BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Greg F.
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 05:30 PM

Not sure why Lizzie Cornish is making such a song and dance about it

Does Liz need a reason to bloviate?

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: selby
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 03:30 PM

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Can you see what it is yet?

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 03:16 PM

Interesting how a guest said what I said but said it to contradict me. Broadmoor is not a high risk hospital. Some of the patients could be a risk to themselves or others if they were left in the community on their own.

Thick as pigshit.

Regarding the convicted criminal Harris, he will be sentenced tomorrow just like any other criminal. Not sure why Lizzie Cornish is making such a song and dance about it. Lots of criminals go to prison each week.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 02:35 PM

I confess - it wasn't Rolf - I did it.

Guilty

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Greg F.
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 02:07 PM

I'd not want to live anymore, were I Rolf

Thank God you're not. Plus I don't think Rolf gives a fart in a high wind what you think[sic] or want or bloviate about - even on your Holy FarceBook (click, click).

You think a great deal to much of yourself, Liz. Sorry, but the sun DOESN'T shine out of your arse.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Jeri
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 02:06 PM

You ever notice how some people get involved in a thread, and they become what the thread's all about? Let's turn a Mudcat thread into one individual's personal Facebook thread...

Eliza, I like you.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 01:46 PM

"as I'm sure the 'guest' whose been on my back trying to make out I had a real problem with them, won't say a thing". Sorry to disappoint you. Every time you open your mouth you condemn yourself. If you really knew anything about transgender you would have realised from the terms I use that I do know what I'm talking about. As for "No doubt they were merely hoping I'd mention my connection with someone who was," if you mean by this that I was hoping you would out someone - no. Outing someone is a major no-no, which you ought to know, since you are so knowledgeable about trans* issues.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 01:45 PM

I realise I'm rather ancient, but isn't it strange how some posters on here seem to be about 10 years old? I've taught that age-group, and when they get het up they speak exactly like some of the less mature people on this thread. A sort of "Mler! So there! Go and eat worms!" kind of style. Fascinating.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 01:38 PM

No, you have no idea what was going on in my marriage at that time..and I most certainly did NOT end my marriage because of anyone else. Sorry to burst your bubble.

No, Shimmy, the squirrels weren't wearing dresses, just smiles.

But hey, if you folks want to poke fun at transvestites, go ahead, as I'm sure the 'guest' whose been on my back trying to make out I had a real problem with them, won't say a thing. No doubt they were merely hoping I'd mention my connection with someone who was, whilst they actually have no idea WHO it was, by the way, as only 2 people on Mudcat know. But you can put down whatever you want.

I wonder if Mudcat is higher security than Broadmoor? If not, it should be with some of the folks in this thread...

Oh and I needed to correct something, when I said I was 'wondering' if Rolf might kill himself tonight, earlier, I meant to put 'worrying', but again, no edit button....

I'll leave you all now to have a guessing game at how many years he'll get, whether you think it's too long/short a sentence and all the torture you could apply to him whilst he's in there....

Seems The Spanish Inquisition is alive and well in here....and no-one suspects that...except me, of course....

Have a lovely evening...and try not to worry about Rolf Harris too much whilst you get your rolls ready for tomorrow's hanging.....

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 01:27 PM

Sooo ... 2 years writing to a sqirrel ... in a frock ... No! ... Must have got that wrong ... somewhere ...??? Probably should go back and wade through acres of verbiage ... but can't be arsed!

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 01:26 PM

From Musket: "Broadmoor isn't a high risk hospital...."



>>>>>..."Broadmoor Hospital is a specialist service that provides assessment, treatment and care in conditions of high security for men from London and the south of England.

It's one of three high-security psychiatric hospitals in England, and is internationally recognised, both for work with patients and for our extensive research activities.

We treat people with mental illness and personality disorders who represent a high degree of risk to themselves or to others...."<<<


Broadmoor Hospital Site... HIGH SECURITY HOSPITAL

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 01:03 PM

"I still care for his 99 year old mother though." you get a lot of mileage out of that one, don't you? Did you ever buy her bath handles and get your son to install them, or is the poor dear still struggling to wash herself because you would rather scream at social services?

