks has been proposed.
Increases the cost of Rum and Coca Cola!

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:39 PM

The last time the US Federal Government took in more money than it spent was 1959

You betcha, PeeDee! and if the income tax schedule was restored to what it was in 1959- before the Reaganite/BuShite tax cuts for the rich- it would be taking in more than its spending today.

Put that in yout TeaBag & smoke it.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: pdq
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:33 PM

The last time the US Federal Government took in more money than it spent was 1959.

Book keeping that some people call "clever" has been used to keep the public thinking otherwise.

fact: It does not matter that a dollar is "off budget", it is still a dollar that the government spent and it still goes on the National Dept which our children will have to pay.

The federal budget has been made to look better than it really is by several dirty tricks, one of them is stealing the excess money collected for Social Security and spending it, returning to the SS fund a huge pile of IOUs.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Jeri
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:26 PM

NOW there's a TAX on Jujubes! (Seriously, a "sugar tax".) I think that's probably Obama's fault. I know where I can get some that... uh... fell off a truck, if you really need some.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:20 PM

I sit corrected. Thank you. However, before anyone bronzes Clinton, I know for fact he didn't do shit about the price of jujubes. THAT'S the sign of a good leader. imo. And he along with his peers failed to do so. A pox on both their houses.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Jeri
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:16 PM

Just the jpg of the chart.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:07 PM

Right on, PDQ.

I haven't read the chart but lemme say this, because it ain't rocket surgery. When I was a kid jujubes were four for a penny. Today they cost near 4 cents EACH, if ya get a really good deal. Prices are rising. Economics 101.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Jeri
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:06 PM

I'd say Clinton inherited the debt from Bush (and Reagan, but the chart doesn't go back that far) and it decreased until it was zeroed out sometime 1997 - 1998, when a surplus began growing.

The problem, in my opinion, is also (as GUEST,999's) the two parties are so busy re-enforcing their political identities and sticking to "What makes a good Dem/Repub" that they can't see that extremes just don't work. Don't tax and spend like crazy, then spend some more doesn't work, and tax (mostly the wealthiest) and spend doesn't work... well it DOES work, but it sure pisses off people who don't want it to work or don't like that it does.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 01:00 PM

From a Google of

Presidential Approval Ratings History - Interactive Comparison ...



Despite negative economic forecasts and all the rue predicted for Democrats in November, President Obama's approval rating is actually faring better than Presidents Reagan and Clinton at this point in their terms, according to an analysis of data provided by the Gallup polling organization.

In a survey of approximately 1,500 adults nation-wide, Gallup said on Oct. 6 that Obama's approval rating was 48 percent. By comparison, Bill Clinton, the previous Democrat to reside in the White House, had a 42 percent approval rating at the same time in his presidency.

Republican icon Ronald Reagan, similarly, had an approval rating hovering around 42 percent at this time in his presidency, thanks to the country's languishing economy which was largely credited for a Republican loss of 28 House seats in 1982.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:56 PM

"When you paint with broad enough a brush, BB, you can say anything you like, but it becomes meaningless."

What , you mean like the comments HERE about "Republicans"???




None of the things you are saying are true about "Republicans" even when they may be true about some Republicans. There were intelligent and reasoning people in the Bush WHite House as well as outside it. Why not speak to them instead of joining the muckrakers and rabble-rousers and the merchants of fog, uncertainty, doubt, fear, and hatred?


Or don't you even see that the statments that are made here about Dems are a lot less vitriolic than those about Bush? Even when Obama has continued the SAME policies that Bush was castigated for?

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: pdq
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:53 PM

We need to get past the usual partisan crap and look at the facts.

Here is a graph of federal spending since 1967:

                                                                                                    What, me worry?

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:50 PM

Well, yes and no Jeri. He inherited a growing debt from Ron, and was able eventually to halt that growth under his administration. Georgie took it to new heights. It's still totally unreasonable that Obama, who's had two years, hasn't been able to clear that up. I think Doug R would agree with me.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Amos
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:44 PM

When you paint with broad enough a brush, BB, you can say anything you like, but it becomes meaningless.

None of the things you are saying are true about "Democrats" even when they may be true about some Democrats. There are intelligent and reasoning people in the WHite House as well as outside it. Why not speak to them instead of joining the muckrakers and rabble-rousers and the merchants of fog, uncertainty, doubt, fear, and hatred?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Jeri
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:43 PM

For the record, the "Willie" administration was the only time in recent history (or at least that which I remember) the budget WAS balanced. GWB is the one who blew that all to hell.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:37 PM

BeeBee, that has to rank up there with possible the largest pile of horseshit, distortion and lies that you've posted in - what .... a day or so?

