Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafesj

Post to this Thread - Printer Friendly - Home
Page: [1] [2]


Scratch Morris sides

Related threads:
Help me undestand Morris Dancing (79)
Morris Dancing in US/Canada? (26)
Morris Dancing in America (51)
Steve Last/Morris Men@ Bull 19/04 (65)
Morris Dance query (6)
Hexham Morris - 25th Birthday (16)
Clubs and Morris in Oxford? (19)
'May' in Morris dancing? (31)
Folklore: Future of Morris Dancing? (27)
Origin of Morris Dancing (66)
Singing in Morris tunes (34)
Folklore: Morris mystery (8)
Morris dancing - what's it about ? (65)
Seattle Morris (7)
what's this uproar about Morris dancing (22)
This Dangerous Business of Morris Dancing (20)
morris dancing video (12)
The origins of Morris Dancing (45)
Morris Dancing in Hull (35) (closed)
Lyr Req: When this morris dance is over (27)
Morris Dancing Rocks! (34)
morris dancing jokes (7)
Hey- want to see some morris dancing? (12)
Morris Dancing? (25)


Geoff the Duck 06 Sep 04 - 05:01 AM
Uncle_DaveO 05 Sep 04 - 08:51 PM
Geoff the Duck 05 Sep 04 - 08:42 PM
Geoff the Duck 05 Sep 04 - 08:37 PM
Geoff the Duck 05 Sep 04 - 08:16 PM
GUEST,Anne Croucher 05 Sep 04 - 08:09 PM
GUEST,nikkih 05 Sep 04 - 07:38 PM
M'Grath of Altcar 05 Sep 04 - 03:08 PM
ced2 05 Sep 04 - 02:10 PM
Folkiedave 05 Sep 04 - 08:26 AM
GUEST 05 Sep 04 - 08:19 AM
GUEST 05 Sep 04 - 08:14 AM
jonm 05 Sep 04 - 04:15 AM
Liz the Squeak 05 Sep 04 - 03:52 AM
GUEST,Anne Croucher 04 Sep 04 - 09:23 PM
Folkiedave 04 Sep 04 - 02:18 PM
Wyrd Sister 04 Sep 04 - 01:50 PM
GUEST 04 Sep 04 - 06:21 AM
Manitas_at_home 04 Sep 04 - 03:29 AM
Liz the Squeak 03 Sep 04 - 04:51 PM
Bernard 03 Sep 04 - 04:49 PM
Wyrd Sister 03 Sep 04 - 04:43 PM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum Child
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:













Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 06 Sep 04 - 05:01 AM

We used to itch when we spent the week in tents on a temporary campsite with very limited washing facilities. Things are not so bad since I have been in cottages with proper baths and showers.
We did try to sell a "Scratch and Sniff" book one year, but there were no takers...
Quack!!
GtD.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:51 PM

What if Morris' sides don't itch?

Dave Oesterreich


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:42 PM

It's getting VERY late - further parts to follow another day.
Quack!
GtD.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:37 PM

Whitby Scratch (History - Part 2)
When I first danced with Whitby Scratch I was a member of Boars Head Morrismen (Bradford). We wore blue tabards and a 3 cornered hat.
I danced with the scratch wearing a 3 cornered hat and blue tabard.
Other people out dancing that year belonged to different morris teams. They did not wear 3 cornered hats. They danced dances I didn't know and if they did a dance I knew from Boars Head repertoire, they did a different version of it.
It didn't matter!
The audience - once it was explained to them - could understand that people who dance with an assortment of different dance teams should not be expected to do steps in the same way.
What the audience did appreciate was the fact that we were performing for THEM. We were not hiding away in a darkened room "playing with ourselves" we were out trying our best to entertain them.
Years have passed, and these days we have our own "team colours", but our agenda is still to dance to the best of our ability and to entertain an audience. Some people seem to have a problem that our crowds enjoy what we do. I cannot understand why! Perhaps it is because our collection is no longer handed to the organisers of the folk festival. It buys T-shirts for the dancers instead.
Quack!
GtD.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:16 PM

I'm not really sure why this letter has been stuck into this forum. I don't actually see it as being relevant to anything. The letter itself is certainly either misinformed or mischievous and if it had been sent here by the original author (I don't know who that was) I would have regarded it as Trolling.
I assume that our respected Wyrd Sister is NOT the author of the original letter.

