Rachel Unthank & The Winterset

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: black walnut
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 10:24 AM

LAST NIGHT - TORONTO CANADA SHOW - FABULOUS - ABSOLUTELY FABULOUS!!!!!!

~b.w.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,caitlín
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 09:19 PM

You must have a very short attention span. Or else you read selectively. Not all of this thread is vitriolic crap - even at the beginning which is the only bit you could be bothered with. And not all the negative comments are vitriolic. People have a right to prefer what they prefer.

I've always liked their music, but not everyone does. I can live with that. But you probably feel better now you've sorted us all out.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Brian James
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 07:13 PM

Read some of the thread at the beginning. When I realised it was vitriolic crap from a bunch of saddo's, I scrolled down to the bottom to add my comment rather than read the rest. There are some great songs on the Bairns album. Having a short attention span, I really like some of the the distinctive sounds. As a middle aged man, I better get used to performers younger than myself, or I'm in for a lonely old age musically. And like the music or not, abuse is not the same thing as critique.

Brian James

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Alio
Date: 24 Jul 08 - 01:43 PM

Rachel and the band are appearing at Shaw Playhouse 2 Theatre again - Thursday, July 31, as part of the Oldham 7 Songs event (7 concerts in 7 different places). I'll be playing some tracks from their latest album on Sounds of Folk Monday evening.

She and her sister are very down to earth, and certainly have their own views on everything, so there's no way they'd let a mere man tell them what to wear!!

Ali

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: black walnut
Date: 24 Jul 08 - 11:43 AM

Thanks for sharing that announcement, Folknacious! I wouldn't have otherwise known...over here on the other side of the pond. That's great!

Now I REALLY REALLY can't wait to hear them live in Toronto!!

~b.w.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: dj bass
Date: 23 Jul 08 - 07:01 PM

OOps, no I won't, they aren't on at Sidmouth. I must have imagined that!

dj

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: dj bass
Date: 23 Jul 08 - 11:24 AM

I saw RUATW at Exeter a while back. The Bairns is a terrific album, but nowhere near as good as they are live. I'll be going out of my way to see Rachel at Sidmouth the week after next, when I'm sure I won't be short of other things to do!

DJ

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Folknacious
Date: 22 Jul 08 - 06:31 PM

Rachel Unthank & The Winterset got a nomination in the Mercury Music Prize today (for The Bairns).

Story here

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Folkiedave
Date: 07 Jul 08 - 04:48 AM

"They said what they wanted to say on their own message board."

I meant interview of course.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: glueman
Date: 07 Jul 08 - 03:40 AM

"They said what they wanted to say on their own message board."

I didn't realise they had one of those already. They are certainly going places.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,jane hogg
Date: 07 Jul 08 - 03:11 AM

Gosh, I seems to have caused offence here which was unintended. I'm sure they will all do great things and are doing already!

JH

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Folkiedave
Date: 06 Jul 08 - 05:31 PM

Having seen them perform at Gate to Southwell, Wychwood and Dent in the last few weeks or so, the answer about message boards can be gathered from their replies on here.

Or not as the case might be.

They said what they wanted to say on their own message board. But people seem to know better.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: glueman
Date: 06 Jul 08 - 03:37 PM

FWIW I reckon Belinda and Rachel are both excellent performers. Questions surrounding arrivals and departures are inevitable and the 'press release' after Belinda left could have been handled better, IMO. Things like that make it seem like the Winterset is a vehicle for Rachel's voice and persona rather than a band.
I doubt very much whether anyone involved gives a flying one what people on a folk message board think, that isn't their bag. Is it?

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Folkiedave
Date: 06 Jul 08 - 05:24 AM

Colin, do not try pointing out facts from the people who know like - Rachel herself. Not good enough for Mudcat.

And this thread - which I must say I thought was moribund - was revived by someone whol ikes them!!

With friends like these...................

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Colin Randall
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 10:22 PM

Just when you thought Mudcat had regained its senses, the more ludicrous "I don't like 'em so they're crap/sold out to EMI/shafted Belinda" theorists are out and about again.
For the record, this is what Rachel had to say about the debate in her interview with me for Salut! Live


