BS: Gno more Gnome

Subject: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:06 PM

Sorry Guys.

I promised myself I would never make a splash but there is no other way of doing this. The Kitty Litter has got far too dirty for my liking. Please keep the Russian Folk Songs and any reference to Swinton Folk Club as my legacy. I won't post my proper email addy here but I am sure the people that matter will understand dpolshaw at hotmail dot com.

Love to all those I have met. Bollocks to all the arseholes and something in between to those who don't know where they fit.

Cheers

Dave the Gnome

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Sorcha
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:12 PM

gobsmacked. In some ways, I can't blame him. Miss you Dave. See you at the Annexe I hope.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: gnu
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:12 PM

Gosh, this is VERY sad news.

Nice to have known you. Take care.

g

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:17 PM

Damn...sorry youre going Dave, but I know the feeling.

Best wishes to you.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bert
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:22 PM

You don't have to leave, just stop opening the offending threads and ignore any offending messages.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: ClaireBear
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:23 PM

Bye, Sir Gnome. I seem to have missed whatever went on, but perhaps that is as well.

I too will miss you. Be well.

Claire

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Rapparee
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:30 PM

Farewell. I consider you a friend.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:30 PM

Come back, Dave! yOU'LL BE MISSED.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 04:41 PM

So long Dave. I hope you will reconsider, I've loved your post.

Sure, there are a lot of "arse" holes here, and people will say things that they would never dare say to your face. You should not let their small minds and anal pleasures get in the way of the good friends and good discussions you've had on Mudcat.

It is easy to walk away and feel that you have done something righteous, but in reality you have let them beat you.   It isn't worth a fight, but it isn't worth making an issue out of leaving either.   Walk away from a discussion, not the forum.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:25 PM

A lot of crap gets said in this section, but this is and will remain a serious and important site for thousands of people worldwide..
We must not hand it over to the foul mouthed yobs.
No one goes further than you to see the other bloke's point of view, and to make allowances for his feelings.
When you do get harsh, you tag it with a silly smile.
We need more contributors like you Dave.
Think again.
Keith.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST,Cruz
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:26 PM

People that exit like Gnome are pretentious. No one forces you to be below the line in the BS. Stay in the music section.

Are you seeking sympathy, for what?

Look at me I am leaving...

Good bye and good luck. Come back soon with an armor of chain mail.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:28 PM

Please just take a break and then come back. It helps, I promise. (Been there.) There are more good people on here than arseholes...your leaving diminishes those odds. Hope you will come back after a respite. You WILL be missed.

All the best,

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:31 PM

Cruz, there are very few people on this site who are less pretentious than Dave.

Allow him the right to try & prick the consciences of those who presumably have caused him to leave, by saying so.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peace
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:37 PM

Guest Cruz is the reason some mammals eat their young.

You are a good man, Dave. The place needs more like you, not fewer.

FWIW, this kind of thing is exactly why the Mudcat should go members-only in the BS section, and the sooner the better.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:42 PM

We don't know what actually precipitated Dave's regrettable departure,I actually thought things were on the up again recently.
Sorry you decided to pull the plug Dave, you can always reconsider you know?
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST,Cruz
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:45 PM

That was funny brucie. Thanks.

I, of course, meant no harm to DTG, but why the Grand Exit?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:49 PM

Bye dtg. I never skip your posts as they are so balanced and well thought out. No idea who you are but you come across on here as a thoroughly lovely bloke. I'm sure you won't be at a loss to fill your time. Stay well.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:51 PM

As one who has left several times, sometimes with notice and sometimes not, I understand, Dave. If you feel like you can handle being back, you'll be part of an exclsuiive club of those who share that history-- and please, PM any time even if it's just to strengthen your resolve. And thanks for the goodbye note-- I know some folks think that's bad form but I think it's helpful to know straightforwardly from the one who's leaving speaking for themselves!

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Janie
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:01 PM

Sorry to see you go, Dave. Hope you'll take a break and come back.

In the FWIW department,I took Bert's advice a little while ago and lo! it worked for me.

Janie

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peace
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:08 PM

Cruz, thank you for your kind response. I do not know the details, but I do know Dave from his posts on Mudcat and a few messages back and forth now and then. He is a quality person. He has always been the epitome of good humoUr, fellowship, support to those who need it when they need it, and he is someone I wish I was more like. He is a good man, but sometimes even good men get beaten down by some of the stuff that gets said on Mudcat.

I have never had the pleasure of meeting him. I hope I do someday, because I like people of character, even though--or maybe even especially because I'm not always like that myself. Folks like him are the unstated reminder that it takes good poeple to make a good world--even within the microcosm that is Mudcat. Your response to me lets me know you are much like that, too.

