BS: Alito brings real balance

Subject: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: DougR
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 01:22 AM

At last the Conservative movement in the U. S. is coming to real fruition. Sam Alito will be confirmed as an Associate member of the U. S. Supreme Court and balance, at long last, will be brought to the court.

The Democrats on the Senate Judicial Committee were made laughingstock by the nominee and Judge Alito will likely be confirmed with bi-partisan support.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: kendall
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 08:49 AM

Doug, I've been watching the hearings and I have seen no laughter.
This man may be a brilliant lawyer, but we must remember that he was not Bush's first choice. What was her name? the lawyer who was never a judge, who thinks Bush is the most intelliget man she ever knew.

Alito is a right wing idiolog who will help the right wingers drag us back to the dark ages. He will work to overturn Roe v Wade and we will be stuck with this man for many years to come.
I had no problem with Roberts, he was honest and straightforward, but this guy...how many questions did he actually answer?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 08:57 AM

Hey, IO don't have much respect fir a guy who once bragged about being a member to a conservative organization that had at it's core racist and sexist values and now syas he can't remember having been a member or putting it on a resume'...

Hey, I might have spent the 60's stoned but I remember evry organization I was affiliated with going back to the 1st, SIR, Students of Individual Rights, in 1965...

Alito is lieing thru his teeth and is nuthing more and another corporatist who will rule in favor of the monied class over the working man, just as Uncle Tom does...

If yer a rich white guy you gotta be licking yer chops at the thought of Alito on the bench... You can forget any 5-4 votes... it will 6-3 in the future...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Alba
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 10:02 AM

Yeah right...real Balance!!!
As long as your not
1. A Woman
2. A minority
3. Anything other than a Republican.
Alito is about as good a real Balancing act in the Supreme Court as putting Minnie Mouse on one side of a scale and Dumbo on the other.
Wake up and smell the Neo Con take over Doug!!! Or wait aminute... you have and you seem to like it..oh dear.
Jude

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 10:03 AM

Actually, Kendall, there has been some laughter...Mrs. Alito has smirked and laughed outright several times throughout the hearings. At one point they changed the camera angle so she could not be seen; I am sure the GOP decided it wasn't efficacious to their cause to have her shifty-eyed smirks taking attention off of her husband. Of course the press only reported on her tears.

I have emailed my Congresspeople urging them to not vote for him. I don't trust him and he has not answered in a clear matter except, maybe, when it comes down to the pure law of being an appellate judge. He will not be the moderate O'Connor has been and we need to keep THAT balance, more than ever.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,Larry K
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 10:12 AM

According to Alba, republicans never appoint woman or minority's. Now lets take our head out of our ass and look at reality.

Current Secretary of State- Condalisa   (woman and minority)
Former Secretary of State-   Colin   (another minority0
(for those of you keeping score, Bush 2 African American Secretary of States, all the demoncrats in history of the USA 0)

Current Supreme Court Judge- Clarence   (another minority)
Current African American Supreme court judges appointed by any democrats- 0
Number of African Americans hired by DMC leader Howard Dean while he was governor of Vermont - 0
Number of African Americans hired by Al Franken - 1
Current Attorney General- Alberto   (hispanic)
Number of African American mistresses by Bill Clinton - Unknown

As you can see republicans never ever appoint black or hispanics to any position of prominance.

Sorry to let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Alba
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 10:17 AM

Eh Larry.
You obviously missed my point! It is NOT about job appointments here.....the implications of an Alito appointment go WAY beyond that.
Sorry to let details get in the way of your Goggle cut and paste skills.
Jude

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 10:24 AM

To refute the above selective cut and paste:

NBC News quantified the dramatic increase in minority cabinet and court appointments under Clinton in December 2000:

    Where his predecessor, George [H.W.] Bush, could find only one qualified woman, one African-American and two Hispanics for his Cabinet, Clinton nominated three black men, a black woman and two Hispanic men to join nine white Cabinet nominees -- three of them women. George W. Bush's push for diversity in his own Cabinet this year [2000] can be seen as an affirmation of Clinton's work on that front. ... In [former President Ronald] Reagan and [George H.W.] Bush's 12 years in office, of the 545 federal judicial appointments, 65 were women, 22 Hispanic, two Asian American and 17 African American. In Clinton's eight years, of 366 federal judicial appointments, 104 were women, 23 Hispanic, five Asian American, one American Indian, and 61 African American.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 10:31 AM

like Udall said on day 2

"Everything has been said regarding Sam Alito, its just that not everyone has yet said it"

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 10:56 AM

"Conservative" my sweet arse.

The word is "radical".

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 11:02 AM

Sam ALito is very presentable and smooth, he doesn't rattle, he dodges efforts to make him commit before the fact to judgements he has yet to make.

But, I have to say that I do not find him especially trustworthy. He's quite facile.

His wife smiled when he handled things well, and burst into tears when things looked rough. So what? She's not on the stand in these hearings, nor should be.

But, on the whole, I find him a bit too glib to be trusted as a judge of actual wisdom.

I would be delighted to be wrong about that.

