Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafesj

Post to this Thread - Printer Friendly - Home
Page: [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10]


Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)

Related threads:
Post Katrina; Songs mentioning/about N O (12)
BS: positive suggestions for disaster planning (42)
New Orleans Musicians who survived (23)
BS: Katrina's real name? (36)
BS: Really... Why Rebuild N.O.'s???... (58)
BS: 3,000 jobless in New Orleans (26)
BS: Hurricane Rita, Mother Nature, & FEMA (155)
BS: Need info about the Red Cross (68)
BS: Hurricane AFTERMATH (208)
BS: Rush Limbaugh blames Katrina's victims (96)
New Orleans Catters? (58)
BS: Black looters, white finders (224)
Lyr Add: My City's In Ruins (New Orleans) (8)
BS: So Where will The Next Disaster Hit? (91)
Hurricane Relief Song: Big Muddy (MP3) (4)
BS: New Orleans (39)
Song Challenge: Killer of New Orleans (34)
BS: My editorial cartoon on Federal Response (14)
BS: Controlling hurricanes (41)
BS: Greater Federal Authority? (23)
BS: Katrina Kamps (11)
BS: Katrina: Sequence of Events (31)
BS: Astrology, Coincidences, Karma & Katrina (102)
BS: Left Behind in New Orleans: the elderly (25)
BS: Why 'NOLA' and suchlike? (51)
BS: Barbie explains it all (22)
Fats Domino missing in New Orleans -found! (35)
A Harrowing Account, Got to be new Thred (16)
Tabasco Sauce, Avery Isle, is it there? (12)
Neti Vaan and Bart Ramsey?Newn Orleans? (2)
BS: Houston Astrodome Censor (12)
BS: Bush to tell HIS side of story. (44)
BS: View any house in disaster area (4)
BS: PoppaGator survives Katrina.... (23)
BS: Death Sentence For Stealing Damaged TV (106)
BS: remember... (6)
BS: Karl Rove v. Hillary on Katrina... (20)
BS: Genocide in New Orleans (177)
BS: more hurricane warnings (105)
BS: New Orleans Will Drown Again (65)
Hurricane Relief: How can I help? (29)
BS: Faith Based Disaster Relief! Ta Da!!! (33)
City of New Orleans - radio requests (21)
BS: the only send money syndrome (27)
BS: One Triumph Over Bureaucracy! (4)
Alive and well and OUT of New Orleans (61)
BS: Mike Brown of FEMA (6)
CD BABY and Hurricane Relief (4)
BS: Bobert to take on Katrina... (76)
Aftermath (11)
BS: Katrina photos (8)


Peace 04 Sep 05 - 05:26 PM
CarolC 04 Sep 05 - 05:32 PM
McGrath of Harlow 04 Sep 05 - 06:03 PM
Peace 04 Sep 05 - 06:09 PM
CarolC 04 Sep 05 - 06:14 PM
SharonA 04 Sep 05 - 06:17 PM
Azizi 04 Sep 05 - 06:31 PM
Peter T. 04 Sep 05 - 08:44 PM
McGrath of Harlow 04 Sep 05 - 09:06 PM
GUEST 04 Sep 05 - 09:49 PM
Peace 04 Sep 05 - 09:51 PM
Amos 04 Sep 05 - 10:56 PM
Amos 04 Sep 05 - 10:57 PM
CarolC 05 Sep 05 - 02:26 AM
Peter T. 05 Sep 05 - 10:19 AM
CarolC 05 Sep 05 - 12:13 PM
McGrath of Harlow 05 Sep 05 - 12:52 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 02:29 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 02:51 PM
DMcG 05 Sep 05 - 03:15 PM
freda underhill 05 Sep 05 - 04:28 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 04:35 PM
freda underhill 05 Sep 05 - 04:36 PM
GUEST,G 05 Sep 05 - 04:39 PM
freda underhill 05 Sep 05 - 04:41 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 04:42 PM
GUEST,G 05 Sep 05 - 04:57 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 05:01 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 05:06 PM
Amos 05 Sep 05 - 05:06 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 05:10 PM
CarolC 05 Sep 05 - 05:16 PM
Peter T. 05 Sep 05 - 05:22 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 05:23 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 05:55 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 06:00 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 06:13 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 06:15 PM
McGrath of Harlow 05 Sep 05 - 06:21 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 07:02 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 07:06 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 07:28 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 07:31 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 07:35 PM
katlaughing 05 Sep 05 - 07:40 PM
freda underhill 05 Sep 05 - 07:43 PM
GUEST,H 05 Sep 05 - 07:48 PM
Azizi 05 Sep 05 - 07:53 PM
Peace 05 Sep 05 - 08:03 PM
Big Mick 05 Sep 05 - 09:22 PM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum Child
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:













Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 05:26 PM

I have but one thing to add. That people died due to the hurricane is not tragedy. Canute could not hold back the tide. However, the disgraceful CF in the American south--the lack of response, the lack of leadership, the lack of compassion by your President, your leader, your Commander-in-Chief, the lack of courage this man displays--it has spoken more eloquently than a million diatribes, a billion words. He does NOT deserve to lead your country. I hope the people of the US wake up to that fact. Soon.

Year ago I read a joke about two bakeries located near Buckingham Palace in England. In an effort to promote business, one displayed a sign that read, "We do baking for the Queen." Next day, the bakery across the road erected a sign that read, "God save the Queen."

President Bush is your leader.

God bless America.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: CarolC
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 05:32 PM

Lighter, do you have any explanations for why FEMA would cut emergency communication lines (forcing local authorities to have to post armed guards to prevent it from happening again), or why they would turn away water and fuel when people are quite literally dying of thirst and heat exaustion?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 06:03 PM

Unthinking bureaucratic arrogance, combined with professional incompetance could go a long way to explain those kinds of things.

