BS: New Speak: words they are achangin

Subject: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 06:38 AM

I saw that North Korean missiles are now being called
Projectiles

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 06:44 AM

Well that's at least a bit more suggestive of their intent than Little Boy and Fat Man, coined 75 years ago. Not-so-new speak, eh?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 07:27 AM

impromptu, ad hoc and spontaneous, have now become "pop up"

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 07:57 AM

Fact Check UK? Wot kinda speek be that?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 08:25 AM

Self-isolate?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 08:40 AM

witch hunt hoax

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 08:46 AM

Fake nooze

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 09:07 AM

Oh please can I have my favourite word of all time - 'innit'?
Any statement can be followed by innit. eg 'He went over to his mum's innit?' I just love that!
I also like 'soz' for sorry. Easier to text I suppose.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mrrzy
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 09:09 AM

Totz.

The one I still mind is Improvised Explosive Device instead of just plain Bomb. Or Peacekeeper for warrior.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 10:22 AM

I understand that "urban", like " nationalist", is taking on or has been accorded a new sense. Anyone else encountered changes to either?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 10:28 AM

'Improvised Explosive Device' (IED) is not really a replacement for 'Bomb', but for 'home made bomb'.
I read 'bomb' as meaning any explosive device, and unless specifically stated (home-made, or IED), as something which can be purchased from an arms dealer.
IEDs are more rough and ready, and available to those with whom arms traders would not normally deal.

IED: Not to be confused with IUD :)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 10:35 AM

"Innit" I take as ending a comment with a request for confirmation (or an opportunity to challenge).
It is not really a new construction, older English might have had a statement followed with "is it not?", or "isn't it?. Even French sentences can be ended with "n'est-ce pas?". Is that not so?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 10:47 AM

I remeber 'friendly fire when it was "killing your own side and collateral damage as Killing civilians
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 10:51 AM

I see bombs more as things wot are dropped via aircraft. RPG and mortars close cousins.

IED are more akin to mines.

It is fair to say we get the words we need, as need arises. Like Fakebook.
psychodelic was taken out of the OED and didn't they remove redundant?








Along with gullible :)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Charmion
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 10:52 AM

My current editorial project is a big, fat book about Canadian operations in Kandahar Province, Afghanistan. IEDs are all over it.

The modifier "home-made" disappeared from the lexicon very early because the devices were, and are, assembled in secret factories (not homes), using designs, manufacturing techniques and materials distributed through insurgent networks. The triggers and detonators, in particular, are frequently manufactured elsewhere -- i.e., Pakistan, Iran, or pick your own favourite sponsor of terrorism -- and smuggled into the theatre of operations. The plastic jugs, canisters and drums in which the explosive charges are packed are used everywhere for agricultural and industrial products such as fuels, pesticides and lubricants.

In the world of munitions, the word "bomb" is a term of art that does not describe all IEDs precisely.

Also, acronym. If a military person has a choice between a common noun and an acronym, the acronym wins every time.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 11:12 AM

"Innit?" can be replaced by "yeah?" if you want to sound more persuading, or by "eh?" if you want to sound a bit sarky.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 11:15 AM

Saying "going forward" should be an arrestable offence, and it gets me goat big-time when I hear yanks saying "if you will..."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Charmion
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 11:28 AM

The meaning of "friendly fire" hasn"t changed, Jim, but it's not precise enough for modern First World war-fighting.

Operations analysis (the study of what worked and what went wrong in military operations) has an experimental aspect called "war gaming", in which aspects of a conflict are played out in a group thought experiment. In these sessions, the main parties to the conflict are designated Blue (us), and Red (them -- the enemy). For the history buffs in our midst, this technique became popular during the Cold War.

But the post-Cold War world is full of conflicts whose complexities are openly acknowledged. In a counter-insurgency operation, such as the continuing Thing in Afghanistan, there are at least three sides: the "coalition forces" (aka ISAF and the Americans), the Government of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, and "insurgents" of various stripes, such as the Taliban. So the war-gamers had to account for the people who are in the war but are not Us (a First World Superpower and its allies) or Them (the clear and present danger to the First World Superpower, aka The Enemy). In Afghanistan, that actor is the national government, so the war-gamers chose Green to represent the Afghan national security forces, both army and police.

