BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?

Subject: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: michaelr
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 01:13 AM

I realize many of you will be tempted to take the piss here, but...

It occurred to me to wonder. We love pork, it's delicious and we eat lots of it. The same is true for beef and lamb (and goats to a lesser degree). We make cheese from the milk of these animals, so why not from the pigs'?

I'd welcome your guesses, and actual information as well.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ebbie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 01:36 AM

One striking difference is that each of the others: beef, sheep, goats, is a two-teated critter. Hogs are multi.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 02:33 AM

Pigs have big bellies and short legs. It's too difficult to get the bucket underneath.


DC

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: GUEST,CrazyEddie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 02:59 AM

From my reading of the totally factual Terry Pratchett book "Nation" it seems the only way to milk a sow is to get ger unconcious drum, and milk with your mouth. Not many have the dedication.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 03:03 AM

I am only guessing but it could be a pig's diet the feed it gets might give the milk a tainted odd flavour. With a cow, sheep or goat you know what kind of pasture or mixture of feed it has been feeding on and how it will effect the quality of milk. Personally I would not buy pig's milk.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ebbie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 03:09 AM

A pig is fairly omnivorous. We know what happened when cow remains were fed to cattle (What were they thinking!). Cattle, sheep and goats are herbivoes.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: gnomad
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 05:28 AM

The mechanics of milking a pig could surely be overcome if we put our minds to it (mankind can be pretty ingenious) but whether it would prove a good idea is a very different question. Like the others here I suspect that such milk might not be to our taste.

I also suspect that the rapid cycle of modern pig production doesn't leave much time while the sow would be in milk, pig breeding timetable. Doubtless selective breeding for diary use could improve on this somewhat, but enough??

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 05:32 AM

Why not include, mare's milk and pigeon milk too?

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:09 AM

I remember reading a few years ago, some scientist expressing surprise that we don't use sow's milk, at least for babies, because it is much closer to human milk than any of the others.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:13 AM

I have read somewhere that pigs don't store much milk - it's secreted on demand. So you won't get much by simply hooking a sow up to a milking machine for an hour a day. Piglets suckle for much longer than that.

I once met an agricultural researcher in New Zealand who'd designed a milking machine for mice. Taking that to commercial scale would mean training a new breed of cat to herd them, I guess.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:21 AM

Hee hee, nice one Jack. A variation on the 'you might as well try to herd cats' saying.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Mo the caller
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 07:00 AM

Pigs are too intelligent to let you milk them. As are cats of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 08:19 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ebbie - PM
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 01:36 AM

One striking difference is that each of the others: beef, sheep, goats, is a two-teated critter. Hogs are multi.

Where I come from cows have four teats. Steers are where we get most of our beef. One "teat" very dangerous to "milk."

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: GUEST,Neil D
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 08:35 AM

From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 05:32 AM

Why not include, mare's milk and pigeon milk too?



Actually, Mongolians do drink mare's milk, fermented. It's
called kumis.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 08:50 AM

I think I knew that Neil, but it was in relation to cheese that I was adding that query.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: MMario
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 09:22 AM

Another point being that a milking sow is not the most docile animal in the world. They do have tusks and they do know how to use them!

That said; there have been milking machines made for sows - I know that they were used in some research applications @ Cornell in the mid '70's.

I believe that there have historically been horse and camel cheeses made as well as the fermented drinks made from the milks.

And I seem to remember a case of dog's milk being used for infants in some tribe or another.....

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ebbie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 11:34 AM

JacktS, Oops!

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 11:51 AM

I've just been down to our local cheese shop (actually it was uphill if there are any pedants who know where I live) and she says that sow's milk cheeses is unavailable for two main reasons - firstly sows don't produce sufficient quantities of milk, and secondly it doesn't have EC approval. The second is why camel's milk cheese isn't for sale here.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 12:16 PM

How about whale milk? Milking a whale might be a challenge, but I imagine the quantity involved should be quite impressive.
....................

As for pig's milk, it is apparently very high in fat content, and in this respect is similar to elephant milk and giraffe milk. But "the milk of the hippopotamus is even richer in fat and protein than that of the giraffe and elephant, and provides almost twice the energy of elephant milk per unit weight."

So no good if you are on a low-fat diet. I gathered this interesting information from this article from the British Journal of Nutrition.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 12:31 PM

Venezuelan Beaver Cheese? "Not today sir, no."

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 02:47 PM

The larger whales actually pump milk, the assumption being that the young are not powerful enough to suck enough to support their necessary growth rate.

So if you could fool a cow whale into thinking your milking machine was a baby whale getting enough should be easy. Note that "if".