You are to be congratulated for outdoing yourself.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:32 PM

Interesting to note that most people said similar things but from the other side when Bush's popularity was in the toilet. Y'all gotta learn to work together, because the two-party system has created a situation wherein most of you haven't been invited to the party. I wish you the best of luck.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:22 PM

Wild Willy and Georgie managed between the two administrations to get the USA in deep DEEP financial debt. Why would half-way reasonable people expect Obama to fix that in two years? You folks dream lots, or what?

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 12:06 PM

Strings,

If Democrats stay in the majority, this will spell disaster for our country because:
1. Democrats today are not bi-partisan.
2. They are the party of big Unions, Big government, Big taxes and Big mandates, and screw the working man and woman, and their children
3. They cheat and lie to get elected.
4. Democrats can stay in office for offenses that many here have said were impeachable, when done by Republicans. In fact, they are rewarded.
5. The U.S. Far Left will have a field day.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Amos
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 11:34 AM

HEre's an unpoular view of Obama and his administration:

Obama is a deeply intelligent, well-read and caring man striving to turn the huge mass of the nation away from the course of destruction on which it was set by Reagan, Bush, and the frothing manics of the right extreme. In doing so, he has probably been overly cautious so as not to seem reckless, and at the same time he has been badgered, clubbed, and thwarted at every possible opportunity by the petty, the vengeful, the psychotic, and the lustful who are the glut of Washington life. He is not ruining the country, but trying to reverse a ruination that was set upon it long ago. He is doing pretty well, but not as well as he should be doing. He is a good human being in an impossible position, forging ahead anyway. For these things he should be given dure credit. Instead he is libeled and lied about in every imaginable way by people who have done nothing to better the state of the nation, and who have no shame.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Stringsinger
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 11:30 AM

If Republicans are elected in the majority, this will spell disaster for our country because:
1. Republicans today are not bi-partisan.
2. They are the party of big business and screw the working man and woman
3. They cheat and lie to get elected.
4. Dems are punished for miscreant behavior such as Spitzer and Edwards whereas
Republicans can stay in office for the same offenses. In fact, they are rewarded.
5. The U.S. Military Junta will have a field day.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 11:20 AM

Right now or nation is being betrayed less by a two party system then by the unrestricted access that the wealthy have to the media, LH... As long as that continues a hundred parties won't change a thing...

Thomas Jefferson warned US that for this thing to have any chance of success oft would require that voters be "informed"... I don't believe that Jefferson would have thought that "brainwashed with garbage" and "informed" are one of the same...

"We want our country back" is not informed... "We want government off our backs" is not informed... These protests of "Obamacare", when most of the screamers couldn't begin to tell you what the health care reform bill contains is not "informed"...

Like they say, "Garbage in, garbage out..."

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 09:43 AM

Douggie's, you're finally losing it completely:

1. responding to a post from BeeBee as if it was from me.

2. And as far as "presesnting information that might support your statements", when have you ever done that? You're projecting again, as in:
The Obama who ran for president is not the Obama who is president. Once elected, he, and his liberal cohorts in the House and the Senate believed they had a mandate to move the country in a direction that the majority of the population do not agree with.... etc.

Subject: RE: BS: Unpopular Views of Obama Administration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Oct 10 - 09:12 AM

Sawzaw, I couldn't agree more with what you said. You have clearly expressed the problem.

"Society works when people find out what they agree on and build from there. People everywhere want basically the same things."

Exactly! Your nation is being betrayed by the battling 2-party system, the money-hungry sensationalist mass media, and the other divisive forces that are deliberately setting the public at each other's throats all the time. It's just a game they're playing. The game is divide and conquer, and they walk away with the profits.

And it seems to be getting worse all the time...I suppose because the usual media/entertainment game is always to stretch things to an even more ridiculous extreme than they did last time (as in action movies, for example)...just to get the viewers to tune in one more time.

What a sad situation it is. The people in the media should be ashamed of themselves. They are traitors to their own society, and they're doing it for the money.

*******

Obama's a very cerebral man and he is probably not accustomed to functioning in a system that relies more upon primitive dramatic histrionics and brief sound bites than upon calm reasoning...so I think he keeps bouncing back and forth between his own basic instincts (to talk calmly and analytically and at considerable length about something) and what his handlers are telling him ("Fire it up! You have to get to people's emotions with simple messages! Get mad!"). He's probably getting confused as hell by now. Who wouldn't be, in his position? ;-)

Anyway, I don't think he's really the boss. I think he's the figurehead, and the corporate/banking/military-industrial system that finances and plans all presidential elections is really the boss. So he has to move within the strict limits they place around him, in effect................or.......pay a price nobody would ever want to pay.