The letter appears to have the purpose of denigrating two morris dance teams. One which appears at Sidmouth Folk Festival and calls itself "Motley Morris" or something similar. The other being Whitby Scratch.
I have never been in a position (due to either finances or holiday allocation from work ) to be able to get to Sidmouth, so I don't know who dances there. I do, however, know a lot about Whitby Folk Week, as I have not missed a year there since 1981.
I arrived in Whitby the year I had finished University and made friends with an assortment of people. That first year I was invited to join the Friday end of festival parade by the musicians accompanying a country Dance display team. I can't after all this time recall what the dancers were called, but the musicians who made me welcome were Mick Peat and Barry Renshaw of the Ripley Wayfarers.
The following year I had started dancing with Boars Head Morrismen of Bradford. Before going to Folk Week, I was advised to take my morris kit along with me. I did so, and found myself dancing with Whitby Scratch.
I could at this point give you a brief history of Whitby Scratch Morris Team, but 22 years with the same dance side does not fit in a single paragraph. In fact, it would not even start to be covered by a pamphlet. It has covered friendships, marriages, births, deaths (Not ALL of these during the actual week), floods, scorching sunshine and some of the moments in my life which I am most proud of, in particular some of the best Morris Dancing I have ever witnessed. I have watched the children of Scratch morris men grow to be adults with children of their own.
One thing which the Whitby Scratch Morris Dance Team is NOT is Ad-Hoc. We have a long history of organisation and performing in public, in fact we have danced during Folk Week more frequently than any other dance team I am aware of. Our aims and goals in life are to entertain an audience and put on a show. Something which many "dance sides" do not do.
We are a "Scratch" team in the definition that we round-up stray moris dancers and invite them to dance out with us, but the core of the team are people who have danced together for up to two decades, which is considerably longer than the members of some "Booked" dance sides.
(THUS ENDS PART 1)
(several other bits to follow!!!!)
Quack!!
Geoff the (Whitby Scratch)Duck.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: GUEST,Anne Croucher
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:09 PM

The professionals?

Anyone who wants to be - apparently.

It seems that these days there is no room for doing things on an ordinary level, just for the enjoyment of it.

Surely at Sidmouth, where there are places people can go and pay money to see morris sides go through their hopefully polished and perfect performances, there should be somewhere for the waifs and strays who just like dancing.

Anyone offended by the happy souls they find dancing or playing for one hour (6.30pm onwards opposite The Marine)need only shield their eyes and pass on.

Anne


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: GUEST,nikkih
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 07:38 PM

when I first went to Whitby the scratch morris was made up of morrismen who had turned up without the rest of their side/team and who wanted to dance. They got together and made up a team for the week and performed Cotswold morris. They were all good dancers, enjoyed the week and the audience showed their appreciation with a generous contribution to the 'bag'. In recent years it has become something else that is not as well received and is at times as previously mentioned an embarressment to the morris world.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: M'Grath of Altcar
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 03:08 PM

Not many morris tunes are minor


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: ced2
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 02:10 PM

Do scratch morris sides have fleas? If so I really pity them, in addition to the leg-bell affliction to have fleas must drive them to distraction. Come to think of it does that not explain something?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Folkiedave
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:26 AM

Ann,

This basic right to be an amateur that you believe in - who are the professionals?

Dave


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:19 AM

Readers of Practical Classics magazine have voted on their top 100 favorite cars, and top of the pile came the Morris Minor beating other favourites such as the E-type and the MGB.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 08:14 AM

"Fifty years on and the Morris Travellor seems set to provide comfortable, reliable transport for some years to come. It's been said before that the Morris Minor was a vehicle ahead of its time. Who would have believed fifty years ago that we'd be talking of the Traveller as everyday transport in the 21st century"

So please don't scratch the sides respect them.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: jonm
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 04:15 AM

When the morris is done abroad, both local folkies and the general populace love it - it has the tradition and obvious history in the movements and the music, but it also has the vigour, violence and often the precision that European folk dances lack, even though they are taken vety seriously by their public and their media.

On a world-class stage like a major festival, reported in the international press and televised, English traditions need to be presented at the highest possible standard - quality music, precise, vigorous dancing by well-practised sides, where only those teams with a track record of quality performance are invited. Anything less is inviting the press to ridicule the whole folk community.

We need to be taken seriously by audiences, particularly on a major stage, even though I know of no morris man who actually takes himself/herself seriously. It is more than possible to have a laugh while putting on a high-standard show. This is what ALL the other teams at ALL the other festivals were doing!

I dance with three Ring clubs who all put on good shows while having a good time. Unfamiliar dances get practised at pubs with no audience and we turn up the wick for a good crowd. I have also danced or played with half a dozen Open/Federation sides with the same philosophy.

There is a place for the motley morris - it's good fun, but, since it's not done for the benefit of the audience, why not do it away from crowds? I have danced with scratch teams in the past most enjoyably, although they were generally made up of dancers with enough ability and experience to put on a credible showing even when performing dances for the first time (!) - and we all made the effort to turn up in kit!

