BS: now California has got nutria

Subject: The Nutria Are Coming
From: keberoxu
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 06:33 PM

The California Department of Fish and Wildlife
is participating in a multi-agency
Nutria Response Team for their state.

Sightings in California are documented since March 30, 2017.
The CDFW newspage expressly speaks of
"the goal of eradicating nutria from the state."

Wonder if it's too late . . .

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 06:39 PM

Californians are asked to report nutria sightings
at
[e-mail]
or at
the nutria hotline
[phone].

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Greg F.
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 06:51 PM

Uh Hunh. Killer Rodents From Hades.

Be better if Califoria expended its resources documenting and eradicating Republicans - that would benefit mankind a great deal more.

All in all its just another rat in the wall...... HEY HUMANS!! LEAVE THEM RATS ALONE!!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 06:59 PM

you had to bring Arnold Schwarzenegger into this ...

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 07:37 PM

Argentina?? That's where the nutria originate?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: bobad
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 09:09 PM

They make nice fur coats.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 09:27 PM

There's a good page on nutrias at the California Department of Fish and Wildlife. I'd swear I saw them maybe ten or fifteen years ago at Lake Winnemucca (south of Lake Tahoe), at an elevation of about 8,500 feet. Maybe it it was some other rodent.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 09:38 PM

I worked on northern Louisiana many years ago and remember some co-workers who were also trappers. I learned about the nutria there, and that the trappers were glad to catch any they could for their fur.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Rapparee
Date: 19 Feb 18 - 10:09 PM

There go California's levees.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 20 Feb 18 - 04:01 AM

We call them coypu here in UK. I think we've more or less managed to eradicate them (escaped from a fur farm, I seem to remember) as especially in Norfolk they were damaging the banks of dykes and water channels. However, some maintained that they did good by clearing away the edges of reed beds, keeping the waterways clear.
They must be feeling a bit hot in their thick fur coats down in California!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 21 Feb 18 - 05:37 AM

Coming next, one of my favorite mammals, the Capybara

According to Wikipedia, several have been sighted in Florida, and a single one in California in 2011.
.
Apparently, they have a benevolent effect on the environment, helping to preserve wetlands. In some parts of their habitat they are exterminated as competitive grazers, in others, farmed for flesh and a grease with special uses.

Humans are funny monkeys. (WADR to our simian cousins.)

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 21 Feb 18 - 06:43 AM

They're very big aren't they Jackaroodave? And clumsy but rather sweet.

Here they've proposed the reintroduction of the beaver. I believe the idea is to protect against flooding in some way. But there has been some opposition. It's always a great risk plonking a new species into a habitat. Beavers lived here 900 years ago, but I'm not sure what the implications would be for our existing wildlife.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 21 Feb 18 - 06:50 AM

for a while we had a colony of wallabies living on Cannock Chase in England.

There has been attempts to reintroduce wolves to Scotland I believe.

In Dorset there are sightings of big cats now and then. A farm down the road had a sheep savaged by a big cat.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 21 Feb 18 - 07:56 AM

I've seen wallabies on the South Downs (many years ago) And aren't there wild boar roaming around the Forest of Dean? They're a bit fierce and their tusks are razor sharp.
Here in Norfolk we have the Lesser Spotted Londoner occasionally seen in Burnham Market!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 21 Feb 18 - 08:26 AM

Sounds like more bush tucker to me. I wonder how they compare to grasscutters?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Feb 18 - 12:14 AM

There have been nutria in Oregon for several generations. The story is that some people invested in them, gambling there was a market for their fur, and released the critters when it didn't pan out. I don't know the actual story.

I do have one story I like. Before I quit smoking cigarettes I rarely, if ever, met wild animals. At that time I did a great deal of hiking in mountains and forests but every time I paused to rest, I lit up. You can imagine that every animal within a mile of me knew there was a human being in the vicinity.

