BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami 11-Mar-2011

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 08:08 PM

leaving aside the nuclear disaster, which overhwhelms all other potential disasters..I can not figure out why sometimes we see a number of soldiers or people anyway in uniforms looking somewhat through the rubble when the odds now are close to zero..houses, cars, not yet..but in the rubble. very low. I saw a picture of I think 9 men carrying a stretcher with one female body..probably not weighing 100 pounds...Couldn't those same men..and there are some roads and some gas..but I don't know what goes where..be helping to evacuate some of the elderly? SHouldn't that now be priority? And getting food to them..by road as far as possible..then bicycle, pack horses, dogs, llamas, whatever is needed..backpacks..it sounds like stuff is getting in and out of places and there are gas shortages but military should commandeer it and get food and water and more blankets to people on verge of starvation now. Again it would hlep if we had photos so could hlep plot routes etc...including sea as I always say. mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 08:02 PM

it also has to do with how small a space the ocean is forced into. Most ports on US coast were fine..a couple were smashed. Looking at a small number of pictures, I see what looks like canals going inland. They could have taken serious hits. mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Naemanson
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 07:28 PM

How high is a four story building? There were people who were that high, especially at the hospital I mentioned earlier, who did not survive. The big waves did not occur everywhere. I heard an oceanographer say the waves built up higher because of the complex sea bottom.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: gnu
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 02:46 PM

T'would be lower out at sea... not higher.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Jack Campin
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 02:44 PM

The tsunami waves that hit northern Japan were 10 to 30 METERS HIGH

None of the film footage I've seen shows anything as high as 10m, let alone 30m.

Maybe higher over the epicentre out at sea, but who was measuring there?

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: gnu
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 02:33 PM

10 to 30m high? I did not know that. Got any references to back that up?

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 02:08 PM

I know what mg meant...

There is a nuclear disaster scale that only goes up to 7.
They made Chernobyl a level 7 event. That maight have to be upgraded as time goes on

The Richter scale essentially has no upper limit however a magnitude 21 would be the energy of Venus hitting the Earth head on.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 02:04 PM

The tsunami waves that hit northern Japan were 10 to 30 METERS HIGH

not 10 feet.

over 90 feet high moving at 41 mph, some of them moved 6 miles or more inland.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Bettynh
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 01:11 PM

Midway island had extensive washover that killed albatross chicks and adults. It'll take years to really find out what the effects of this event were on ocean ecology worldwide.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Naemanson
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 08:21 AM

MG, you need to start listening to legitimate news organizations. Whoever you are using as a source of information is wildly inaccurate and completely out of touch with reality.

Have you actually looked at the pictures of the areas that were hit? Have you noticed the piles of splintered wood that used to be homes and businesses? Did you realize the paths through the rubble had been painstakingly cleared by desperate people trying to get through to those who need help?

I think your basic mistake is comparing the government of the USA with that of Japan. Martial law is not an option because the people are not prone to looting, rioting, or mayhem of any sort. It's the Americans who do that.

As for nuclear power, I agree with anyone who says it's too dangerous and the waste lasts too long. The problem is that we lost that argument years ago and now live in a technological society that needs power. Lizzie, you may be willing to live by candle light but you are in the minority. Nuclear power is here and all we can do is try to limit future plants and push our governments to push businesses to develop clean energy. That means we cannot yell NIMBY when they want to put a wind farm or solar facility near our houses.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 06:55 AM

"...Remember that one of the waves went inland for 10 kilometers. How do you prepare for that? "

We cannot make life safe. We can make it safer, but not safe. We have become such an arrogant and stupid species...greedy too. We want this planet to be run for US. We want all the wonderful things technology has brought us, all the comforts we have, but we don't want to think where it's coming from, what's behind it all.

One thing we can prepare for is to ensure this exact nuclear situation never occurs again. How? By facing up to the end of nuclear power altogether. By admitting we allowed something so horrific to be used to keep us all comfy and cosy...and that we must never again put our own species or others, in such a nightmare situation.