No one else involved? Really? I remember being pretty embarrassed for your husband at the time. If any woman had ever humiliated me in public over some internet infatuation the way you did him, I would have behaved with a lot less dignity than he did.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 12:55 PM

No, I didn't leave my husband for anyone. I left for my own reasons...which have been profoundly shown to have been the *right* reasons too. I still care for his 99 year old mother though. There was no other person involved at all. Again, sorry to burst your bubble.

Interesting, Eliza? Would you like some knitting needles so you can busy yourself as they drop the blade?

I'm wondering if he'll kill himself this evening. Why would he not? He lives in a beautiful home by The River Thames, has been there for decades. Tomorrow, he faces years in a prison cell. Today, so they say, he's been tying up his business affairs, so they're assuming...as 'people in black suits' have been visiting, whom they believe to be accountants.

I hate what this country has become...and soon, it will be even worse...

I'd not want to live anymore, were I Rolf. I couldn't bear to live in a country filled with so many vile people who have turned into a lynch mob because they've been told to by people who just want to make money out of his story....

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 12:22 PM

It will be interesting to discover the sentence given tomorrow. I had a look on a website on legal matters, and it's quite a difficult case to deal with. The maximum custodial sentences vary, and one would take into account his age and 'good character' since the times of the offences. I suppose it would also be considered whether to make the sentences concurrent or consecutive. The feeling was that they would be concurrent. The general consensus was about 4-5 years. Less than 4 yrs and one used to serve a minimum of half. More, and it was two-thirds. But this may have changed nowadays.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Musket
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 12:01 PM

Broadmoor isn't a high risk hospital.

For what it is worth, Broadmoor, Rampton and Ashworth serving England, and Carstairs serving Scotland and Northern Ireland cater for the acute end of forensic psychiatric care. Many patients are referred via the judiciary and a huge number have personality disorder. That said, some have organic mental health issues and a curative care plan may appropriate, so for Lizzie Cornish to dismiss testimony purely on the basis of once being a patient there is grossly irresponsible.

The risks are to the patients or public should they abscond. There is no inherent risk in the hospitals. Details of patients remain confidential as per records governance legislation, in particularly The Health and Social Care Act 2008 (regulated activities) regulations 2010.

I used to inspect one of the above and was involved at one time in commissioning forensic care. I find her choice of words disgraceful. You do not get "sent" there. You may be referred, but your admittance is on clinical need, and not all are accepted.

Any more bullshit or can this thread either discuss a convicted criminal called Rolf Harris or quietly slip down the page?

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 12:01 PM

Lizzie didn't *knowingly* spend 2 years writing to someone who was a transvestite. She spent 2 years in an internet "relationship" with someone who called himself Sam and claimed multiple personalities on Mudcat and presumably in other places. I believe she left her husband for him, without ever actually meeting him, as he was a fantasist who was allegedly coming to England to live happily ever after with her. But he never turned up. Between him and that Rolph bloke I'm not sure Lizzie has always showed herself to be the best judge of character.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:57 AM

on the basis that she's read about it in the media so she knows the truth
As posted before her original post is a close match to a report on the BBC news website. Not quite as bad as relying on, say, the Daily Wail but those on-line articles don't have room for detail. I would rather see a full court report.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:49 AM

No, no. The squirrel was wearing the frock. It started life as a female, but became a transgender. As a male squirrel it wore a frock because it was actually a transvestite. It bit several underage men (keep up!) but was arrested and found guilty by a jury who had absolutely no right to do so. How can you all be so THICK? I will be writing to complain to the Daily Mail, the BBC and the Queen. I will also be ringing up the Mirror and swearing profusely on Radio 4.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:46 AM

"I spent two years of my life writing to someone who was a transvestite" What's that got to do with Stephen George, who is transgendered not transvestite.

"And write to April Ashley," Did she write back?