Dave, if must needs, take a week off. But please stick around.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:13 PM

Don't walk out of the session!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:24 PM

This is a sad week. I have received a pm from another member Dave who has just left this site due to the shite that is slung here.

Keith, it's you that is driving people away.

Can we not just ban Keith ?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Sorcha
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:31 PM

Why? At least one member has been banned lately because he upset the wrong people. It DOES matter who you make angry. If you make me angry, oh well. Pretty much garuntee nothing will happen.

Besides, if the banned members care enough they can figure out ways to come back even as members.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:35 PM

Paul and Peace there are members leaving this site due to cynical posts such as this one below. "In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king".

From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 05:25 PM

A lot of crap gets said in this section, but this is and will remain a serious and important site for thousands of people worldwide..
We must not hand it over to the foul mouthed yobs.
No one goes further than you to see the other bloke's point of view, and to make allowances for his feelings.
When you do get harsh, you tag it with a silly smile.
We need more contributors like you Dave.
Think again.
Keith.

"A lot of crap gets said in this section" we all know Keith and it's you saying it.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:36 PM

"No one forces you to be below the line in the BS.'

... and no one forces people to say things that our way out of line. No one forces people to hide their identities so that they can feel real important when they say crude things to another. No one forces people to start arguements just for the sake of having an arguement. No one forces people to stay in the same room with racists, sexists or bigots either.   

No one would force me to allow some of the vermin that lurks in these forums into my home. No one would force me to be civil to them either.    However these idiots can enter into any discussion and be as abusive as they wish with no one to stop them. The moderators try to give us free speech, but the privalage is abused by mental midgets who love to cause trouble.

Look at posts from five or six years ago. Sure there were a few assholes causing trouble, but it was much easier to have a conversation and really discuss things.

Dave is not the first to leave, nor will he be the last. Sooner or later the rest of us will either get disgusted or realize that there is no one decent to chat with.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:38 PM

Sorry Sorcha, don't want to start an argument here, but just who are 'the wrong people'?
If you refer to the person I think you do, then that person upset an awful lot of people, they can't all be 'the wrong people' surely?
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: freda underhill
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 06:41 PM

dear gnome

sad gnews, Dave, you are a good one. Mudcat would be the less without you. as many of the others have suggested, why not take a cyber holiday and come back in a while? a break could give you some distance from whoever has upset you. many of us would be pleased to keep reading your posts again.
best wishes

ms hobbit

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:12 PM

I doubt that its Keith who has given Dave away, Guest, I really do, so I'm sure you'll understand when I say that I am very sure that youre lying.

Not that my opinion in this means jack shit, of course, as you have chosen not to give your claims the credibility of using your Mudcat name.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:21 PM

Hmmmm...that was to Guest: 06:24 PM, of course, & maybe I should revise my above post slightly, as you didnt actually claim Dave had given that as his reason. You just just stated it was down to Keith, in a manner that implied he was the cause. Why?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:39 PM

Gnowing Dave as a personal friend for over twenty years, it saddens me that people who seem to take themselves far too seriously have upset him to this extent.

My visits to Mudcat are far less frequent than they used to be, because I don't care for the vindictive comments some people make about others.

Criticism which is justified and fairly made is one thing, but inflammatory and often grossly inaccurate  remarks are an entirely different matter.

I do not wish to become involved in such slanging matches, which is why I am careful not to name any names. That way, those who are causing offence will over-react and quickly make themselves known because I have pricked someone's guilty conscience - if, indeed, they have a conscience at all.

It is also inevitable that someone may misunderstand what I have said, and take offence where no offence was intended. Tough.

Don't waste your time throwing crap at me, because to insult me, first I have to respect your opinions!

Dave's dropping out of Mudcat will not deprive me of a good friend, because he lives nearby.

I'm with you, lad.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:43 PM

Touching!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST,Cruz
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:44 PM

Well then Bernard, twist the lad's arm a bit to keep him at least in the music section. Only good friends can do that.

I am still laughing at Peace's comment...

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Azizi
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:48 PM

Dave, I'm sorry to hear this news and I hope that you reconsider.

Either way, Positive vibrations!

Azizi

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: pdq
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:49 PM

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Subject: RE: BS: The Curse of Cromwell
From: ard mhacha
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:23 AM

DTG, You do slobber on, if you care to read my posts further up this Thread you will see that I stated that the attendances in Ireland had declined, given as 60^ in 1998

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Subject: RE: BS: The Curse of Cromwell
From: ard mhacha
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 03:18 PM

Are you still rattling on DTG, have you a problem or did a dog piss in your eye, careful where they set you down in the garden.