This of course, will mean sacrifices. Not human ones though, material ones. It will mean a very different way of life, but you know what, our ancestors lived their lives simply and survived, left the world in a good state for us, whilst we are tearing it apart for our children.

I'd quite happily go back to candles, suffer the inconvenience of life as it was, rather than live with a Nuclear Nemesis.

If we don't do this, if we don't start using other forms of power, using far LESS power in the first place, living with nature, rather than killing it off, then we have no future to plan for anyway...

The choice is ours.

We need to have our own Countdown to Meltdown...and the meltdown with us is to stand up and say "NO MORE! NEVER AGAIN!"

Nuclear power isn't safe, it never has been, it never will be..and for Jiminy's sake, this stuff stays radioactive for tens of thousands of centuries!

The question to ask is WHY we were SO stupid in the first place????

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 06:20 AM

It is amazing the mothers in all the recent disasters who put their own lives on the line to keep their children safe or get them to safety.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 01:36 AM

Well for one thing you declare martial law the minute the earthquake starts and if you need gas to prevent a nuclear meltdown that is where it should go first. I doubt that all the local boats were destroyed..but there are boats elsewhere. You can't clear all roads but you can clear a path to the sea hopefully. That is where salvation lies. That is why I say we need photos and videos and perhaps they are out there...I don't know...so that engineers and transportation people and intelligence people can go to work from around the world saying here is what looks like the best path...

I have heard they have a different earthquake rating system so their 7 could be our 9. I don't know. But if your numbering system stops, you increase it. You don't say no can do. We can only count to 7. mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Naemanson
Date: 17 Mar 11 - 01:17 AM

Actually the reactors had triple redundant safety systems. There were diesel generators to back up the power systems, seawalls to protect from tsunamis, and the facility was built to protect it from any massive earthquake.

I agree you need to prepare "...for way worse than you expect..." but how far do you take it? Should you prepare for everything up to and including Judgment Day? There has to be a reasonable cut off point. We can second guess the designers but you need to remember these reactors have been working fine since the 1960s.

If you have an earthquake scale that goes to 7 it is unlikely that you need to worry about a 9 or 10. Humans can only prepare for reasonable occurrences. What happened in Japan is beyond reasonable but it happened.

I didn't hear about a shortage of bodybags but I do know that the oil refinery that burned in Chiba prefecture would have supplied fuel for a lot of those trucks and ambulances. Plus the private citizens have been desperately filling their cars. Remember they are a free capitalist society.

I think people need to look closer at the level of destruction. Towns were not just damaged. They were literally wiped from the face of the earth. look again at my last post. They were ready. They just couldn't predict the size of the disaster. The waves were expected but not waves of that magnitude.

When I worked for the Navy in Maine we built our buildings according to high earthquake expectations. It made the buildings more expensive but they were safe. Maine doesn't get many earthquakes and none of any great magnitude but we were ready for them. But we would not have been ready for an earthquake like the one that hit Japan.

You say they could use boats. The local boats were all destroyed or deposited on dry land. The water for miles around is full of bodies and newly deposited navigation hazards. The facilities for unloading boats have all been destroyed.

The roads have been buried beneath the rubble that used to be towns or the mud carried around by the waves. Clearing them involves heavy machinery that has to come from somewhere else. Remember that one of the waves went inland for 10 kilometers. How do you prepare for that?

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 08:06 PM

I do not buy that. You always have to prepare for way worse than you expect, which we do not here, and I personally am not prepared and live right on the tsunami belt. However, I am not responsible for nuclear reactors that are failing because fire trucks do not have enough gas from what people are saying. People have been saying for years that huge earthquakes, certainly 9.0, are expected. To build nuclear reactors there, I can not say I would do it, but if I did, for damn sure I would have way more than triple redundancy..maybe 10X redundancy..if first thing fails what do we do? Second thing? Third thing? All the way up to bucket brigades I suppose. Did they even have double redundancy? It seems to me that they were saying we have this system that depends on electricity the reactors produce that will power the pumps that will put the cooling water on the reactor. Duh..what if the reactors fail? This is human incompetence on an unmeasurable level. We can understand Haiti, understand Ukraine..they are suffering economies. Japan had the finances to do way better..and to run out of 2,000 body bags? In a country of millions? In a city of hundreds of thousands I think? Well, maybe they got washed away. But a lot needs to be accounted for, and for here in US as well. Do not think there will be food or water or anything where we have to evacuate. Do not put all your hope in the 2 helicopters that are available. Store stuff here and there in various places. Plan to use boats. Have ways to get gas out of cars and boats..this would have perhaps saved the meltdown if theyhad been able to gas up the firetruck two days ago.