I believe someone has already taken issue with you over your belief that people who have mental health issues are incapable of telling truth.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:39 AM

>>"You really do hate trans* people, don't you. Is that why you chose to accuse 'Alison' Pink of lying?"<<<


WHAT??????????????? !!!!!!!!

How fecking DARE you say such a thing...

FYI, I spent two years of my life writing to someone who was a transvestite, which can be checked with other folks on Mudcat who know about that...so why don't you put that up your arse and do whatever you so choose with it...

And write to April Ashley, you'll find her on FB, as I wrote to her a while back now, about a year back, to thank her for writing her book, the one I read when I was 14, for opening my eyes to the pain many folks endure to finally become who they were always meant to be.

Alison Pink, well, Broadmoor is one of the top psychiatric hospitals in the country, with some very mentally unstable patients, as in, VERY unstable indeed. May I politely suggest you look some of them up...and anyone who chose to believe, outright, the kind of claims being made by this person without first looking into those claims deeply, would be behaving somewhat oddly, don't you think? You do NOT get sent to Broadmoor for not paying for your Tea & Biccies, you know. NO paper should have published the hearsay of this person, nor of anyone else, whomsoever they might be, without having EVIDENCE that they are telling the truth, or a reliable, truthful witness....

Peter Sutcliffe, Ian Brady...etc...

You can read about more of them right here:
Broadmoor Gives Up It's Secrets

ALL claims of sexual abuse should be looked into seriously, but NONE should EVER be taken at face value, without further investigation, particularly if you are dealing with those from the kind of high risk hospital Broadmoor is. To do otherwise, would be extremely foolish

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:28 AM

"but oddly enough I've never been bitten by a man in a frock ???"

Ha! You've never lived!!

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:28 AM

Exclusive -

Man in frock bites underage squirrel !!! Rolf Harris denies all involement. Loyal supporter demonstrate outsides Court
"Rolf is innocent" she cries "He never laid a finger on any small rodents
unless begged to heal them by their worried owners - that's the kind of pure spirit Rolf is"

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:22 AM

The squirrel was obviously innocent.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Colin Cackhead
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:12 AM

oh, right, I think I get the gist of it.....

I supposes it would be too self indulgent and far from the point
if I were to delve deep into my own personal history and experience
and share this for public scrutiny;

I've a scar on my finger where a squirrel bit me,
but oddly enough I've never been bitten by a man in a frock ???

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 11:00 AM

No, Lizzie is saying he never touched any squirrel, cross-dressed or otherwise, on the basis that she's read about it in the media so she knows the truth and the jury (who merely sat in court and listened to the evidence) are wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Colin Cackhead
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 10:56 AM

I've had to skim read to catch up, as this thread's now getting a bit too chaotic and difficult to follow..

So, sorry if I've not quite understood ...

but are some folk now saying Rolf Harris is a cross dresser who talks to squirrels ?..

dresses as a squirrel ?..

fiddles with young squirrels in dresses ...???

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 10:41 AM

"Transgender, transexual, sex swap, sex reassignment, intersex, hermaphrodite, ALL are terms used 'out there' to describe whichever section of this you may choose to describe."

You really do hate trans* people, don't you. Is that why you chose to accuse 'Alison' Pink of lying?

"And now, we have the Newest of The New Headlines, of how two EVIL PAEDOPHILES (yes, Savile and Rolf) were both at Broadmoor!!

Shock! Horror! FUCKKKKKKKKKKKKK#!!!$%$^&*!!!!!!!###

Right, ROLF was there at THE SUMMER FETE, signing autographs, whilst sitting down at a desk, in the sunshine.

HOWEVER, a lady called Alison Pink, who was formerly a Mister, has now said she, when she was a he, saw Savile and Rolf watching the female patients at Broadmooor undressing later that day...