Where conspiracy theories tend to come unstuck is that they require a high degree of intelligence in planning, in carrying out plans, and in clearing up the things that don't go according to plan. Can anyone believe these guys are capable of anything that difficult? If they had to find their way out of a paper bag, I suppose they might just about manage to do that...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 06:09 PM

I agree with what you've said, Kevin. But they are not who I am alluding to. There is a power behind the throne I think. However, I hope you are right and I am wrong.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: CarolC
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 06:14 PM

Where conspiracy theories tend to come unstuck is that they require a high degree of intelligence in planning, in carrying out plans, and in clearing up the things that don't go according to plan.

They don't really, McGrath. All they require in cases like this one is a largely "hands off" approach combined with the purposeful appointment of incompetent people in highly sensitive positions of responsibility.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: SharonA
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 06:17 PM

"Power behind the throne", Peace? You mean Dick Cheney? You think maybe he wants Halliburton to go to N.O. and clean up this mess???


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 06:31 PM

Here are several dailyKos posts about two German newspapers' reports that the Bush interview with two African American women {or one woman and a female teen} was staged:

"There was a striking dicrepancy between the CNN International report on the Bush visit to the New Orleans disaster zone, yesterday, and reports of the same event by German TV.

ZDF News reported that the president's visit was a completely staged event. Their crew witnessed how the open air food distribution point Bush visited in front of the cameras was torn down immediately after the president and the herd of 'news people' had left and that others which were allegedly being set up were abandoned at the same time.

The people in the area were once again left to fend for themselves, said ZDF.

by Buffalo Girl on Sat Sep 3rd, 2005 at 19:49:26 PDT"

-snip-

"And the German Tagesschau (first state channel, ZDF being the second) reported a similar scenario, with a different reporter.

Bottom line: When the convoy of the President arrived, hectic activity broke out for the first time, bulldozers appeared and cleared areas that didn't need clearing because nobody was still living there, and when the President disappeared, so did the bulldozers and workers.

Christine Adelhardt, the reporter, said, that the fake scenario shocked her as much as the destruction she had seen.

http://www.tagesschau.de/video/0,1315,OID4700936_RESreal256_PLYinternal_NAV_BAB,00.html

(video only)

by vanguardia on Sat Sep 3rd, 2005 at 19:04:57 PDT"

-snip-


"...in the second paragraph (went to Babelfish first and then cleaned it up based on my knowledge of German). Should read:

Along the President's route, troops had cleared debris before Bush arrived and would have hidden corpses. Then Bush left, "and with it", said Rueggeberg, "so did the troops". In Biloxi, the situation remains unchanged - everything is still lacking.

by fpc on Sat Sep 3rd, 2005 at 19:07:35 PDT"

-snip-

There were other posts in that diary or others that suggested that the women themselves might not be victims of the hurricane. One post talked about hearing audio about bring on the Black women...

And the main subject of that diary was this Levee Repairs Faked for Bush Photo-op


If any of this true, it is reprehensible.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peter T.
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 08:44 PM

If any of it is true, it is typical of every event I have ever been at where someone important arrives: presidents and TV crews automatically mean cleanups.

What strikes me most about this thread, as a foreigner, is the recurring astonishingly infantile belief that the President is somehow a godlike father figure who should be all-knowing, all-wise, and able to handle a vast natural disaster with a wave of his hand, that he is to blame for any and every flaw in the response, and the refusal to plan adequately for it beforehand, and when he isn't such a God, there is widespread anguish.   Bush is a complete idiot, but the crazed reaction is absurd.

yours,

Peter


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 09:06 PM

The President has a symbolic role, and that matters. Part of that symbolism is that, when things go badly enough, he should have to carry the blame, and be seen to carry the blame. That's what the assertion that "the buck stops here" is supposed to mean.

There's a practical side to it too - the etiquette in these things is that the underlings down the system take their lead from the man at the top, when it comes to ordering their priorities. If he's saying, in effect, this doesn't really matter, and things are ok the way they are, that's what the people below are listening to, rather than to the voices from below, or the evidence of their own eyes.

And that applied earlier too, when it came to decisions to slash essential work on flood defences way to a tiny fractiion of what was being asked for by the people who knew what was needed. The priorities articulated by the Presdeint, under which things like that didn't matter, were the priorities that mattered.

It may well be that the man is a pathetic and indadequate puppet with his strings pulled by others, but that puppet is the public face of the beast. There's nothing irrational in focussing a degree of attention on that public face.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 09:49 PM

Why is the media so afraid to tell the truth??????


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 09:51 PM

Damned good question, GUEST.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Amos
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 10:56 PM

KATRINA: LANDRIEU ASKS FOR MORE HELP

http://www.newschannel6.tv/news/default.asp?mode=shownews&id=8695

Saturday, September 03, 2005

Landrieu Implores President to
"Relieve Unmitigated Suffering;"
End FEMA's "Abject Failures"


WASHINGTON – U.S. Senator Mary Landrieu, D-La., issued the following
statement this afternoon regarding her call yesterday for President
Bush to appoint a cabinet-level official to oversee Hurricane Katrina
relief and recovery efforts within 24 hours.

Sen. Landrieu said:

"Yesterday, I was hoping President Bush would come away from his tour
of the regional devastation triggered by Hurricane Katrina with a new
understanding for the magnitude of the suffering and for the abject
failures of the current Federal Emergency Management Agency. 24 hours
later, the President has yet to answer my call for a cabinet-level
official to lead our efforts. Meanwhile, FEMA, now a shell of what it
once was, continues to be overwhelmed by the task at hand.

"I understand that the U.S. Forest Service had water-tanker aircraft
available to help douse the fires raging on our riverfront, but FEMA
has yet to accept the aid. When Amtrak offered trains to evacuate
significant numbers of victims – far more efficiently than buses –
FEMA again dragged its feet. Offers of medicine, communications
equipment and other desperately needed items continue to flow in, only
to be ignored by the agency.