I wish I knew how bad the roads were and how bad the shorelines were..not expecting ports to survive..some did not survive here...but surely somone..Somali pirates for sure..could get smaller craft into shore from a larger craft with supplies and to take people out.

We have all lost a lot of wisdom and practical knowledge over the last few generations as we become over-intellectualized I think.

I also think those Somali pirates could have figured out really quick how to get some gas to the firetrucks and some water on the reactors. mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Naemanson
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 07:35 PM

Donuel, you should leave fear-mongering to the Republicans. They are professionals and much better at it.

I am grateful that my wife does not read this site. She is already devastated by what has happened to her nation. We have friends living in Chiba, the site of the oil refinery fire. Her best friend lives in Utsunomiya where the radiation spiked earlier in the week.

It's important to remember what has happened. Japan is the most quake ready nation on earth. They have been visited by devastating quakes over and over. They have also been victimized by tsunamis. I read a story yesterday about a woman who lived in a town where they had annual tsunami drills. They had safe zones on high ground. When the sirens went off she went straight to the high ground and on to the higher ground beyond, turned and watched the wave sweep over the supposedly safe zone.

This disaster is unparalleled. Japan's earthquake measurement system only goes to 7. This measured 9! They prepared for the types of tsunamis they had seen in the past. These washed hospital patients out of the fourth floor of the hospital. The building stood but only those on the fifth floor survived!

The point is that you can prepare for the reasonable event but this goes beyond reasonable. The nuclear power station was protected from tsunamis and built to withstand earthquakes. It would have been safe from anything. But this was far and away much more than you could plan for.

As of this morning they announced the death toll has hit 13,500 people and they expect it to keep climbing. This is the worst disaster to hit Japan since the Allies firebombed the Japanese cities. In terms of physical destruction (not loss of life) it is worse than Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined with the added horror of nuclear fallout.

There is no way to understate the level of the disaster.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 07:09 PM

If you thought the Gulf oil leak took a long time to bring under control, the events in Japan will take years.

It is Chernobyl's silver anniversery and after these last 25 years radiation levels are too high to spend more than a week without permanent damage to your body.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 07:06 PM

Sarcasm aside, something people would like to know is what are they being lied to about.

1 the claim that a nuke plant can not explode is a technical lie. It can explode but in the way a neutron bomb explodes, like a fizzle with such extreme radiation that only animals are killed.

2 The radiation can not cross the ocean. This is a whopper of a lie. You have heard about how the sands of the Sahara desert blows yellow sand across the Atlantic and deposits it in the Carribean Islands and Florida. You have heard about how the deserts above Beijing China blow all the way to California.

Now if sand and talc like fine sand can cross oceans, why cant really hot atoms that rise in the air cross an ocean. All sorts of radioactive particles can attach to anything else in the air and amke the journey. The concentration will be very low but all you need are an atom or two stuck in your lungs or gut to start a disease event.

3 The big lie about covering up a total meltdown is jaberwockey. Once the moten tons of fuel burn down to the ground there is no way to contain all the steam explosions it will produce as it continues to burrow deeper.

4 For all the reasons above the claim there is no hazard or concern to the United States is a bald faced lie.


5 NRC spokespeople say they do not know what MOX is in the Japan reactor. It is 5% Plutonium. Now how would I know that and he doesn't? He is lieing . You see they do not like to use words people have bad notions about. Words like Plutonium and death.

6 The incentive to lie is because the nuclear industry have4 Trillion dollars on the betting line. They will certainly cheat for that kind of money and believe me they are expert cheaters.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 03:51 PM

Remember the tsunami videos of the bay that was full of those moderately large white boats being dragged over sea walls and under bridges?