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Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:52 PM

You should "never" demean the little people. A curse on your house.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Hawker
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 07:52 PM

Goodbye Dave, nice knowing you and sharing your posts, hope to meet you out there in reality!
Peace, love and a Happy New Year
Lucy

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Alba
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 08:03 PM

Be Well Dave.

Hopefully time will heal and you'lle feel like dropping in.

It does get crappy at times.
I was for the off not so long ago when I found that someone shared the contents of my PM to them with a couple of their "buddies" on here...now that's areshole behaviour huh!!

Then there are the truly genuine, no head messing, REAL Friends on the Mudcat that I can't imagine not being in touch with. Losing those Folks would create a very big space in my heart...so...I ignore the arseholes now...totally..... and save my time and energy for the People that come to visit the Mudcat with no hidden agenda.

I truly hope to see you in here again in the near future and wish you nothing but the best Dave ma Dear.

Love and Light and warmest of Wishes for 2007
Jude

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 08:05 PM

A hissy fit over the NI threads.

Anyone posting to those suckers bloody well deserves what they get, regardless of with whom they side.

Also, Sorcha is right about the "who you know" thing.

DtG is well-liked by those "who you know" sorts. He is well known by me as a bootlicker of same.

And now, with this silly exit with a furious flair, a drama queen.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 08:11 PM

Flamingo Ted is now a GUEST ? Thought it was him.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 08:22 PM

You've gotta go when you've gotta go!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: The Walrus
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 08:53 PM

Bernard,

I don't know if DtG is still reading these posts - I somehow doubt it (he doesn't seem the type to make a big exit and then watch for the effect).

Please try to persuade him to return, his input always seemed interesting and reasoned and without him Muncat will be a poorer place.

BtW, do you know if he ever DID find a source for the Cossack kit he was looking for?

W

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 09:53 PM

(answered via PM)

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Dec 06 - 10:08 PM

"Also, Sorcha is right about the "who you know" thing."

I find that interesting.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Sorcha
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 12:24 AM

Only with permission from the sender first. I do have some standards.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 12:27 AM

That was not about you Sorcha

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 03:33 AM

Dave and I never had a cross word on the forum, corresponded outside the forum and have a standing invite to each other's homes.
The vicious personal attack from Ard may have been the final straw but I bet this kind of deceit and lies, member using this thread to smear another member(me) must have been part of it.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 03:45 AM

I suspect it was because of you Keith, not Ard mhacha.

"I bet this kind of deceit and lies, member using this thread to smear another member(me) must have been part of it".

You Keith A of Hertford are the master of lies and deceit as many here are aware.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 04:58 AM

You suspect wrong.
You know it is a lie anyway.
I have a pm from Dave confirming it.
Any Joe clone is welcome to look in my inbox.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: JennyO
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 05:13 AM

Yet another reason for making this forum members only. That troublemaking GUEST will have to go away or post under his/her/its real name - if he/she/it has the guts.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Gervase
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 07:09 AM

God this place is getting pretty nasty, with pusillanimous drivel like "Guest's". I can sympathise with Dave's leaving. I don't read through enough here to get my bile rising to danger levels, but if a poisonous, snivelling and cowardly little turd like that "Guest" was a real guest in my home I'd take great pleasure in pitching it down the front steps PDQ.
So, come on Max, Joe et all - how about removing the right to post for those who won't leave footprints? How many genuinely constructive posters would we lose because they never have access to a computer which will accept cookies?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 07:15 AM

Down the street the dogs are barking
      
And the day is getting dark.
      
As the night comes in a-fallin'
                        
The dogs, they'll lose their bark.

The silent night will shatter
      
From the sounds inside my mind
            
As I leave one too many mornings
   
And a thousand miles behind.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 07:18 AM

There is a lot of leaping at guests here but it would be interesting to know what finaly broke Dtg down.

My speculation is that the biggest straw for him would have been the almost Irish vs English threads (one of the last comment I read of his was "Did you not know that anyone English is always the aggressor?" which are threads largely played out by the same members.

I could be wrong, and there could also be several reasons but I do feel having the guest to blame does prevent looking at other possibilities.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 07:21 AM

Could the Guest/s be one of those who post on the threads you mention?
G

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 07:30 AM

From an anonymous Guest:

This is a sad week. I have received a pm from another member Dave who has just left this site due to the shite that is slung here.

Keith, it's you that is driving people away.

Can we not just ban Keith ?

To receive a pm, this nameless one must be a member hiding behind anonymity to attack someone else. I consider that to be far worse than a straightforward unidentified visitor.