"But perhaps the greatest disappointment stands at the breached 17th
Street levee. Touring this critical site yesterday with the President,
I saw what I believed to be a real and significant effort to get a
handle on a major cause of this catastrophe. Flying over this critical
spot again this morning, less than 24 hours later, it became apparent
that yesterday we witnessed a hastily prepared stage set for a
Presidential photo opportunity; and the desperately needed resources
we saw were this morning reduced to a single, lonely piece of
equipment. The good and decent people of southeast Louisiana and the
Gulf Coast – black and white, rich and poor, young and old – deserve
far better from their national government.

"Mr. President, I'm imploring you once again to get a cabinet-level
official stood up as soon as possible to get this entire operation
moving forward regionwide with all the resources – military and
otherwise – necessary to relieve the unmitigated suffering and
economic damage that is unfolding."


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Amos
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 10:57 PM

Stuff happens.

And when you combine limited government with incompetent government, lethal stuff happens.

America is once more plunged into a snake pit of anarchy, death, looting, raping, marauding thugs, suffering innocents, a shattered infrastructure, a gutted police force, insufficient troop levels and criminally negligent government planning. But this time it's happening in America.


Fred R. Conrad/The New York Times
More Columns by Maureen Dowd

Forum: Maureen Dowd's Columns
W. drove his budget-cutting Chevy to the levee, and it wasn't dry. Bye, bye, American lives. "I don't think anyone anticipated the breach of the levees," he told Diane Sawyer.

Shirt-sleeves rolled up, W. finally landed in Hell yesterday and chuckled about his wild boozing days in "the great city" of N'Awlins. He was clearly moved. "You know, I'm going to fly out of here in a minute," he said on the runway at the New Orleans International Airport, "but I want you to know that I'm not going to forget what I've seen." Out of the cameras' range, and avoided by W., was a convoy of thousands of sick and dying people, some sprawled on the floor or dumped on baggage carousels at a makeshift M*A*S*H unit inside the terminal.

Why does this self-styled "can do" president always lapse into such lame "who could have known?" excuses.

Who on earth could have known that Osama bin Laden wanted to attack us by flying planes into buildings? Any official who bothered to read the trellis of pre-9/11 intelligence briefs.

Who on earth could have known that an American invasion of Iraq would spawn a brutal insurgency, terrorist recruiting boom and possible civil war? Any official who bothered to read the C.I.A.'s prewar reports.

Who on earth could have known that New Orleans's sinking levees were at risk from a strong hurricane? Anybody who bothered to read the endless warnings over the years about the Big Easy's uneasy fishbowl.

In June 2004, Walter Maestri, emergency management chief for Jefferson Parish, fretted to The Times-Picayune in New Orleans: "It appears that the money has been moved in the president's budget to handle homeland security and the war in Iraq, and I suppose that's the price we pay. Nobody locally is happy that the levees can't be finished, and we are doing everything we can to make the case that this is a security issue for us."

Not only was the money depleted by the Bush folly in Iraq; 30 percent of the National Guard and about half its equipment are in Iraq.

Ron Fournier of The Associated Press reported that the Army Corps of Engineers asked for $105 million for hurricane and flood programs in New Orleans last year. The White House carved it to about $40 million. But President Bush and Congress agreed to a $286.4 billion pork-filled highway bill with 6,000 pet projects, including a $231 million bridge for a small, uninhabited Alaskan island.

Just last year, Federal Emergency Management Agency officials practiced how they would respond to a fake hurricane that caused floods and stranded New Orleans residents. Imagine the feeble FEMA's response to Katrina if they had not prepared.

Michael Brown, the blithering idiot in charge of FEMA - a job he trained for by running something called the International Arabian Horse Association - admitted he didn't know until Thursday that there were 15,000 desperate, dehydrated, hungry, angry, dying victims of Katrina in the New Orleans Convention Center.

Was he sacked instantly? No, our tone-deaf president hailed him in Mobile, Ala., yesterday: "Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job."

It would be one thing if President Bush and his inner circle - Dick Cheney was vacationing in Wyoming; Condi Rice was shoe shopping at Ferragamo's on Fifth Avenue and attended "Spamalot" before bloggers chased her back to Washington; and Andy Card was off in Maine - lacked empathy but could get the job done. But it is a chilling lack of empathy combined with a stunning lack of efficiency that could make this administration implode.

When the president and vice president rashly shook off our allies and our respect for international law to pursue a war built on lies, when they sanctioned torture, they shook the faith of the world in American ideals.

When they were deaf for so long to the horrific misery and cries for help of the victims in New Orleans - most of them poor and black, like those stuck at the back of the evacuation line yesterday while 700 guests and employees of the Hyatt Hotel were bused out first - they shook the faith of all Americans in American ideals. And made us ashamed.

Who are we if we can't take care of our own?

(Excerpted from Maureen Dowd's editorial in the Times


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: CarolC
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 02:26 AM

He's not God, Peter T, but because of his position, he has the ability to do a lot of good or a lot of harm. He appears to be choosing the latter of the two, more often than not, and he's taking the rest of the country down with him while he's at it.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peter T.
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 10:19 AM

I can't see how he is now personally responsible for many years of ecological mismanagement. And battles between local, state, and federal governments in emergencies is endemic around the world in the absence of a serious plan.    As Paul Krugman might possibly have remarked, continuing degrading of the role of government is certainly responsible for some of this -- though one might think that neoconservatives who believe in strong security and the rights of property would demand a strong role for emergency planning.   So sure, you could pin some of it on Bush. Putting an ex-horse show manager in charge of FEMA was not too bright, and dithering for a couple of days is his style for everything, and he has a country-club attitude to the poor (some of them will make excellent waiters), and so on. But still.

The Iraq War was a personal decision, and he is completely responsible for the fiasco there.

yours,

Peter T.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: CarolC
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 12:13 PM

He can turn the mismanagement of the environment around if he wants to. He has that within his ability. But the thing he deserves the most scathing criticism for (and criminal indictment, in my opinion), is the number of unnecessary deaths that have resulted from his inaction during this emergency, and his administration's evisceration of the agency that is responsible for helping people during disasters of any sort.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 12:52 PM

I don't think people should see it as a particularly personal thing. In a sense he's a figurehead and a puppet, but he put himself in the position. It's not his fault he's the man he is, but it is his fault the man he is is president.