In Sendai it seems there was a hughe Dolphin hunting fleet of boats harbored. An American who filmed the COVE secretly documented the mass killing of dozens of families of Dolphins near Sendai.

This documentarian happened to be there when the tsunami hit. In fact he was filing the streets and the villigers all around twon as he randomly drove uphill in town. Then suddely he had to gun it and make some wild turns to get out of the way.

The video of many hundreds of people out walking to go check on friends who had felt the earthquake is eerie. You realize that all the people you see down by the harbor are all dead.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: gnu
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 03:32 PM

Well, sIx, after Harper went on TV claiming that the earthquake in Japan was a clear sign that the opposition should not defeat the government and cause an election due to the fragility of the global economy being at the mercy of Mother Earth and our economic recovery hanging in that balance with only Himself to save us, what did you expect? Even Mother Earth is pissed off at his idiotic musings and she grumbled at the silly SOB.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 03:17 PM

Don't want to cause any alarms here with my fellow canucks ...

but

just in on the CBC ... 5.0-magnitude tremor damages Quebec town

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Stringsinger
Date: 16 Mar 11 - 10:58 AM

9.0! No nukes! (When will we ever learn?)

Look out California! Diablo and San Onofre on notice.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Naemanson
Date: 15 Mar 11 - 06:53 PM

Donuel, my wife's family lives about 100 miles from the plant.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Wolfgang
Date: 15 Mar 11 - 04:06 PM

Latest news rom a German crackpot (singing daughter of a really good folksinger):

Earthquakes are triggered/staged as a weapon by the USA (who else, of course?).

(1) Haiti was a warning to Chavez.
(2) Japan, well that was to punish Japan for signs of weakening regarding their contribution to the Afghanistan crusade (the nuclear fallout was not planned -it just was a collateral damage- for who could guess the safety of the reactors was so abysmally low).

I bet some American crackpots and conspiracy theorists will soon catch up with this particular claim.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Bettynh
Date: 15 Mar 11 - 02:47 PM

There are lots of quakes. The list is for worldwide earthquakes over 5.0 (on our scale of 1 to 10). Shoving an island the size of Japan 8 feet over is going to have some consequences.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: gnu
Date: 15 Mar 11 - 11:24 AM

6.4, 14km down. Near Mount Fuji. Not connected to the big one (different fault line). No damage. Few minor injuries from falling.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: gnu
Date: 15 Mar 11 - 10:41 AM

A powerful earthquake with a preliminary magnitude of 6.0 jolted central Japan on Tuesday night.

The Japan Meteorological Agency says the quake with an intensity of 6 plus on the Japanese seismic scale zero to 7 hit at 10:31 PM.

The focus of the quake is in the eastern part of Shizuoka Prefecture and is estimated to be at a depth of 10 kilometers.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Mar 11 - 09:37 AM

It is Unconscionable for TEPCO and Japanese government lies and propoganda to continue unchallenged. IN a meeting at the American Embassy in Japan the embassy staff and familes asked the ambassador "SHould we leave or should we go?

The US ambassador said they should do as the Japanese Government advises, at which there was an outcry and angry outbursts yelling that TEPCO has a long history of lieing and that the face saving element of Japanese culture serves no purpose when lives are at stake.

There are other things I know that I can not post on a public international site like mudcat, it could jeopardize my insurance status among other things.

If you are able to read between the lines.
At least you should believe me when I tell you,
The containment vessel #2 is breached.
There are 10 reactors at Fukashima in total. All but one will continue to reamin in serious trouble.
I am sure you know what that means and also know that there is no precedence for the 100,000's of tons of nuclear fuel left to burn in the open.

Remember just one cooling pond for spent rods to cool for two years holds as much as 25 reactor cores. It was exposed and fires resulted.

I leave it to you to answer the question the Ambassador could not.

IF there are people in Japan 100 or more miles from Fukushima who need to ask "should I stay or should I go?".

the answer is go.