Just one thing you might like to know about Miss Pink, she is a former INMATE of Broadmoor, the highest category psychiatric hospital in the country, lest we forget, which houses Ian Brady and Peter Sutcliffe, amongst other Friendly Folks You'd Not Ask Round To Meet Yer Granny

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 10:37 AM

Good to know that Operation Yewtree is being/has been run by Fine, Upstanding, Outstanding Officers/Former Officers, who think going on Big Brother (don't even get me STARTED on THAT load of bullshit) is a worthy thing to do!

Well, he looks A Former Officer Of Integrity, for sure....

Former Operation Yewtree Officer enters 'Big Brother' house

It's me, ain't it?

Im too old for this world....

You see, I come from a time before fecking Big Brother and all this Porn Stuff, and now, here is one of the former Yewtree Officers appearing on this fecking load of porno/dumbed down bullshit!!!!

WHAT has happened to us, as a Species?

Answers, PLEASE, on a postcard to:

IREALLYDoNOTunderstandAfeckingThingAnyLonger
c/o WFTisGoingOn Cottage
Fecked-Up-On-Sea
Yewtree Britain

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 09:57 AM

...on HIS deathbed, that should read...Darn this 'no edit' thing on Mudcat...

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 09:55 AM

Well, I learned a lot more from watching the shadows forming from the sunshine and the leaves of the trees, Richard, than you did listening to your teacher, it seems. The 'squirrels' by the way, used to be on my lap each week day morning, on my way into work from Ruislip Manor, as I waited for the train into London. We'd share our early morning time together, they munching on the nuts I'd feed them each day....Do keep up..

Transgender, transexual, sex swap, sex reassignment, intersex, hermaphrodite, ALL are terms used 'out there' to describe whichever section of this you may choose to describe.   Perhaps you'd like to start a new thread on language usage?   Or, merely carry on carping...and talking of carping...there's this, but who knows if it's true or not.....

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/intersex-fish-showing-up-in-pennsylvania-rivers/


Meanwhile, one of Rolf's neighbours and 'friends' (yeah, right, Missus) is busy talking to the Daily Mail about how let down she feels by him, what with him having the kindness to sing softly to her dying husband on her death bed, being there for her instantly...

Good 'friend', huh?   Nothing like a kindness being 'repaid', eh, Missus?

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT!!!!

I'd not be surprised if he kills himself shortly, to be honest, possibly tonight, as it will be his last night of freedom...and who would blame him, because who would want to remain living in this vitriolic world of Pack Humans who believe WHATEVER they are told by the newspapers....

If he doesn't, I'm sure it won't be long before he dies in prison....

And I feel desperately sad about this, desperately sad, but heyho, at least all his 'victims' ????? will get to share out all his £millions and have a party, until one day, their guilty may get too much, just like the guilt of the father of Michael Jackson's 'victim' did...and they too may take their own lives....

If I could leave this country, I would. I think we've taken leave of our senses...and this morning they were pushing for ALL children to be believed on sex abuse, at all times...

Watch this space, folks.....

Of course, no-one EVER mentions that maybe we need to get back to CARING for our children in the first place, loving them, having time to BE with them, not being made to work 24/7 whilst other folks raise them, abuse them, fuck up their minds, etc. whilst the children grow deeply resentful of their parents not being there for them, making up stories about their parents abusing them, phoning Childline, etc..etc...Even Esther Rantzen has spoken of her concerns of starting up Childline now, after she'd been filming some children, can't recall where now, and had been advised against taking photos of them, in case she could be 'accused' of something at a later date......

Totally fecking fucked up.......

I need tea!!

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 08:23 AM

Oh, Guest, no chance of her understanding that, she stared out of the window at school, to watch the squirrels.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 08:09 AM

Lizzie - "Yes, sex swap, or 'gender swap', choose whichever you prefer, as in being known by a different gender entirely, to the one they were previously known by, having surgery to either remove one set of sexual organs (some being born with both)"

Not whichever I prefer, whichever trans* people prefer. And it's "gender reassignment".

"(some being born with both)"

You also appear to be confused about the difference between transgender and intersex. Do a little research!

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Greg F.
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 07:54 AM

an expression you would never use if you actually knew any transgendered people.