He ought to resign. Nixon did after all, and Watergate was a trivial matter in comparison with what Bush has done and failed to do.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 02:29 PM

Why was trained help turned away from New Orleans?

See this dailykos diary:

"Mon Sep 5th, 2005 at 07:55:38 PDT

Why FEMA turned away help
by Ducktape
Mon Sep 5th, 2005 at 07:55:38 PDT
For days after the disaster, help and volunteers of all sorts headed for New Orleans with relief supplies and expertise, only to be stopped and turned away by FEMA.

Last night, one of my friends joined our regular Sunday chat. He had just come home from New Orleans with his group of volunteer firefighters from Houston, after they had waited outside New Orleans for since Tuesday for FEMA to let them help in New Orleans, or use them somewhere else in the stricken region.

FEMA's "reason" -- they wouldn't let anyone in "until the National Guard has secured the city." The details of his experience are below the fold.

Ducktape's diary :: ::
Bill is a member of a volunteer firefighter team in the Houston area. He and his team have a lot of experience helping after hurricanes. And they also have special expertise -- a lot of them work for a living on oil infrastructure and repairs. Bill is a professional logistics expert whose assignments have included getting a client's tsunami-flattened distribution facility back operating within a couple of weeks, and pre-invasion logistics work in Kuwait.

On Monday night, his group assembled their rescue equipment and tools, and packed them into their boats along with all the emergency supplies they could carry. By Tuesday morning, they were almost to New Orleans. "We were stopped at gunpoint by FEMA and told to turn back," he told me. When I asked, he clarified that they did not point the guns at them, but they were carrying and displaying their weapons.

FEMA told him that no one was allowed to enter the city to help "until it was secured by the National Guard." The Houston team asked if they could wait. The FEMA staff told them yes, but that they shouldn't expect anything to change.

So they set up camp in the parking area where they had been stopped, and they waited. By Thursday night, when they were still waiting in the same place, some of the team returned to Houston. The rest decided to wait longer. And still nothing changed, so the remaining team members returned to Houston on Saturday night.

Needless to say, Bill is livid about this. I asked him why they had not been sent to some of the other communities in the hurricane-stricken area where security was not as much of an issue.

"We asked," he told me, "but they said that our expertise was more needed in the New Orleans area." The fucking catch-22 -- they were needed in New Orleans, so they weren't allowed to go elsewhere, but they weren't allowed to go into New Orleans, so the upshot was that they did nothing except sit and wait, and then go home in frustration.

What had him frosted more than anything else is that they also have very specific expertise, as individual professionals as well as a firefighter team, in dealing with damage to oil infrastructure in the aftermath of a natural disaster. "We've been doing this more than 10 years," he told me. "We are not amateurs, and we have an enormous amount of experience with areas which have been hit by hurricanes."

"A lot of the damaged oil facilities aren't even in the city of New Orleans itself," he told me, "so they weren't in an area that you would think would have looters or security problems that were different from any hurricane we've worked in. We're used to arriving and immediately going to work."

They didn't just sit and wait -- they kept going back to the FEMA people who were holding them up and making suggestions about how and where they could be useful. But FEMA had no interest in listening, and the line never changed. "You can wait if you wish, but don't expect any change anytime soon. Or you can go home."

You know all that "help is on the way" BS that was spouted? A lot of it wasn't just "on the way" -- it was already there, but blocked from doing anything because of FEMA.

We've heard so much of this over this past week, of help and supplies arriving and not being allowed in, of the USS Bataan cruising off the city with helicopters, medical facilities, and supplies, but doing nothing because they hadn't been asked to help.

I thought my outrage meter was already off the dial, but I discovered it had new levels when I heard the first-hand account from a friend who had left work for a week to bring specific expertise to the disaster, and who was among the thousands of such people blocked by FEMA and their incompetent bureaucracy from doing anything at all."

-snip-

Click Why FEMA Turned Away Help to read comments


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 02:51 PM

Was the Red Cross refused entry to New Orleans or did it refuse to provide support?

See this comment from the same diary whose link is provided in my last post:

"You need to have a look at this

I believe there exists a contract between FEMA and Southern Baptist Convention's American Red Cross granting Red Cross the sole right to administer disaster relief EXCLUSIVE of all others. That would make sense for the Red Cross in its quest for power and donations, and for FEMA in its attempt to simplify disaster coordination. And I think this monopolization goal is the basis upon which other agencies and private individuals were denied access. The problem is that the American Red Cross is answerable to no one.

Here is a link to a research diary by Addison last night which fell off the list too fast. Note the bold text. Today, Red Cross is claiming that FEMA won't or wouldn't let them in to New Orleans. But last year before Ivan, It's here documented that Red Cross refused to set up in New Orleans. Note that ARC's upper echelon is Republican, white and baptist and NO is black and Catholic and Democratic.

So Red Cross's claim of being denied access by FEMA is not quite true. They have a no enter policy when it comes to NO and I believe they used their clout and perhaps an exclusivity contract to keep others out.    I believe, that there is some kind of connection between the Red Cross's refusal to enter New Orleans and FEMA's refusal to allow other aid groups to enter New Orleans, and refusal to cooperate with other aid agencies in Houston, which was diaried in the last couple of days by a woman who wen to Houston to help and was refused, went to other agencies to help and was told they had been shut out.

by NorCalJim on Mon Sep 5th, 2005


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: DMcG
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 03:15 PM

On being refused entry:

A number of British people were trapped in New Orleans and have been complaining that the British Embassy did nothing to help. According to Lord Triesman this is because they were refused entry. According to US Homeland Security's Ross Knocke (2min 44 secs into program) that is not true.

