BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary

Subject: BS: And Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 22 Jul 16 - 08:45 PM

The Republican National Convention ended last night, and none too soon. After a week listening to people with that mindset, I was starting to think they might be a majority in the U.S.

But The convention ended Thursday, and Friday was a Hillary day. First she had a rally and answered the Republican convention very aptly, but the left the question of her running mate hanging. Late in the day, Clinton announced that Virginia U.S. Senator Tim Kaine would be her running mate.

I was hoping Hillary would pick Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders as a running mate, but it sounds like Kaine is a good choice.

You go, Hillary!

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 03:47 AM

Now it's all about Hillary.   From the perspective of World Peace, that is the problem

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 06:11 AM

"From the perspective of World Peace,"
Britain armed Qaddafi, educated his son to take over and armed his opponents to help overthrow him.
Lorra-lorra "world peace" in that.
im Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 06:59 AM

Delegates to the Democratic National Convention have been cautioned against using the words "great", "fantastic", and "amazing" when speaking with the media. A list of alternative superlatives such as "superior", "outstanding", and "extraordinary" has been provided.

The words "epic" and "awesome" have also been proscribed, not because they are identified with Mr. Trump, but because they're just plain fucking lame and nobody should use them.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 07:01 AM

Gaddafi is gone Jim, brutally murdered, we are not discussing him in this thread, but the motivations and perceptions of someone who may be the leader of one of the most powerful nations on earth.

In my opinion she is proven to be unfit for high office.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 07:03 AM

Mr Trump may also be unfit for office, but that is yet to be proved or disproved.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 07:10 AM

My God, ake, are you really that dense, or are ya trollin? If you are, seek help. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: gillymor
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 08:36 AM

He is that dense. This is the guy who not to many months ago was still promoting Sarah Palin as the savior of western civilization.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 08:39 AM

"Dense" is a serious understatement.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 08:42 AM

"Gaddafi is gone Jim, brutally murdered, we are not discussing him "
Then why did you raise a statement by him?
"In my opinion she is proven to be unfit for high office."
You haven't liked her since she turned you down.
Britain has dealt with, supported, sold arms to very shade of political extremism on the planet and continues to do so.
In fact, Clinton says nothing at all in support of Qaddafi in your clip - she states it exactly as it was.
Whatever her failings, and I have no doubt there are many, she is infinitely more acceptable that the alternative of a monster like Trump - though it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest that you support him and his racist viciousness.
What do you propose as an alternative Ake?
Putting him in office to prove whether he is fit is gibberish - his pre-election statements expose him as the fascist he is.
"My God, ake, are you really that dense"
Yup - 'fraid so.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 09:01 AM

Malania is much too innocent to be hanging by her heels in front of a gas station. Donald, not so much. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 12:47 PM

Mr Trump is no Fascist, he is of Scottish extraction on his mothers' side.....she was a MacLeod of Lewis daughter of a crofter, Maryanne to her kin. I know a family who remember her.

If Mr Trump has any of the "Leosach" in him, he'll make a fair enough president for the Yanks. Och the puir craiturs need a wee bit grit in their diet or they'll all be goin' aboot layin' soft shelled eggs.

My great grandmother was a "Leosach"

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 12:53 PM

"Mr Trump is no Fascist,"
Yes he is - what's his ancestry got to do with anything - don't they have fascists in Scotland?
You sound as if you're recommending him on his racial purity - point made, I think.
Did you know that the father of the Nazi Party was a basket-maker?
Not a lot of people know that!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 03:28 PM

I think Kaine is a very good choice, Joe. I'd much rather see both Bernie and Elizabeth stay in the senate.

My concern is that Trump is not being taken seriously by his opposition in either his own party or by many in the Democratic party. He is a master manipulator.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 08:32 PM

Scottish fascists? There've been a few all right, in every sense of the word.

But I don't really think Donald Trump fits the word. Every bit as nasty, but lacking some of the essential characteristics of your classic pseudo-militaristic Fascist.

He's a xenophobic American populist, interested in getting power, and without a single thing he believes in, apart from himself. And as Chesterton sagely wrote "Believing in himself is one of the commonest signs of a rotter... Believing utterly in one's self is a hysterical and superstitious belief." In fact it is a kind of madness.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 23 Jul 16 - 08:34 PM

And as I pushed the button to send that, another name of whom much the same could be said popped into my head. Tony Blair. And he of course was Scottish...

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 02:08 AM

I don't think Mr Trump would turn out to be an ideological interventionist Mr McGrath, should he be elected President.

