BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 10 Apr 10 - 10:23 AM

"You said that they (the ACORN workers) were GUILTY, GUILTY, GUILTY."

Point it out please.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 09 Apr 10 - 06:24 PM

Whatever the truth is, half of the people are not going to believe it. That's probably the real tragedy.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Genie
Date: 09 Apr 10 - 03:01 PM

BradBlog.com - summary of Brown's investigation findings, plus links to the unedited videos themselves

Key points:
The videos were severely edited and spliced so as to misrepresent what actually happened. "The Brooklyn D.A.'s office was quoted as describing them as a 'heavily edited splice job' when his report was released several weeks ago."


"Of the four ACORN employees O'Keefe and Giles met with in three different California cities, none "committed, solicited or conspired to commit any criminal acts," says Brown in his report. "There is no evidence that any of the ACORN employees had the intent to aid and abet such criminal conduct or agreed to join in [O'Keefe and Giles purported] illegal conduct."

"ACORN did not receive billions in federal funds and did not control elections.
In fact, ACORN had received an average of just $3.5 million in federal tax dollars over each of the last 15 years. "

"No evidence that any vote was ever cast illegally, in any election, following an improper registration by an ACORN worker. In most cases, such improper registrations were discovered by ACORN themselves and reported to authorities."


--
Some of ACORN's hundreds of workers may have acted unwisely or "inappropriately" at times (of course that never happens in private business or any other large organization), but our "mainstream media" have done a horribly sloppy (or deliberately partisan?) job of investigative journalism and fair reporting.

Meanwhile, true election fraud, where thousands of voters have been improperly disenfranchised or otherwise blocked from voting (e.g., having to stand in line for hours to vote; being deliberately directed to the wrong polling places) or where voting machines have "flipped votes," etc. - there's hardly a mention of that in the media.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 09 Apr 10 - 03:28 AM

The unedited tape (raw footage) speaks for itself. Jerry Brown released the raw footage. With the release of the raw footage, we don't have to take anyone's word for it.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 08 Apr 10 - 12:35 PM

All Jerry Brown did was to determine that no crimes were committed. I didn't think anyone ever thought there were crimes committed.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 08 Apr 10 - 11:58 AM

Fair enough. however, MSNBC is hardly unbiased 'reporting' either, so I wouldn't be too quick to cite them as a source, either!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 08 Apr 10 - 06:08 AM

I can't find any mention of that, GfS, except in the Free Republic website, so I think I'll hold off on accepting that one until I see more evidence that you are right.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 08 Apr 10 - 02:18 AM

Oh CarolC, Congressman Cleaver said that NOBODY spit on him. (Heard it on the radio).

Just thought you might have wanted to know.......

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 10:15 PM

Bertha Lewis said many times that the tapes were phony. Nobody listened to her, but she did say it. The employees did tell her that the tapes had been falsified, and Bertha herself said that the tapes had been falsified, many, many times.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 10:08 PM

It doesn't matter whether or not Brown has a credibility problem. The hard evidence is there for any experts to examine. When the ACORN workers had been declared guilty by everyone on the right, no one had seen the raw footage. The raw footage is now available. That's the difference, and that's why we don't have to take Jerry Brown's word for anything. And that's why we know the ACORN workers were framed.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 10:05 PM

I said we never saw the guy dressed as a pimp while he was in the room with the ACORN workers. I said that the we never saw him actually talking in the video and we didn't see most of what was said by the "prostitute", so we had no way of knowing that they said what we were told they said while they were in the room with the ACORN workers. I said that unless we saw them talking in the room with the ACORN workers, and could see for ourselves that they were saying what we were hearing, and saw how the guy was dressed in the room with the ACORN workers, there was no reason to believe the accusations that were being made against ACORN.

You said that they (the ACORN workers) were GUILTY, GUILTY, GUILTY.