But OF COURSE she knows them - they're on her FarceBook Page! (click, click)

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Greg F.
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 07:50 AM

Is the math just slightly off on those figures?

Its LIZ that's off, and a bit more than slightly.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Johnny J
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 07:31 AM

"The only way to keep the criminal justice system honest is to presume that all judicial procedures are as unjust as the Salem witch trials unless there is clear evidence to the contrary."

There would be even fewer members of the public prepared to give evidence for the prosecution and, perhaps, nobody would consider it worthwhile reporting crime at all if they felt that everybody automatically assumed they were liars. Likewise, nobody would want to appear on a jury or risk producing a guilty verdict.

Of course, if one does have knowledge and access to evidence, then by all means challenge a court's findings but public forums such as these are not the most effective means of doing so.

Perhaps Lizzie does have some inside knowledge of these cases but she should take it to the authorities. Perhaps, she could even have volunteered to become a witness for the defence during the trial?

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Jack Campin
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 07:04 AM

When accused persons are found not guilty, it's not acceptable to slander them publicly or dispute their innocence in the media or in public forums. So why is it OK to defend convicted criminals and bad mouth prosecution witnesses as one particular poster has done in this instance?

To make occurrences like the convictions of Dreyfus, Timothy Evans, the Birmingham Six or the Al-Jazeera journalists in Egypt less likely in future. The only way to keep the criminal justice system honest is to presume that all judicial procedures are as unjust as the Salem witch trials unless there is clear evidence to the contrary.

I have no inside info on the Harris case and haven't been following it, so I'm in neither the "hang him" or "free him" camp.

Does Lizzie actually know anything about it that the rest of us don't?

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Johnny J
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 06:49 AM

"And to the person who stated that I should not be challenging the jury's decision in any way, nor the witnesses, may I point him to The Guilford Four and the Birmingham Six............"

If anyone has information or good evidence to suggest that the conviction is unsound then they should present it to the appropriate authorities. There are procedures which have to be adhered to in such matters, e.g. appeal processes, judicial inquiries and so on.

By all means, injustices and erroneous verdicts should be challenged but in the appropriate manner.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 06:45 AM

"He can't be innocent. He is guilty. Neither statement above contradicts any stance as to whether he committed any crime. He has been convicted in a court of law following due process. There is no alternative whatsoever to the judicial system, and luckily, holding a court in contempt is a crime itself if expressed in said court."

Am I dealing with Dingbats here, or WHAT?

Yes, it is called THE COURT OF APPEAL


The Birmingham Six

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 06:39 AM

>>>"Lizzie, dear, 'transvestite' and 'transgender' are not the same thing. Transvestites not want a 'sex swap' - an expression you would never use if you actually knew any transgendered people. Transvestism is not the same as transgender. Reading an autobiography decades ago does not make you an expert."<<<

Where, WHERE have I said they are the same thing? Please, feel free to put that down.

Yes, sex swap, or 'gender swap', choose whichever you prefer, as in being known by a different gender entirely, to the one they were previously known by, having surgery to either remove one set of sexual organs (some being born with both) or, having had a total reconstruction to align their body into total alignment with who they have always felt themselves to be....

Next!!!!   


Oh, and my complaint to the Operation Yewtree folks has gone in, via The Met Police, who sent it to the team by email, painstakingly taking down my words to be sent onwards to them...

Messages left on the answerphone of The Mirror, both deeply insulting journalist, mentioned above, and the secretary to the Editor...

Just about to email Amanda Platell, via a colleague of hers who has said she'll pass it on....And whilst Amanda may not be a most favourite person of mine, to be honest, she is one who had the guts a while back to stand up for her dear friend of 15 years, Rolf Harris, in an article she wrote about him....

Three things will happen here..

An innocent man will be left to probably die in prison, his fortune given away to people who have lied outright about him....

He may admit to everything (although I think he'd have done this immediately, to be honest, had he been guilty)

Or, it will become recognized that a gross miscarriage of justice has been allowed to take place and he will be either set free, or exonerated posthumously, if he has already died in prison.