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Genie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 03:49 PM

I think whale milk, like milk from any marine mammal, is probably too high in fat/oil content for most humans' taste or nutritional need.
Not to mention the logistics of staying under the critters long enough to milk them.

But why not buffalo milk, llama milk, donkey milk, etc?

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Dave Swan
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 04:04 PM

Buffalo Mozzarella is good stuff. I'd love to have a buffalo dairy. The problem is that I couldn't bring myself to cull the herd and would end up knee deep in pet buffalo. D

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 04:07 PM

It's not Kosher.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 04:11 PM

Mozzarella is a cheese made from buffalo milk, from a proper buffalo, not the North American Bison. What's the difference between a buffalo and a bison? You can't wash your hands in a buffalo.

You can get llama milk cheese in Peru, yak milk cheese in Tibet. A camel dairy in Mauritania even makes a soft cheese from camel milk - it's called 'camelbert'. Turkey has a horse milk cheese.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ed T
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 04:12 PM

Milking a Dachshund would present challenges to overcome.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 04:34 PM

From the National Bison Association site's FAQs:

Any product labeled as buffalo milk, or buffalo cheese is produced from the milk of water buffalo. Water buffalo are a separate species, and are not related to bison, even though American bison are commonly known as buffalo. Bison are not milked commercially for a couple of reasons. First, the teats on female bison are very small. Also, bison are undomesticated animals, and the females do not adapt well to the type of handling necessary in a milking operation.

I imagine that might be quite something to see: "the females do not adapt well to the type of handling necessary in a milking operation".

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 04:39 PM

How about Bob?

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 05:06 PM

THIS thread should be closed in case google searches find the secrets within.

In an ancient text 'The Secularium Biologica' there is a recipe for "White Gold" which was to restore the true lifespan to human beings which is 700 years. Ancient Egyptian texts also allude to a similar elixer.

Alchemists mistook the recipe for actual elements to be mixed or tranmuted to produce this rare elixer. While highly secret beyond the 42 Masonic rite, however if you substitute pig milk for the main ingredient and decode the other additives correctly with the use of a seperate text named The Ventris results have been more than spectacular.

Goggle white gold elixer

The Egyptian recipes also lead the uninitiated in the wrong direction of heavy metals instead of the Mitochondrial masterpiece of nutrition that promotes good health and phenomenal longevity.
Translating code is a very tricky business and creates laughable results given our current use of language and idiom. For example one section seems to suggest that a sub set of the ingredients in the recipe recipe be filtered in a pigs ear. Other references to eye of Newt sounds proposterous but upon decoding seperately the reference is to the viscous humor and not an actual eye.

SInce 1930 the search for the white gold exlixer in its most perfect form has taken many turns and pitfalls but the discovery of the Ventris in 1941 made the promise of the Secularium Biologica a very near reality.

Still, who in the hell is gonna milk a pig for eternal life?

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 05:14 PM

Religions since ancient Egypt have all tended to lead people away from pig, pork and pork products to avoid the socio economic problems of having the whtie gold elixer produce a class of near immortal citizens who would enslave a society to serve their antiquated wishes and indulgence in luxury.

Extreme logevity is as dangerous as super capitalistic corporate monopolies.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: olddude
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 05:22 PM

I live outside of Buffalo, I wouldn't want any milk from that place. It would glow in the dark from the Niagara River

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 05:23 PM

My Dad said he can't stroke his recently inherited bitch's tummy anymore. She loves cuddles, but until she's 'done' she will lactate milk anytime her tummy is stroked.
Eewy..

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ed T
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:08 PM

Many good cheeses have a high fat content. So, how does milk from different animals stack up...I willc heck on porky later.


Consider how humans stack up against these animals (values are given in percentage weight—all data from Jenness 1974).

• Human: 3.8% fat; 1% protein; 7% lactose*

• Cow: 3.7% fat; 3.4% protein; 4.8% lactose

• Rat: 10.3% fat; 8.4% protein; 2.6% lactose

• Dog: 12.9% fat; 7.9% protein; 3.1% lactose

• Rabbit: 18.3% fat; 13.9% protein; 2.6% lactose

- Some species of seals and large whales have milk fat content over 50%; the highest percentage of fat recorded in marine mammals is 65% in the hooded seal.


*(To some degree, milk composition varies by diet as well. The numbers above reflect the average milk composition of British women. For instance, an analysis conducted in India produced an estimate of 3.4 g fat per 100mL -Gopalan et al 2000).


Nutrients and calories in breast milk
© 2008 Gwen Dewar, Ph.D., all rights reserved

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: michaelr
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:15 PM

"Camelbert", I love it! LOL

Thanks for all your contributions.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: gnu
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:16 PM

MMario... "a milking sow is not the most docile animal in the world..."

