BS: Prince Harry - What a star!

Subject: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:06 AM

Well, he finally managed it, until a Yank blew his cover. 10weeks on active service in Afghanistan. God bless her Majesty and Prince Harry. Hip hip.

                         The true path.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:10 AM

I agree with you.He is third in line let him have a career which he wants to do.

Well done Harry.


Scooby.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: theleveller
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:20 AM

Can't see what all the fuss is about. He's a career soldier. He goes where career soldiers go. Big deal!

Sooner we get rid of these disfunctional wasters who consider themselves our 'betters' the better for all of us.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:21 AM

Just one of the lads, is he? The report I saw here said he got to order bombings and air strikes, and he whined about no beer.

What a transformation.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:25 AM

Good on him for going out there. He may be a soldier but he is also 3rd in line to the throne and reports last year were saying that they didn't want him to be out there. He didn't have to go to the front line he could have had some cushy desk job back in the UK.

All the men and women out there do a grand job. My brother is due to go out to Afgahnistan in the next couple of months.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:30 AM

How nice he gets a choice in the matter. Just like all the other soldiers get to pick their assignments, I'm sure.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:39 AM

Maybe he has found his niche in life? Go and have a punch-up with some foreigners, eh, lad? Can't do that on a Saturday night in Windsor, eh?

But it does seem pretty irresponsible of any pressman to reveal his whereabouts, as a strike that got him would be a big propaganda coup for the Afghan insurgents.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:49 AM

Yes, but he does have that one thing going for him that will make it hard for the insurgents to pick him out of the crowd--all royals look alike to them.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:51 AM

How nice he gets a choice in the matter. He doesn't really, does he? As this fuss shows - no sooner does it get leaked that he's there than he gets yanked away, with no say in the matter.

Essentially the royals are a family of publicly-owned slaves, provided with very luxurious facilities, but there to do whatever their masters wish, including serving as a butt for our jokes, and with very little choice about most things, when push comes to shove.

I can't see where the rancour comes in - they are only there because the public wants them, it's not their doing.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:52 AM

Hmmm. Well, you don't see Dumbya or any of the chickenhawk BuShites putting their children in harm's way, do you?

Good on him.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: bankley
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:00 AM

Harry for President.... well, Harry the 2nd.... Truman was the first,,,, but they both liked to blow things up....

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:02 AM

You are really appalling with that comparison to slavery McGrath. Really god damned appalling.

Here is the thing. Any member of the royal family can walk away from it all at any time. Thing is, they are only in it for the money. And it is quite the friggin' paycheck.

So don't try and pull the 'poor, pitiful royal' crap here. He isn't a hero, just because he serves, anymore than any other daft idiot is.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: bobad
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:08 AM

Well, I suppose he could be doing something more meaningful with his life like pissing and moaning about other's career choices on an internet discussion forum.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Jeri
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:10 AM

Last night when I heard the story, they named Matt Drudge. Today, the news channels I've watched are saying 'a reporter'. The British sources don't seem to be afraid to name Drudge.

A lawsuit or other legal action based on putting lives in danger wouldn't be unreasonable.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: alanabit
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:23 AM

No Guest, McGrath is completely right. I dislike the institution of royalty intensely, but I would not swap places with one of the poor bastards for all the Martins in Music Store. It's a crap job.
Now that some shithead in the press has blown his cover, Harry Windsor has to suffer the ignomony of being airlifted away from his mates, with whom he has trained and worked for months. He may be a yob in uniform, but he has a sense of loyalty to his mates and he is not chicken. (A remarkable contrast to Republican hawks, who send other peoples' kids into danger).
As it happens, I don't think there should be any British (or US) troops in Afghanistan. However, I don't see why a career soldier should not be allowed to follow his chosen career.
In principle, taking cheap shots at the royals for being born royals is no better than attacking someone for being born poor, gay, Black or Thalidomide. Tell me, what influence did you have in the circumstances of your own birth?