DC

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 07:31 AM

I don't know what geusts might enter them, Giok. There is however a group of members who usualy find issues such as NI to fall out over. I'm sure we could all draw up very similar lists.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: kendall
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 08:02 AM

I have also met Dave, and he is welcome in my home, even if he doesn't bring any spiced rum.
Please reconsider, Mate.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: The Barden of England
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 08:04 AM

Well said Gervase - anybody posting as GUEST is doing so because they don't have the backbone to own up to who they are. Cowards the lot of them.
John Barden

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: JennyO
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 08:22 AM

To receive a pm, this nameless one must be a member hiding behind anonymity to attack someone else. I consider that to be far worse than a straightforward unidentified visitor.

I agree with you, Doug Chadwick. And if this site was members only, a member would have to use his/her name to post, and they might think twice before taking a pot shot when they know they will be known and made accountable for what they say. Although this step wouldn't get rid of all the nastiness, I think it would certainly lessen it.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Ron Davies
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 08:23 AM

Dave's posts were more balanced than many others. He will definitely be missed. Obviously he has many options.   He could lurk and return eventually, he could take a cyber-holiday, he could just post above the line. Political discussions can get rough, but he knows that--and it's not likely to change anytime soon.    Possible improvements might be to restrict all "Guest" postings to music only--if that were technologically feasible, to outright ban all postings by those who refuse to take either a name or a handle, or to stop anybody who just posts as a "Guest" from starting any thread. Those who post just as a "Guest" seem very frequently to only want to stir up trouble. People who don't want to cause trouble can easily take a name or a handle--then at least there is a semblance of accountability.   Refusal to do so on the basis of "security" is a red herring.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: jacqui.c
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 08:44 AM

I agree with the idea of members only posting in the BS section. At least then the identity of the trouble makers would be known. Posting as Guest to put across nastiness and vitriol pisses me off. These types are just cowards, afraid to say their piece out in the open for fear of what others may think of them. I hope that I never descend to such small minded behaviour.

I'm sorry to see you go Dave - one less sane voice in what can be a wilderness sometimes. Hopefully, one day, I'll get to meet you in real life when I'm travelling around the UK. As has been said - take a break and come back and see us again sometime.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 09:15 AM

I've spoken to Dave on the telling-bone, and he's grateful for all your good wishes, which I have passed on to him.

He will be back occasionally sometime in the future, but this place just isn't what it used to be any more.

Although anonymous guests can be a problem, some members seem to have their own agendas, too...

It's worth remembering that resorting to petty name-calling and insults is a clear admission that you've already lost the argument...

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: number 6
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 09:37 AM

Allowing Guests not to post would resolve the issues somewhat ... but it appears the an equal amount of nasty posts have been delivered by 'members'.

I think we should disciplne ourselves to ignore such outright attacks, as it seems we (myselve included) do at times fall prey and just feed the frenzy.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 10:30 AM

dtg didnt leave because of guests, he left because of the spew from ard and co. All members.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 11:25 AM

Yes. These days I often type a response to a post, then just 'walk away' without submitting it.

It makes me feel a lot better knowing I haven't been sucked in by the 'spew'.

Discipline isn't quite so easy, because human nature makes us feel that we want to win... but sometimes the only way we really win is by retreating!

Far from being cowardly, it is a brave act!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Mooh
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 11:39 AM

I am often reminded about catching a bass from off its nest. Before it's released another fish may well have raided the nest and eaten its full. Will it ever be thus with the Mudcat? There will always be someone to replace the absent?

I am sincerely sorry if I have contributed in any way to the departure of anyone here, but I too ignore most of the nasty stuff and continue on my way, or it seems like I'm an observer rather than a participant, just standing by, slack-jawed, hands in pockets, not getting involved.

Either way Dave, I hope you return to the commmunity sometime.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST,Cruz
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 11:50 AM

Bernard, I often do that with serious matters. I have had conflicts where I sit down and type a 2 page or more letter thrashing something on someone then do not even send it. I may have wasted a hour or two but I got it out, even if only to myself. That is why journals are important.

I have vacillated on the Guest posting issue. I have concluded that some intelligent, good folks need anonymity to post. Some of the posts are excellent, thought provoking, and raise the level of the discussion. Therefore, let people continue to be "ghost writers" as long as there are no salacious attacks as happen recently when the whole thread was deleted, then partially revived.

Let the mudcat elves remove the "mud" slinging posts even if continuity is somewhat broken.