So, nowadays, in a news story about Afghan police officers turning their weapons on American soldiers, you will see the phrase "green-on-blue attack". In 2002, when a USAF pilot strafed a Canadian infantry battalion on exercise at the Tarnak Farm training area near Kandahar City, it was a "blue-on-blue" incident.

I haven't seen "friendly fire" in years.

"Collateral damage" has likewise gone out of fashion, for (in my opinion) two reasons: first, it is often difficult to identify the intended target of an attack, especially when it is an IED strike, and, second, because the acknowledged target of an attack is a civilian and others who die in the fire-fight or drone strike are assumed to be that person's henchmen.

For example, in 2009 a massive IED blew up a bus in Kandahar City, killing everyone aboard and many passers-by, and wounding lots more; the butcher's bill came to more than 150 casualties. There were no military installations nearby, and the road where the IED was laid was not part of a convoy route. Eventually, intelligence analysts concluded that the IED blast was part of a long-running war between commercial factions over government contracts, but the intended target was never identified. Perhaps the road surface itself was the target -- a big enough hole, and everybody with a dump-truck and half a dozen shovels could get a piece of the repair action.

See the problem? Events like that produce the weird jargon of today, and retire the weird jargon of yesterday.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Charmion
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 11:34 AM

"If you will" is Yank for "in my opinion" or "I think".

"Going forward" means "from now on", which is way too much like what Mum says when she lowers the boom and, therefore, not cool.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 12:08 PM

I's never heard of friendly fire until the US began killing their own in Vietnam and later Afghanistan
I have little doubt it was invented to sanitize what was happening
It's simply not good enough to used wods like 'complicated' when the real cause is that weapons have been developed to create fear rather than take out opposing troops (Hiroshima and Nagasaki are pretty good examples of that)
You might as well add 'special rendition' to the list - torture has always been torture, whatever you call it
When I was comin' up, it was a war crime - not musch sighn of 'prosocutin of that nowadays - or perhaps there's a new word for that too !
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 12:18 PM

I'm not sure I like 'yeah'. It seems a bit dismissive, as does the now-universal 'whatever'.
I recently joined Facebook in order to leave a message for a chap who has my maiden name and lives where my father was born. He's called Duncan. My message was very polite, and gave a few details of my grandparents, as I suspected the man is actually my cousin.
I received a reply which said,"Yeah. Your dad and mine were brothers. So yeah, we're cousins." I must be a ghastly snob, as I didn't like the sound of him at all.
My funny sis later told me she already knew of Duncan. It's true he is our cousin and he's a terrible racist, member of the BNP etc. She double-dared me to send him a photo of my husband, but I haven't yet!
He'd be horrified innit? Yeah!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Charmion
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 12:33 PM

Jim, most of us here, including you, are too young to remember when "friendly fire" entered the language. I have seen the phrase in documents dating back to the Great War, when it usually meant artillery rounds that landed on the wrong targets.

You don't like "complicated"? It's the best I could do without writing a long paragraph. All wars are complicated, of course, but some are more complicated than others. Wars of insurgency are full of cross-cutting loyalties and people changing sides, which makes them "interesting" for historians and bloody difficult for the people who have to fight them and do so under the unremitting gaze of the backseat drivers of the news media.

Which, of course, is where the euphemisms come from. Our ancestors could say that the role of infantry is "to close with and destroy the enemy", but God forbid that a senior commander in a "good" army of the 21st century ever use such blunt terms where civilians can hear him.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: meself
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 12:51 PM

Bear in mind that we are several nations here separated by a common language. I had to look up "sarky" - and in a country in which the utterance of "eh" is - or was - so common as to be a stereotypical identifier, I cannot imagine how it could be used in a "sarky" (i.e., sarcastic) way.

Not long ago, I was talking to a Canadian academic who, after a long and far-flung career, settled into a position at Cambridge. "I was relieved that I wouldn't have to learn another new language," says she. "Boy, was I wrong about that!"

