BS: Britain tops the yobs league

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 12:47 PM

I had the unfortunate experience of visiting a 82 year old man after he had been robbed of his few pounds, the evil scum who carried out the robbery also left this brave old man with an egg-sized lump on his face.
The three teenagers involved were apprehended shortly afterwards, when they were brought to court and sentenced not one of the sneering thugs expressed a word of remorse for the old man.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 02:53 PM

I rest my case.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Shields Folk
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 04:31 PM

Just a question Ard, based on your first post should the title of the thread be 'Britain and Ireland tops the yobs league' ?
Perhaps a Joe Clone could change the title ?

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 05:49 PM

From the 1966 thread:-
1966 - after the 'cup' a certain family moved into my village and I became baby sitter to two lovely children and official dog walker to a black and white mongrel dog called Pickles. Dreadful day when some young hooligans strung him up on a fence and left him to die a few years later.

You see in England - we have our traditions to uphold, and our culture. but we don't sing about them. We sing about the battle of Waterloo, or the green fields of wherever - which is violence of a more picturesque and acceptable kind. We sing as we all dance away to jigs and reels.

And that's why our folk culture is up shit creek, the paddle misplaced, the currents not in our favour. A disocciated sensibility.

Can't believe Ireland is as bad as England. they seem a bit more together than us culturally - more sure of themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: alanabit
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 03:48 AM

I also think it is right to turn the other cheek when assaulted... It is just that I think one should also turn one's hips at the same time, while trapping the assailants wrist and elbow...

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 04:26 AM

Shields Folk no problem with a change of Thread, but it won`t cure the scum that follow the English soccer teams at least our supporters behave well when abroad, your soccer fans have left a legacy of hate over mainland Europe,I admit Ireland has it`s problems with young drunken scum, whether it has reached the same peak as Britain is another matter and living in the north-east your opinion on drunken yobs would be appreciated.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 05:19 AM

I am in full agreement with you over the scum, Ard Mhacha. It seems however to have overflowed into our town centres as well so I am not fully convinced that football scum is the right term. Just scum would usualy more than suffice.

I work in view of Old Trafford - Just across the bridge in Salford Quays. The number of times I see hoardes of ignorant selfish young men creating fear and havoc in these parts is beyound belief. Sad thing is that it seems to be accepted behavior by some. "Oh, it's just high spirits" and "Football fans are very passionate about the game" is heard over and over. OK - These idiots are not vandalising. They are not fighting. They are not rioting. What they do though is take up the whole pavement and are completely oblivious, or uncaring, to the old man on a zimmer frame or the young mother with a pram who is forced to walk in the road. What they do is stop at the side of the nearest building and urinate, in full view of the policeman on his horse. What they do is barge into the local bars and by pure strength of numbers they push and intimidate the locals outside to make room for their loud and often foul mouthed chants of 'support'.

If you haven't gathered I am quite passionate about this. As I said earlier the trouble is it is no longer confined to the terraces and outside the grounds. Visit Manchester city centre any night after about 9pm - Particulary Friday and Saturday and you will see the same loutish behavior. The only difference is that they yobs are not wearing tribal colours but tribal designer outfits. And they are not just men, the women are equaly loutish.

The solution? Dunno. Off the top of my head. Zero tolerance? Curfew with serious tagging of offenders? Electric cattle prods? Hopefuly something will be done before long anyway.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 06:02 AM

Seeing is believing Dave, Shields Folk berates me for not including Ireland in the Thread heading, I did not conduct the survey, the British media gave this plenty of publicity and Ireland wasn`t included.

I am not hiding behind my nationality, I have seen our local scum taking over the streets every week-end, I had a visit a month ago from my two nephews both middle aged and from Sunderland, quite close to South Shields, they were both adamant that they wouldn`t go through Sunderland late at night on the week-end.

It seems we will have to live with this, Blair said he would ensure that the streets would be given back to the people, just like his WMDs lies, things have got worse.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 07:16 AM

Actually we had some yob trouble in our neighbourhood last christmas, and the cops were very responsive and helpful - there has been no recurrence.

I couldn't tell you whether things are getting better or worse - sure as hell is no fun to be at the receiving end of this sort of behaviour. Halloween passed this year without incident.

You know, I'm not at all sure it is the feral broods of lumpenproletariat at the bottom of this business. Some of the young buggers that gave us trouble, look quite well to do.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 18 Nov 06 - 12:48 PM

All you UK catters loOk in on Sunday night BBC1 when Panorama investigates the English youngsters binge drinking problems.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 18 Nov 06 - 01:29 PM

Must be good stuff this Binge. Anybody know where I can get a bottle or six?

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 18 Nov 06 - 01:30 PM

BTW - I noticed on the box today a report about soccer yobbery and racist violence in other European countries - Germany being one of them. Why no thread about German Football Hooligans?