Ol' Dave likely just needed a break from the vicissitudes of this section of the deep, sometimes murky, muddy section of Mudcatsville. Catfish are bottom feeders and some of the Cats here a bout's are as low you can go.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 11:54 AM

Bernard, all that is needed for evil to triumph is that good men do nothing .
Post and be damned.
I would prefer to lose an argument than win by lying.
Let them do it. It shows how weak their arguments are.
But watch for them to give themselves away, and then expose their deceit.
Also personal abuse. It is resorted to when argument can not prevail.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: number 6
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 11:57 AM

Time to hit the 'ignore'button.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Jeri
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 12:09 PM

On the internet, all that is needed for evil to triumph is for good men respond to it. Especially when the 'evil' is designed solely to piss you off so you reply.

A smart person knows when walking away is the best option. You can't change the world, or even the desired mind when you flounder about with a troll. You may, however, change the minds of others who watch you feed the beast and see how it makes him come back for more, and know they can thank you for that.

I'm sorry DtG is gone and hope he comes back at some point, perhaps when the usual suspects decide to shut up and give it a rest, or more likely when he decides he can still talk with those who don't want to play the hate game or engage in trollery. I also find there isn't much intelligent discussion possible here currently, but things change.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: kendall
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 01:11 PM

I think the clones do a pretty good job of deleting the personal attacks and name calling, but they can't be everywhere.
One of the worst offenders has finally been banned and I don't miss him a bit.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: ard mhacha
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 04:03 PM

Well darn my hide, I spend the day at my favourite pursuit, watching sport and I come back to see Guests and co lambasting me for seeing off the Gnome.
Quite simply, go to the Thread in question, The curse of Cromwell, an see how often DTG kept misquoting me, as for worrying about his departure, I couldn`t care less, if he cant take it on an internet site, then he shouldn`t be here.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: John J
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 04:15 PM

DtG is a seriously decent bloke, and I for one will miss his informed and intelligent postings. I hope he re-considers and returns to the Mudcat, it's a poorer place without him.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 04:34 PM

I'm with ard mhacha. If he can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Cluin
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 04:48 PM

Who's been banned?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 04:52 PM

I haven't a Clu..in.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 05:24 PM

martin gibson - there said it. Now the roof will cave in.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: number 6
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 05:26 PM

Time to hit the 'ignore'button.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 05:37 PM

I'm going to ignore that last comment!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: skarpi
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 05:56 PM

I wonder who is this " Guest " who is afraid to show his/her name ??

but on the other hand he or she dont have to .... but still .....

I dont know what all this is about , but I would like to know who this guest is .

Who is the guest talking to the guest ...............

just wandering.............


have a good new year , and love and happiness to you all

from all guests

all the best Skarpi Iceland. :>))

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 06:02 PM

The general 'atmosphere', not any one person, has caused Dave to re-think his reasons for visiting Mudcat, as have many of us previously.

To paraphrase our 'GUEST 04:34PM' - if you can't stand the crap, get out of the toilet!

Now, where's that 'ignore' button?!

;o)

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 06:52 PM

I would just like to clarify what seems to be a belief of some members posting to this thread.

If you believe making Mudcat member only will mean that people will have to use their "real" names to post here, you are wrong.

And maybe you should make a Mudcat New Year's resolution to take a course on how the internet world actually works.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: skarpi
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 08:57 PM

or stop use it, ? well you never know ..........

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: JennyO
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 09:05 PM

I, for one, was not talking about members using their REAL names, just a consistent handle. I still think it would slow down the nastiness somewhat. A lot of us know some other Mudcatters in Real Life too.

Of course I realise that you can be a member with a handle that doesn't give away your real identity, and those like Martin Gibson MAKE SURE that nobody ever knows who they really are. Bue he/she/it was finally banned. I also realise that those who really want to deceive could have multiple memberships, and that is probably hard to police.

I STILL think that having Members Only would be an improvement.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Sorcha
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 09:06 PM

How the internet actually works.....Do YOU know, Oh Almighty Guest????
Please tell us. Inquiring minds want to know. And, Skarpi may wander where he pleases.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 09:47 PM

"I still think it would slow down the nastiness somewhat."

Good for you. Honestly and sincerely, I mean it.

I'm more cynical than you about Mudcat flaming and trolling, obviously. I look at the nastiness of so many members here (and not just towards us perpetual guests), and wonder how anyone can think that going member only will cure that.

To the surprise of many, I have been advocating that Mudcat go member only for years, just because the "blame the guest" syndrome here is so out of whack.

But despite the clones' cryptic warnings that going member-only is imminent, I've taken a "believe it when I see it" attitude towards it all.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: katlaughing
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 09:59 PM

And, we'll believe you when we see you, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: bobad
Date: 30 Dec 06 - 10:24 PM

Dave, you're a good man, I'll miss you.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: skarpi
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 05:36 AM

I dont have any attitude to you my dear guest , like I said I was just wandering ............