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 12:54 PM

Here in the UK a footpath is wot U walk on. Sidewalk if you will. But in the UK it has a legal definition outside of the highway, where you can walk, even across someone's land if it is a designated footpath. They are distinct from bridleways that horse & rider may use as well. And even motorbikes in many cases. towpaths are foot paths, unless you are a pushbike!

So when did all our footpaths become footways?
Now all roadworks that impinge bear signs saying "FOOTWAY CLOSED". Thus not implying any legal rights attached thereto, one has to assume.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: meself
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 12:58 PM

Btw, I wouldn't say that "if you will" means "in my opinion" - it's synonymous with "as it were" - in other words, the speaker is expressing awareness that there is something unusual - if not potentially offensive or misleading - in her wording. Not an expression I use, but it doesn't, if you will, get up my nose.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 01:00 PM

Bombs are round and black, the size of bowling balls or xmas puddings,
have a sparkling lit fuse poking out,
and might have a funny face, or sometimes the word "BOMB" painted on them...

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: G-Force
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 01:02 PM

I agree about 'going forward'. Well I suppose if you believe Albert Einstein we could go backward too. But for most of us, going forward must be the default, so why say it?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 01:03 PM

When an emergency RED ALERT progresses to a BROWN ALERT...!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 01:55 PM

never trust a fart.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 01:58 PM

"Jim, most of us here, including you, are too young to remember when "friendly fire" entered the language."
Must have missed it, I genuinely never heard it prior to the Vietnam war
It apparently originated in World War One, but was never accepted as a term until WW2   
Must be my naive opinion that killing anybody is distinctly 'unfriendly'

I assume I'm ok with 'Collateral damage' (May 1961 - Vietnam) - and 'Special rendition' (2005, when the US started sending terrorist suspects to countries notorious for their use of torture to be 'questioned - though there were rumours of it four years earlier)
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 02:21 PM

"Sidewalk if you will."

Grr. Somebody call a constable...

When I prattled on about "yeah" and "eh," I was envisaging their use only at the end of a sentence, either a suggestion or a question, employed with the Aussie upturn inflexion. "So, you were at the pub last night, yeah?" is far friendlier than "So, you were at the pub last night, eh?", especially when you say the latter with the hint of a cynical snarl...

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 02:33 PM

New Speak is when powers that be invent new word usage as in naming laws the opposie of what they do, like
Citizens United

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 03:16 PM

And it's railway station, not a bloody "train station..."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mrrzy
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 03:19 PM

A bomb is something that blows up - mines are a type of bomb. Saying Improvised is condescending and thus annoying. Nothing to worry about, it's only improvised ...

Pet peeve: Bucket list. When else would you do those things, *after* you die?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: meself
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 03:35 PM

'"So, you were at the pub last night, yeah?" is far friendlier than "So, you were at the pub last night, eh?", especially when you say the latter with the hint of a cynical snarl...' When I imagine these in an English context and in English accents, I understand exactly what you mean. In Canada, however, someone saying, "So, you were at the pub last night, eh?" would be ordinary speech, and would likely either be a neutral conversation-starter ("Many people there?"), or full of bonhomie ("Betcha had a good time, eh?"). Of course, if it were a cop saying it while he's got your face shoved against the wall, it might not be so friendly.

'"So, you were at the pub last night, yeah?"' would just sound kinda weird.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 03:54 PM

The word "drop" is now often used to mean "premier" or "introduce". As in, "The first episode of the new season of 'That TV Show Everybody's Watching' was dropped last night."

To me, "drop" means to get rid of something. As in, "'That TV Show Everybody's Watching' was dropped because nobody was really watching it."

I guess that makes "drop" one of those "auto-antonym" words that can mean either of two opposite things. (Other examples: "cleave" and "sanction".)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 04:18 PM

More and more English people are writing "mom"...

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 04:27 PM

Duncan,my new-found cousin, is very much a Geordie. I wonder if the 'yeah' is common parlance now among folk in the NE? I might ask one of our lovely neighbours John, who is also a Geordie, and of the younger generation. He might be able to enlighten me.

My sister uses 'yup' in e mails. I don't much like that either. (fussy old biddy aren't I?)