I was right, and you were wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 09:44 PM

Think about it, D. If the employee's words had been changed, wouldn't they have told Bertha that. And if they told her, why didn't she believe them. The original journalists have a lot more credibility than either Brown or this Rachel person.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 07:09 PM

"...pointing the finger at the journalists ..."

JOURNALISTS?? tsk...

Bertha did not HAVE the original tapes, but I saw her explaining what had happened about several of the issues and accusations.... and will YOU please document which employees were fired, and for what reasons and in what circumstances?

" The phony tape scenario seems not to have made the scene until it was handy for other political reasons."

You don't think they gave up the incriminating tapes easily, do you? Jerry Brown had to force the issue to get them. What credibility issue can possibly change what the unedited tapes showed? Perhaps you are suggesting that being a Democrat is an issue....

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 06:59 PM

And she is pointing the finger at the journalists who made the videos, so what's the difference. If the tapes hadn't been accurate, why did Bertha Lewis run around and fire the low level employees at the various sites instead of making the case that the tapes were phony.
            The phony tape scenario seems not to have made the scene until it was handy for other political reasons.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Neil D
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 06:39 PM

No, but you do. You might disagree with Ms. Maddow's politics and have every right to do so, however, accusing her of doctoring evidence is not only lacking in credibility, it is libel.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 05:18 PM

"The Attorney General of California examined the raw video..."


               Isn't the Attorney General of California Jerry Brown? Doesn't he have a little bit of a credibility problem?

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 04:54 PM

*grin*.. The truth is the truth, no matter how you criticize the technique of those telling the truth. ACORN was framed, and most of the shrill conservatives WANTED to believe ACORN was guilty of... something... so they propagated **untruths**, whether they were aware they were lying or not.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 03:32 PM

"You were wrong about the accusations made against ACORN"

You were the one saying the video people were guilty until proven innocent and Acorn was innocent until proven guilty.

You still cannot say who is wrong and you do not mention any particular accusations.

You topically lump several things into one as proof of something.

Now you shrilly chant wrong wrong wrong like a little kid taunting and bullying somebody.

Seeing that the thread was about multiple accusations about Acorn other than the videos with several people making the accusations. it is rather immature to shriek "you were wrong I was right" four times in a row as it it carries more weight the more it is repeated.

Why not just shriek it 1000 times without saying who was wrong about what, then there will be no doubt.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 03:23 PM

Riginslinger, it's possible to use technology to detect edits. The raw video can easily be proven to be raw video, while edited video can easily be proven to be edited. The Attorney General of California examined the raw video, issued a statement based on that video, and then released the video to the public. Any expert can examine that video to determine whether or not it has been doctored.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 02:04 PM

Lies?

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 02:02 PM

Riggo, that is crap! She 'doctored up' nothing...she reported on what the information showed. Various investigations have gotten access to the raw videos and shown clearly that places like Faux News 'doctored' the stuff the make the claims in the first place!
You cannot simply 'assert' such blatant lies and get away with it.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 01:49 PM

Certainly we can't be expected to believe evidence doctored up by Rachel Maddow.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 01:23 PM

You were wrong about the accusations made against ACORN based on the videos. You were wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong about that, and I was entirely right.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Alice
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 01:09 PM

I started this thread in 2008, and I am still saying "Spread the Truth about ACORN".

- Alice

---------------------------------------------------

04/07/2010 05:11 PM
Unedited ACORN Videos Tell a Vastly Different Story
        

'In the video that helped destroy the community activist group ACORN, an employee is shown supposedly helping a pimp and his hooker girlfriend set up a child prostitution and human smuggling ring. As it turns out, the truth was edited out.

As shown on the Rachel Maddow show, the unedited video includes the ACORN employee calling the police as soon as James O´Keefe and Hannah Giles, playing the pimp and prostitute, left the office. Other video was radically edited to change its meaning.

For example, an ACORN employee is heard telling Giles "don´t give up" as Giles, the "prostitute," says she wants to start a prostitution ring. Unedited, the video shows the employee was responding to Giles saying she wanted to finance a house.'