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Grab
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:28 AM

What choice, Guest? He was *posted* there. And he *requested* a posting to Iraq (as any soldier is entitled to request a posting) and was turned down. Yes, he was coordinating air support. That's one thing you'll find a trained Army officer doing. You won't find proper Army officers who take pride in spending their whole career polishing a chair with their arse. And that's the point - Harry either wanted to do this properly with no special privileges, or not at all.

The fuss is about two things really. Firstly that some shitbag reporter leaked this, endangering Harry and his unit. And secondly that people like Guest insist on their preconception that he's wrapped in cotton wool and goes everywhere with some servant strewing his way with rose petals, which this plainly shows is complete fiction.

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:39 AM

I wouldn't wish life in that fishbowl on my worst enemy. Well, maybe I would. . . ;-D

Perhaps from his perspective he was hit by civilian press flak instead of Taliban flak.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: theleveller
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:46 AM

How many royals does it take to change a lightbulb?

None, of course. What does one think one has servants for?

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Leadfingers
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 09:59 AM

It must be REALLY comforting to be able to be as rude as you like in a public forum , knowing that as an anonymous guest no one can get back at you . At least theleveller is posting under his mudcat handle

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Big Mick
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 10:17 AM

So many axes being ground at the same time in this thread.

Gigi is using one of her oldest tactics. She is completely opposed to the use of the military, finds any justification for it to be reprehensible, finds any glorification of the soldiers to be repugnant and a tool used by the ruling class/elite/royalty to control people. Intellectually she believes she has the high ground. I don't necessarily disagree with much of her purely philosophical arguments, as to the intent of those who continue to throw the fodder of workers and less fortunate on the fire of their own ambitions. I do, however, part with her on several distinctive points.

I do believe there are just causes worth fighting for. I also believe there are causes that are not as clear a choice, but that we sometimes are pushed into. These are always examined in hindsight, and we can learn much from them. Due to the imperfect human condition, and different interests being at odds with each other, we will always have armed conflict. Would that it were not so, but there it is.

Another of her tactics that I disagree with is the attacking of the young men and women who follow what they believe to be their duty. I have been one of these young warriors. I have fought along side of, and against, young men and women who truly believed in what they were doing. The fact that history has either proved their sacrifice as justified and worthwhile, or unjustified and not, should not lessen our admiration for, and support of them when they come home. The rule of law is what we live by, and we should not castigate young folks for doing what they believe to be the right thing to do. I understand clearly that many are forced into this by economic and social conditions, but this ought strengthen our resolve to honor these young people, not castigate them, and the memory of those who did not come home.

There is also an argument happening about the worth of the royals. I don't have a dog in that fight, other than a historical one in that I am an American, and that I am of Irish Republican stock. Hence, the value of the royals is for the Brits to debate.

Finally, the issue of this young prince. I must admit that I admire him a great deal. Sure he has advantages, but that is not of his doing. In fact, he has often decried these, wishing he could live a more normal life. If what I am understanding of his deployment is true, the High Command denied his requests repeatedly, and then relented to him, but only on the condition that he could cut the deal with the press that would allow him not to put his squad in danger for simply serving with him. He did this. Without regard to whatever else one wants to say about royals, this is a young man of character who wanted to have the costume that he is forced to wear to mean something. He did not want his squad to sacrifice more than he had to. As much as was possible, he forced this to happen. I suspect that if he could stay, he would. Good for him, he is different and has values I admire. He is a credit to the British, to his family, and specifically, a credit to his Mother's memory.

As to Matt Drudge, or whomever leaked this, you are scum. I guess it is too much to expect journalists these days to resist the story, but it would be wonderful to see integrity and honor in journalism once again. Did you give no thought to the fact that your reporting could have gotten someone killed? Could you not put aside your ambitions in the interests of not putting someones family member at risk? Sadly, I think that day has come and gone when there is much deep thought given to much other than the sensational and self interest.

All the best,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: theleveller
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 10:21 AM

Yup, and with a name like theleveller, everyone has to know I'm a republican (small 'r').

BTW I never say anything on message boards I wouldn't say to anyone's face (got the scars to prove it!).