An expression which irritates me quite a bit is 'bored of'. Very common nowadays (innit eh?)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 07:11 PM

Downsize. Pre-owned/pre-loved. Pre-order. Prior to. Albeit. "On a daily basis." Bugger, you've really got me started now...

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 07:21 PM

Ah Steve, I loved your list of office-speak on another thread a while back, things like:
         Run it up the flagpole and see if anyone salutes it.
         Blue sky thinking
         Thinking outside the box
         Singing from the same hymn sheet etc.
People groan now at these I expect.
That's the trouble with new expressions - they quickly become old hat!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 07:25 PM

I love to get my ducks in a row before I start cooking, Eliza. Can you jump in the pool with me and swim with that?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 07:27 PM

Pwaaaahaaahaaagh Steve! Love it!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 20 - 07:38 PM

Now then, Eliza, we could do with an idea shower in order to identify the low-hanging fruit. Let's put the record on to see who dances. The main thing is to not let the grass grow too long on this one. Let's put in the overtime and discuss this at lunchtime al desko...

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 03:42 AM

It's 7am the next day Steve, and I've just spilt my morning tea reading those! Hahahahaaaaaagh!

I also find "I was like..." irritating. I assume it merely means "I said..." in which case why not use that? Examples:-

She was thirty minutes late and I was like, "Where have you been?"
The dog ran into the road and I was like, "Oh no!"

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 04:26 AM

And it's railway station, not a bloody "train station..." - and the distinction is?

How are you on bus stations? Not a bloody roadway station**?
Anyway Gloucester doesn't have a brand spanking new bus station it is a Hub. and buses arrive via a one way street (except buses) that is called a bus gate - wot is that all abart then?
So well thought through that they still have to use streets around as bus termini, or did I mean terminals?

Just as a wind up, would you care to opine on rail waystation. Factually correct and IMNSHO more correct!


**in Stroud they bulldozed the bus station and use the street as the focal point for all buses. That would be a roadway station I submit. We just call it bus stopsssss

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 04:38 AM

who is also a Geordie, - only if from Newcastle. From Sunderland they is Makems

'cos Newcastle built the boats, but Sunderland made them (fitted them oot)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Donuel
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 07:12 AM

collection of best words

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 07:23 AM

Well, Mr Red, on roads you can have bus stations, coach stations and petrol stations, so if it's a place where buses gather it's helpful to have the word "bus" in there for identity purposes. Not needed for railway stations. "Train station" is an ugly Americanism that we've let creep in.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Charmion
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 12:02 PM

"I was like" typically indicates a paraphrase, at least among the denizens of Ontario.

As for "focal point" -- don't get me started!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 01:22 PM

"Epicentre" is almost universally misused. That should be an automatic prison sentence.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 01:29 PM

"Epicentre".. so it's not the main local retailer for Epiphone Guitars...???

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: JennieG
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 04:22 PM

Charmion - "I was like" reached the sunny shores of Oz several years ago. The world is doomed, I fear.

I would like to know when a helpful hint (meaning an idea, as in "she gave me a hint for using those over-ripe bananas") became a "hack". "Hack", to me, denotes a rather nasty cough.

However, I quite like the way language is continually evolving and changing. If it didn't, we would all still speak in the style of Chaucer and his forebears.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mrrzy
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 04:29 PM

Forsooth!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 04:43 PM

Senoufou - "whatever" in Croydon has morphed into "wha'evaaaaar" from the melting pot of languages!!

"innit" without the t being pronounced of course - an absurd nightmare!!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mrrzy
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 05:15 PM

I always liked the British "innit" as being so much simpler

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mrrzy
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 05:17 PM

...than having to *concorder* [can't make italics here] the tag question to the main phrase (did she, haven't they, etc). Just like n'est-ce pas. Simple.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 06:40 PM

Ha Bonzo, yes! The pronunciation of these gruesome new expressions is excruciating, but interesting too.

Mrrzy,my poor Ivorian husband spoke only Malinke and French when he first came to the UK. He had the devil's own trouble trying to get English versions of 'n'est-ce pas' correct. Isn't he? Don't they? Hadn't we? Wasn't she? It drove him mad. Sadly he still gets them wrong, but substitutes 'hein?' and a head tilt.