Source: www.mediaite.com        
WebReporter: Ben_Reilly

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 01:06 PM

Right about what?

Who is wrong?

It does disprove some claims made about Acorn.

Have any of the claims made by Acorn been disproved?

Does it mean Acorn did not throw it's own dues paying members under the bus in return for a million dollar bailout from a fat cat developer?

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 07 Apr 10 - 12:39 PM

I was right, you were wrong. I was right, you were wrong. I was right, you were wrong. I was right, you were wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 30 Mar 10 - 01:52 AM

Isn't ACORN nuts???

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 04:11 PM

Is the embezzling brother working for SEIU now, along with the other?

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 03:13 PM

Where is my endorsement?

You endorse Acorn who rolled it's own members under da bus for money from a rich, fat cat developer.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 27 Mar 10 - 09:07 PM

We're talking about American political operatives here. If you found anything other than lies and nonesense on either side I'd be astounded.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 27 Mar 10 - 05:47 PM

Sure, your endorsement of the faked videos that were supposed to be of a couple posing as a pimp and a prostitute as the truth. That's total lies and nonsense.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 27 Mar 10 - 05:09 PM

Got any examples of the lies and nonsense?

George Bush was never prosecuted for anything so everything he did was legal according to your reasoning.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 09:15 PM

Anyway, the statute has run; it's time to go after SEIU.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 12:34 PM

Has anyone been prosecuted for covering up the embezzlement?

For an example of the lies and nonsense one only has to read most of the things you've posted on this subject.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 11:36 AM

So it is legal to cover up an embezzlement?

"either lies or nonsense" Care to give an example?

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: GUEST,Neil D
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 10:56 AM

Rachel compares ACORN to other government contractors.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 07:13 AM

The truth has been spread about ACORN. Now it's time to go after SEIU.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 03:34 AM

Good question, Songbob, almost all of the stuff he posts on this subject is either lies or nonsense.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 03:32 AM

One person at ACORN defrauded the organization by embezzling money from it. That's not at all the same thing as the organization itself doing things that are illegal. That's why the organization didn't get prosecuted for the embezzlement.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 26 Mar 10 - 12:10 AM

As you read on, you'll find evidence that a Times reporter knew of (and was alarmed by) a $1.5 million loan/grant that Brooklyn-based FCR gave last August to ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, which had suffered severe cash flow difficulties in the wake of an embezzlement scandal.

This is incredible, reporter Stephanie Strom wrote after learning that the deal was allegedly approved without ACORN board's assent, adding that an explanation given to her doesn't hold water.

In doing so, FCR has helped bail out an organization reeling from the revelations that not only did the brother of ACORN's founder embezzle nearly $1 million in 2000 but also, as the Times reported 9/10/08, that the news was concealed by senior executives until a whistle-blower told a foundation leader about it in May.

Also, as the Times reported 10/22/08, ACORN's budget has been suffering, as it apparently owes taxes to federal and state authorities while foundations that previously supported the organization have backed off. Meanwhile, two board members, both members of a committee established to lead ACORN through its turmoil, have sued the organization, charging that ACORN was destroying financial documents and covering up improper expenditures.

The Times chose not to report on that crucial loan. But that FCR-ACORN relationship remains worthy of sunlight, given the crucial partnership between FCR and ACORN's New York affiliate in the enormously controversial Atlantic Yards project in Brooklyn.

ACORN on 5/17/05 signed a Housing Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) that promised 2250 units of affordable housing in the project, which Lewis considered a huge victory. In exchange, ACORN agreed to publicly back the project--and has continued to do so, despite many reasons to doubt FCR's promises.

How frequently does a controversial real estate developer, who does its work regionally, bail out a struggling national activist organization, one which saw contributions decline and faced a major tax bill--after the revelation that Dale Rathke, the brother of longtime chief organizer Wade Rathke, embezzled nearly $1 million? More here

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Songbob
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 11:40 PM

A federal judge has ruled that the government has to pay ACORN what they should have been paid prior to Congress' action in stripping them of their grants and contracts. It seems that singling out one organization for punitive action without a court conviction is a "bill of attainder," which is verboten by the Constitution.