Nosiree!. I recall jumping up on the boards of a sty as a lad and having a sow with piglets charge at the boards, butt them and start chewing on them. My Dad's cousin took me off the sty and told me that was not a safe thing to do. Scared the crap outta me.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ed T
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:18 PM

The fat content of pigs milk is 8.5 (but it does vary).

"Pigs are difficult to milk. Cows and goats have udders with nipples as long as a human hand which made it easy for the first farmers to milk them, so they were domesticated and bred cows and goats for that purpose. Pigs have many small nipples- not that easy to milk"



economics of pig milk


Secret pig cheese of Italy

more piggy stuff

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 06:20 PM

Old dude I lived there too. I have been IN Niagra Falls at the falls as well as tubing farther up. I have even been to the bottom of the toxic pit at Niagra Falls.

That is one cruel place in hell.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: GUEST,Bob L
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 07:57 PM

Do you get camel's milk from a dromedairy?


(Sorry)

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Charley Noble
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 08:36 PM

With a resource like Mudcat one can expand one's knowledge exponentially every day!

When we tried to milk our sows on the farm we found it udderly frustrating!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 10:20 PM

Pigs is too smart to give away they milk. "You wanna WHAT!?!?!?"

HELL no!

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Genie
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 10:23 PM

I can't believe Art Thieme and Severn haven't discovered this thread yet!

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Dave Swan
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 11:57 PM

and wait 'til Catspaw gets hold of this...

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 26 Oct 10 - 11:59 PM

A possible difficulty with any commercializing of sows' milk might be the extent to which pigs can be infected by virtually any human diseases or parasites. Extreme (relative to common agricultural) sanitary restrictions would likely be required.

This was apparently at least one of the factors in shutting down this li'l ol' cheese maker not very long ago.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Mr Red
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 06:50 AM

if Pig's milk tastes bad use it as a medical rub

and you get Oinkment.



I'll get my coat...............

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ed T
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 07:17 AM

Pasta Filata, Sus scrofa

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 08:08 AM

Verina Secularium Biologica

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 08:31 AM

>Buffalo Mozzarella is good stuff. I'd love to have a buffalo dairy. The problem is that I couldn't bring myself to cull the herd and would end up knee deep in pet buffalo. D<

Dave, I feel this way about sheep and just couldn't bring myself to send them to market and my home would end up looking like a scene from Wallace and Grommet or Shaun the sheep. Sheep everywhere.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 09:26 AM

"the females do not adapt well to that type of handling"
I think I dated a few of those (in my youth , of course).

RtS

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 09:38 AM

Donuel referred to "super capitalistic corporate monopolies."

Wasn't that a song in the movie version of Mary Poppins?

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: maple_leaf_boy
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 10:02 AM

I'll bet that pig cheese would taste better than soya milk cheese or
rice milk cheese.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 10:25 AM

I know a man who used to have a buffalo herd for milking. Nobody bought the milk, but nowadays he sells some very nice steaks.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 10:26 AM

>"the females do not adapt well to that type of handling"
I think I dated a few of those (in my youth , of course).

RtS<

Of course I forgot pigs are said to be intelligent animals and the sow probably wouldn't let you without putting up a fight. Don't blame her really, LOL!

Apart from anything else the nipples being that close to the ground it might not be very hygenic either.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ebbie
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 12:05 PM

"What's the difference between a buffalo and a bison? You can't wash your hands in a buffalo." Les from Hull

*G*

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: MMario
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 03:27 PM

Bison is new world; the american "buffalo" is a bison. shaggy fur, beards, humps.

Buffalo is old world - lighter coat, no beard, no hump.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 03:35 PM

I have been following this thread very closely, because it is answering a question that has troubled me all of my life. I'm sure this is a question that many of us have pondered. I'm still somewhat confused about a statement from John MacKenzie about pigeon milk.

Is that the white stuff they leave all over my car?

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: gnu
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 03:47 PM

If yer bison, I'll have a double and we'll yak as long as ya don't try ta buffalo me.

Sev... hump yer ass on in here and let's have some pun.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: MMario
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 04:00 PM

There is a(n) European Bison; aka "Wisent" - not domesticated.

Joe - pigeon milk is a gruel-ish substance they produce in their crops - basically pre-digested food - they regurgitate it for their chicks.

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Ed T
Date: 27 Oct 10 - 09:24 PM

sheep cheese

Subject: RE: BS: Why no pig's milk cheese?
From: Charley Noble
Date: 28 Oct 10 - 12:07 PM

You also can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear either but someone here will come up with a thoughtful suggestion, I'm sure.

Charley Noble