Given the two candidates, Mrs Clinton is the only proven warmonger.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 02:16 AM

I think Ake STILL is clueless about American government and politics. It does rather read like trolling.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jon Bartlett
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 02:41 AM

Trump actually reminds me of Huey Long, "The Kingfish"

Jon Bartlett

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 02:47 AM

I never dreamed I'd actually see anyone supporting Trump on this forum - but taking into consideration who it is......
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Thompson
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 04:40 AM

Trump horrifies me. But hearing this morning that Clinton's chosen vice-president candidate is "adamantly against the death penalty" but presided over something like nine State killings during his time as a governor gives me no confidence.
(I speak as someone who has lost two close relatives to State murder.)

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 05:27 AM

I don't "support" Mr Trump Jim, had I been eligible to vote, my vote would have gone to Mr Sanders as Democratic candidate.

I think that Mrs Clinton is beyond the pale given her previous record in office and her professed attitude to World Politics.......I would probably abstain had I the opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 05:29 AM

"I think Ake STILL is clueless about American government and politics."

It's very kind of you to keep the list so short.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 05:32 AM

Acme, you should know by now that I never "troll".
Everything I write I consider carefully and firmly believe.

Your remarks concerning my supposed misogyny would almost certainly be in the trolling category?

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 05:54 AM

"I don't "support" Mr Trump
By even considering a racist, crudely aggressive, mysoginist, warmongering boorish lout as the leader of the most powerful country in the world is support enough - he is an extremely dangerous man, and to suggest that his might turn out otherwise is strange to say the least.
Your obsessive hatred of Clinton is irrational - she is no better or worse than any other middle-of-the-road pro-capitalist politicians - I have to confess that, as you have never explained that hatred, misogyny sprang to mind with me - not beyond the realms of possibility considering your homophobia - horse and carriage.
You cannot blame people for reaching their own conclusions given your constantly making outrageously extreme statements then leaving them undefended.
I find you totally beyond the pale politically.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 09:15 AM

"I hate and despise the person I am talking about" is a mode of discourse better left to the Trumps of this world, I suggest. Not the best role model.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 09:43 AM

To whom are you referring in your previous post Mr McGrath?

I have never said that I hate and despise anyone.

I have said that Mrs Clinton is a serial warmonger. A supporter and prime mover in the interventions regarding Iraq Libya and Syria....all completely wrong in my opinion and decisions which have greatly endangered us all; resulting in the advancement of Islamic Fundamentalism and associated terrorism.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 10:12 AM

I give mr Carroll a second. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 10:17 AM

There is a reason the Russians and Wikileaks released the hacked Democratic National Party emails RIGHT NOW - they fear and want to cripple Hillary. They're probably ecstatic over the idea that a hot mess like Trump would end up in office - every strong man and dictator, every Kim Jong-Un and Putin, would be able to run circles around that fool. He might even do their work for them, if they can fool about who is doing what out there in the World. Hillary has her eye on the ball.

If this thread is indeed "about Hillary" then Ake, I suggest you relax and not post every other remark here. Your bad opinion has registered, and by continuing to interfere in a thread that you don't understand, that you just want to undermine, IS TROLLING. So sit on your hands while you read, or better yet, go play a musical instrument. Let the people who actually have an interest in this discussion participate without your noise.

I have thoughts on Brexit and on the SNP, etc, but you didn't see me arguing with everyone who put up a post opposite of my opinion. Especially since it would be pompous of me to push myself into the middle of a discussion you're essentially holding among yourselves.

Get it yet?

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 11:00 AM

Thompson. My condolences to you and your family.

Don't know if this will be useful information to you. https://www.buzzfeed.com/chrismcdaniel/tim-kaines-complicated-history-with-the-death-penalty?utm_term=.qhAawaWW1#.mqxQyQBBd

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 11:40 AM

There have certainly been times when I have held my nose and voted for candidates I considered the lesser of evils, but that won't be the case in this election. I think Hillary is a qualified to hold the office of POTUS as any person can be in this post-modern age.

I also understand that many on the left and the right really do not like or trust her. My hope is they will hold their noses and vote for her anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 12:22 PM

Wow "hot mess" is perfect. I approve of Mr Kane's selection. I was pulling for Liz or Sharod, but as their replacements would have fallen to republicans, I'm ok. Besides, he's amazingly progressive for someone elected in Virginia, and we need the Senate. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: robomatic
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 04:19 PM

Trump reminds me of Berlusconi due to his relationship with popular media, loose speech and shoot from the hip attitude. But he is potentially and American Berlusconi with access to The Button.

I think Tim Kaine is an adequate choice. I enjoyed his speech with occasional dips into Spanish.