"I do try and avoid message boards as a rule, but you intrigued me so I had a look. Well, what can I say! People are truly divided, it's quite unsettling to be the subject of such controversy! Some people obviously think we can't sing for toffee whilst others think we are breath of fresh air!?! In our defence we do like a clashy harmony or two and enjoy bending the odd few notes. But who am I to say? As for the EMI debate, mmm I don't quite get it. Maybe people aren't aware that it only a licensing deal we have with them. We researched, recorded, produced our album ourselves on a limited budget and a vocal booth which consisted of our under the stairs cupboard. We have complete artistic control in everything from music to artwork and definitely pick our own frocks! I am tempted to think that some people in their internet universe may not be aware of the current fashions in the outside world, it's not unusual for young women to wear frocks!! However, this is probably very judgemental of me, I shouldn't join their ranks! Perhaps we should start wearing jeans and woolly jumpers on stage to look a bit more authentic. Quite seriously though, people might think that wearing posh dresses is about marketing and glamour, but with us I think it comes more from of an old fashioned, working class hang up of always wearing your best frock when in public, and by god if standing on a stage isn't a good excuse to get your spangles out, then what is! As for Belinda, none of us wanted her to leave the band and EMI certainly didn't push her out. She has been an important part of our soundscape and we've loved having her in the band. The creative process has always involved the five of us however (me, Becky, Niopha, Adrian and Belinda), and was never led by one individual. I'm sure our sound will change, but her departure won't signify a sudden dearth of creative ideas. Just been back to Mudcat and it's all turned a bit vicious!! I suppose reading these chat rooms is a bit like over hearing people talking about you in a bar. Sometimes it'll be a pleasant experience, sometimes not. I think I might avoid them in future though. It's a bit like they don't think we are real people, just sport. It's important not to believe the hype about yourself or the mud slinging if you are going to remain sane."

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Folkiedave
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 06:52 PM

Jackie Oates and Belinda O'Hooley have real talent. Make of that what you will

What does that say about Niopha and Steph then?

Whereas Rachel and Becky after five years of succesful singing in public don't have real talent - it's just that the audiences that go to see them often on a repeat basis haven't got any taste. It's just that festival organisers who book them all over Europe and elsewhere haven't got a clue what they are doing.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Folknacious
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 05:39 PM

Hi Belinda

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,more of the same
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 04:34 PM

exactly - perhaps they aren't so easily controlled...

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Lord Batman's Kitchener
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 01:20 PM

Jackie Oates and Belinda O'Hooley have real talent. Make of that what you will

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,More of the same
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 01:06 PM

"Could there be more to Jackie Oates and Belinda O'Hooley leaving this band than what has been written on the band's myspace? Perhaps the degree of control exerted on the band was not seen by all as favourable? It seems odd that two such talented people that helped create their individual stark sound didn't stick around to enjoy the success of recent times for the band."

Jackie and Belinda were both sacked by Adrian, they didn't leave. Make of that what you will.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Folkiedave
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 10:54 AM

I do however think it a shame that such talented women have to be driven, organised, recorded, told what to wear, sing, by their manager/sound engineer, bus driver, fiance, record company owner adrian mcnally.

Rachel has been with Adrian for over five years at least since when when I first came across her and Becky singing together as a duo - in 2003. I'd let her make her own mind up.

As for most of the functions you are talking about there - that's what some managers do. Otherwise they drive themselves? I see nothing "controlling" in driving them, organising them, etc. Unless you want them to do it - or a succession of complete strangers. Which would you prefer - a fiance or a stranger?

Adrian has been doing their sound for all that time for them and other groups.

As for telling them what to wear etc. - if he is controlling four young intelligent women and telling them what to do - then he is doing better than 99.99% of all the men I have ever known. I suppose it's possible but if true, quite an insult to the girls I'd say.

I seem to think there was some ccorrespondence on here claiming that Adrian had sold them out to EMI. Now he gets the blame for controlling them. I suspect that the truth is neither.

Rachel and Becky's Dad George went on their Australian tour - does he get some of the blame too?

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,jane hogg
Date: 05 Jul 08 - 07:24 AM

I hope people don't mind if I express my opinion on this subject.

I'm a big fan of rachel unthank & the winterset - I find their music captivating and engaging, especially the passion and honesty in rachel and becky's voices against the stark musical background of piano and fiddle.

I do however think it a shame that such talented women have to be driven, organised, recorded, told what to wear, sing, by their manager/sound engineer, bus driver, fiance, record company owner adrian mcnally. It reminds me of the svengali managers of the 1970's and also worries me that such an admission of his power by rachel on stage, though humerous, suggests they are completely dependent on him. Always better to keep your options open in my opinion.

Could there be more to Jackie Oates and Belinda O'Hooley leaving this band than what has been written on the band's myspace? Perhaps the degree of control exerted on the band was not seen by all as favourable? It seems odd that two such talented people that helped create their individual stark sound didn't stick around to enjoy the success of recent times for the band.

That said, I think the winterset are hugely talented women and look forward to their next project.