And to the person who stated that I should not be challenging the jury's decision in any way, nor the witnesses, may I point him to The Guilford Four and the Birmingham Six, along with Leonard Peltier, who, to this day, remains illegally and wrongfully imprisoned in the USA, 39 YEARS after being framed by the FBI...


Oh yes, and as to George Rolph, yes, the man fooled me and many others, although it was our fault, because the merest click on the internet to his name, revealed all.....

Strangely, nothing was 'revealed' about Rolf Harris though, until now, when masses of 'abused' people are apparently falling out of the woodwork, just as they have in every other Yewtree Trial, regardless of the men being proven guilty or...innocent.

ALL I would have to do, to make such an accusation, would be to find out places these men have appeared over time, say I was there...and my mother knew, but she's now died...and there we have it, 'MY STORY OF ABUSE'...I wouldn't even have to state he took me back to a house, or a car, or a caravan (which could be traced, possibly) as I could just say 'I was in a queue, waiting for his autograph, officer!' and apparently, there it would be...#evidence# enough to convict a man and send him to prison in this Brave New World Of Women Who NEVER Lie.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: selby
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 06:37 AM

As I understand this, Rolf has been found guilty by a jury of a crime.
If he and his solicitor think that the verdict is flawed they can then seek leave to appeal. At the moment he has not be given his sentence,so we will have to wait to see if he is going to appeal.If the evidence,victims and witness are flawed as is being suggested then the whole sorry story will rumble on.

Even with compensation there are no winners.

Keith

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 05:59 AM

good old Rolph!

what a song....Streets of London!

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Musket
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 05:57 AM

He can't be innocent. He is guilty.

Neither statement above contradicts any stance as to whether he committed any crime. He has been convicted in a court of law following due process.

There is no alternative whatsoever to the judicial system, and luckily, holding a court in contempt is a crime itself if expressed in said court.

You can question whether the evidence was presented properly, whether evidence was suppressed or ruled inadmissible or whether the jury was directly objectively and in line with the cross examination and evidence the jury saw and heard.

That is what the appeal process is all about.

He is guilty until proven innocent. That's the shift in emphasis once a court has judged.

My only concern is that the police are now asking CPS to consider further charges that they didn't bring forward before. I am uncomfortable with the notion that it is easier to get a conviction on someone who is already guilty in another court of similar crimes. His fame precludes a jury's opportunity to look at allegations without prejudice.

The police should have added those to the charge sheet and asked CPS to consider them at the time.

Did he do what the jury agreed he did? There is nobody here on Mudcat with the perspective the jurors had. Full stop.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 05:41 AM

"But please, feel free to keep knocking me, if you so wish, although, quite WHY you even bother to read my posts, which seen to upset you so much, I've no idea...."

I can assure you that I'm not upset, Lizzie. But if you're really as concerned about environmental matters, as you say you are, then I think that you should be striving to oppose the the various destructive forces out there as effectively as possible. And such opposition should include effective communications. All you seem to do is go on and on and on and on and on etc. about how much more concerned you are about the fate of our "beautiful planet" than anyone else!

"Black Americans have had a lot more respect being given to them, a lot earlier, than the Native Americans have, ..."

Perhaps that's because Black Americans got organised and developed an EFFECTIVE Civil Rights movement. And perhaps they didn't sit around all day going on and on and on and on etc. about how 'spiritual' they are?

Anyway, this is getting a long way from Rolf Harris. You still haven't convinced me that he's not guilty, by the way, Lizzie.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 04:44 AM

Lizzie, dear, 'transvestite' and 'transgender' are not the same thing. Transvestites not want a 'sex swap' - an expression you would never use if you actually knew any transgendered people. Transvestism is not the same as transgender. Reading an autobiography decades ago does not make you an expert.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: Johnny J
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 04:29 AM

I can't understand how some peple are able to make assertions regarding convicted persons such as Harris being actually innocent unless they were in court during the trial itself or had an inside knowledge of the case. The jury heard the whole trial and, if there wasn't a case to answer, the judge would have directed them accordingly. You can't make a proper judgement based on media sound bites and court reports on TV.