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Nov 06 - 03:24 PM

Sunday night, no chance! we're all off on the piss..... Big folk music party somewhere in the environs of Monsall Head. everybody will be there. Theakston's Old Peculiar mixed with Pinot Grigio being the unthinking man's brain damage local tincture.....

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 04:19 AM

You swine Al - you know alcohol's off the menu for me!! ROFL!

Anyway, I ask again - why haven't any of our English-Haters started a thread about German thuggery and racism? Double-standards methinks (wouldn't you just know it!).

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: autolycus
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 05:08 AM

UK population grew 1951 - 2001 from 50.3 million to 59.1 million.

   So it did not double in that period. (Just type 'uk population 1951' into google).






       Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 07:05 AM

Is that Monsall Head, Derbyshire, Al? At the pub of the same name? If so how much folky stuff is on there coz I have access to a cottage just down the road:-)

Cheers

DtG

BTW - I don't think anyone will start a thread about German Hooligans SJ because it would not provoke a reaction amongst so many people. Not double standards, just standard journalistic practice. Same reason that no-one starts threads about Moslem peace workers or Christian extemists.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 09:29 AM

I was in Berlin two weeks ago and never encountered any drunken yobs for the whole of the weekend, picture the same scene in any of our towns on any weekend.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Alice
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 10:16 AM

I agree with kendall and his daughter. I grew up in a family where we respected our parents so much that just disappointing them with our behavior was painful enough punishment. I learned as a parent myself that when kids get hit, they think it is ok for them to hit people, too. Violence breeds violence, and there are more effective ways to teach appropriate behavior. Rewarding appropriate behavior is key. Starting when kids are toddlers is important, which means parents need to have those skills in the home.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Alice
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 10:27 AM

There are two popular American reality shows about parenting kids. Both bring British nannies in to American homes where the kids are out of control. "Nanny 911" and "Super Nanny". It all comes down to TRAINING THE PARENTS in parenting techniques that teach kids appropriate behavior. Parents have to be taught how to parent effectively if they haven't figured it out from their own experience.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Mr Red
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 10:52 AM

Call me a fascist but...... It is about time we topped the yobs

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 01:54 PM

Fair enough: "Fascist."

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Alice
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 02:01 PM

Here's a question, what's a Yob? Juvenile delinquent?

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 02:32 PM

A backward boy, Alice! A play on spelling and meaning, which in the UK is a colloquialism for a hooligan.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 02:34 PM

Backslang for Boy. Means an unpleasant sort of boy or young man. Most of us have been like that from time to time, some people seem to be like that most of the time.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Nov 06 - 06:22 PM

I must say, adding to Ard Mhacha's comments, I was in Stuttgart some years ago and experienced quite an interesting thing. There were dozens of young men staggering around the town, blind drunk. Appararantly they were the latest release from conscription in the army. They were all wearing tattered white shirts with writing all over them - messages from friends apparartly, and were all chanting and singing very loudly in the bars and squares of the town.

Funny thing was that every time they encountered anyone else at close quarters they became very calm and polite. I saw then kissing the hands of old ladies and buying beers for elderly men in the bars. When I came across a group of about 20 wandering in the opposite direction from me in the main square they all parted and let me through with a smile and a wave. I asked a couple that came and sat with me in the next bar I was in what it was all about and they said it was a regular event that they looked forward to.

Far cry from the idiots that stalk my home town. The local council try to contol them by banning pavement drinking and stopping glass vessels in bars. Wonder why the bars in Stuttgart are OK with outside tables and proper glasses but those in Manchester are not?

Beyond me but, even though I am generaly proud to be English, I will certainly not become an appologist or excuse maker for the behaviour of English yobs.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 08:24 AM

Unlike some others on this Thread Dave, you are not burying your head in the sand regarding the young scum that take over our towns at the weekend.
I have last nights Panaroma programme on tape and will look at it later, it will be interesting to see if they have a solution for the drink problem with our yobs.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 10:50 AM

"Our yobs" when you're talking about "Britain", ard macha?

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 12:01 PM

Ard, the PC namby-pambies won't allow what the little bastards really need - a bloody good dose of the birch.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 01:09 PM

I have just seen the Panorama programme, the feeling I got after viewing this horror film was one of absolute hopelessness, you had to feel sorry for the parents from the Bristol area, who had tried everything to control their two daughters, this was made impossible by the company they kept,and the same dilemma applied to the other towns featured.

Children as young as 11 years old were treated for excess drinking in hospitals throughout the land, liver disease at one time a disease associated with adults is now common with people in their early twenties.