JH

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Colin Randall
Date: 19 Jun 08 - 12:15 AM

Suegorgeous:

The first part of the Rachel Unthank interview at Salut! Live should be accessible at....

http://www.salutlive.com/2008/02/rachel-unthank.html

The article contains links to the subsequent instalments. Each of the three parts also has its own link down the right hand sidebar when you reach any page of the site, which is at http://salutlive.com

I knew people sometimes had trouble reaching my sites here in Abu Dhabi, which I attribute to the UAE's disapproval of Flickr (which I sometimes use), but this is the first time I have heard of anyone being unable to get into them from West.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 18 Jun 08 - 08:39 PM

Oh...and I couldn't get any of the links to Colin's interview with Rachel to work, and on his site I couldn't find the interview. Please can someone hand it to me on a plate? :)

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 18 Jun 08 - 08:37 PM

I saw them last week at Bristol's Venn Festival - loved their live performance (and slightly disappointed that the CD I bought there didn't quite live up to it). I really enjoyed their voices and harmonies - didn't hear one wrong note, and the passion and engagement were unmistakeable.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: black walnut
Date: 18 Jun 08 - 08:09 AM

SEPTEMBER 23 - 2008 Just announced - Rachel Unthank and The Winterset at Hugh's Room in Toronto! We've already got our tickets. I'm so glad they're crossing the ocean to sing at a great folk venue!!!

~b.w.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: glueman
Date: 31 May 08 - 06:04 AM

Elvish or Chaucer?

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: the button
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:24 PM

Just got back from the Shaw Theatre, and they were the best I've seen them yet -- they've really come on since the tour to promote The Bairns (when I first saw them "live").

If anything, they were a bit more "traddie" than they used to be -- we had more unaccompanied stuff, including a song about whaling I haven't heard before (thought I knew 'em all ;-)) sung by the sisters with different (and breathtaking) harmonies for every verse. They also gave the fiddler a solo spot, singing something in a mixture of Irish and English, and all unaccompanied. Lovely stuff.

Maybe it was the venue or just a good night, but Becky's voice tonight was a revelation. I've always preferred her voice to Rachel's, but tonight she was amazing.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Euthryphro
Date: 12 May 08 - 02:38 PM

I'm glad someone else has mentioned Adrian McNally; his influence is common knowledge amongst those who would claim to be "in the know", but the wider world seems to miss this. "Single-minded" is one way to put it, certainly!

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Rasener
Date: 12 May 08 - 12:15 PM

Yes, I know, so thought maybe somebody who has a subscription, might be able to do it.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: glueman
Date: 12 May 08 - 11:19 AM

A search on The Express web site for 'Rachel Unthank' revealed a fat zero.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Rasener
Date: 12 May 08 - 11:15 AM

Graeme it wasn't that review.

It was written by Charlotte Heathcote and the heading was Unthank-you for the music and it is on page 74/75 of the Sunday Express on May 11th 2008.

Its too much for me to type. There is a big photo of them walking around at the Criche Tram festival.

I don't know if anybody can magic up the article.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Graeme
Date: 12 May 08 - 09:44 AM

I think the article might be the one on their website

http://www.rachelunthank.com

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: black walnut
Date: 12 May 08 - 09:34 AM

The Villan - would it be possible to copy/paste or otherwise post?

~b.w.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Rasener
Date: 12 May 08 - 08:55 AM

There was a big write up in the (I think) Saturday Express about them last weekend.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: the button
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:46 AM

Off to see them tonight at the Shaw Theatre in London.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Graeme
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:43 AM

Saw them at The Round in Ouseburn last night. I first heard them when my wife got The Bairns and was quite impressed but not totally overwhelmed. However seeing them live was something else. They seemed to genuinely enjoy performing and had a honesty and innocence that captivated the audience.

I don't understand this attitude that a folk act can't be successful or popular, if more people get into the music because of band like the Winterset than that can only be a good thing.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,glueman
Date: 04 Apr 08 - 10:59 AM

Belinda added much needed acid to the brew, it's a shame she's gone although it's hard to see such a larger than life person staying in that set up. I hope she doesn't disappear into musical ghettoes licking her wounds for too long, she's much too talented.
Rachel seems a personable young woman and she undoubtedly has something and not only things the camera likes. The jaded me sees the Winterset fading and Rachel going very mainstream but that's not necessarily a swear word in my book.
I don't know whether there was a hint that I'd bumped the thread for commercial reasons, I'm just a music buying punter. Good luck to all concerned.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: the button
Date: 04 Apr 08 - 08:34 AM

Oops. Thanks for that. I really should know, since I'm on *Belinda's* e-mail list.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Cardboard cutout
Date: 04 Apr 08 - 08:24 AM

Loath though I am to return this to the top of the threads for yet more attention, I have to say it's interesting that this thread has been resurrected just when the band return to the Northern Hemisphere: steered by a folk Svengali indeed.

Most of what Guest "glueman" says is accurate.