All the best to you Skarpi Iceland .

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Myrtle
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 07:01 AM

Sorry to hear the news Dave, I enjoy your balanced posts.
Hope to see you soon at Swinters.
Regards, Myrtle.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 07:14 AM

Skarpi, Guest was just pointlessly 'nit-picking' at an understandable tiny spelling mistake.

What you meant, I think, was that you were wondering.

Wandering is to walk along, casually, not feeling the need to particularly go anywhere with any urgency.

A very easy mistake to make!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Sorcha
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 08:57 AM

Yes, Paul, but Guest, you know what? Skarpi's English is a DAMN sight better than MY (and I suspect, YOUR) Icelandic!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 09:02 AM

Abso-bloody-lutely!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 09:40 AM

;o)

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 08:43 PM

Well i'd like to add my name to the chorus of goodbyes. I am sorry that D the G is off. Its a sad way to start the new year.

If it is ard's line in malarkey that has upset him, I do feel sorry. Its quite stinging at times, and one gets the impression that all the abrasiveness doesn't really make ard himself a happy bunny.

i hope the D the G will reconsider. Friendship and cyber friendship has its limitations. but life is a bit miserable without it.

all the best to all parties and happy new year

al

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: skarpi
Date: 31 Dec 06 - 09:13 PM

Hallo all , Sorcha thanks but its not worth it , ignore it
as I will from now on .There are so many who have left the Mudcat
through the years and others that we see less and less :<( and some of them just becouse of " Words " has been spoken, some of us can handle it but some others dont and they have left the building .


The ........ will left alone here in the End .

Happy new year and may it bring love and happiness to you all
even to the ......... , and thank you all for those years
witch are gone , but gave me alot, Max , Mick , Joe if you good men
dont do anything soon about all this , all this will go bad.


All the best Skarpi Iceland.

P.s Dave sorry you left.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Gervase
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 05:14 AM

It does seem that there's bugger-all worth reading on here these days - just left-v-right bickering, The Shambles' obsession with censorship (would that it were true!) and the increasingly squalid abuse by by members and guests. Another bookmark to remove, another cookie to delete...
Enjoy yourselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Rman
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 08:14 AM

So who will inform us of forthcoming events at Swinton FC now?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 10:21 AM

Tantaraaah!

I will do it, my captain!

(Sinks slowly into underpants)

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Wolfgang
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 11:03 AM

Mudcat is a better place with the Gnome. Sorry to see you go.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 11:20 AM

He'll be back...

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: The Walrus
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 11:56 AM

"...From: Bernard: Date: 01 Jan 07 - 11:20 AM

He'll be back... ..."


That's good news

W

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 12:04 PM

You can't keep a good man down...

;0)

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: JennyO
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 10:27 PM

...as the actress said to the bishop...

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peace
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 10:37 PM

She was no actress.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: number 6
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 10:42 PM

and he was no bishop.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peace
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 10:46 PM

I just knew . . . .

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: number 6
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 10:47 PM

Which reminds me .............



.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peace
Date: 01 Jan 07 - 10:58 PM

Five bucks. Same as downtown.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Cluin
Date: 02 Jan 07 - 04:55 PM

Congratulatons. You have just been screwed by the Sisters of Mercy.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Gizmo
Date: 02 Jan 07 - 05:42 PM

Bernard,

Please let GTG know, that although I don't really know him, the posts I have read of his have been balanced, and helpful and generally a good read.

I would love to hear more of his point of views and I for one can't wait to see him back.

Personally, I have not been a member of this forum very long, but during one of my first 10 posts, I was abused by some member and a guest from the beginning. I thought it was a joke at first.

I have met (read?) lots of lovely people on this forum and would love to meet you and dtg and many others in real life terms.

Thank you for your posts DTG.

Nicci

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 02 Jan 07 - 09:25 PM

Will do!

As for meeting sometime in real life, I must warn you we are both pretty scary looking!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Genie
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 01:54 AM

I haven't 'gnown' the Gnome well here during my 5+ years, but well enough to 'gnow' that he's the sort we need more of, not the ignoble sort we might be happy to see 'gnome o'er'.

(Gawd, that was horrible!)   

Sorry,

Bernard, when you see Dave, please tell him the genie hopes the gnome will come back too.

G

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul Burke
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 04:02 AM

I think that the Armagh (Ard Mhacha) disaster of 1889 was caused by a train without brakes. Internet anonymity seems to have a similar effect on people, and social inhibitions get loosened, a bit like alcohol. Which is one reason I use my own real name.

We had an incident at the New Year party, when a guest accosted another, and accused her of bewitching his girlfriend of the previous year (they hadn't met inbetween) and causing her to leave him. We eventually restrained him, gently led him away, and put him on a whisky drip until he was sedated.