When accused persons are found not guilty, it's not acceptable to slander them publicly or dispute their innocence in the media or in public forums. So why is it OK to defend convicted criminals and bad mouth prosecution witnesses as one particular poster has done in this instance?

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 04:29 AM

'sex sway' should have been 'sex swap' of course...

No, I understand a GREAT deal about Transgender and Transvestite situations, thanks...more than you will ever know, as I knew someone who was Transvestite and have several Transvestite/Transgender folks on my page...I was also reading the autobiography of April Ashley when I was 14 years old....

Sigh...

No, Shimmy, you miss my point...I will ALWAYS write in the way which is totally natural to me. I have been told how to write, how much, how little, the content, the grammar, been ridiculed, abused, etc..etc....but NOTHING will ever stop me writing as I write. I speak this way too, passionate about what I believe in..and I know I can sway people around too. I am welcomed on BBC Radio Devon phone-ins all the time..and was told by Nicky Campbell, who was hosting a BBC Radio 5 phone in on fracking, a while back now, that they'd never had so many calls about my phone call, I cried in the middle of it, because I knew what was to come, what we are doing to this amazingly beautiful planet we are so blessed to live upon...Nicky came back to me for a second call that morning...and during that time on his show, I got in more information than many on the horrors which are staring us directly in the face, environmentally, because I've come to know about many different ecocidal pieces of insanity now happening around our planet.....

But please, feel free to keep knocking me, if you so wish, although, quite WHY you even bother to read my posts, which seen to upset you so much, I've no idea....

Yes, Eliza, once, we just used to hug and touch each other in a normal, HUMAN, way, but now that's all changed...Much of it is also because of people who hate being touched at all, who are driving through rules and regulations which are insane. Also, you now have so many mothers who have no choice but to give their children over to others to raise, all day long, so they can keep a roof over their heads, one salary no longer being able to do this. Those mothers are torn apart, desperately fearful their children are going to be abused and so, draconian rules are brought in....Those who lose out are the children, who are now all but devoid of human touch from others...

When, as a Mum, I helped out at our village playgroup, if any child was crying/hurting, we'd simply pick them up and treat them as our own, hugging them, kissing them better etc, no thought at all of HOW we should do this, just a totally natural reaction. Now, my friend, who works in a 'pre-school learning alliance' as they so chillingly called in many instances these days, has to have two staff to accompany any child the toilet, in case one of those staff is a paedophile... ????

Also, when I was in Neasden Eye Hospital for well over a month, aged 19, I was put in the children's ward, (only 6 beds, very small hospital, now gone, I believe)...and every evening, the children who were able to get out of their beds (some had to lie very still and flat on their backs) clambered into my bed for our evening story and I'd sit on the bed cuddling them all in as best I could...

Today, I would be arrested for doing that.

When I lost the first of the two little souls I lost, the chief radiologist, who'd been called in, due to the nature of what was happening to me, hugged me SO tightly and for SO long, after he'd given me the news that my baby had died. He knew what lay ahead, for many years, too. Had he NOT shown me that deep care and compassion, coming on to the ward the next day to go through everything with me again, making sure I understood in minute detail, I really don't think I'd have got through what was to come. I went back, time and again, to the love that man showed me at a time I needed it so badly.   It was nothing more than Human to Human contact in a moment of desperate need.

Today, he would lose his job, be sued by the woman, and probably end up in prison......

What a truly fucked up world we have created........ :0(


And Al, whilst we are playing Cowboys and Indians, a la Hollywood's version, the Native Americans were being abused, ridiculed and hugely disrespected, because we had all been so indoctrinated against them. Today, they are still being treated that way by many... "Just get over it!" being the common cry they hear most often, whilst celebrities dress in their headdresses 'for a bit of fun' and continue to 'play at being Indian'....