However, it is pretty much amoot point; I think he will be confirmed.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,Whistle Stop
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 01:59 PM

Anyone who expects to gain any real insight from these hearings is deluding himself. The confirmation process has become an elaborate dance, whereby the nominee's supporters praise him and toss him softball questions, and his opponents try to find ways to trip him up. For both sides, it's about playing to the cameras, reinforcing their base, and asking trick questions in the hopes that the nominee will momentarily drop his guard and give them substantive answers We hear things like "What are your views on stare decesis (the doctrine that holds that precedents should be accorded a certain amount of deference?" or "Do you consider Roe v. Wade to be "settled law"?, and we get the answers any halfway intelligent person would give when he knows that he is in the hot seat.   None of this provides the Senate with information that wil be helpful to them in evaluating the nominee's qualifications, judgment, or temperament.

Alito is a conservative, nominated by a conservative President, and therefore I expect that I would prefer someone else. But he is qualified (unlike Miers), intelligent, and dignified. He will be confirmed, and everyone involved in this process knows it. Still, they play the game, and we play along.

While I tend to the liberal side of things, I think it's ludicrous when the opposition is asking Alito about what student organizations he joined in college. I find it equally ridiculous when the nominee wastes time talking about how much he liked to play baseball as a child. Come on! Either they should have a substantive, candid discussion, with meaningful questions followed by meaningful answers, or they should dispense with this nonsense and cast their votes.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: michaelr
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 02:05 PM

I kept expecting him to ask the committee "Would you like some syrup with that waffle?"

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: DougR
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 04:29 PM

Gee! I must be in the minority here. Surprise!

Bobert: your remarks regarding Alito's affiliation with the student group at Princeton is a bit hypocrital isn't it? After all, who is the greatest admirer on the Mudcat of Senator Byrd, former member and high potentate of the Klu Klux Clan in West Virginia? Why it's yourself, isn't it? Anyway, no one has turned up any nefarious activities Alito was involved in with the Princeton club have they? The exalted New York Times tried, but couldn't find anything.

We got a new Marshall in Dodge folks, better get use to it.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,G
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 04:32 PM

Some cute comments - allow me to say "Welcome, Judge Alito."

Also, Whistle Stop sums up the process very well. While I do welcome the new Judge to the Supreme Court, our system is beyond flawed and most in the House and the Senate have forgotten the real reason for being there. If anyone thought there was something substantial in the hearings, go back and reread Whistle Stops' post.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 04:40 PM

Appointing judges on the basis of their political views is surely a mark of a society with a somewhat marked democracy deficit. Regardless of which political extreme is involved.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Claymore
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 04:41 PM

Actually his stand on "stare decisis" is the one most people should look at, and that would tend to mitigate his preferences on abortion. While I am mostly Republican (though I have on many occasions voted for qualified Democrats) I strongly support a womans right to choose. And after following his comments, I believe that unless the heavy burden of precedent can be moved in his mind, I don't believe he will vote to overturn Roe. What I'm not certain every one understands is that even if Roe was overturned, the next day every State in the Union could create their own pro-choice laws with no recourse to the Supremes. This was always the case, but the Dems don't want you to know that.

In any case I thought the hearings were far more civil than I expected, though I believe Mrs. Alitos tears brought back some of that level of civility.

And to see Kennedy speak on any matter regarding morality or the plight of women without a thunder-bolt striking him in mid-bloviation, does cast a shadow on the existence of God...

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: kendall
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 05:34 PM

Doug, Senator Byrd was a member of the Klan 70 years ago. He NEVER put it down as something to be proud of on a resume', and he was never considered for the Supreme Court. Let's get some perspective here.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 06:02 PM

Gee, Doug....if by 'balance', you mean having a court that is gonna weigh every option before they vote for more restriction on freedom, then I guess you're right.

I can't say Alito is not a decent, honest man who thinks he always tries to be fair & reasonable...but so many of his answers indicate that he is likely to just vote 97% conservative, and then say, "I DID keep an open mind and consider each case on its merits"

Such a strange attitude the conservatives take, to look at questions that ought to be matters of personal choice(yes, like abortion), and say "MY choice will do for everyone."

If a liberal court prevails, no conservative would be forced to HAVE an abortion....I simply do not comprehend how a mind can work to decide that "everyone must ACT the way I wish, no matter what you believe."

we shall see, hmmm...it sure does look like he will be confirmed. Lets re-open this thread in a year.......

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 06:08 PM

Maybe now people won't have theri land taken away from them for commercial development.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 06:19 PM

Did the Supreme Court do that?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 06:56 PM

Doug,

Senator Byrd, at age 88 years old, doersn't say he doesn't remember being 20 years old... Alito does... Heckm he can remember court cases from over a hundred years ago that he wasn't involved with but can't remember his own college days???

If this ain't purgery than what is???

Hey, Clinton was impeached for the same thing... And now we're getting ready to appoint this liar to a life time job???

Give me a break...

But, like Amos said, Alito will get appointed... And the wash=kneeed Dems will vote for him becuase they don't wnat to look "rude" 'er nuthin'...

But this is a bad choice for the avergae American and great choice for Boss Hog...