And, "the button", it's Belinda, not "Brenda", that was previously in the Unthanked band.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: the button
Date: 04 Apr 08 - 07:44 AM

I'm off to see them on 23 April for an "alternative St George's Day" thingy at The Barbican. Looking forward to seeing how they sound without Brenda.

(Billy Bragg's also appearing, but hopefully he'll be on last, so me & my good lady can sneak out. ;-)).

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Rasener
Date: 04 Apr 08 - 07:29 AM

I am looking forward to seeing them at The Gate To Southwell Folk Festival soon, for the first time.
I will be watching them with an open mind.

I can only make the a similar comment as I did for Kate Rusby recently

"If you like what Rachel Unthank & The Winterset do, then enjoy and bollocks to anybody else."

So if you don't like them, get off their backs and concentrate on the performers you do like.

I often suspect that people who make such nasty comments about performers are not fit enough to fill the boots of the performers they are criticising and could just be plain jealousy.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,glueman
Date: 04 Apr 08 - 05:39 AM

This feels like digging up a dead thread but an opinion is forcing its way out. Much of the vitriol is down to two things IMO, firstly that Rachel is marketable and secondly the band appear to be the 'creation' of Adrian McNally. A folk Svengali may be an oxymoron but reading between the lines that looks like what we have, someone who's seen an untutored purity in Rachel's voice and has invented a format to accomodate it.
Admittedly its a creaky, impure commodity which is probably what the wider world finds so attractive and enthusiasts compare unfavourably to exemplars. Would the band be popular if Rachel looked like the back end of a bus? No. Would they be crossing over without McNally's single mindedness? Very doubtful, they'd probably be doing a singaround upstairs in a boozer. Are they any good? Certainly.
A lot of this thread reads like the columns in the music press when punk emerged; rock people missing the point and using virtuosity as the only yardstick.

If the band encourage more people to listen or even to play traditional music more power to them. These are just views, I know now't.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Pete Sumner
Date: 03 Feb 08 - 11:51 PM

I'll be glad when it stops snowing and blowing over there so some of the sad sods who have contributed to this thread can get out more....this sort of stuff really smokes them out doesn't it?

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Cuddles
Date: 03 Feb 08 - 08:02 AM

I think they look very pretty. Nowt wrong with that, each to their own.

I wish they'd sing some more cheerful songs though, going by what's on their Myspace page I feel like Eeyore all of a sudden. Those songs are all so gloomy.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Chris Murray
Date: 03 Feb 08 - 07:52 AM

Rachel Unthank and the Winterset is my favourite band at the moment. I was sad when Jackie Oates left and I'm gutted that Belinda has left. I wonder if they'll still be playing her songs?

I don't see why any of us thinks we've got the right to criticise the way they dress. The first time I saw them, Becky had some new shoes which she liked because they had red spots on and a bow. She insisted on showing them to the audience so we could admire them.

They are brilliant musicians, red shoes or not. I actaully think it's quite nice when musicians dress up to perform, but it doesn't deter from the music in any way.

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: Gene Burton
Date: 02 Feb 08 - 05:50 PM

200

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's Apprentice
Date: 02 Feb 08 - 05:34 PM

"I have found this material to be outside what I would personally think of as folk"

As much as I've read about Show of Hands, the only people I've ever seen refer to them as folk are the "folkies" No where have I seen either gentleman that make up Show of Hands refer to themselves as folk musicians. Actually, it all comes back to a person's personal definition of folk, and that's an arguement that will never be settled.

Charlotte (just plain folks)

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 08 - 05:33 PM

OT but re "good enough for folk".

Personally I'm glad that folk music is capable of allowing participation at all levels of ability and can be friendly and encouraging for beginners. This to me is a special feature of folk music.

What I don't get on with are interpretations that work along the lines of:

"folk is not worth the effort of trying your best at"

or

"as it's folk, there should be no "entry level" requirement for participation/performance at any event".

Subject: RE: Rachel Unthank & The Winterset
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 02 Feb 08 - 05:22 PM

Not to me re SOH. I go a step worse as not only do I not particularly enjoy what I've heard of their theirs, I have found this material to be outside what I would personally think of as folk. But that leads to other suggestions, eg. You don't like listening to it because you don't think it's folk...

What I've heard of RUATW is actually well within what I would normally consider to be folk and I don't think they are that bad. I don't dispute the backgrounds of the sisters either.

Whether marketing can elevate a group I find "competent but average" and whether things may be explained simply by matters of tastes matching (or otherwise) are things I do ponder. And I believe I tried to express earlier in this thread.

Diane's comments in reply to me were of most interest to me in this thread. She indicated she finds them better live than on CD. Perhaps I'd find the same. Who knows?