No doubt this will be a minor spat that is quietly forgotten.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: freda underhill
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 04:28 PM

A number of Australian people were also trapped in New Orleans, and also complained that the Australian Embassy did nothing to help. Out Foreign Minister explained publicly that the US government had denied access to foreign diplomats and refused them entry.

Australia had a city wiped out by a Hurricane on Christmas Day in 1974 - Hurricane Tracy destroyed Darwin. Before the hurricane approached, the government shipped in supplies and by the evening of Christmas Day the army had arrived and in the next couple of days 38,000 people were evacuated from Darwin.

It can be done.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 04:35 PM

The flood in Manitoba

The province constructed the Red River Floodway in 1968, put up permanent dikes in eight towns south of Winnipeg, and built clay dikes and diversion dams in the Winnipeg area. Other flood control structures completed later were the Portage Diversion, and the Shellmouth Dam on the Assiniboine. But even with these flood protection measures, in 1997 the province experienced a flood of 7.5 m, which caused 28,000 people to be evacuated and $500 million CAD in damage to property and infrastructure. Called "The Flood of the Century", the 1997 flood had a probability of occurrence of about 1 in 100, and came close to overcoming Winnipeg's existing flood protection system. The Red River Floodway, a Canadian waterway which opened in 1968 (first used in 1969), is a 47 km flood control channel which, during flood periods, diverts part of the Red River around Winnipeg and discharges back into the Red River below the dam at Lockport, Manitoba. ... {{Canadian City/Disable Field={{{Disable Motto Link}}}}} Motto: Unum Cum Virtute Multorum (One With the Strength of Many) City of Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Location. ... The Canadian dollar, CAD or C$, is the unit of currency of Canada. ...

Towns upriver in Manitoba, forewarned by footage of Grand Forks buildings burning and covered in metres of water, built ring dikes to protect their homes and properties, and the province of Manitoba called in the Canadian Forces, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and the provincial Department of Natural Resources. Thousands of volunteers also helped to build sandbag dikes around homes and property. An emergeny dike, later called the Brunkild Z-dike, 15 miles long, was constructed in a matter of days when it was realized that overland flooding threatened the City of Winnipeg. Canadian Forces Flag The Canadian Armed Forces (Fr. ... The Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP or Mounties; French, Gendarmerie royale du Canada, GRC) is both the federal police force and the national police of Canada. ... Sandbag may refer to a Nintendo character, Sandbag A sandbag is typically used in flood control, but the exact use can vary. ... A dyke (or dike) is a stone or earthen wall constructed as a defence or as a boundary. ...

Almost all of the ring dikes around the towns held, save one—St. Agathe. The town's dike system was prepared for the river approaching from the south, but the river had spread and swamped the town from the west.

At the flood's peak in Canada on May 4, the Red River occupied an area of 1,840 km² with more than 2,560 km² of land underwater. Nicknamed the "Red Sea", this temporary lake forced about 75,000 people to abandon their homes. $450 million in damage was caused. May 4 is the 124th day of the year in the Gregorian calendar (125th in leap years). ...

The province of Manitoba asked the International Joint Commission (IJC) to provide a report on the flood event and to recommend measures to ensure further flood protection for the city of Winnipeg. Largely as a result of this study, the province now plans on expanding the floodway. The International Joint Commission is an independent binational organization established by the United States and Canada under the Boundary Waters Treaty of 1909. ...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: freda underhill
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 04:36 PM

"unfortunately although the media have managed to get into New Orleans, the American administration won't allow any government officials to go in. Now we've said, well, if the media can go in, why can't government officials go in, and we might more easily be able to round up the Australians and get them out? And they're insistent that it's their responsibility, the Americans' responsibility to take everybody out."

http://www.foreignminister.gov.au/transcripts/2005/050903_ds.html

TONY EASTLEY: The Foreign Minister Alexander Downer has heard what the Australian families have had to say, and he's defended officers from his department who've been accused of incompetence.

ALEXANDER DOWNER: .. the situation here is a very difficult situation where the Australian and British and Canadians and others have been refused consular access to New Orleans
http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2005/s1453241.htm


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: GUEST,G
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 04:39 PM

"Shipped in supplies before the Hurricane hit". ?????
The problem with a Hurricane is not much left after it passes.
Must have been a Tropical storm or somebody is pulling your leg.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: freda underhill
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 04:41 PM

Australian Opposition Leader Kim Beazley said the federal government should have completely ignored a United States directive to keep consular officials out of hurricane-ravaged New Orleans. Mr Beazley said the lives and security of the 70 Australians stranded in the city were much more important than Australia's relationship with Washington. Mr Beazley said Prime Minister John Howard should have used his top-level contacts to force the US government to allow consulate officials into New Orleans.

"I don't think the government cares enough, I think the government is out of touch," Mr Beazley said.

But Foreign Minister Alexander Downer has in turned blamed the US government for the limited Australian response.

ALP SLAMS GOVT ON KATRINA HELP
5.9.2005. 18:29:56 SBS World News


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 04:42 PM

Worst ice storm in Canadian history.

In some parts of the country the lack of power was accompanied by very cold temperatures and winds that compounded the freeze. Rescue efforts went well.

As Freda said, it can be done. The American south will recover thanks to its people. I don't doubt that Bush will garner the credit where he can, but it will be common American citizens who make the difference, not people like George.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: GUEST,G
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 04:57 PM

I don't think the "American South will recover thanks to its' people".
In spite of some of them, they are being helped by outsiders.
I think this is a prime example, and what has been my policy for ever, is that we cannot wait for the Government to take care of us.

I worked rescue during a major Blizzard. We arrived at a rural home 4 days after all power had been knocked out to find a smiling Grandmother and her 3 Grandchildren who had stayed in a bathroom heated by candles. A grill served to heat up canned food and soups.

Her comment was, "Well, we have bonded about as much as possible and it is probably time for the children to go home".