Now the Supreme Cour will be undeiably under Boss Hog's thumb...

Just watch the rulings flow outta this court that favor Boss Hog... It will get to the point where the doctor can take off the wrong leg and get a friggin' medal for it...

Mark my words... This guy will not side with working class America even 1% of the time...

Screw abortion... It's just a smoke screen non issue... This is all about money!!!

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 07:00 PM

The Guardian ran an article that made it clear the man is and always has been a fascist idealogue. In a civilised country he should not be allowed to judge a school three-legged race.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 07:02 PM

Claymore, I wish I had your optimism about every State in the Union enacting their own pro-choice laws the day after if the Supremes strike it down. There are many States which are chomping at the bit to go back to the old days when women died from back-alley abortions.

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 07:25 PM

kat -

There actually are several states "chomping at the bit" to repeal the amendment giving women the right to vote. One Kansas Legislator (female, in fact) has publicly stated, in effect, that it should be done, and the same bigots who manipulated the vote on the gay marriage amendment are fully capable of getting it passed here, should an opportunity arise.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 07:33 PM

Wealthy, white women didn't, Kat... They took their "little vacations"... Lotta folks don't remember those days ot have just repressed the realities that Roe v. Wade just ended "limited access" to the white and the wealthy...

But I'm less concerned about Roe v. Wade in that I don't think that Alito will strike it down, though therer is no assurance...

But, when it comes to killing off the New Deal, the Great Society and an 80 year old "social contract" betrween Boss Hog and the working class, he's Boss Hog's man...

Just another nail in the coffin of the middle class...

In Justice Alito's world it will be "I'm rich, screw you!!!"

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 07:37 PM

It sure would be fun to go back to the days when a few states tolerated abortion while their neighbors sanctimoniously banned it. Lots of sneaking across state lines, and moralistic vigilantes watching borders and and clinic anywhere near the state line.

Heck, I KNEW a chiropractor in Kansas who supplemented his slumlord enterprise with coathangers back before Roe. (and it wasn't much easier on doctors in Kansas after Roe!)

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 07:52 PM

Don't you remember the "mexican vactions", Bill??? The over-the-state-line just wouldn't do for the priveldged class... No, it was Mexico for a little sun-clip-n'-fun...

B...

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 08:55 PM

Bobert who is not a liar in your opinion? The list is probably a lot shorter.

My 12 year old grandson doesn't say he doesn't remember being 20 years old either so that is even more proof that Alito belongs on your lair hate list.


"Justices Affirm Property Seizures
5-4 Ruling Backs Forced Sales for Private Development
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/23/AR2005062300783.html
By Charles Lane
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, June 24, 2005; Page A01

The Supreme Court ruled yesterday that local governments may force property owners to sell out and make way for private economic development when officials decide it would benefit the public, even if the property is not blighted and the new project's success is not guaranteed..."

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 08:55 PM

DougR, I was going to start a thread like this once it was official, but cool, he's as good as in.

The nominations of Roberts and Alito bring a strong ray of hope to the supreme court and to this country in terms of educated, respectable men being on it.

The Democrats can not rant about anything that isn't a lie about Alito and yes, Kennedy, Feinstein, Bidon, and Durbin were made to look foolish as they cavorted in the name of the Democratic Party. They not only looked foolish, they really were.

You knew there would be howling and moaning, DougR! Thanks for starting this post.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 09:13 PM

Well, gee, Old-Guy, you say that Alito will be a good Supreme because yer 12 year olf grandson doesn't remember being 20???

Well, yer logic is typical Bushite logic...

And I agree with Martin when it comes to Democrats... They are supreme losers and they know it... And fools, too...

They should have blasted Alito and taken it to the wall with guns blazin'... Instead, they came out as Bush-Lite, which they ain't even are... They are a lost party with no rudder and I hope it stays that way....No, I hope they loose the main sail and the jib....

This is the only way they are ever going to be an oppostion party... Right now they are just irritants, like a bunch of gnats...

Hey, they dug the hole and now it's their to lay in...

But still don't cjange the fact that ASlito is the final piece of the puzzle as Boss Hog will finish off the New deal and the Great Society, or die tyrying....

My thoughts are that Boss Hog doesn't have a clue that when he crosses Southern Man he ain't gonna be able to reel him back in and wheh the Southern Startegy cracks, there will be Hell to pay...

So, in a way, I'm glad that Alito will be confirmed... Just moves up the timetable for whan Boss Hog is going to say, "opps..."

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: kendall
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 11:05 PM

Thomas, Scalia, and now, Alito. My God, what a crew!

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: kendall
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 11:06 PM

Perfect for a friggin' Pirate ship!

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 11:19 PM

Exactly, Capt'n.... And seems like America needs a good dose of 'um before it wakes up....