Interesting, eh?

And I don't understand the context of Sawzaw's post just above mine. What is he going on about now?

Bob

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 11:18 PM

The tent ceremony seemed to symbolize all that was bizarre about the project, especially as the political gyrations: Not one local legislator was present, as the city was bypassed entirely by his process, as were the state reps, due to Ratner's being shielded behind an inscrutable state agency, the Empire State Development Corporation (it proved impossible to sue it).

Or his racial manipulation: Having paid millions for support from some black leaders, he then had to hide the most prominent one, Bertha Lewis, founder and national leader of ACORN (who was contractually obliged to publicly support Atlantic Yards), replacing her on the dais with the Rev. Al Sharpton, whose group also was the target of Ratner largesse.

While Forest City provided lobster sliders for his guests, Ratner could hear the noisy protesters at the fences. But he did not worry about them entering. The tent was surrounded by layers of concrete Jersey barriers, extra high cyclone fences, and dozens and dozens of police. So much for a grand gesture of bringing something the public is supposed to treasure. Just as the process was calculated to avoid public input, so was the ceremony. More Here

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 11:10 PM

A whistle-blower forced Acorn to disclose the embezzlement, which involved the brother of the organization’s founder, Wade Rathke.

The brother, Dale Rathke, embezzled nearly $1 million from Acorn and affiliated charitable organizations in 1999 and 2000, Acorn officials said, but a small group of executives decided to keep the information from almost all of the group’s board members and not to alert law enforcement.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 06:28 PM

pdq, there is no evidence that the ACORN organization were doing illegal things. If there was, they would be prosecuted for them.

DougR, all of the fraudulent registrations that their workers generated were flagged by the management as being potentially fraudulent, and were turned over to the authorities as such. So you are wrong about that. And not one of the fraudulent registrations resulted in anyone casting a fraudulent vote. The management of ACORN did not commit any election fraud.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: DougR
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 06:06 PM

Carol C: and no doubt they registered a whole lot of folks that they shouldn't have too!

Bill D: Pull your shorts out of the crack, I was just expressing an opinion (but I'll bet I'm right!)

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: pdq
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 02:48 PM

"...National Open Ballot Project advisory board which includes Bertha Lewis, who is the CEO of ACORN, a co-chair of the Working Families Party, an initial director of the Working Families Organization and a former treasurer of the Progressive America Fund. Also on the advisory board is Melissa Mark-Viverito, a former Service Employees International Union (SEIU)organizer who had WFP and ACORN support in her 2005 election and 2009 re-election bids to the New York City Council."

ACORN is a monsterous group of approximately 300 smaller groups with interlocking directorates. The name ACORN was banned from receiveng federal monies by parts of the federal government including the Census Bureau. They were banned because their actions were corrupt, even criminal.

The ending of the name ACORN is a huge rope-a-dope. Meaningless, because the money will flow to the same people for the same business, just through different organizations.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 02:28 PM

If they do, count on the Republicans trying to shut them down. Because one of the good things ACORN did was register a lot of perfectly legitimate voters in areas where people tend to vote Democrat, and the agenda of the Republicans is to disenfranchise voters who might vote against Republicans.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 25 Mar 10 - 01:45 PM

Acorn did some good things but unfortunately there was an atmosphere of being above the law as exemplified in the Acorn workers advice "Don't get caught, 'cause it is against the law."

Hopefully an organization or better yet a lot of smaller organizations who won't get the big head, will replace them and continue the good things.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 23 Mar 10 - 09:39 PM

This is an organization that needed to go, now it's time to get rid of SEIU.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 10 - 06:15 PM

That's the thing about the Faux conservatives. No policy solutions just smears and lies. And any Republican't is ready and willing to start the lies. The only thing grass roots about the self styled "conservatives" of this country is their lies.