LaGuardia campaigned in English, Italian, and Yiddish.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Thompson
Date: 24 Jul 16 - 05:54 PM

Thanks, Janie, that's the article that I saw that gave me the creeping chills.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Stringsinger
Date: 25 Jul 16 - 12:09 PM

Along with Michael Moore, I am the bearer of extremely bad news. Get ready to say hello to President Trump, the new "Il Duce".

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 25 Jul 16 - 12:19 PM

It could have been worse..:00

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 25 Jul 16 - 01:17 PM

"It could have been worse"
Unbelievable!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 25 Jul 16 - 04:45 PM

Timing is everything.

Putin's online troll factory may be trying to get Trump elected to undermine US.

Ya think?

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Charley Noble
Date: 25 Jul 16 - 08:57 PM

Well, everyone has to admit the Democratic Convention has gotten off to a horrendous start. Thanks to the Russian hackers, there is no longer any doubt that the Democratic National Committee was doing its best (or worst) to tilt the primaries for Hillary Clinton. I suppose that's really no great surprise but I do resent the Russians trying to manipulate our elections. And, of course, Trump is delighted that they are so successful.

As a Bernie supporter in the Primary, I have no problem now urging others to stand with Hillary Clinton. There's no way this country can afford a Donald Trump. Reread IT CAN'T HAPPEN HERE by Sinclair Lewis in the 1930s, and think carefully before you sit this one out, vote for a third party candidate, or vote for Trump.

Charlie Ipcar

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 01:51 AM

Not a harmonious start, CN, but I don't think I would call it horrendous. We will have to wait and see how it plays out over the remaining 3 days. I wasn't able to tune in until just after 8 this evening. At the point I started watching it was pretty raucous and the Hillary Haters were going strong. Appears they were able to restrain some of their hate a bit once Michelle Obama began speaking. She was magnificant!

Had an interesting conversation with my 87 year old mother this evening. She watched the Republican convention and had seen some of the earlier broadcast of the DNC and environs that I had not seen.    What struck her was how much hate was in evidence throughout the Republican convention, and was very worried with respect to the state and the future of our country that hate was also in evidence to the extent it was from Hillary haters at the Dem. convention.



Michelle and Booker were inspirational.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Stu
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 05:01 AM

"I suppose that's really no great surprise but I do resent the Russians trying to manipulate our elections."

Is it any worse than Obama coming over here to threaten the UK during the Brexit campaign? Because that backfired and really pissed people off, including Remainers. Russian/US self-interest are the motivations in these interventions and democracy can go hang.

Same man, different hat.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 07:10 AM

Folks, a giant elephant is dropping ever-larger turds in the room. We do not have the luxury of choices anymore. There is exactly one. You can have Clinton, or you can have Trump. Period. Full stop.

Never mind all the yes-but-look-at [fill in the latest scandal] arguments. None of them makes any difference now. The only thing that matters is what name you mark in your ballot on election day. And the sole power available to you is: Decide which is the greater evil. Then back the lesser one.

Abstain or waste your vote on a third candidate - ANY third candidate - and you throw away your single chance of affecting the outcome which you, along with the rest of us, will be living under. We're all in the same boat come November, whatever our divisions in July. America's leader will either be Hillary Clinton, or else it will be Donald Trump. Choose. Don't run away because you don't like either of them.

The pile of elephant shit is growing as I type, and the room is only so big. It will smother us alive if we're not careful. If we're not mindful of the stark realities. If we're not unified.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 07:10 AM

Michelle Obama in 2024! She knocked it out of the park last night.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: gillymor
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 07:18 AM

Well said, Bonnie. If Sanders supporters don't get behind HRC they are going to wind up with pretty much the opposite of Bernie. Just ask the man himself.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 07:39 AM

If it is al about Hillary why doe everyone involk th name Trump in this thread?

There was no mention of Bernie.

When the Tea party took over the Republican propaganda machine the elites of the party became concerned they could lose power.
The elites funded House candidates under the Tea party banner and the GOP lost their own base.

Bernie has started the revolution that now threatens the Democratic Party.

The under card for the next 4 years may be Bernie candidates.


The best line of the Michelle speech CAN NOT be plagurized by the TRUMP family.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 08:03 AM

Perhaps it'd be better to refer to him as He Who Must Not Be Named.

What need is there for any positive reasons to vote for the only person who can stop him?

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jeri
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 09:13 AM

Michelle Obama and Corey Booker both nailed it last night. For the record, if you watch it on C-Span, you don't get all the talking heads.