No looting, no raping and no murders in the entire area.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:01 PM

Lucky I didn't say the world is round.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:06 PM

Hey, G. Would you please list all the things Bush has done right?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Amos
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:06 PM

Well it is round.

"By Sidney Blumenthal

Aug. 31, 2005 | Biblical in its uncontrolled rage and scope,
Hurricane Katrina has left millions of Americans to scavenge for food
and shelter and hundreds to thousands reportedly dead. With its main
levee broken, the evacuated city of New Orleans has become part of
the Gulf of Mexico. But the damage wrought by the hurricane may not
entirely be the result of an act of nature.

A year ago the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers proposed to study how New
Orleans could be protected from a catastrophic hurricane, but the
Bush administration ordered that the research not be undertaken.
After a flood killed six people in 1995, Congress created the
Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control Project, in which the Corps
of Engineers strengthened and renovated levees and pumping stations.
In early 2001, the Federal Emergency Management Agency issued a
report stating that a hurricane striking New Orleans was one of the
three most likely disasters in the U.S., including a terrorist attack
on New York City. But by 2003 the federal funding for the flood
control project essentially dried up as it was drained into the Iraq
war. In 2004, the Bush administration cut funding requested by the
New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers for holding
back the waters of Lake Pontchartrain by more than 80 percent.
Additional cuts at the beginning of this year (for a total reduction
in funding of 44.2 percent since 2001) forced the New Orleans
district of the Corps to impose a hiring freeze. The Senate had
debated adding funds for fixing New Orleans' levees, but it was too
late.

The New Orleans Times-Picayune, which before the hurricane published
a series on the federal funding problem, and whose presses are now
underwater, reported online: "No one can say they didn't see it
coming ... Now in the wake of one of the worst storms ever, serious
questions are being asked about the lack of preparation."

The Bush administration's policy of turning over wetlands to
developers almost certainly also contributed to the heightened level
of the storm surge. In 1990, a federal task force began restoring
lost wetlands surrounding New Orleans. Every two miles of wetland
between the Crescent City and the Gulf reduces a surge by half a
foot. Bush had promised "no net loss" of wetlands, a policy launched
by his father's administration and bolstered by President Clinton.
But he reversed his approach in 2003, unleashing the developers. The
Army Corps of Engineers and the Environmental Protection Agency then
announced they could no longer protect wetlands unless they were
somehow related to interstate commerce.

In response to this potential crisis, four leading environmental
groups conducted a joint expert study, concluding in 2004 that
without wetlands protection New Orleans could be devastated by an
ordinary, much less a Category 4 or 5, hurricane. "There's no way to
describe how mindless a policy that is when it comes to wetlands
protection," said one of the report's authors. The chairman of the
White House's Council on Environmental Quality dismissed the study as
"highly questionable," and boasted, "Everybody loves what we're
doing."

"My administration's climate change policy will be science based,"
President Bush declared in June 2001. But in 2002, when the
Environmental Protection Agency submitted a study on global warming
to the United Nations reflecting its expert research, Bush derided it
as "a report put out by a bureaucracy," and excised the climate
change assessment from the agency's annual report. The next year,
when the EPA issued its first comprehensive "Report on the
Environment," stating, "Climate change has global consequences for
human health and the environment," the White House simply demanded
removal of the line and all similar conclusions. At the G-8 meeting
in Scotland this year, Bush successfully stymied any common action on
global warming. Scientists, meanwhile, have continued to accumulate
impressive data on the rising temperature of the oceans, which has
produced more severe hurricanes.

In February 2004, 60 of the nation's leading scientists, including 20
Nobel laureates, warned in a statement, "Restoring Scientific
Integrity in Policymaking": "Successful application of science has
played a large part in the policies that have made the United States
of America the world's most powerful nation and its citizens
increasingly prosperous and healthy ... Indeed, this principle has
long been adhered to by presidents and administrations of both
parties in forming and implementing policies. The administration of
George W. Bush has, however, disregarded this principle ... The
distortion of scientific knowledge for partisan political ends must
cease." Bush completely ignored this statement.

In the two weeks preceding the storm in the Gulf, the trumping of
science by ideology and expertise by special interests accelerated.
The Federal Drug Administration announced that it was postponing sale
of the morning-after contraceptive pill, despite overwhelming
scientific evidence of its safety and its approval by the FDA's
scientific advisory board. The United Nations special envoy for
HIV/AIDS in Africa accused the Bush administration of responsibility
for a condom shortage in Uganda -- the result of the administration's
evangelical Christian agenda of "abstinence." When the chief of the
Bureau of Justice Statistics in the Justice Department was ordered by
the White House to delete its study that African-Americans and other
minorities are subject to racial profiling in police traffic stops
and he refused to buckle under, he was forced out of his job. When
the Army Corps of Engineers' chief contracting oversight analyst
objected to a $7 billion no-bid contract awarded for work in Iraq to
Halliburton (the firm at which Vice President Cheney was formerly
CEO), she was demoted despite her superior professional ratings. At
the National Park Service, a former Cheney aide, a political
appointee lacking professional background, drew up a plan to overturn
past environmental practices and prohibit any mention of evolution
while allowing sale of religious materials through the Park Service.

On the day the levees burst in New Orleans, Bush delivered a speech
in California comparing the Iraq war to World War II and himself to
Franklin D. Roosevelt: "And he knew that the best way to bring peace
and stability to the region was by bringing freedom to Japan." Bush
had boarded his very own "Streetcar Named Desire."
- - - - - - - - - - - -

About the writer Sidney Blumenthal, a former assistant and senior
advisor to President Clinton and the author of "The Clinton Wars," is
writing a column for Salon and the Guardian of London. Sent from my
Verizon Wireless BlackBerry


Sigh....


A


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:10 PM

'Bush had boarded his very own "Streetcar Named Desire."'