This is the only respondsible answer.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Naemanson
Date: 15 Mar 11 - 03:28 AM

I met Masato several years ago. I know he lives in or around Tokyo so he was well clear of the tsunamis. He is also clear of the nuclear fallout for now.

As for him checking in on Mudcat I believe he had an elderly parent to care for plus he will be subject to the rolling blackouts.

I believe he is OK.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: wysiwyg
Date: 14 Mar 11 - 03:45 PM

There are quite a few people with the same name. Yes, I tried to find Masato on FB several weeks ago and found only a plethora of similar names; not enough of them had pix for me to spot him.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 14 Mar 11 - 01:56 PM

Equally sad to what I posted above, it seems some have lost their lives by being too camera-keen; on the other hand, mobile phones must have saved many lives, as well as saving worrying, as Ruth said.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Jack Campin
Date: 14 Mar 11 - 01:28 PM

Masato is professor emeritus at Hitotsubashi University in Tokyo, it seems. So he probably wouldn't go in to work every day anyway, and communications there are difficult, even though most people are safe.

There are quite a few people with the same name. This Wikipedia page (on a Japanese version of Auld Lang Syne) makes it clear which is the right one:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aogeba_t%C5%8Dtoshi

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: wysiwyg
Date: 14 Mar 11 - 01:02 PM

PS the last email address I had for him (it's pretty old) ended with:

@m2.ocv.ne.jp

... if anyone can track that to a location?

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: wysiwyg
Date: 14 Mar 11 - 12:57 PM

Masato is a uni prof I believe whose hoime is/was in a somewhat urban area. He's been much on my mind as I am sure he has been on others'.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Mar 11 - 03:53 AM

Donuel, 10:49: eloquent and insightful.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Mar 11 - 12:01 AM

Perhaps I was only feeling a personal helplessness.
If there are people who can make it all better overnight please give them a heads up mg.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 11:56 PM

I don't necessarily agree. I think some things need to be done quickly, can be done quickly and there are people who can do them. They are often called veterans, and have been trained to move quickly and decisively. Ready, fire, aim. One of the great tragedies of Katrina is that help was on its way from private parties, from Swiftboat veterans in boats etc., and they were turned away. I can see turning them away from the epicenter, or where rescue efforts are underway, so as to not have too many conflicting people getting in each others' way, but the Just Send Money It Is Cheaper And Better If We Buy The Stuff Over Here is often nuts. Sometimes it is OK if there are stores etc. open with goods.

mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 11:49 PM

We as human beings become full of ourselves. I am talking about myself or the entirety of mankind and not individuals here.
We think we can do something, the right thing and the wise thing quickly if we only had the proper leaders and understanding.
We can't
The only thing we as a species can do instantly is to destroy.
Certainly given enough time and steady progress we can do amazing things, be it the Great Pyramids or a global satiltte communication system.

To mobile boats when most boats are damaged by tsunamis or even to bull doze roads which are washed away or displaced, are things that are wishful. To do the simplest thing may be impossible at some point.
All we can do is what can be done in a particular moment.
That is what is so dreadfully sad and insufficieant in the midst of such an enormous catastrophe and woe.
Right now there are countless survivors still alive who are stuck somewhere alone in the cold wet and waiting. 10,000 people perished from one town alone.

We see a snappy multi graphic TV screen scrolling ,1,200 dead 1,700 injured...but the truth is far more painful, sad, alone and frightening. ITs like the meat counter at the grocery store, what you see is nothing like what happened getting there under the lights and mist and music.

The helplessness in times like these are the times in which faiths and religions give some minor comfort for some. SOemtimes it is more than cosmetic. Sometimes a person may draw upon real or imaginary powers to not give up and struggle against hope to save themselves or someone else.

No we can not know what it is like in Japan in its entirety, nor should anyone one person have to bear that suffering. We can do what is possible now. Someone else can do something small along with another and another until slowly something big and great may happen.

Maybe someone will someday learn how to do something wonderful and great that can be activated and built in as little time as we are now able to destroy things with missiles bombs and particle beam weapons.