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Ron Davies
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 11:27 PM

It seems to all hinge on Stare Decisis. But Alito is a classic pig in a poke. However, remember who pushed David Souter--and how he turned out. People can change once on the Court. But, as I think I pointed out at the time, it never was very likely the Democrats could stop Alito. The time to have done that was November 2004.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 14 Jan 06 - 12:33 AM

From U.S. Senator Barbara Boxer on the Nomination of Judge Samuel Alito

Washington, DC – U.S. Senator Barbara Boxer (D-CA) today made the following statement on the nomination of Judge Samuel Alito to the Supreme Court:

"At the end of the Alito hearings, I am deeply disturbed about this nomination. It is not Judge Alito's qualifications that concern me; clearly he is intelligent and capable. Rather, in three days of questioning, he refused to back away from some of his most controversial past statements and positions.

"When asked repeatedly about a 1985 memo in which he wrote that the Constitution does not protect the right of a women to choose, Judge Alito would not disavow that statement, and he refused to concede that Roe v. Wade is settled law. I believe these ominous statements clearly signal a hostility to women's rights, and I worry that we will go back to the very dark days when abortion was illegal in many states.

"Judge Alito's support for a more powerful executive branch is also troubling. In the past, he has endorsed the controversial theory of the 'unitary executive,' which would give the President broad powers not subject to control by Congress. In the hearings, Judge Alito would not even rule out the President invading another country, in the absence of imminent threat, without first getting congressional authorization.

"Another area that disturbs me is Judge Alito's continued narrow reading of Congress's authority under the Constitution to make laws that protect families. He continued to defend his opinion in the Rybar case that Congress couldn't ban machine guns, even though the Supreme Court ultimately said he was wrong, and he refused to back away from an opinion that narrowed the Family and Medical Leave Act.

"In addition to these serious substantive concerns, I remain unconvinced by Judge Alito's answers to questions about his membership in the Concerned Alumni of Princeton club, an extremist group that was hostile to the inclusion of women and minorities at the University. And I am still amazed that Judge Alito did not recuse himself from the Vanguard case."

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Jan 06 - 01:15 AM

Judge Alito's support for a more powerful executive branch is also troubling. In the past, he has endorsed the controversial theory of the 'unitary executive,' which would give the President broad powers not subject to control by Congress.

Like I said... he's no conservative. He's a big government guy who wants to further centralize government by increasing the powers of the executive branch. These are not conservative principles.

And I bet he won't have any problem whatever with the idea of taking people's property away for the benefit of commercial interests (unless it's the property of his rich and powerful cronies and benefactors).

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Mark Cohen
Date: 14 Jan 06 - 01:47 AM

I was fairly impressed by him, until the seemingly minor matter of Concerned Alumni of Princeton came up.

I was a year behind Sam Alito at Princeton, and I remember him very well. Now, Sam Alito is a very bright guy--a lot brighter than I am. If he remembered enough about CAP to believe his membership in it would score points for him with the Reagan administration, it is inconceivable that he would have "no specific memory" of the organization now, when I remember it quite well, and I wasn't even a member. He remembers all those hundreds of legal decisions, and he can't remember an organization he put on his resume 13 years after graduation? He's lying, folks.

Not that that's surprising, of course. Just sad.

Aloha,
Mark

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: .Woody
Date: 14 Jan 06 - 10:08 PM

Maybe I put my foot in it but you said
Senator Byrd, at age 88 years old, doersn't say he doesn't remember being 20 years old..Alito does.

I took you to mean that alito was worthy of being on your hate list decause he didn't say wht Byrd said. My grandson didnt say it either so is that a reason?

Maybe your statement had another meaning. But anyway why are you so full of hate?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,michaelr
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:10 AM

Woody, it's not hate. It is a very, very deep and urgent concern about what is happening to this country. The neocons have finally, after 30 or 40 years of working on it, managed to hijack this great republic and are in the process of reshaping it for the benefit of the powerful few.

Thereby completely perverting what it set out to be: of the people, by the people and for the people.

And the American people, due to their apathy and gullibility, are letting them destroy our democracy before our very eyes.

This isn't creping fascism anymore. It's galloping, folks.

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:17 AM

That last set of hearings was a ridiculous joke.

That stupid bitch crying. Puh-leeze! The guy is a judge, he makes tons of money. He's being nominated for the supreme court. Even if he doesn't make it, what the hell does she have to be crying about???

She's rich. She'll never work to work in her life. Her husband goes through what EVERY SINGLE SCOTUS nominee goes through. And she's she's crying because the dems are being so mean. Boo-hoo!

And the pubs are playing up on it as though they themselves welcome with open arms any nominee put forth by a dem president instead acting like a pack of rabid bloodhounds. They plaster her ugly weepy face on the news and say, "Look what those terrible dems did to this poor woman."

Well, excuse me, if I have absolutely no sympathy for a weepy rich bitch who shouldn't even be sitting there to begin with. Just go out and buy a few diamonds and some hot real estate, honey, you'll be grinning before you know it.

With that said, Alito won't make a bit of difference about anything--just like every other SCOTUS judge before him. SCOTUS is about as useful as a one-legged tap-dancer. The important decisions always come from lower courts and those decisions are never even heard by SCOTUS.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 01:00 PM

Bobert:

Maybe our real differences come from the fact that I did not spend the 60's stoned. I had my own TV repair shop back when you could still repair TVs and I remeber sitting at the bench when news of the assasination of JFK came over the set I was working on.