Then I quit smoking- and among other wildlife encounters I was barked at by a deer (I didn't know they barked!), came upon the flicking tail on the hind end of an oblivious deer browsing in a bush next to the trail, found myself in the midst of small twittering birds at a water puddle, and was growled at by a nutria.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Thompson
Date: 22 Feb 18 - 05:14 PM

Are nutria nutriacious?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Feb 18 - 09:46 PM

You go first, OK?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 03:28 AM

Hahaha, coypu casserole!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 03:35 AM

Who will be first?


http://www.nutria.com/site14.php

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 03:44 AM

Good grief Iains, it's really true! And 'Nutria Sausages' !!! Hahahaha!!
Actually, any mammal on the earth should be more or less edible. My husband has eaten Lord knows what in his life in W Africa. Protein is protein. That's why he looks a bit longingly at roadkill we drive past here in Norfolk, dead muntjac etc. He's tempted to shove it in the boot, bring it home, skin and joint it and make a spicy stew. He thinks we're mad to just leave it to rot, or for magpies and crows to scavenge.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 03:55 AM

Senofou, you're up early.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 04:01 AM

Senoufou. It gets worse. Rats as bushtucker. They give you a bit of a shock the first time you see one in the wild. You think mutated domestic rat on steroids!

https://www.livestocking.net/6-reasons-why-you-need-to-raise-grasscutter-cane-rat

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 04:18 AM

Hello there Donuel! It's 9am here in UK. I usually get up at 6am though.
Iains, my husband has eaten ordinary rats many times. His family courtyard in Adjame (district of Abidjan) is absolutely overrun with them.
I've seen cane rats in Africa, and I've just asked husband about them. He says only in his ancestral village (Nafamadougou) in the north. They eat them there. Muslims aren't supposed to eat such stuff, but if one's children are starving one has to improvise somewhat!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 04:59 AM

Hi Senoufou. I have not tried rats for dinner, but I did have a green mamba come slithering in wanting to join me at lunch one time.(30 kilos of steel pipe on its head kind of tamed it's appetite.) While working in the jungle near Warri one of my local crew used to go looking for a particular palm and get a basin of grubs to fry up to eat. I suppose it is no different to escargot, just a question of what you are used to.
Get hungry enough anything that moves is fair game.
http://theconversation.com/five-edible-insects-you-really-should-try-17672

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 06:19 AM

Gaaaaaah Iains!! Western green mambas are extremely venomous! Good job you used the pipe. I'm usually in favour of trying not to kill things that are dodgy, just run away (eg enormous spiders) but mambas are another thing altogether. Although the green ones are normally fairly timid, if cornered or they feel threatened, they'll strike. Inevitably fatal...
Grubs are probably quite nutritious and tasty. As long as something is well-cooked, it shouldn't do one any harm.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: robomatic
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 02:42 PM

So do nutria make good eatin'? And do they need to be trapped or can they be hunted? Maybe they're good for wild predators?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 04:13 PM

"And do they need to be trapped or can they be hunted?"
If they are escapees and wrecking the ecosystem they inhabit they need to be exterminated. They are a four footed equivalent of Japanese knotweed.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Thompson
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 04:04 AM

a) I wouldn't eat a rat, or anything that might have been slowed down a bit because it's been poisoned. I'd be very hesitant to eat any solely carnivorous animal.
b) We're much classier in Ireland. Our problems are caused by escaped mink.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 04:43 AM

and Japanese knotweed. In west Cork anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Ian Read
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 12:48 PM

Those of us who like a nice fedora or trilby know that the best fur hats are from beaver, next comes Coypu and then coney.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 01:01 PM

Ian Read. You are refreshingly non PC for this forum. You dare still wear fur, Sir? More power to you.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Greg F.
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 01:16 PM

If they are ... wrecking the ecosystem they inhabit they need to be exterminated.

Rather like coal companies, fracking companies, chemical companies, and Trump's minions rolling back environmental safeguards and regulations, you mean?

They do a shitload more damage than nutria- so let the extermination campaign underway.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 02:29 PM

What I hear about Louisiana,
where the nutria have been present for years,
is that they have given up
on extermination:
there is just too much that is wetlands,
and the nutria are too deeply entrenched there.
If they tried to eradicate Louisiana nutria,
they would end up eradicating the wetlands along with them.   

Which does not bode well for California.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Donuel
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 02:37 PM

https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/02/nutria-spreading-california-wetlands-louisiana-swamps-spd/


In another 30,000 years they may evolve from aquatic to underwater mammal fish. \^:"

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 02:40 PM

I didn't know, Donuel,
that the nutria had made it to Chesapeake Bay in Maryland.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 02:49 PM

"Rather like coal companies, fracking companies, chemical companies"

Greg you really have no idea how the world goes round, have you?

No coal, no fracking, no chemicals. .........
Whoops! no modern world and everyone is popping their clogs!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: michaelr
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 03:16 PM

I had no idea these animals existed.