It's enough to make one Blanche.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: CarolC
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:16 PM

One of the things about major snow storms is that they tend to keep people apart. Forced evacuations from flooding tends to throw large numbers of people together, and in this case, without any police presence, and without any food, water, or sanitation facilities, and with dead bodies floating all around. Two entirely different situations, and two entirely different kinds of stressors and group dynamics.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peter T.
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:22 PM

Dearly as I love Sidney Blumenthal, he is being absurd. George Bush has been in office 5 miserable years. Wetland destruction in the region has been going on since probably 1780, if not earlier; and the idea that somehow his neglect of the wetland destruction problem in the region has something to do with his ignorance of science is bizarre. Environmentalists and others have been screaming about this for practically forever. NOBODY CARED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yours,

Peter T.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:23 PM

True. But Canada's federal response was there ASAP.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 05:55 PM

FEMA is part of The Department of Homeland Security.

Among other things, that Department indicated that last year it provided:

"State and Local Preparedness Coordination - Provided more effective coordination with all levels of government so that extensive advance planning, training resulted in faster deployment of resources and manpower. For example, assistance was available and ready to turnaround at a moment's notice amid the disasters wrought by Hurricane Isabel, the wildfires in California, and the worst tornado season in years."

Dept. of Homeland Security

-snip-

Let's repeat that "assistance was available and ready to turnaround at a moment's notice amid the disasters wrought by Hurricane Isabel, the wildfires in California, and the worst tornado season in years."

So why did it take so long for assistance to be available and ready to turnaround in New Orleans????!!!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 06:00 PM

More from the Dept. of Homeland Security website:

"What is the Mission of the New Department of Homeland Security?

The many men and women who daily protect our borders and secure our country are committed to the safety of our homeland. The new Department will help them do their jobs better with increased communication, coordination and resources. Specifically, the new Department of Homeland Security (DHS) will have three primary missions:

Prevent terrorist attacks within the United States,
Reduce America's vulnerability to terrorism, and
Minimize the damage from potential attacks and natural disasters.


In order to accomplish these three goals the new Department will focus on creating the new capabilities discussed in the July 2002 National Strategy for Homeland Security. The Strategy points out that today no one single government agency has homeland security as its primary mission. In fact, responsibilities for homeland security are dispersed among more than 100 different government organizations. America needs a single, unified homeland security structure that will improve protection against today's threats and be flexible enough to help meet the unknown threats of the future.

The new Department of Homeland Security, the most significant transformation of the U.S. government in over a half-century, will transform and realign the current confusing patchwork of government activities into a single department. DHS will give state and local officials one primary contact instead of many, an important advantage when it comes to matters related to training, equipment, planning, exercises and other critical homeland security needs. It will manage federal grant programs for enhancing the preparedness of firefighters, police, and emergency medical personnel. DHS will also set standards for state and local preparedness activities and equipment."

-snip-

So their role is to transform and realign the current confusing patchwork of government activities...and set standards for state and local preparedness????

Does anybody think that FEMA, a part of DHS, did a great job???

Yep, Bush's core followers, but even some of them have jumped ship {excuse the water analogy}.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 06:13 PM

Because some might have missed this comment that speaks to the issue of FEMA's responsibility for managing disaster relief, I'm taking the liberty to re-post an excerpt from a Guest's post on this thread Faith Based Disaster Relief Ta Da!


Subject: RE: BS: Faith Based Disaster Relief! Ta Da!!!
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 12:55 PM

"...The Bush administration's justifications for the National Guard security failure is all spin, no substance. The Coast Guard was operating in the theatre. The local police were. The local fire departments were. The local paramedics and EMTs were. Actually, there had been an EMS convention in New Orleans over the weekend before the storm, and many of the first responders were stranded in New Orleans and set up triage in their hotels. The emergency medical volunteers at the area hospitals, the MASH at the airport, hotels, etc. were working practically round the clock with no relief.

There has been a road open and cleared of debris, allowing passage on the ground, in and out of New Orleans, since early Tuesday morning. Coast Guard, city and state helicopters have been taking off and landing without any problems since last Tuesday. Baton Rouge airport has remained open. Barksdale Air Base in northwestern LA was always functional after the storm. It easily could have become command central for the disaster relief efforts.

Barksdale is located just 18 miles east of the Texas border and 70 miles south of Arkansas--a short drive to any of several large cities. Barksdale AFB is 3 hours from Dallas, TX; 6 hours from New Orleans, La; 5 hours from Houston, TX and 3 hours from Little Rock, Arkansas. The base sits on Interstate 20, and Interstate 49 ends just 8 miles from the base.

It was FEMA's responsibility, under the aegis of the Dept of Homeland Security, to provide local and state emergency responders with the equipment they needed for this disaster. Guess who hasn't gotten their equipment from the feds yet?

The mismanagement blame can't be conveniently shifted to the local and state authorities, just because your boys are sitting there with egg all over their faces, and Bush is made a permanent lame duck because of his administration's ineptitude and incompetence...."

-snip-

Thank you Guest who posted this comment, whoever and wherever you are.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 06:15 PM

The right person for the right job. How it really happens.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 06:21 PM

There are better ways of coping with hurricanes. I just posted this on another thread, but I think it is worth repeating here:

The devastation caused by Hurricane Dennis in Cuba (2005) is estimated to be $1.4 billion US and the death toll has risen to 16. This is much higher than initially expected. Thirteen people died in Granma Province, two in the Province of Santiago de Cuba and one in the province or Sancti Espiritu.

The level of disaster preparedness in Cuba is extremely high and it is thanks to this that even more losses of lifeand property was prevented. In advance of the hurricane local authorities evacuated over 1.5 million people, including thousands of tourists, to safer areas. Of these, 245,106 people were moved to State provided shelters and the rest of the people weathered the storm in the homes of family and friends, 8 million people were at risk. About 475,000 animals were evacuated, 225,000 cows and 170,000 chickens.
(From Oxfam Canada)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:02 PM

"another mayor heard from

From the www.wwltv.com breaking news page:

3:32 P.M. Ben Morris, Slidell mayor: We are still hampered by some of the most stupid, idiotic regulations by FEMA. They have turned away generators, we've heard that they've gone around seizing equipment from our contractors. If they do so, they'd better be armed because I'll be damned if I'm going to let them deprive our citizens. I'm pissed off, and tired of this horse$#@@."