That sort of made me sit up and take notice of the status of things in the world. Every comparison I make seems to go back to that time.

From every measure I can think of I see that everybody is better off now than we were then. America seems to bumble along while people make dire predictions about crap.

If another country gets ahead of the US it will be because of creeping socialisim.

I am sitting here listening to my 7 year old grand daughter learning to play the piano and sing the theme from Alladin. My major fear is that a terrorist group will strike the US again with something like a dirty bomb. I wish NSA had a person monitoring every phone in the us in order to prevent another terrorist attack. I have nothing to hide and even if I were arrested by accident I would realize that such things happen. Nobody can be perfect.

When I hear people calling GWB a facist because some overseas phone calls are tapped (which has been done repeatedly for far less reason) I can only think they are risking everyone's safety because of their own narrow minded idea of freedom that they are trying to force on everybody. I do not feel like I am giving up any freedoms by letting the government do it's job as good as it can under the circumstances.

Is your quality of life going downhill or uphill?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 01:27 PM

Mine keeps going up. Why? Because maybe I am working harder.

You are so right, Old Guy. We have it great in America for those who want to work for it.

Personally, I would be a liar if I didn't say I am glad that the last two judges elected are middle age educated and common sense white men.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 02:01 PM

Truth be told, the quality of my life is pretty good. In respect of possessions, comforts, good friends and beloved relations.

But I am not so short-sighted as to think that my own comfort is the measure of my nation. And in that regard, the quality of my life is declining. I once took intense pride in the core precepts of individual freedom, of checks and balances under a rule of law, and in the fundamental decency of Americans all over the country.

Bush's imperialism has revealed a nation where the law is a mere convenience, the Constitution a piece of paper, where ditto-headism is the highest virtue, and where freedom to speak and assemble is curtailed. The openness of citizens to dialogue has given way in many places to rabid partisanship, name-calling, and blind lashings of the sort which Old Guy has posted in the past. Most important, we have become a nation that is willing to start wars and invade other countries. I don't think we have ever had so pusillanimous a Congress nor so aggressive and fascistic an executive branch before.

So although I am doing okay, my optimism is a bit less sunny than Martin's; I think there is some writing on the wall that we need to pay attention to.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 04:19 PM

Personally, I don't know how anyone can consider him or herself a patriot, and say that the people of this country are better off than they were before when our veterans and service men and women keep getting the sevices provided to them cut and large numbers of them are experiencing crushing deprivation.

But as long as you and yours get what you want, why should you worry?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 04:47 PM

Which is it??

Is Alito to the right or left of Tito ????????

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 04:53 PM

DougR's idea of "real balance" is about as honest as Fox's "fair and balanced" news.

What is so balanced about putting another wealthy, inbred, Yalebird law, white Catholic male on a Supreme Court which includes:

1 person of color
1 woman
4 Catholics (Alito will be the 5th)

???

Balance? Not even a little.

But then, I opposed Roberts for the same reason. The Supreme Court should reflect the US population, as should the US Congress and the Executive branch. Fat chance of that ever happening again before our nation goes down the tubes.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 05:04 PM

Mainly, Alito has done a smooth job with the questions.
Regarding CAP, his claim not to remember the group though attempting to score points by listing it on his job application is a plain case of his having been advised that, like Reagan's convenient memory lapses, this is the best tactic to avoid nasty explanations and wicked sound bites. Whether you agree with his record or not, Alito is clearly an intelligent man. There are only two possibilities here ; a) he really doesn't remember, which reveals a significant flaw in his mental capacity, which should rule him out of the position of Supreme Court Justice or b) he's lying, which should rule him out of the position of Supreme Court Justice. His positions on abortion, dominance of the executive branch, etc are all secondary to this fact.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Greg F.
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 07:01 PM

Now here's a thread title that only George Orwell could love.

As for Douggie-Boy, Landmine & Old Fart, they, as usual, seem to think this is some sort of football match.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 08:28 PM

Amos:

When did this willingness to start wars and invade other countrys begin?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 08:48 PM

>>>My major fear is that a terrorist group will strike the US again with something like a dirty bomb.<<<

So your solution is to turn Iraq into a terrorist breeding and training ground? Sounds like job security to me. Tell your granddaughter she has far more to fear from you than from terrorists--the adult version of the bogey man.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 09:08 PM

AR282:

You shure make short work of a long and thoughtful post with snide sarcasm. I suppose that is you cure for the world, rip everybody to shreds and let God sort them out.

Can I tell you what to tell your grand daughter about you? Even If I had your permission I would not because it would be improper to do so.

Have you got any long and thoughtful posts that might contribute anything but negativisim and sarcasm?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 09:13 PM

>>You shure make short work of a long and thoughtful post with snide sarcasm.<<

You have the thoughtfulness of a toilet seat.

>>I suppose that is you cure for the world, rip everybody to shreds and let God sort them out.<<

Seems to be yours.

>>Can I tell you what to tell your grand daughter about you?<<

I don't know, can you?

>>Even If I had your permission I would not because it would be improper to do so.<<

If it's permission you want then you ask, "May I tell your granddaughter about you?" "Can I..." is asking me if you have the ability and hence my response.