This programme made very depressing viewing especially the shots of the young people in the various towns staggering around and being sick on the pavements, anyone got any ideas as to how this can be curbed?, as the programme makers never came up with any solutions.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 01:15 PM

Sorry McGrath to disillusion you but the problem is not confined to the UK alone, Ireland has the problem also.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 01:23 PM

Anyone wishing to view this Panorama programme go to BBC and type in Panorama in Search.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 01:45 PM

I know it is, ard Macha, and it's a crying shame. But "Britain" is a separate island from Ireland, even the bit that is still in the UK.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 02:14 PM

If hair splitting was a cure for the disease our worries at both sides of the dub would be over.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 03:14 PM

The young lady reporter seemed to be terrified, the towns looked like a film set of Sodom and Gomorrah, amazing.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 03:42 PM

Having seen many late nights in Europe recently I only wish the Irish youth mob culture could learn a bit from the Europeans. I can't speak about other parts of Britain, but I can speak for my own home town. Some of our youth are lawless and know the police simply can't be bothered. If they pull a couple of them in they are faced with a mound of paperwork, phoning social workers, solicitors and on call doctors. These thugs know the system inside out and know their rights and call all on all available services simply to mess them about.

I have spoken to French, German, Italian and Spanish landlords is various cities recently and none face what I see weekly in my hometown.

The faults are with the law, youth today can milk them, laugh at them and flaunt them. We won't reverse it now I am sorry to say.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Shields Folk
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 04:02 PM

Two of Mudcats most prominent Irish Republicans suggesting/accepting that Ireland is part of Britain.

The World turned upside down!

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 04:13 PM

Ah come on Shields, I'm a new man since July 2005. Hope your well.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Shields Folk
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 04:15 PM

Do you know I had noticed.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 04:22 PM

Thanks, still a lot of places free in the Divis fan club though !

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 04:50 PM

Shields have another look at this Thread and while you are at it have a look at the scum that frequent your town at weekends, are you another one-eyed limey.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Shields Folk
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 04:56 PM

I understand the point you made, there are a load of scum on our streets. I just thought that you were unfair labelling the thread "Britain".

That was until I realised that you included Ireland under the British umberella.

(..and to be truthful I'm a four eyed limey)

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 05:03 PM

Again Shields I did not make the survey as you can see from my header, it did include all of Europe, maybe not tops at sports but this is better than nowt.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Shields Folk
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 05:17 PM

"In case some worthy Brit accuses me of bias I can tell them that the condemnation in that report also applies to Ireland, all 32 counties."

"...Shields Folk berates me for not including Ireland in the Thread heading, I did not conduct the survey, the British media gave this plenty of publicity and Ireland wasn`t included."

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 20 Nov 06 - 06:20 PM

David Cameron is right. All they need is love, but its important that its the right kind of love.

If we gave them all free access to an adult channel, they would all be too tired to cause trouble. And what fun they'd have!

Anal sex could also be an imaginative solution to these restless young folk. If they were all walking round zonked out of their head on heavy medication with a vibrator up their arses, I feel we might be a significant part of the way, to a solution.

It would mean their probation officers and social workers multi-tasking. They could change the batteries, whenever they checked their security tags.

Just like it says on the Jeremy Kyle Show, we've got to be there for them, with tough love....cos after all these young folk are our future.

Well not our future, cos we'll be dead by then.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 21 Nov 06 - 04:05 AM

There is a saying in the north-east when someone is an irritant, "go to Shields", but nowadays avoid the weekend.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: ard mhacha
Date: 21 Nov 06 - 06:54 AM

The Blair government has just announced a new £4 million scheme called"Super Nannies" will be launched in 77 areas of England which have high levels of anti social behaviour.
A Mori poll result 85% gives parents as the main cause.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Nov 06 - 07:06 AM

I do not.
There have always been inadequate parents.
Their kids will always have misbehaved at home.
Now the kids misbehave at school and in the street as well.
People do not change. We must look elsewhere for the cause.

Schools used to do a good job of instilling a respect for authority at an early and formative stage, whatever the home situation.
Now they just try to be nice and friendly, then hope the parents can help when the kids go wrong.
Usually they can't.

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: GUEST,memyself
Date: 21 Nov 06 - 09:20 AM

Don't blame the schools - and I'm not saying you necessarily are - if they're like the schools in Canada, and I'm assuming to some extent they are, they've had much of their authority taken out of their hands. I don't go in for the ol' "let's beat them into submission" approach that seems popular on this thread, but it is helpful if young people feel that those in positions of authority actually have some sort of power.

And while many blame the situation in the schools on policies imposed by the state, parents in general DO NOT want their children to be subjected to any sort of discipline in school. Yes, they want eveyone else's children to be subjected to discipline but they want their own little angels to be free to behave in whatever manner they like. As a teacher, I have seen intelligent, well-educated, rational, socially-responsible citizens turn into raving, slobbering idiots when confronted with the vicious accusation that their teen-aged infants have done something inappropriate. Often the same people you hear longing for the days when you would be afraid to go home and tell your parents if you got into trouble at school ...

As a teacher, every time you consider disciplinary action, you have to weigh the possibility that you will be commencing a ten-year war of attrition with vengeful parents and perhaps an extended family as well.

(Yes, a little frustration coming out here ... )

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Nov 06 - 10:02 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Britain tops the yobs league
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Nov 06 - 10:07 AM

100!