Meanwhile help is on the way. Two weeks without further disasters will be the time when all that could be done will be done to reach lives that will be saved. Some rest will have graves others will not.
And maybe some may become fossils for another age to testify about ther ordeal. It looks sad and will always be sad but there are things we will do to make some things better, slowly over time.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 11:11 PM

I would insist that the owners and CEOs and the engineers etc. be on site to solve any problems that come up. Perhaps they are..mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 11:08 PM

That is good. They said they were bringing relief supplies to people via car. How? The roads are shattered. They are "considering" bringing supplies by air and sea. Once newest tsunami passes (and where did that come from without an earthquake? Series of aftershocks?) they need to get stuff in by boat I would imagine...

I say again our biggest dumbness as a nation is our inability to move goods that they somehow figured out how to move in the 1800s across the world. We should constantly be bundling up old clothes and bedding (cleaned first of course and further sanitized perhaps with steam) vacuum packing and sealing in plastic and be ready to drop them from aircraft or perhaps even into the sea near a shore..certainly should have been done in Haiti where there is a very young population that could have rowed out to big boats (they didn't send boats because docks were destroyed..huh? They could have swam to the big boats)in warm tropical water..Japan of course is freezing cold but I bet there are still a lot of working boats..you have to be able to mobilize boats in a disaster..anything..bicycles, horses, wheelbarrows pushed by juvenile delinquents..

One thing about being mostly elderly..some logistics are going to be easier. They are a more mobile population as in if they are in a nursing type home they can be moved to another one in a safer area. A family situation has to consider schools and jobs and more material goods and farms and etc. As long as they are safe and warm and in touch with their families, and not in medical distress, their needs are going to be easier to meet. If they are exposed to radiation and it is not too high and they are nearing the end of their lifespans, it is better than if they were 5 or 10, the age of so many of the Ukranian children exposed.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 11:02 PM

Perhaps the poor video I saw was of #3 while they were talking about #1


I studied the HD TV pictures in still mode and noticed the difference of the trees and vegetation before and after the explosion of #3.

Before there were evergreen bushes that were full and green.
After those same bushes were scant and brown.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 10:58 PM

Reports that a C T scan is a hundred times more radiation than what is by the crippled N plants.

I say lower Anderson Cooper into reactor 3 like a tea bag now.

"this is Anderson Cooper and below me is a Nuclear power plant without its roof. I am being lowered by heli..take me up take me up its fucking hot down there! No no ...I am still being lowered into tha hot mist down here and   WHOA they just detached the wire and are flying away. Excuse me if you can;t here me through this respirator but it is really hot and Im, im i"


Ya know as soon as the President of Japan said everything was now unbder control at the Nuke Plants that is the signal to run for your life.

Once again a critical chain reaction which amounts to an atomic blast is unlikely but not impossible. When there is enough heat in a huge clump of melted fuel you do not need an initiator or an explosion to set it off. Heat alone is the catalyst.

The thrid plant that reported loss of cooling is now claimed to be a rumor because the radiation sensor was probably just picking up Fukashima radiation.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 10:53 PM

According to Reuters, the latest explosion at reactor #3 has not damaged the reactor containment unit.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 10:44 PM

New explosion from reactor #3. (potentially hydrogen) The damage surpasses what we saw on #1.

In addition a new plume of white smoke is rising from reactor #3.

The video is worthless since the ship off shore has moved about 6 miles away.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 10:30 PM

A second reactor explosion and another tsunami warning -- man, can it get any worse for those poor people.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Jack Campin
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 09:34 PM

Volcanic eruption now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gpl3VK3dl7I

Shinmoedake blowing up with its biggest eruption for 52 years.

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 08:41 PM

Good thing I am not a conduit...mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 08:40 PM

I watched as the scientist said meters repeatedly and the stupid talking head on TV responded with feet each time.

Pretty faces with stupid brains are a particularly bad mix when they are the conduits of vital media information

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 08:37 PM

I have been reading 8 feet..will rechcek. mg

Subject: RE: BS: 8.9 earthquake off Japan, tsunami
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 08:37 PM

Sendai, the Japanese harbor town which is most often pictured on TV is in fact a retirement village and few children except for grandchildren lived in theat retirement village.