>>Have you got any long and thoughtful posts that might contribute anything but negativisim and sarcasm?<<

For you? No.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 09:20 PM

It is pretty alarming when the main reason for appointing a judge is that he is a rabid anti-liberal idealogue, in a country where "liberal" is a term of abuse. In most of the world "liberal" is a term of praise. This brings WWIII a bit, maybe not a little bit, closer.

In the words of Dave Allen, "Goodnight, and may your God do with you".

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 09:37 PM

Yo, OLd Guy,

Yeah, I mighta been stoned in the 60's but I don't mean I weren't there...

The 1960 campaign was the first I had ever worked... I was 14 years old and my mom was involved with the Kennedy campaign so I knocked on a lot of doors...

In '65 I was an organizer of the first progressive student organization at Richmond Professional Institute (now Virginia Commonwealth University) and over the next 5 years when I got my Bachelor's degree from VCU, I was involved in not only anit-war organizing, but also managed to work for 1 year in the local CAP program as well as working for Bobby Kennedy in the '68 campaign as a paid orgainizer...

So lets not get "getting stoned" meaning "dropped out"... One thing about me is that I have always been involved with community oraganizing and alsways been in the game... Still am... I'm what they call an "activist"... Heck, I've allready given references to newpapers articles that have been written recently about what I'm into now but its the same old me... Trying to make my community better....

But this ain't got much to do with Alito...

All I can say, and I hope I'm wrong, is that I fear this guy is going to be jsut another corporate puppet on a court that is packed with folks who think the corporation is GOD... Yeah, that scares the heck outta me... The corporations allready have a stranglehold over our lives....

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 09:40 PM

So what is your point AR282 other than to try to goad me into trading insults?

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 10:16 PM

That's never taken much; and to answer your question, the policy of invasion and starting wars begins in crooked minds and greedy black little souls. Present company included.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 10:46 PM

Amos and bobert,

al quaida needs your addresses so they can send you a thank you card and gifts of appreciation.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 10:54 PM

No, Martin, they need yers... They just love the Bush true believers... Been good for recruitment... Yeah, Bush might be having trouble with his recruitment efforts here at home but with your continued efforts, Martin, Osoma ain't havin' any problems...

Osoma says "Keep it up, Marty"...

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:00 PM

No he doesn't. Osama would kill me on the spot as a Jew.

Shows what you know, pal. He likes your non-support of America's leaders. They are not perfect, but the majority elected them.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:05 PM

No, Marty, Osoma is perfectly willing to let yer one little flaw be over-looked as long as yer playing the good pawn in Bush's game...

"Keep up the good work, Marty", Osoma would say...

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:09 PM

Of course you know what he would say. You guys are on the same wavelength about America and hatred of George Bush.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:16 PM

Ain't got nuthin' to do with what I feel but what you do... I'm not in Osama's equation... You are... And he says, "Keep up the good work, Marty..."

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:29 PM

Marty, you're doing one heckuva job. Jus' like ole Brownie. Making a flaming ass of your own self while posing and shooting off at the old mouth. Keep up the good work. Fact of the matter is your bogey Osama, word on the street says, is so near dead it makes little difference.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 15 Jan 06 - 11:39 PM

Bobert, your brown eye is doing a fine job.
Thank you Amos.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 16 Jan 06 - 12:22 AM

Sure thing, AR. Anytime you want the record straightened out.

A.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 16 Jan 06 - 06:35 PM

>>Bobert, your brown eye is doing a fine job.
Thank you Amos.

Sure thing, AR. Anytime you want the record straightened out.<<

That wasn't me. Old Guy/Martin Gibson likes to use my moniker to insult Bobert thinking he can start a big war between us.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 16 Jan 06 - 06:53 PM

AR:

I kinda figgered it was one of those slime-scum doing their hijinks. No hard feelings.

Some people really know how to pervert communication, huh?

A

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 16 Jan 06 - 10:57 PM

Hey, it's entertainment! It's all good!

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 01:47 PM

Why worry about abortion rights? There is always Roto Rooter.

Call Roto-Rooter, that's the name
And away go troubles down the drain

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 03:02 PM

Ted Kennedy like Amos does not know the difference between political satire and the truth:
Alumni Group Membership at Issue
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/11/AR2006011102148.html
Washington Post, United States - Jan 11, 2006
... Kennedy read aloud a number of passages from the group's magazine, Prospect ... One 1983 article, titled "In Defense of Elitism," began: "People nowadays just don't ...

The 1983 essay "In Defense of Elitism" by Harry Crocker III included this line, read dramatically by Kennedy: "People nowadays just don't seem to know their place. Everywhere one turns blacks and hispanics are demanding jobs simply because they're black and hispanic..."

The essay may not have been funny, D'Souza acknowledges, but Kennedy read from it as if it had been serious instead of an attempt at humor.

"I think left-wing groups have been feeding Senator Kennedy snippets and he has been mindlessly reciting them," D'Souza said. "It was a satire."

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 03:12 PM

Amos, bober, and Osama

A great team out to destroy america.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 04:42 PM

Martin -- A great team of multiple personalities out to recover their collective sanity.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 05:10 PM

I know it's a hard concept to grasp but

You can believe America needs to be strong defensively while still condemning George Bush's bumbling strategy in Iraq.