The rabid Sanders fans have been driving me crazy since whenever, and I'm a fan. I think that if they're just looking for an excuse to be jerks, they should just go join the jerk party.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 09:30 AM

Jeri, I think Sara Silverman nailed it. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jeri
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 09:44 AM

I totally agree, mkebenn. Sarah Silverman's speech.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 10:26 AM

Oh man, you're not kidding Sarah Silverman nailed it. Heartening to hear the lengthy roars of approval when - in what appears to be an unscripted moment - she told the Bernie Or Bust Brigade that they were being ridiculous. (What part of "bust" are they failing to understand?) Also glad to see the enthusiastic reception for her "unity"-speak. Thanks SO much for posting that link. Hope it goes viral.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 10:43 AM

We need to run scared, lest the unthinking unlikely voters outnumber Hillary supporters.

Sarah is my sweetheart for the last 20 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 11:25 AM

Well we don't do politics that way (maybe we should), but that was stunning! 😃

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 01:39 PM

Just got home from surgery to treat a small infection below the pineal gland. While I am a bit short tempered I feel pretty good.
I just can't wait to vote for Trump & family and later this Fall reprogram some Diebold machines.

You tell 'em Ake!


;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 03:56 PM

My favorite speech of the first night was the one by Michelle Obama, with a great video beforehand:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEs1J0e-2tw

.

As one might expect, Elizabeth Warren gave a good speech. I listened to it on the YouTube video posted by FoxNews:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVhdg7Yl5ws

At 1:41, some at the convention began shouting "We trusted you," and drowned out Elizabeth for about 30 seconds. She just kept speaking, ignoring the hecklers.

There's video of the Warren speech posted by PBS here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0EsVKS4ADw

I had wondered if FoxNews might have amplified the hecklers, but the volume on the PBS video is about the same. So, guess I can't fault FoxNews on that.

Whatever the case, Elizabeth Warren did a good job. So did Sarah Silverman, and so did Bernie Sanders. All in all, this is a much more positive convention than the one we saw last week.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 05:21 PM

Last week came across as rather like a 21st century American version of Triumph of the Will. Must have made a lot of people round the world feel sick at heart.

This week did a lot to repair the damage. And in fact the open disagreement that was so evident actually helped that. It broke with the tradition of the slickly orchestrated coronation.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 07:49 PM

Indy actor Elizabeth Banks is MC tonight. She is quite lovable.
She entered the stage in the exact way Trump did. Funny and plagiarized. I just saw a gigantic rooster head walking about the convention with a poster of Hillary on it. It fit my whacky nonsense mood.

Please Bill please keep your comments about the nominee under 3 minutes.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jeri
Date: 26 Jul 16 - 07:53 PM

Effie?

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 02:02 AM

Well done, Madeleine Albright and Mr. Clinton.

re last night, I though Booker as well as Michelle Obama's addresses were powerful, positive and inspirational.

I don't have cable so can't watch on C-Span, sans talking heads.

As annoyed as I found myself feeling on occasion by the NPR/PBS analysts, I realize some(but not all) of my annoyance had to do with just wanting to join in rooting passionately for my "home" team from emotion mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 02:36 AM

The Bill Clinton speech was a delight:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yD_K7b2S8Aw

It may well have been the best time I've ever had watching a Bill Clinton speech, all 43 minutes of it (just 40 minutes over Donuel's limit). Bill was relaxed, and played the role of storyteller masterfully. He was really enjoying himself up there at the podium. He plainly and honestly portrayed the human side of Hillary that so many have forgotten, and he did it very well.

Madeleine Albright gave a good presentation, but not remarkable. Now I'm going to watch Meryl Streep, who's wearing a flag dress. She's got only 4 minutes, but I'm sure she'll be good. Can't say I liked to Elizabeth Banks attempt to parody Trump's dramatic appearance before he introduced Melania. It felt mean-spirited to me. I suppose The Donald deserves mean-spiritedness, but a mean spirit doesn't make for good humor.

So far, my favorites are Michelle Obama, Bernie Sanders, and Bill Clinton. I'm sure I'll enjoy President Obama tomorrow night, so he'll make my list of favorites.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 03:07 AM

Well you may think this odd coming from me, but as an outsider reading this thread I'm finding the harmony among the US contributors herein to be very refreshing. 🙂

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 03:25 AM

Don't miss the Mothers of the Movement / Black Lives Matter presentation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8IUUBF_E2A

Three mothers of victims spoke, and helped me to understand why the "Black Lives Matter" movement is so important. It's hard to believe that anyone could refer to them as "terrorists."