This isn't some Branch Davidian talking about using guns to fend off the feds - it's a mayor of an American city..."

by DBJ on Mon Sep 5th, 2005

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/9/5/174910/2216


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:06 PM

Two more posts from http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/9/5/174910/2216 :


Ben Morris is a Republican too

Just noting that.

"Our country right or wrong. When right, to be kept right; when wrong, to be put right" - Carl Schurz
by RBH on Mon Sep 5th, 2005


****

Jefferson Parish

CNN is reporting that Parish President Broussard wants to rename his jurisdiction to "Jeffersonia" and leave the U.S. because of the country's failure to provide help.

by dirtgirl on Mon Sep 5th, 2005


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:28 PM

Good article from the NY Times.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:31 PM

Remember that story about the police shooting five people in New Orleans yesterday? Well, it turns out they were looters or gang bangers.



"Five dead 'were army workers'

September 05, 2005
At least five people shot dead by police as they walked across a New Orleans bridge yesterday were contractors working for the US Defence department, according to a report by The Associated Press.

A spokesman for the Army Corps of Engineers said the victims were contractors on their way to repair a canal, the new agency said,

quoting a defence Department spokesman.

The contractors crossing the bridge to launch barges into Lake Pontchartrain, in an operation to fix the 17th Street Canal, according to the spokesman.

The shootings took place on the Danziger Bridge, across a canal connecting Lake Pontchartrain to the Mississippi River.

Early on Sunday, Deputy Police Chief W.J. Riley of New Orleans said police shot at eight people, killing five or six.

No other details were immediately available."


http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,16494579%5e12377,00.html

-snip-

How tragic!

I wonder what race these men were.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:35 PM

Sorry A Big Correction to my last post

It turns out they were NOT looters or gang bangers.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: katlaughing
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:40 PM

Azizi, I am confused. According to this report from google news, it was NOT contractors who were killed:

New Orleans -- Police shot and killed at least five people Sunday after gunmen opened fire on a group of contractors traveling across a bridge on their way to make repairs, authorities said.

Deputy Police Chief W.J. Riley said police shot at eight people carrying guns, killing five or six.

Fourteen contractors were traveling across the Danziger Bridge under police escort when they came under fire, said John Hall, a spokesman for the Army Corps of Engineers.

They were on their way to launch barges into Lake Pontchartrain to help plug the breech in the 17th Street Canal, Hall said.

None of the contractors was killed, Hall said.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: freda underhill
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:43 PM

Guest G "must have been a tropical storm..

cyclone tracy

more on cyclone Tracy


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: GUEST,H
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:48 PM

Dom't start confusing him/her with facts.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 07:53 PM

The information about the shooting was from an Australian online newspaper by way of dailykos.

Here are the follow-up comments.

New Orleans Police shoot five (none / 0)

It was reported the New Orleans Police had shot five "insurgents" who opened fire on workers repairing the levees.

It turns out these "insurgents" were Department of Defence contractors:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,16494579%5e12377,00.html



by BradMajors on Mon Sep 5th, 2005 at 15:31:38 PDT



Wrong (none / 0)

Keep up with current events - this was diaried a couple of times yesterday, and the original AP story was wrong, and they've corrected it - the police shot men who were shooting at the contractors. That's been reported on all the networks today. You've got the old, incorrect version of the story.

by geordie on Mon Sep 5th, 2005 at 16:07:17 PDT

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/9/5/174910/2216

-snip-

I can't find the diaries that are referenced in that comment.

Apparently one version of this story was reported by the AP and then picked up by the Australian newspaper and then retracted.

I apologize if I've repeated the incorrect version of this story.


Azizi


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Peace
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 08:03 PM

"No OECD country has suffered a natural disaster on this scale in many years but there is some precedent from Australia. When Cyclone Tracy hit the Northern Territory in 1974, the city of Darwin was, like New Orleans today, virtually destroyed and abandoned for many months. While the number of casualties and people generally affected was lower in the case of Tracy, there are clear parallels.

Most importantly, this example shows there is reason for optimism; within less than a year, Darwin was almost back to its pre-storm population, and the city was substantially rebuilt by 1978. Many of New Orleans' great cultural landmarks are, of course, irreplaceable, but the challenge of reconstruction is, though daunting, not impossible. America's economic vitality will provide the necessary support to rebuild the Gulf Coast."

From here.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Outraged over Bush! (Hurricane Katrina)
From: Big Mick
Date: 05 Sep 05 - 09:22 PM

I think many folks, including my very dear friend Peter T, are missing the point. Bush is not responsible for the ecological damage in New Orleans, other than broadly with his moves to weaken the Environmental Protections. It is not his fault that we have chosen to try and control Mother Nature, and in doing so have built a city on silt and without the annual floods that used to build it up. Hence the silt is packing down and that is why the city is sinking.

The key point has to do with the changes, made in the interest of granting a $600.00 tax cut when you are setting out to make war, done to the structure of FEMA. He moved it from a cabinet level post. In placing it within Homeland Security without proper oversight, the communication and command chain was muddied up. That is why these folks are still arguing as to who is in charge of what. In this action he and his henchman took one of the stellar performers in terms of their mission statement, and turned it into another frickin bureaucratic mess with a bunch of mid level managers arguing about who is in charge of what while folks are dying. For this alone he deserves to be rebuked by the country. Homeland Security was his pride and joy, his shining example of private industry management tactics making government more efficient. And they failed miserably. And folks died.

Mick


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
Next Page

  Share Thread:
More...


You must be a member to post in non-music threads. Join here.


You must be a member to post in non-music threads. Join here.



Mudcat time: 19 May 3:22 AM EDT

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 2022 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.