"Nutria" sounds like a sweetener to me...

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 03:42 PM

I'd never heard the word michaelr until I saw it on here. They've always been 'coypu' to me.
That's the problem when a species not indigenous to an area is introduced. It will cause changes in the habitat and native population.

Here in UK the arrival of the grey squirrel reduced the population of our red squirrels markedly. The muntjac, fallow and Chinese water deer (not native to UK) have caused a lot of damage to woodlands. They nibble away at young trees and also remove the bark all around the trunk, eventually killing the tree.
There's also the harlequin ladybird, which is affecting our seven native ladybird species.
When I was last up in Edinburgh a couple of years ago, I saw quite large areas of that wretched Japanese knotweed. The authorities had blasted it with everything they'd got (strong chemical herbicides) but it seems it still bounces back. If there was another nuclear war, after the Apocalypse I bet there would be shoots of Japanese knotweed jauntily poking through the blackened earth!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Greg F.
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 05:06 PM

Greg you really have no idea how the world goes round, have you?

Right back atcha, boyo- have a glance in the mirror. You might also wish to hone your reading comprehension skills.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Greg F.
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 05:14 PM

Senoufou,

Tell Lore Redesdale we'll come get out grey squirrels if he takes back his goddam starlings and house sparrows.

By the way, North American red squirrels have no problem holding their own against the greys - the ones in the UK must be wimps.

Perhaps assertiveness training is the answer.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 05:35 PM

I think it's due in part to the parapox virus Greg, which the greys transmit to the reds. The greys are not affected much by the virus, but the reds succumb.
They also eat up most of the green acorns, leaving few for the reds (who cannot digest mature ones)
Where my sister lives up in Perthshire, there are quite a few red squirrels. It's lovely to see them, as I remember as a child watching red ones in the woods near our house.
House sparrows are getting a bit scarce here. I like the cheeky sparrows of all types. For some odd reason, my husband absolutely adores starlings and puts out food for them. They're just ordinary, boring birds to me, but he loves them!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Greg F.
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 05:45 PM

House sparrows are getting a bit scarce here.

OK THEN!!! How many million would you like??

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 06:33 PM

Has anybody here seen nutrias in California? The state Department of Fish & Wildlife says they have been sighted in Stanislaus, Tuolumne, Merced, and Fresno counties.

I think I recall having nutrias pointed out to me in the Sierra at 5,000 feet, but the Fish & Wildlife seems to indicate they were at lower elevations.

Maybe I'm getting them confused with marmots. Do they have the same general size and appearance?

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 06:34 PM

Hahaha! We have the Tree Sparrow and the House Sparrow, both of which have declining numbers. Actually, though I hate to admit it, the experts think that cats kill them, as they're nice, friendly little birds that frequent our gardens, and are therefore easy prey.
Please send us as many as you can spare Greg!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: bobad
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 06:40 PM

OK THEN!!! How many million would you like??

Remember Greg, all god's chillun got wings.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 09:48 PM

Gee, nutrias were front-page news on today's Sacramento Bee newspaper. They can destroy all the vegetation in a marsh very quickly, and they dig holes in the levees that protect California's Central Valley from flooding. I understand that in the United States, Sacramento is second only to New Orleans in vulnerability to flooding. I'm glad I live at an elevation of 2,300 feet.
-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 11:29 PM

Somehow, this thread reminds me of a book I had as a child called "Wild Animals of the World." It was illustrated with exquisitely shaded pencil drawings that now come to mind as each wondrous name trips off the tongue. There were the

coypu
capybara
onager
okapi
wapati
sun bear
pangolin
przewalski's wild horse (as it was known then; apparently it's only feral)
kinkajou
coati mundi
meerkat
and of course the
echidna and the
platypus

Did anyone else have this book?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 26 Feb 18 - 06:54 AM

just on telly....there are now 50 thousand alpacas in England. it would be great if some got free and they were like cats and slept under your car, and appeared in your garden and you put out a saucer of milk for them...
OR
like hedehogs, we all made little alpaca homes that they come and stay in.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Iains
Date: 26 Feb 18 - 07:22 AM

Not just pretty faces either.

http://www.thatsfarming.com/news/alpaca-livestock-protection

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 26 Feb 18 - 08:19 AM

There's a new, trendy hairstyle for young lads at the moment (one Headmaster called it the 'See you in McDonald's' haircut!) which to me looks exactly like the head of an alpaca. Big mop on top and short back and sides.
Jackaroodave, that book rings a bell, but when I looked for it online (secondhand books etc) I couldn't find it.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: BobL
Date: 27 Feb 18 - 05:02 AM

Sounds like the one accidentally invented by the Farmer in the Shaun the Sheep Movie .