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Stu
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 06:23 AM

Michelle Obama is an inspiration and seems like a decent, grounded person. It's worth checking out her doing car karaoke with James Corden, which is brilliant: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/video/2016/jul/21/michelle-obama-on-carpool-karaoke-with-james-corden-video

I understand Bernie supporters are pished off but learn for the Brexit vote here in the UK and don't underestimate the power of support the opposition has, or you too (and in the case of the US Presidential election the rest of the world as well) will repent at your leisure.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 08:51 AM

well said, Stu. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 10:48 AM

First Gentleman Bill Clinton would make for an extremely entertaining sitcom. The wild West Wing.

The Trump House would be the blackest comedy since Doctor Strangelove.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 12:10 PM

or Canadian Bacon

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 05:24 PM

Bill played well with others. I am personally annoyed by his long winded twang. At least it wasn't cringe worthy.

The Russia hacks and Donald's remarks are cringe worthy. This is like an October surprise in July.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 06:18 PM

I am betting on a sit com by the people who brought us VEEP to write a comedy about 'The Education of Donald'.

* A President does not invite a foreign power to meddle in our elections or hack Democrats beyond anything Watergate burglars stole.

^ A President does not accuse people with treason lightly. (Uma-Weiner)

# A President does not make Yes Minister episodes at the microphone daily.

Lets hope this sit com does not become a reality show.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 07:41 PM

I'm hoping tonight or tomorrow night they will put some serious focus on the economy, jobs and world affairs. We are going to need independents. People are experiencing real anxiety about jobs, safety, terrorism, Putin beginning to rattle his sword. The Party needs to do more than just make soothing sounds such as "hush child, there is nothing to be afraid of."

It's clear our Party is still a big tent covering a diverse number of people and perspectives. It is important to assert "peace, love, respect for everyone. But some tangible statements about ideas for moving the country, and the world closer in that direction. Gonna take more than a slogan, "Better Together."

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 07:52 PM

You know, Janie, I'm not sure how well strategies and plans will work to deal with the economy, jobs, and world affairs. I think that for the most part, the running of government is a reactive job. People enter positions of power with basic values and basic philosophies, and then react to the situations they encounter. A President may be able to get one or two big things done during an 8-year administration, but maybe not. Obama got through a flawed healthcare plan that his opponents have undermined since the day it passed. He should have passed a comprehensive immigration bill during the first two years when he had a majority in Congress, but he failed at that.

But as a reactive President, Obama has been good. I think Clinton will be, too. Trump would be a disaster - I hope the electorate comes to realize that.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hill
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 08:31 PM

Any sword-rattling by Putin is essentially about keeping the Russian public onside. The idea that he's on for conflict overseas is a fantasy. Ukraine is very much a special case.

And the same is true in reverse, when politicians in America or elsewhere build it up as a foreign threat. It's a kind of game for domestic consumption.

Which doesn't stop it being a dangerous game.
.......................
The focus on the Presidential election risks missing what's in some ways more crucial. Obviously stopping Trump matters - but if Hillary Clinton is going to build on what Obama has achieved, and on what he was stopped from achieving, it's going to take a Congress that doesn't wreck everything. And America needs a sizeable Sanders inspired contingent of legislators to make sure Hillary stays on course.

Trump is a nightmare danger - but also a real opportunity, with the real possibility that the Republicans face electoral disaster down the ticket, dragged down by the Marmalade Mussolini.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 09:10 PM

Well Joe I would concur with Janie. Everything in reality is reactive and interactive. I would think in terms of the best laid plans of mice and men...
Every journey begins with a first step.

Overcoming a Banks gone wild economic crash in 8 years instead of 16 was a great accomplishment. Yes a CCC would also have had benefits.

The central power of any election is the power and manipulation of emotion. I have said this 437 times. Getting that power to serve plans is secondary.

Frankly this is a Hillary weakness so far.
The feelings inspired by Trump lies is a strength no matter how despicable that is to all of us.

All my adult life I have implored people to see how susceptible the human spirit is to hypnosis, the great lie and the deceptions of Hitleresque shared hatreds. It may seem that the human bonds we share are super strong but they are more fragile than we care to admit.

Its time to admit it.

Lets see how well we do with only high minded denials of the Trump tools of deception. Oh that's right, we always deny that hypnosis at play in the arena of political power and lies.

If on the other hand we sharpen the tip of the spear and add hooks we could out propaganda the hell out of Trump.

For example in response to the proposed high crimes and misdemeanors that Trump has only suggested so far, we repeat clearly the legal response to such criminal acts until the name Trump is equated with the criminal punishments awaiting him. Just as they did to Hillary.
Forget the Logan act, Trump is a treasonous Watergate co-conspirator.