Bet Harry's not existing just on his army pay – that wouldn't buy a round of drinks in Annabelle's.

Which reminds me; there was a nice cartoon in Metro today: one Taliban to another – "If Harry's so close, maybe we should open a nightclub".

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 10:21 AM

Nevertheless, I do feel the situation was more under control when he was ligging round London , dressing up as a Nazi and taking drugs.

it was playing with fire sending him out there, really bloody silly. The war with all its spin-offs of race relations in this country is quite inflammatory enough. if he'd appeared in a dvd , having head hacked off - it would have been the equivalent of if we'd hanged an IRA terrorist at the height of the troubles. Our communities would have been rocked.

I can't believe the late Princess Diana would have approved.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Big Mick
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 10:27 AM

One more observation, with regard to GUEST,Guest. Since we have instituted the rule that even Guests must post with a consistent handle, she has honored that. Her posts have, for the most part, stuck with the rule that there not be personal attacks. While we may not like the tone at times, nonetheless she pursues her points aggressively and without personal attack. In retrospect, her tone is no worse than mine has been at times, as well as others. I would ask the question: As long as she is using a consistent handle, not sniping from the unknown, how is she any different than anyone else using something other than their real name?

So let's don't get bogged down in that, and move on with the discussion. Have no fear. Posts without a consistent handle will be removed, as will personal attacks.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,Bob Ryszkiewicz
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 10:32 AM

PEACE...

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 10:40 AM

Running the place all on your own, now, are ya, Mick?:-)

One difference is as long as someone posts as a "guest" with a handle or not, we have no way of knowing if it is consistently the same person or not. ANY guest could use that handle as you well know. Sure we might be able to spot the rhetoric style, but one never knows. By contrast the likelihood of two different people posting as, for instance, Big Mick or katlaughing, etc. is rare, these days.

As for Harry, good for him and shame on the idiots who claim to be journalists.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Teribus
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 10:42 AM

"Here is the thing. Any member of the royal family can walk away from it all at any time. Thing is, they are only in it for the money. And it is quite the friggin' paycheck." - by WTFK?

Here is the thing:
"Any member of the royal family can walk away from it all at any time."

Eh? No they can't - classic example - Mountbatten.

Thing is:
"they are only in it for the money. And it is quite the friggin' paycheck."

Eh? No. As a member of the Royal Family Harry may or may not be entitled to money from what they call the "Civil List". As 3rd in Line to the Throne I would not imagine that that would amount to much as it is paid for performing civic duties. Now for drawing money from the Civil List the Royal Family forgoes income from the Crown Estates - that all goes to the Government. Now then WTFK? a little indication for you, that I think is needed because you are obviously from the far side of the pond. Civil List costs the UK Tax Payer £37.2 million pounds per year. In Profit by way of income the Crown Estates contribute around £190 million per year. So they are most definitely are not in it for the money, or if they are, they have obviously been very badly advised.

Oh and by the bye WTFK?, from what I recall, as an officer in the Household Brigade, The "Blues and Royals" are part of the Household Brigade, Cornet Wales' Army salary will probably not even pay his monthly Mess Bill.

Good on him and all the other lads out there and to hell with the so-called journalists who decided that getting their "gossip" story out was worth more than potentially increasing the risk of endangering the lives of a whole rake of people already in harms way.

Catherine Jayne, I wish your brother all the best, if he goes out to Afghan in a couple of months time he will be out there at the same time as my son.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,Nigel Spencer (astounded, what century again
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:08 AM

Mental note to self: don't visit Mudcat to discuss politics. Looks like it's all 'gawd bless the poor old royal family, they're just ordinary working folks' round these parts...

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: bankley
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:09 AM

His great uncle, Edward the Simpsonizer gave up the throne... just as well... and Harry's mama tried to walk away from it all, made it as far as Paris, and didn't Uncle Andrew serve in the Falklands war ?
It's hard to keep track, not that I try that much... but his Grandma's green face is on my CDN twenties, 'tho I prefer the other side with Bill Reid's Haida art and the tiny inscription by Gabrielle Roy which says "Could we ever know each other in the slightest without the arts?"