The answer is simply to ignore it, and if you feel your differences are irreconcilable, don't talk to each other.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 08:05 AM

Yes Paul, exactly. It takes strength of character to be able to 'walk away' instead of retaliating.

'Bernard' is my real name - and is the name of the Lancaster Pilot in WWII whose skill is partly responsible for my father's survival as a rear gunner. Both men are still alive and in their eighties at the time of posting!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: ard mhacha
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 02:06 PM

Paul Burke and St Bernard I had a PM from Dave the Gnome on the 30th assuring me that I wasn`t responsible for his departure, if he cares to get in touch you will find I am, as is always the case, telling the truth. OK.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peace
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 02:12 PM

People like scapegoats. Always have and always will. I never did think it was you, ard.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 02:25 PM

I knew that - Dave told me himself (on the phone). Did I ever suggest otherwise?

How did you know my friends' nickname for me is St Bernard? Did Dave tell you?! ;o)

Oh... I see... you mis-read my post. Understandable, as I wasn't specific... I was referring to Paul's comment about 'ignoring it', and nothing else. Sorry if you (and others) may have thought I meant summat else!

I added the bit about my name because I did...

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Emma B
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 02:29 PM

Dog gone it Bernard!
Where's the brandy?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 02:32 PM

Bu-u-u-u-rp!!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peace
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 02:32 PM

Is that really what they carry? Not a Pinot Noir that has nice legs and travels well?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 02:47 PM

Ah come on Bernard, how scary can Dave be...he's a Gnome...*G*

Genie, how many Xmas Crackers did you have to open to get those terrible puns? *G*

I too had a PM from Dave, I can confirm that Ard's name was not mentioned to me either.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Emma B
Date: 03 Jan 07 - 04:46 PM

I travel well thanks

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul Burke
Date: 04 Jan 07 - 04:10 AM

I don't like the blonde dye Emma. Sorry, ard m., if I jumped to conclusions, and I shan't accuse you of a mass killing (largely of children) again, unless you've done it.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: ard mhacha
Date: 04 Jan 07 - 02:15 PM

Yes I thought that was a strange analogy, over 100 primary school children in a rail crash and you made fun of the fact, that was a wee bit Burke and hairish.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: JohnB
Date: 05 Jan 07 - 12:00 PM

For various reasons, I don't spend too much time around here anymore myself. I spend even less time "below the line".
However if Dave had never been here, I would never have met him and had a really GREAT day with him and the rest of the lads of Abram Mummers at the Lancaster Maritime Festival.
I would also probably never have been to the Swinton Folk Club (where Dave never goes when I am in England) and met Bernard also.
So as far as I am concerned the leaving of Dave the Gnome from Mudcat is a terrible loss.
Please give him my best wishes Bernard, you can keep a few for yourself too.
JohnB

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 05 Jan 07 - 12:05 PM

Righty-ho, John! Have a few back for yourself!!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: folk1e
Date: 05 Jan 07 - 07:45 PM

Gonme...but not forgotten
You could all show your support by coming to THE club at Swinton with our very own New Landlord!
.....Mine's a pint of Santa's Little Helper
Cheers
Dave (definitly NOT the Gnome)

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Slag
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 04:12 AM

Pretty solid tribute to DTG, this thread. I'd like to have gotten to know you better, Dave. Maybe when things settle down? Seems like a lot of folks here would like to keep you around!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 05:25 AM

well the thing about dave was that he had interesting things to say. he wasn't just stirring the shit. he ventured an opinion.

also he'd been around folk music, and folk musicians - so when he got to talk about music, it wasn't stuff, he'd sat at home and fermented - it was actually based on a version of reality. Life as is lived - sort of thing.
And really that's all the best of us ever have to offer.

all the best to all

al

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: John Routledge
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 07:57 AM

This thread reminds me how much I used to enjoy Swinton Folk Club.

Will renew attendance starting Monday week.

Pity the problems of The 'Cat can't be solved as easily

Thanks for many many stimulating posts DavetG

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 12:00 PM

Gervase, you leaving too? The place has certainly disintegrated.

"...this is and will remain a serious and important site for thousands of people worldwide..." In your dreams, Keith. Joe can correct me if I'm wrong, but my guess is that Mudcat is used by fewer than 500 people, with maybe as few as 200 checking in once a week or more. Overwhelmingly they are in the US and UK. Mudcatters who live in other countries - the Irish Republic (5?), Germany (3?), Japan (1?) Australasia (5?) and Iceland (1?) come to mind - might number 20-30.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 02:31 PM

I'm really sad to see Dave go. I always thought he was the sweet voice of reason.