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 27 Feb 18 - 05:25 AM

Yes! Yes! That's exactly what I mean BobL!! Hee hee!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 27 Feb 18 - 09:03 AM

I may have the title wrong, Eliza. My brother managed to inherit it, the scoundrel, I'll check with him.

Oh, yes, almost forgot, the agouti!

But I think of all these wondrous creatures, my absolute favorite is the woodchuck (in Connecticut), or groundhog (in West Virginia) or wuchak (Algonquin) etc.. It's just so perfectly fit to be what it is.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 27 Feb 18 - 09:09 AM

Well I never realised that a groundhog is a member of the marmot family (I just googled it) Or that woodchuck is another name for groundhog.
I've always prided myself on knowing a bit about flora and fauna of the world, but it's pretty obvious I know less than I thought!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 04:07 AM

...but now you know more, Senoufou!

We don't have groundhogs or woodchucks in California that I know of, but we do have marmots. They're bigger than you'd think, almost the size of a beaver. I once saw some walking on a ridge above me in the High Sierra. Very impressive.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: bobad
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 08:27 AM

I believe groundhog, woodchuck and marmot all refer to the same animal, at least where I am they do.

From Wikipedia:

Groundhog
Rodent
The groundhog, also known as a woodchuck, is a rodent of the family Sciuridae, belonging to the group of large ground squirrels known as marmots. It was first scientifically described by Carl Linnaeus in 1758. Wikipedia
Scientific name: Marmota monax
Family: Sciuridae
Trophic level: Omnivorous Encyclopedia of Life
Mass: 3.9 kg (Adult) Encyclopedia of Life
Higher classification: Marmot

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 08:33 AM

Well let's hope the groundhog doesn't pop back into its burrow having seen a shadow of itself, or this awful winter will never end!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 09:25 AM

Now California has got nutria
And the orchards have gotten fruit tree-er

sorry wrong thread!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 07:51 PM

why not make the thing rhyme?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 10:46 AM

(complete thread drift)
I was nattering to my sister on the phone yesterday about how much my husband loves starlings. She said they look 'common' and 'greasy'; in fact, they remind her of used-car salesmen!

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: BobL
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 03:14 AM

Starlings round here are a load of delinquents. Especially the juvenile ones in Spring - mobbing the bird feeders so not even the jays get a look in.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 04:56 PM

Went back and read some of the journalism more closely.
Detail I missed the first time:

Nutria perish in the cold
because
they die of frostbite on their tails.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:15 PM

And now the nutria alert has spread
to Twitter and FoxNews Channel.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:02 AM

Senoufou: "Jackaroodave, that book rings a bell, but when I looked for it online (secondhand books etc) I couldn't find it."

Eliza, here is proof that Wild Animals of the World
exists. The US Amazon site has a good review, but is sold out. There are several sources, but all pricey.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 12:48 PM

Ha well done Jackaroodave for locating it! But it is a bit pricey, due to the scarcity of copies I should imagine.
I do hope you didn't think I was doubting you!

When my aged Irish aunt died many years ago, my parents were clearing out her house prior to selling it, and found several lovely old books which she used to read to my sister and me when we were small. (Edward Lear 'The Complete Book of Nonsense' for example) My parents shared them out between us both.
There's something about 'old friends' isn't there?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 03:09 PM

No, Eliza, I was doubting my own memory of the exact title.

I know what you mean about the old ones: My brother got the wild animal book, but I got the family copy of The Wind and the Willows, which I reread every couple of years.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 02:55 AM

Nutria perish in the cold
because of frostbite on their tails.
I told them, wear some woolly pants
but seldom commonsense prevails.

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: Senoufou
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 07:10 AM

Hahaha Big Al! Cue for a song?

Subject: RE: BS: now California has got nutria
From: keberoxu
Date: 11 Mar 18 - 10:58 AM

The following site is tricky to link to;
we'll see if it works or not.
But this is related to the harvesting,
shall we say, of the furry nutria.

Peace Fur, formerly Petit Mort Fur