You don't need to grow a pair anymore, you just need body armor forged with truthful lies of emotion..facts are not enough.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 09:10 PM

Hey, can I get one of those cool "Joe" signs that they're holding up for Biden right now?

Live coverage at http://www.pbs.org/newshour/

It's so nice to see that Barack Obama and Joe Biden have become so popular during their last year.

I've listened to most of the major speeches from both conventions. I noticed last week that I was getting really grouchy. I'm feeling a lot better this week. Biden has the strongest and most rational anti-Trump words I've heard so far.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 09:27 PM

Way to go Joe Biden. Feelings first.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Jul 16 - 11:57 PM

The majesty of the greatest orator of my lifetime Barak Obama has inspired and defined the heartfelt moment of our times once again.

He also addressed the debauchery of demagogues and fascists.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 12:12 AM

I think you have that right, Donuel - "greatest orator of our lifetime." I was so moved by Obama's speech, I couldn't talk afterwards.

Billionaire and former New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, spoke as an Independent. He got in some great jabs at Trump, whom Bloomberg terms "a dangerous demagogue." Bloomberg says there has been a lot of talk in the campaign about needing a leader who understands business, and Bloomberg agrees" "I couldn't agree more. I built a business, and I didn't start it with a million-dollar check from my father."

Vice Presidential candidate Tim Kaine gave a nice speech, but nothing exceptional. Joe Biden's speech was much better.

But there's no question, Barack Obama was the star of the evening. As Donuel says, he's a splendid orator.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 02:47 AM

Strange to see President Obama lumping "Communists" with "Jihadists".

Shades of McCarthyism perhaps, or a swipe at the folks who are demanding change in the Democratic Party?
His admires here would do well to remember that some of the most revered figures in folk music were "communists"

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 03:14 AM

You're trolling again, Ake, and it's particularly lame this time. The context is this: "That's why anyone who threatens our values, whether fascists or communists or jihadists or homegrown demagogues, will always fail in the end." (click for speech text).

There's no doubt that during a long stretch of the 20th century, the communists were a threat to the U.S. Those weren't water balloons the Soviets were installing in Cuba in 1961.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: akenaton
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 03:25 AM

I am not "trolling" Joe I have been a socialist all my life and a CP member for many years, surely an alternative political viewpoint is not now considered an act of trolling?

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 06:35 AM

In deference to American history and the Revolution maybe he should have included Tories in that list of those who have threatened America. And secessionists, perhaps.

I think Michelle is actually better than her husband at this kind of thing. I'm sure he'd say that.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Jeri
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 09:33 AM

Pretty much trolling, but I don't think anyone expects otherwise. I just hope other folks don't follow you down that particular rabbit hole.

I've been dipping into the convention via C-Span. Hillary's speaking tonight. I was for Bernie and didn't like Hillary much, but the one thing I care about most is that we don't elect a wannabe Hitler, white supremacist, lying, bigoted, crazy man to have his finger on "the button".

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 10:43 AM

I also monitored the FOX converge of the DNC speeches just to study the lie craft and propaganda both video tricks ,subliminal and other, as well as rhetorical. It was cruel, childish, stupid and effective.

Dear Martin Gibson, or is it Akenaton now,
Keep going
Without a Bearded Bruce we need a wall to practice our serve.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 12:47 PM

Minor fun factoids;

A most often used rhetorical phrase to denounce the opposition said by both parties in the last election was "But in reality..."

This year the most popular phrase of both parties has been "To be Clear..."

Clearly, reality is off the table this time around.



Talking to people in the Metro DC area over the years I have found that folks really like Joe Biden and have an average of only 1 degree of separation. There is even a jealousy of people who have a closer relationship than themselves, to Joe.


Among whites when asked who is most "one of us", Trump wins !?

When asked who is "qualified to be President", Hillary wins.


Dick Morris (Bill Clinton's token conservative in his administration) has hit 300 lbs. Dick seems to be unable to sell his latest book, even to Republicans.

Conservatives say Obama and liberals are Isis sympathizers and liberals say conservatives are a domestic Taliban. There is little mention of non terrorist citizens except for Hillary ads.

If Trump were to stop globalization, Wall Mart prices would generally double.


How new is the Trump phenomenon ? Father Flannigan held religious rallies in support of the Lindbergh pro fascist and racist era in the 1930's

The state of Indiana had the most government KKK members as well as the most KKK constituents.   

In England a trumpence is worth absolutely nothing.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 12:59 PM

In England a trump is a fart. Not so different, I suppose.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 01:14 PM

One thing that feels uneasy was the constant declarations of American exceptionalism, with the Democrats if anything more than with the Republicans. "We are the greatest..."