Come back soon, Dave

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 08:37 PM

For Dave and gnomes everywhere


I went into a forum I used to frequent,
To post words of wisdom it was my intent.
Imagine my horror as the curser did roam
When it found the thread title, "Gno more Gnome"

And it's gno, gnay, gnever,
Gno, gnay, gnever, gno more,
Will I post here on Mudcat,
Gno, gnever, gno more.

It seems he's been driven to withdraw his words
By obgnoxious gnonsense and gniggling gnerds
And gnow he's been left there with gnothing but pain,
Gnonmembers and gnobheads must shoulder the blame.

Chorus

So let's raise a glass to our most gnoble Gnome
And hope he'll ig gnore all the gnerds and come home.
Then all the begrudgers will learn to their shame
That a gnome will gnever fall foul of their game.

And it's gno, gnay, gnever,
Gno,gnay, gnever, gno more
Will they drive Gnome from Mudcat,
Gno, gnever, gno more.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: John J
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 04:42 AM

Well said / sung!

JJ

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 07:49 AM

Only a guestimate Peter k, but I was including people who use the site as a resource.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 09:20 AM

And how did you guestimate how many use the site as a resource, Keith?

(see how long it takes him to go off-topic)

Gnome ore, then?

Thanks for mailing Hazel Blears
we have only Keith's word that he copied and pasted your own mail, Dave

At least you have a bit of integrity.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 09:46 AM

Tir, I always have this trouble with your posts.
Please say clearly and unambiguously what you are accusing me of so that I can answer.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: jacqui.c
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 09:46 AM

No wonder Dave left.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: freda underhill
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 09:49 AM

GUEST Date: 06 Jan 07 - 08:37 PM

re gno gnay gnever - what a great song! I hope Dave sees it!

freda

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Captain Ginger
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 10:17 AM

I'm glad I'm not the only one to find Tír Chonaill's post a bit gnomic.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 10:55 AM

Thank you freda. Let's hope that Dave makes the last post here. He started the thread, he should finish it and hopefully come back.

PS. Give my regards to Rooty Hill Public School next time you're passing. I spent two years teaching the wonderful children there back in '74.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 10:55 AM

Captain Ginger, you are in good company.
Tir once forgot to name a post and poor Divis thought it must be from my side.
Accused him of being lobotomised.
Somewhat risque for a mental health professional I thought.
Now Tir, I did not cut and paste any mail from Dave.
I said I had pms and offered any moderator access to my in box.
If that is not enough I am willing to give my password to any mutually trusted person. Bernard? Peace?
I think that you should apologise.
Some hope!
Please just crawl back under your stone.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 11:02 AM

Tir, sorry. I get it.
Hazel Blears was Dave's MP.
Back in May 2005 Dave wrote to her about disarming Loyalists.
I used his format to write to my MP. (I had to edit a bit)
You did not just have my word for that Tir, I posted my MPs reply in full.
Now crawl away.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 11:47 AM

Keith why say "I think that you should apologise"

What would be the point, you are well known for ignoring apologies on the site Keith.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 11:50 AM

Justify please.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Captain Ginger
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 11:50 AM

I would say Keith is known more for making a heartfelt apology as part of an extremely honest admission that he had made a mistake. Something that is as rare as hens' teeth around here.
And something that I think is entirely to his credit.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 11:53 AM

Never mind.
This is Dave's thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 01:13 PM

Nonsense, Keith you "nicked Dave's mail and sent it" as your own - no mention of editing 'a bit'

whadid I tell youse all about him going off topic???

Jump Keith.
How high and for how long?, he says

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Bernard
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 01:16 PM

No need for access to your mailbox, Keith. I can vouch for what you said, as Dave told me himself. On the phone, not in writing.

He did mutter something about checking out Jon Freeman's Folkinfo.org forum...

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 02:08 PM

Thanks Bernard.
Tir, Dave's mail included references to events they had both attended.
Otherwise I did indeed nick his letter to send to my MP and I said so.
Now, what is it you are accusing me of?

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 02:35 PM

I do believe the men wear the knickers on this Site, bitches aplenty.

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 06:50 PM

Looks like he's accusing you of being Keith A of Hereford, Keith.

Best not admit to it though, you'll never know to what use he'll put that admission!

Subject: RE: BS: Gno more Gnome
From: wysiwyg
Date: 07 Jan 07 - 06:53 PM

Of course, people on the lam from Mudcat generally do not find it good manners to make their comeback while their ta-ta thread is still up and running, so if you really want DtG to come back quietly and without causing a fuss he may not enjoy, ssssssssshhhhhh!

~Susan