I hope that none of our troops get hurt today, whoever they are...

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:13 AM

"But it does seem pretty irresponsible of any pressman to reveal his whereabouts, as a strike that got him would be a big propaganda coup for the Afghan insurgents."

Yep, another big-gob Yank. Just as irresponsible as the big-gob Yank who announced to the world that the US knew where OB-L was because they were tracking his mobile-phone activity. Mobile phone promptly switched off. Duh!

Still, spragging on Harry makes a nice change from the Americans bombing and shooting their closest allies, doesn't it.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: theleveller
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:17 AM

We need to differentiate between Harry the soldier (best wishes for a safe return to you and every other serving solider and damn all those who sent you there) and Harry the royal, an institution I abhor.

Perhaps it's no coincidence that I was born on 27 January, when, exactly 300 year previously, Charles l was found guilty of treason against the people of England. Regrettably, one tyrant was replaced by another and the chance of a true democracy was squandered .

What is Harry fighting for in Afghanistan – a true democracy? Does he know the meaning of the word?

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:18 AM

BTW, leveller, Guest Guest, et al - whether you approve of the Royals or not, the fact is that he's someone's much-loved son, and he's in a f**kin' dangerous place, far more dangerous than you're ever likely to be in.

A little humanity costs nothing.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Grab
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:21 AM

WLD, the IRA assassinated one major royal (Mountbatten), and at Brighton they killed one MP and the relatives of other MPs. On a more man-in-the-street level, they killed and maimed a whole bunch of civilians in pubs, shopping centres and crowded streets in England and Ireland. It's difficult to see how hanging an IRA man would have made the situation worse, to be honest. :-(

Anyway, the anti-Taliban deciding factor has already happened, with 9/11, and various beheadings since then have just confirmed the situation. It's difficult to see what they could do that'd solidify Western opinion more against them than it already is.

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: theleveller
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:27 AM

Here's another riveting fact (yawn!): a few months after Charles l's execution, Levellers in Cromwell's New Model Army mutinied. One of their grievances was that they did not want to be sent to invade another country. That country was Ireland (the results can be seen above in Grab's post). Three Levellers, including my namesake, were shot in Burford churchyard. Wonder what would have happened if there'd been a similar mutiny in the army before they were sent to Afghanistan or Iraq?

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: theleveller
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:29 AM

Sorry, that should read 'a few months' don't want you to think I'm an illiterate b****d.

fixed it for you - el joe clone:-)

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:40 AM

There are some smug bastards on this thread.
Also, if Guest guest is who I think she is, perhaps she would be better getting her own, President George W Chimp to take his brave boys out of Iraq.

G

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Big Mick
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 11:52 AM

Unfair shot, Giok. Folks from your side of the pond revel in telling us what is wrong with us. A Yank, and yes you have guessed correctly as to ID, certainly has the same right, no?

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:00 PM

'It's difficult to see how hanging an IRA man would have made the situation worse, to be honest.'

I have no such difficulty in imagining the scenario. A little more imagination and flexibility would have denied the IRA their greatest victory - the hunger strike - one of the greatest set pieces of resistance. Surely the turning point in the whole period of conflict.

The public execution of one of Diana's children would have been a whole different ball game to Mountbatten's killing. Diana was the most loved of all the royals. A lot of English people would have hard pressed to know who Mountbatten was.

I still think it was a damn silly thing to risk, and might have left our cities in flames. Still that gang of Bertie Woosters at the Ministry of Defence/MI5 might have been hoping for just that result - devious bastards!

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: irishenglish
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:11 PM

Couple of points: As a royal he is required to serve in the military, it was his choice what arm of the service, and which regiment he wanted. Andrew was a RN Helicopter Pilot, who was in potential harms way in the Falklands.

I do applaud him (despite his bizarre and questionable behaviour at times-the Nazi costume was just unfunny, no matter how you look at it) for not getting lost, and taking an office assignment, but joining an actual unit with the real possibility of combat.