In spite of my teacherish and snobby attitude to language changes, I'm secretly enchanted by new words, accents and expressions. I can't resist copying them and using them in conversation.
I love Norfolkisms too. A man yesterday outside the village shop asked me if I'd like to 'coax' his dog. That's Norfolk for 'stroke'. I immediately coaxed and coaxed the animal!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Rusty Dobro
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 06:40 PM

'Nahmean?' always appears at the end of a statement so simple and straightforward that its meaning could never be mistaken, as in 'I'm goin' for a beer, nahmean?'. It could be rendered as 'do you know what I mean?', but never is.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 06:52 PM

I really like 'ting'. It's London Jamaican for a casual girlfriend.
There's a pop song by Ramz called 'Barking', and he sings about 'linking his ting from Barking' (ie getting together with his bird in East London.)
The word has other meanings too. 'Dat's mah ting' could mean 'That's what I'm doing/what I'm interested in' etc'. 'Thing' is so boring in comparison! Innit? Yeah!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Mar 20 - 08:03 PM

Know wharram sayin'?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: FreddyHeadey
Date: 12 Mar 20 - 07:33 PM

Senoufou ,,, 'innit'

"A dictionary of the hybrid language has been gathered by Baljinder Mahal, a Derby-based teacher and published this week as The Queen's Hinglish.

...And the dictionary identifies how the ubiquitous "innit" was absorbed into British Asian speech via "haina" - a Hindi tag phrase, stuck on the sentences and meaning "is no?".
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6122072.stm

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 04:42 AM

Oh Freddy that's fascinating! My Hong Kong friend at University taught me quite a bit of Cantonese, and 'innit' could be translated into 'hai-mhai' (is/isn't it?) which is rather similar to the Hindi you mention.

But as a child in West London, we all spoke with rather a Cockney-type of accent, and I remember my father smacking my bottom for such utterances as, "It's raining innit?" But the 'innit' was only used strictly as a substitute for 'isn't it'. I love 'innit' when it's used for any and every kind of question or statement. It always makes me giggle innit!

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 05:07 AM

so if it's a place where buses gather it's helpful to have the word "bus" in there for identity purposes.

IMNSHO you shot yourself in the foot there. A Rail Waystation is a place where trains congregate. So no different from bus or coach. You could say that a Rail Station is a place where rails meet, but only if there are points. If you get my point!

Then again, is it not, technically a rails station, unless it has a monorail? And wot abart a halt? Language, especially (English) English, conveys concepts - if you want precision try computer languages - the real home of the pedant.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 05:23 AM

It's a station on or along a railway. It would make sense if we had adopted the term 'bus station' for bus stops but language is inconsistent. Bus stations are not necessarily termini for all the routes so perhaps they should have been called nexuses instead.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 05:30 AM

Or nexi, along with fora and viri. Not to speak of hippopotami and octopi. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 06:03 AM

So what is Pi in Octal then? I could work it out (approx) but I am running for a bus at the local nexus wot ain'ta nexus - wot doo ya call a temporary nexus?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 08:38 AM

Octopodes. Mattri, waitri, though.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 10:35 AM

Didn't Flanders and Swann sing "A regular army of hippopotami..." in 'Mud, Mud, Glorious Mud' ? :)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 12:07 PM

Octopodes. - or Octopussies

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 12:24 PM

The plural of octopus is "an octopus and another octopus."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 01:51 PM

Or 'an octopus n sum uvvers an orl'.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Lighter
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 04:40 PM

The Illustrated War News (London) (Oct. 3, 1917):

"Their barrage might be falling...short of the required distance....perhaps endangering [their comrades] with friendly fire."

Coconino Sun (Flagstaff, Ariz.) (Sept. 20, 1918):

"I must not forget the first time I came in proximity with artillery fire. This was friendly fire."

N.Y. Times (Oct. 11, 1918):

"A machine gun barrage laid down on the enemy emplacements was friendly fire from a unit ... acting without orders to cover their advance."


Ibid. (Apr. 3, 1944):

"Admiral Nimitz disclosed that thirteen Americans had been killed and forty-six wounded by friendly fire in another ‘tragic episode’ of the war."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Lighter
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 06:00 PM

Almost forgot:

Journal of the Royal United Service Institution (1867), p. 256:

"Something that is placed at a considerable distance from the friendly fire, the fire of the gun itself."