You can believe that America should pursue Bin Laden, Zawahiri and their ilk mercilessly, while still believing that unauthorized wiretaps and torture are wrong.

You can believe that Social Security needs to be fixed while still believing that Bush's plan is bogus.

You can believe that Congress is still the best political construction for representation of the people, while still stating that Tom Delay and Jack Abramoff and the rest of the Republican corruption mafia are thieves.

You can believe in God and still think He shouldn't have a throne in Washington.

You can believe unnecessary taxation is wrong, while still seeing that tax cuts for the wealthy coupled with unprecedented and out of control federal expenditures are driving us us deeper into a debt that we owe to foreign countries that our children will likely inherit.

In short, you can be a loyal American and be disgusted by what Bush and his cohorts are doing to the country.

It may even be your duty.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 05:41 PM

Or you can be a socialist and side with the Democratice Party to try to undermine everything to regain power.

It may even be your agenda.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 06:25 PM

That's true, Martin. But that only accounts for a fraction of people who disapprove of the job George Bush is doing. Unless you think all of the 60% of people who disapprove are socialists. I doubt that. A lot are probably hard-working capitalist taxpayers like myself. Get a competent and intelligent middle-of-the-road Republican like John McCain to run, and I may even vote Republican. But with the born-again reactionary element currently dominating the party, I doubt it will happen.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 10:56 AM

Hear, Hear, EJ!

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Amos
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 12:00 PM

LEJ, you got it taped in one. Well said.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 12:19 PM

... middle-of-the-road Republican like John McCain...

Middle of the road? Not quite. More like a Trojan horse in Dems clothing...

Ya need to do a bit more research; good starting point is
HERE

Yeah, yeah, I know, that Commie-Liberal, Tear-America-Down, Freedom-Hating Traitor publication" blah blah blah. However, the article concisely raised some disturbing points that can easily be verified elesewhere with a little further research- all public record stuff.

Have at it.

Best,

Greg

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 01:08 PM

Right Greg. And Pat Robertson sees George Bush as too liberal for his taste, too. Really, it's a matter of perspective. The Republican Party has drifted so far to the Right that the Middle looks like the Left. Fortunately, the rest of the country is on a more even keel, and ripe for a course correction.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 01:35 PM

Bobert:

If you were a Kennedy fan, I am sort of a Kennedy fan to, What do you think if the Secret war in Laos? Americans were not in combat untill he sent them in. The American people and Congress were not told about it and in his SOU he said he would keep the American People and Congress informed of his actions?

If Kennedy was justified in doing that why is GWB not justified other than the fact that you have a grudge against him?

There is no comprehensive information about this war on the net. It is scattered here and there and you have to look real hard to stirn bits and peices together. There is a History Chanel program that sums it up pretty good but it does not come up often.

You see I do not follow party lines. I never have which gives me a wider vision, the big picture instead of your narrow minded hatefull, opinionated concept of the world.

You see Kennedy was a leader. He did not mind going against popular opinion to do what he thought was right. He was not an ass kisser like Clinton or a crook like Nixon. I think he was justifed in doing what he did and before you judge GWB, put your hatred and bile on hold for a while compare his actions to Kennedy.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 07:02 PM

Or, compare his actions to those of Caligula, why don't we? Because those situations are not remotely similar, either, and comparisons are pointless, tho possibly entertaining. Kinda like discussing "What If" Picketts charge had succeeded......

Then we can get back to the real world & discussing The BuShites and CURRENT events.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: CarolC
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 07:26 PM

Kennedy was wrong, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 07:30 PM

Ancient Greek rhetoricians admired -- and feared -- powerful speakers who had the gift of emotional appeal and exhortation. My worn copy of "A Handlist of Rhetorical Terms" lists over 50 types of emotional appeals. From "amphidiorthosis" ("to hedge or qualify" a dangerous or bold position ) to "threnos" (a lament), thoughtful minds in the fourth century B.C. had analyzed every plea, supplication, ploy and gambit.

Yet there's strong evidence a healthy democracy requires rhetorical showmanship and convincing verbal drama. (Hesoid argued that effective justice also requires it, since a ruling judge must persuade aggrieved parties justice has been served and not partisan interest.)

The vernacular of government -- the wonk words, tech jargon, statistics, weasel-ese, endless qualifiers -- is a calculated patois of obscurity, deniability and sleep-inducing lethargy. The wily bureaucrat loves sleep, and this love goes well beyond his post-lunch nap. Boring bureaucratese, with paragraphs of passive verbs, helps keep the public snoozing.

Democracy, however, demands transparency, responsibility and energy. The Marines argue our common defense requires a few good men. A few good verbs and metaphors won't ensure good government, but debate and discussion energized by grand language further that goal.

However, hot rhetoric untethered by fact or untempered by reflection undermines debate.

Fortunately, these hot words often burn the unfettered and ill-tempered tongue that utters them.