A touch of Kipling's Recessional might be healthy, perhaps...

"Far-called our navies melt away;
On dune and headland sinks the fire:
Lo, all our pomp of yesterday
Is one with Nineveh and Tyre!
Judge of the Nations, spare us yet,
Lest we forget—lest we forget!"

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 01:28 PM

Accuracy is important in history, Donuel. Charles Lindbergh was an isolationist. Some people called him a fascist because he opposed U.S. entry into World War II, just as Woody Guthrie had. Lindbergh's father had been a congressman from Minnesota, and had opposed U.S. entry into World War I.

Father Flanagan (portrayed by Spencer Tracy in a 1938 film) founded an orphanage outside Omaha Nebraska called Boys Town.

Father Charles Coughlin built the National Shrine of the Little Flower in Royal Oak, Michigan, and preached on the radio from the shrine. He had been a strong supporter of FDR and the New Deal, but later turned against Roosevelt and supported ideas that were closer to those of Hitler and Mussolini. He was especially opposed to "Jewish bankers." [His church, by the way, is a gorgeous example of Art Deco architecture].

As for Joe Biden, it was interesting to see how warmly the delegates greeted Joe at the beginning of his speech. It was clear that he is well-loved.

And speaking of farts, the "Bernie or Bust" folks had planned a fart-in, a bean dinner to take place during Thursday's acceptance speech by Hillary Clinton. The dinner was moved to Wednesday evening so participants could go home a day earlier. No reports on the outcome of the bean dinner yet, but I'm sure all the participants are "regular guys" now.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 07:59 PM

Nancy Pelosi's delivery was pretty awful. Is that typical of her? Is she a bad public speaker?

McGrath. I don't know if it was you or someone else from the UK that commented earlier in the thread the realization the conventions are designed for USA consumption and to both rally the party bases and draw in less motivated or more ambivalent voters of either party or independents.

They are theater.

American exceptionalism wins votes.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 08:33 PM

As I said earlier, I don't have cable so can't watch the entire thing on C-Span without the interjection of the talking heads during times they consider whoever is at the podium to be inconsequential.

I have the CBSN broadcast on my computer, and the NPR/PBS broadcast on my antenna-ed television. 6 ordinary people walked out on stage to speak about concerns of common folks like us. The first two were broadcast - one was a low-wage healthcare worker. The next was a schoolteacher from my state, a school teacher, trying to pay off huge student loans from his education at a public university at the low wages North Carolina teachers receive. Neither PBS nor CBS considered the rest of the speakers worth broadcasting nationally and cut to the talking heads.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 08:37 PM

On-line have now switched to the official DNC website. Hopefully will see and hear all the speakers there even though any protests from the floor may not be shown. Don't know that, but a reasonable assumption.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 08:57 PM

Here's the YouTube channel for C-Span:

https://www.youtube.com/user/CSPAN/videos

You're right, Janie - don't see any live streaming.

Here's a live link from "Democratic National Convention":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fw7XiCJL4M

Don't know if that's the official feed, but maybe it is.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 09:01 PM

I think Nancy was too vain to use her much needed glasses.

Hey Joe, you are too kind. you know how many trips to Germany Charles took and who received him? Hermann Goring and top Nazis were on his A list.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/lindbergh/sfeature/fallen.html

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 09:14 PM

I am however totally wrong about Flanigan.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 09:40 PM

Following is the DNC live stream I am watching.
https://www.demconvention.com/live/

It also is not broadcasting all speakers. Sans the ability to watch C-Span live I'm watching NPR/PBS on the television and going back and forth between CBS and the DNC stream on the computer to try to watch as many of the speakers as I can.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 10:01 PM

Whether one is a person of faith or not, Rev. Barber [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbjhzI1g3EE] was intelligent, articulate and passionate. Head of the NC NAACP and organizer of the Moral Mondays to confront our current state government, both the executive branch and the legislative branch.

PBS only cut to him about halfway through his speech, apparently surprised to realize his speech was "worth" broadcasting. Really surprised me. CBS broadcast none of it. The demconvention site broadcast all of it.

If you are of a monotheistic religious persuasion, I think he articulates the heart of the core values (not the rules, the values) of the three related monotheistic religions arising from the ancient mideastern world remarkably well.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 10:08 PM

No edit button. Clarification. Rev. Barber's speech did not surprise. Surprised me that it was not one of the speeches either of the networks already planned to carry.