Shame on whomever gave him up, and if it was Drudge, I hope someone goes after him on that. Whatever you think of the war, or of the royals, that could have had severe consequences, and they should be ashamed of themselves

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: irishenglish
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:13 PM

WLD-hard pressed to know who Mountbatten was? I find that very hard to believe.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,PMB
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:18 PM

Who's this Prince Harry then?

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:19 PM

Most of the kids I taught in the 1970s wouldn't have been able to name Prince Philip - if you'd shown them a photograph. I presume they know even less nowadays after twenty years of Keith Joseph's national curriculum.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: theleveller
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:23 PM

"he's someone's much-loved son, and he's in a f**kin' dangerous place"

Of course he's in danger, Backwoodsman, he's a soldier. Every other soldier is also in danger. As a police armed response officer, my son's in danger every time he gets a shout. Nobody's making a huge fuss about them, so what makes Harry so special? Oh yes, he's an overprivileged young man who happens to be in the public eye.

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:47 PM

Nah Mick I was having a go at the Guest guest who I assume is our old friend Janet. Not attacking US citizens for commenting on our affairs. If that stopped [both ways], we'd have a lot fewer posts on Mudcat wouldn't we?

Giok ¦¬]

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: Big Mick
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:48 PM

LOL.....yep. And what would I have to bitch about?? I would have to go back to abusing small animals, guitar strings, goatskin drums and golf balls...

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:59 PM

But are those his whereabouts? How do we know he is actually there? Isn't this just another God bless the Royals campaign cos they are looking a bit sheepish about the murder of Diana; if is she is actually dead!

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 12:59 PM

You are really appalling with that comparison to slavery McGrath. Really god damned appalling.

How so? I wasn't thinking in terms of the slave system that operated in America, if that's what gigi assumed. There have been a fair number of slave owning societies in which wealthy and powerful slaves were to be found. For example Ancient Athens, Rome, the Ottoman Empire and China. They led very comfortable lives, so long as they did what their masters required - but they weren't free.

True enough, if the royals decided to walk away they aren't going to get their heads chopped off, or get clapped in irons,which would have been the kind of thing those wealthy slaves would have likely to have happen to them. So they aren't technically slaves, and I didn't say they were (that's what "essentially" meant). But sanctions like that are not the only way in which freedom of choice can in practice be reduced to vanishing point, and their freedom is in mnay ways very restricted, as thsi latest episode demonstrates.

But I'm still puzzled by the hate people seem to feel. If people in general didn't really want them, they'd be gone by the end of the week, whether they liked it or not. They've been placed in that situation purely by an accident of birth, nothing to do with anything they did. Why blame them? Surely no one is actually jealous?

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: skarpi
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 01:00 PM

what people do for money and glory .

so Harry is is afganistan so what ?? and now he dont want to go back
from the fighting , he s a soldier and is doin his duty .

we dont have a army here in Iceland " thanks to the old vikings god
odinn and thor " :>)

so I dont know about this duty thing .

all the best skarpi Iceland
amd we should all be friends in here or least try

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 01:22 PM

Public eye yes...great big bulls eye..yes. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: GUEST,Windsor Knot
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 02:09 PM

Did you ever see such a load of manufactured bull in your life !
Harry Hewitt is no more out on the front line than Trevor McDonald is.
He has been seen at many social events over the past number of weeks ( no idea if he was doing the nazi salute again).

This is all to make out that the son of James Hewitt is a brave and jolly good sort. It was the same the the time of the Falklands, Andrew was jockeying around London and they tired to make out he was sitting in a chopper, another load of bull.

Well how could the "hangers on" not expect their loyal public to swallow it, after all, they swallow every other feed of it !

Next they will be telling us he is the son of Prince Charles !

Subject: RE: BS: Prince Harry - What a star!
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 29 Feb 08 - 02:29 PM

The best trolls are subtle Windsor NOT, and that was one of the worst and most obvious failed efforts at trolling I have seen in a long time!
Look at ms Lemon's post a couple before yours. Now that's what you call a good troll.

G ¦¬]