Take the Rev. Pat Robertson as a recent example of "failure to reflect." When Robertson said that Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's tragic stroke might be a divine rebuke for "dividing God's land," a wave of deserved scorn and ridicule swamped the silly man. The White House and The New York Times blasted Robertson, a right-left political condemnation of a right-wing ayatollah.

Idiocy isn't illegal, nor is lying -- at least, not if one lies in U.S. Senate hearings. Ted Kennedy provides the recent example of hot, emotion-stoking rhetoric untethered by truth.

On opening day of Judge Samuel Alito's Supreme Court confirmation hearings, Kennedy opened up with a faith-based fire Robertson might envy: "Judge Alito has not written one single opinion on the merits in favor of a person of color alleging racial discrimination on the job. In 15 years, not one."

Kennedy's statement is completely false. Alito found for plantiffs alleging racial discrimination on the job in several cases (for example, Zubi v. AT&T Corp. and Goosby v. Johnson & Johnson Medical).

Kennedy, possibly because of his status as a left-wing political ayatollah, has avoided Robertson's mass condemnation. His snake dance and sanctimony is as poisonous as the Rev. Robertson's, however, and perhaps more venomous, since his fib slanders Judge Alito.

Kennedy hasn't quite escaped. Duke University Law Professor Erwin Chemerinsky, a left-wing legal scholar, begrudgingly admitted on Hugh Hewitt's radio program that Kennedy "was wrong. I'm not denying that."

Good for you, professor -- best not deny hard judicial fact.

Defenders of Robertson and Kennedy -- and who knows, there may be two or three out there -- could argue that both are "merely playing to their political base" by "pushing hot buttons" and "tossing red meat." Here's my lamentation: In contemporary politics, it seems flame raises more money than fact, and thus fund raising trumps truth, decency and common sense. Tactical politics dovetails with practical finances. The hot words are supposed "to drive the news day" and "hit the news cycle," feeding a "news machine" that thrives on sound-bites and glories in "gotcha."

Robertson was burned for his flame, and Kennedy should be. The likely burn in Kennedy's case is Alito's confirmation.


Copied from article by Austin Bay

Yours, Aye. Dave

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 08:05 PM

Long time ago, Old Guy...

You can't apply today'e realities to stuff that happened over 3 decades ago.... They don't interface...

Looking back, I also wasn't too happy with JFK's decision to the build up of US forces in South Vietnem or the assasination of Presdident Diem... Those decisions were dumb...

Bobby Kennedy??? Different Kennedy... I was working in his campaign when he was assasinated...

But back to Alito... Looks like he's gonna be a 61-39'er or maybe a little better...

I think alot of Dems are seeing him as another Clarence Thomas who will side with the corporation and Christain Right 99.9% of the time...

Waht will this make??? 8 of the 9 Supremes nominated by Repubs... Shame on the Dems fir not being an opposition party... They have lost alot of elections because they were way too afraid of being labeled "liberals"... Oh, how scarey... Hey, the liberals ain't responsible for these reecnt deficits or Iraq-mire...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Duane D.
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 08:37 PM

The ONLY thing Doug R. is correct about in this thread is it's name, it's ALL BS.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 21 Jan 06 - 01:08 AM

Alito is going to be elected.

Face it, the likes of a Greg F. will never be happy with whoever is President unless his name with either Karl Marx or Joseph Stalin. I mean, when you are on the fringe of society, you will never fit in.

I'll just be you have a shit job Greg F or none at all. You seem unhirable.

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 21 Jan 06 - 01:32 AM

Bobert 30 years is too long for me but 200 years is ok for you:

Yeah, Thomas Jefferson warned us that if democracy would work it would tinvolved and informed electorate... Well, like troll has pointed out, most kids don't know sh*t from shinola...

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Old Guy
Date: 21 Jan 06 - 01:42 AM

Democrats in ad for Alito:
http://news.findlaw.com/prnewswire/20060113/13jan20060858.html
The ad profiles two democrat supporters of Alito -- former Attorney General Robert Del Tufo (D-NJ) and Yale law professor J.L. Pottenger.

"I'm a Democrat, actually I'm a very liberal Democrat and Sam's qualifications to serve on the Supreme Court are unassailable," said Yale law professor J.L. Pottenger. "He understands that a judge is not a policy maker. I resent the political partisan attacks on Sam Alito."

"He does not have a partisan bone in his body nor an ideological bent," echoed former Attorney General Robert Del Tufo (D-NJ). "He would certainly be a credit to this country."

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: DougR
Date: 21 Jan 06 - 12:58 PM

Amos: you are a riot. You offer quotes from Barbara Boxer to support your views! Unbelievable.

Bobert: Your excusing Senator Byrd for his past transgressions and jumping on Alito for what you perceive to be his is astonishing! And McGrath, do you know, FOR A FACT, that Byrd never mentioned membership in the Klan (a leadership one in fact) on a resume? Where did you get your info? The GUARDIAN?

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Alito brings real balance
From: Once Famous
Date: 21 Jan 06 - 11:13 PM

No, he gets his news from The National Enquirer or possibly The Ladies Home Journal.

Barbar Boxer Shorts is a spokeperson for the Amos' of society. It's like going to a comedy club.