Black Americans have had a lot more respect being given to them, a lot earlier, than the Native Americans have, albeit they still have to endure shocking racism at times, but more people ARE shocked when those instances happen. Yet, when the Native Americans face the same kind of racial hatred, or abuse, most folks look away, snigger, or yell 'Get over it!'

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 03:42 AM

"Shimmy, yes, I've heard of both. I don't have the precis gene, sorry about that, and..I write the way I write, never telling you how to write, please note that last bit....Thanks..."

Lizzie, I very much doubt that there is any such thing as a "precis gene". Concise prose comes with practice and a desire to communicate effectively. I would never dream of telling you how to write - but I should point out that I usually manage to get through less than half of one of your diatribes and then tend to give up. So you rarely effectively communicate anything to me!

Here's a salutary tale:

A couple of years ago a local woman - let's call her ... oh, I don't know ... 'Lucy Devonshire' ... got in touch with me because she feared that a major infra-structure project might damage local wildlife and she knew that I was interested in this area. Eventually, we contacted our MP - who arranged for us to meet the developers to discuss our concerns with them. I thought long and hard about what we should say to them and prepared a 10 minute presentation. We got to the meeting and as soon as the introductions had been made, Lucy launched into a diatribe - it was unstructured and rambling and she went on and on and on ... and on and on ... and on and ... well, you get the picture? Everyone glazed over. Unfortunately, there was no effective chairperson to shut her up. I got 5 minutes, at the end of the meeting, to cram my 10 minute presentation into. Afterwards, my MP said to me that, during my brief stint, he caught the developers looking at each other as if to say, "this bloke knows what he's talking about!" Nevertheless, we were never invited back and local wildlife got damaged.

And the point of this story?: Going on and on and on in a rambling and unstructured way rarely achieves anything - except to piss off your readers/listeners!

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: akenaton
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 03:37 AM

Modern society is the problem, we have allowed fools to twist the rearing and nurturing of children out of recognition.
The culture of "self" rules, children are regarded as an impediment to life, not an enhancement.
Divorce, separation, the undermining of family and conservative social values, all have led to the shambles.......Personal responsibility has vanished to be replaced with....."somebody will pick up the pieces"

"OH but these are "historic cases"......History did not start in the 60's and 70's, but something more insidious and destructive did!

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 03:06 AM

As a retired teacher, I often consider the changes over the years regarding touching, cuddling or grabbing children in the course of school life. I've taught all ages between 6yrs and 12yrs. (Primary and Middle School) I've often had to separate fighting lads in the playground, and needed to grab the little horrors by the arm (or even round their waists!) to get them apart. I've had children crying with a skinned knee and had to pick them up, comfort them and cart them off to the Welfare Lady. I once had a little girl in my class, aged 8, who was seriously disturbed and sobbed on her desk most of the time. She was having psychiatric help, but I always managed to calm her by sitting her beside me at my desk and tucking her under one side of my thick Arran cardigan! She sometimes spent the whole lesson like that, a chick under the wing of a mother hen. Nowadays, I suppose all this is totally taboo and might be construed as a bit pervy or whatever. So although I of course deplore Harris's actions, it must be said (not as exoneration but just as a general comment) that in those days, touchy-feely behaviour with children was seen differently. This probably provided a good cover for anyone with nasty intentions, and is the reason for the changes today. But it is a shame. My lovely neighbour works in a pre-school nursery, and she tells me there are many restrictions on what one is allowed to do regarding the physical care and restraint of the young children there. She finds it a bit silly (she has children of her own) but like me she sees the reasons behind it.

Subject: RE: BS: Rolf Harris Found Guilty of 12 Offences
From: GUEST,TT
Date: 03 Jul 14 - 03:04 AM

" And NO, I do NOT have a problem with folks who are transvestites, or who've gone for the whole sex sway, thanks, before you push that on me too, in every effort to make me look as bad as ever..."

Perhaps you could check up on the difference between transvestite and transgender, since you've got that totally wrong as well. Check your facts, Lizzie, check your facts.