Journal of the Military Service Institution of the United States (May, 1910):

"What have we done to avoid their being shot to pieces by friendly fire? Absolutely nothing that we have ever heard of -- and yet this is one of the most serious problems that confronts the leader of troops. Courage before the enemy will quail before a fire from the rear."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: leeneia
Date: 13 Mar 20 - 07:28 PM

"If you will" means "If you accept my way of expressing it."

As in, "It's a bungalow boondoggle, if you will."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Mar 20 - 05:36 AM

Woman policeman.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 14 Mar 20 - 06:32 AM

So before every sentance - Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

well should invoke the same reaction, but barely registers. - Well, personally!

So why?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Mar 20 - 08:48 AM

Why do inanimate things have a sense of smell?
The car smells.
I could see how a thing could stink but not smell.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 14 Mar 20 - 01:17 PM

Well these smart cars - driving themselves, maybe they are too polite.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 14 Mar 20 - 02:27 PM

I hate the word 'app'. I'm always being exhorted to 'download an app'. I don't even own a phobile moan. And what the blazes is an 'app' anyway? I'd really love a nap (in fact, I have one every afternoon after lunch)
Also, every site wants to know if I'll accept cookies. Of course! Hobnobs, digestives, and especially Tunnocks caramel wafers please. Thank you.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Mar 20 - 10:48 PM

I use "well" a lot here. It's a faintly polite way of starting a sentence (spelled thus, by the way, Mr Red) in which you want to express disagreement with something said earlier. It has a slightly shrugging air about it. It can represent scepticism about something that's been said. It can express your opinion that the person you're responding to isn't properly in charge of the facts, for example if someone crows that the majority of the country voted for brexit, you can reply "Well, in fact only 38% of the electorate actually did so. So the majority of the country didn't, nothing like..."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 14 Mar 20 - 11:46 PM

"well" is a more proper word version of "hmmmmm"...

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 15 Mar 20 - 06:21 AM

Well/Thus - don't get yer drift old boy. If I wus tu use thus, thus, I would mean thus. Well has a deeper meaning! To draw on.
:)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Senoufou
Date: 15 Mar 20 - 06:57 AM

Not 'new words' exactly, but they were new to me when I moved from Edinburgh to Glasgow in 1970 to teach eight year-olds. The introductory "See you...?" "See him...?" " See her...?" followed by a comment.

My young pupils often remarked, "See me Miss? Ahm swaitin'!" (Would you please open the window as I'm rather hot.)

"See him Miss? He nicked ma piece!" (Miss, that chap over there has stolen my playtime bread-and-butter.)

"See you? Ah cannae understond a wurrd ye say!" (Miss, your accent is far too English, which makes comprehension a little difficult.)

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: mayomick
Date: 15 Mar 20 - 10:25 AM

"innit" affirms a stated fact ; it is not a question.As in :"be careful or I'll mouth or I'll punch you in the mouth , innit."

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Mar 20 - 11:50 AM

I often tell people here that challenging me on spelling or grammar here is likely to earn you a scornful response with more than a hint of ridicule. We're not writing legalese here and we can afford to be casual, and we all overlook others' errors most of the time. However, there was nothing wrong with my use of "thus." There was everything wrong with your spelling of "sentence" in a post that purported to chide me. There's the rub. Leave it off with me and I'll leave it off with you, innit.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 15 Mar 20 - 01:32 PM

Leave it orf? You? U is 'avin a larf innit?

There's the rub.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Mar 20 - 03:39 PM

God, you're funny. Thank God you're a red.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 16 Mar 20 - 04:19 AM

sartorial affectation only. Political colour is that of pure unadulterated water (where found). Transparency rules OK?

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mrrzy
Date: 16 Mar 20 - 09:26 AM

My dog has no nose. How does he smell? Awful! is an old joke, Donuel.

Subject: RE: BS: New Speak: words they are achangin
From: Mr Red
Date: 17 Mar 20 - 12:47 PM

My dog has no nose. How does he smell? - worse than the joke!