Having said that, while I know Rev. Barber could be a national civil rights leader on the main stage, while well known withing the civil rights movement, he has chosen to focus on change within his own home state throughout his leadership.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 28 Jul 16 - 10:28 PM

You can rewatch the entire thing (or parts of it) from the DNC site itself. PBS isn't playing the same thing that the DNC site is playing. This afternoon I listened to Obama's speech last night because it was interrupted by my local channel (that accidentally switched to the regular programming at 10pm). I listened to the rest on the radio and hadn't been able to see Hillary walk out on stage for a well-deserved victory lap. I wanted to see that bit of history being made.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 12:11 AM

I watched the entire Obama speech, including Hillary coming out at the end this morning on Youtube before I went to work. Was late for work as a result. Was so tired I fell asleep on the couch as it turns out, just as Obama started speaking. That was about 2 seconds after I convinced myself I I could lay my tired body down and stay awake.

Silly me.

I have always voted but never gotten involved in campaigns other than making modest financial contributions. This year I feel obliged to figure out some way to have some time to volunteer at a task my personality can deal with. Such as stuffing envelops or running them through postage meters.

I thought Hillary's acceptance speech was warm and articulate. She is not a gifted orator. Trump isn't either, but he is a gifted rabble rouser. Gonna take some very hard work on the ground to get her elected.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 03:12 AM

Here's a link to the Hillary Clinton acceptance speech:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnXiy4D_I8g

She did a good job. I suppose she's not the orator that Bill & Barack are, but it was a good speech with a lot of substance.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 08:24 AM

Janie you are not alone with the silly. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 08:59 AM

C-SPAN is always an option to be sure, They carry every single speaker and skip all the floor fluff. & no ads!

Whoop de doo Hillary is the ideal candidate for 1996-2000
She is more exciting than a new Geico commercial.

That's OK. Sanity is very important to me, besides a US President does not have to be "must see TV".

How Hillary goes from "thats OK" enthusiasm to "We want that Now" is an uphill battle.

She will get the vote of every thinking person but it is hers to lose to all the unthinking people.

Janie I fell asleep too, yawn that's OK.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: gillymor
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 09:28 AM

I thought HRC did an excellent job last night. She delivered her well prepared address with passion and conviction and it starkly pointed out that there is only one serious adult left in this presidential campaign but, to me, the speech that really got to the heart of the matter and most effectively made the case against that unqualified, wise-cracking buffoon was given by Khzir Khan. When he asked Donald if he'd read the constitution I could have answered "Hell no, by his own admission he doesn't read anything" with the exception of tweets, maybe.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 10:29 AM

Winds in the East
Mist coming in
Like something is brewing
about to begin

can't put my finger
On what lies in store
But I feel what's to happen
All happened before.


Mary Poppins.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: mkebenn
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 10:34 AM

Aye, Donuel, Those who won't learn from history are doomed to repeat. Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe_F
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 05:51 PM

No, it's not about Hillary. It's about the Democratic Party -- less obnoxious, on the average & on the whole, than the alternative.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Ebbie
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 06:48 PM

I stayed engaged through each evening of the Democratic convention. There were some remarkable speakers- and just about every single one of them spoke reason, sanity and good sense. As opposed to the GOP convention- if I could color the aura/atmosphere of each convention, the DNC would be full of light and animation while t'other would be dark and red and roiling.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Joe Offer
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 07:45 PM

Hillary is not a superstar. Her gifts are wisdom and tenacity. She has been in the public eye since 1992, and she has expressed many of her ideals and goals through the years - and she has held true to those ideals. I don't think she will come out with a lot of new programs and grandiose plans, but she will keep her ideals and goals in the back of her mind.
And when the opportunity comes, she will put those ideals and goals into action - quietly, but firmly and effectively.
I expect Hillary to win, and I expect a very wise Presidency from her.
-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 09:01 PM

So long as there's a strong movement keeping her on course.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Janie
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 09:39 PM

Agree, McGrath. It will take a strong movement.

Joe, I strongly agree with your impressions of Hillary and what her presidency might look like.

I diaagree with you re your expectation she will win. She will win only if the full spectrum of those people who support her pretty much whole-heartedly and those who might hold their noses and vote for her as the lesser of evils join together and very actively work to get her elected.

Otherwise, I expect Trump will win.

Subject: RE: BS: Democratic Convention - Now It's About Hillary
From: Donuel
Date: 29 Jul 16 - 10:44 PM

Cornell West summed it up thusly;

You are at the LA train station and have a wedding in San Francisco.
The express train was sabotaged and canceled out of caution.
Another train going to San Francisco is a slow local.
But there is a THIRD golden express train.
It's going to hell.