The Hinckley Bullockers go out on the Saturday nearest to Plough Monday. The dances are simple, most men have only practised them once beforehand, the kit is basic but distinctive (most men could knock it up from what's already in the average morris wardrobe) and the performances are entertaining and anarchic, increasingly so as the beer wears on. Dancing is done to small audeinces who enjoy the anarchy, but recognise from the "team" element that this is intentional. Any old scratch team with random kit or no kit doesn't have this - and the Bullockers are performing in small villages.

The One Day Wonders are another side - they get together on a Friday night once a year, seven dancers and a musician, and an appointed foreman teaches half a dozen dances nobody has ever done before. On the Saturday, the team goes out and performs those dances at pre-booked venues. The "buzz" of the unfamiliar is there, but the standard of dancing is extremely high.

Dancing unfamiliar dances with new friends is good fun and most enjoyable, but it's place is in massed morris or away from critical audiences. On an international stage, the only way to give credibility to the tradition (something we need if we are going to attract new recruits) is for performances to be of the highest possible standard.

My equally opinionated two penn'orth.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 05 Sep 04 - 03:52 AM

Actually, I've seen a world reknowned (sp? - it's a bad day) team dance, in a highly public format, using different styles within the same dance. It all depends on whom they learned the dance from. Two part (i.e., not complete) teams combine to form one whole team and they deliberately stick to their own style.

At least Motley admit to being bits of allsorts - that's what Motley means!

LTS


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: GUEST,Anne Croucher
Date: 04 Sep 04 - 09:23 PM

I have gone along to watch the Motley Morris during Sidmouth week for many years, but am unaware of any 'stunt' they were involved in last year. This year I decided to get more involved and took my drum along, and it was great.

I feel that there is a basic right to be an amateur, fundamental to the British psyche - in an environment where there are lots of polished performers, dozens of well rehersed and uniformed groups there has to be a place for those who arrive without a team, without 'the right kit' - and the Motley Morris provides it.

The dancers do go wrong sometimes, they are not always in step and their performance of the steps varies - but why is that a bad thing?

Are we so fixated with Performance Art that the dance is not important? As for 'the audience' - we don't have to accept a TV mentality, total separation between performers and audience is a very modern concept. So is the Morris Ring come to that.

I am a singer - but I do not perform for an audience, I expect the involvement of others, that is Folk.

The Motley Morris is just people being there and doing the dances for the dance - not for the side - not really for the onlookers, just for the joy of it.

They have not disrupted other sides or performers, not that I have ever seen - I have never even seen a dancer get into a pet, or an argument of any kind. I have seen them demonstrating steps, explaining the order of the dance, first one person then another, so as to make the best they can of their diversity.

That is not anarchic behaviour - that bit of the promenade that week is possibly the only bit of truely democratic ground in the country.

Anne


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Folkiedave
Date: 04 Sep 04 - 02:18 PM

The letter was serious and was first published in the Morris Federation newsletter. I was unaware of it being republished elsewhere.

I can only agree with the sentiments wholeheartedly.

When Morris dancing is treated so badly by the media in general (and often deservedly so) then to give people the opportunity to mock it further seems daft to me. Some people treat their traditions seriously (the rest of Western Europe for example)and are treated equally seriously by their media. We often don't, and thus we get the media we deserve.

As for giving people the opportunity to learn new dances I am all in favour. But then to show the public an ill-practised, recently-learnt, dance? Why? Poor singers do it and they remain poor singers.

If people need to behave like prats perhaps they could do it in the privacy of their own homes.

Incidentally the person who wrote the letter was happy to include his name. Why has it been omitted?

Best regards,

Dave Eyre
Sheffield City Morris.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Wyrd Sister
Date: 04 Sep 04 - 01:50 PM

I'm afraid it is a very serious letter, faithfully transcribed. No catheters inserted.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Sep 04 - 06:21 AM

This is extracting the urine, it's not a serious letter, IS IT?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 04 Sep 04 - 03:29 AM

Just a point,the Motley Morris at Sidmouth is, in fact, very well established and has been running for at least 20 years. It's a good opportunity for people to learn new dances and refresh their knowledge of old ones.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 03 Sep 04 - 04:51 PM

Hmm... at least when Hammersmith disrupt a dance, they do it in full and proper kit, with the good grace to accept it back when it happens to them (even if it's a giant doing it!)

One day, someone is going to turn on the likes of Scratch Morris and it's not going to be pretty or a good advert for Morris dancing.

LTS


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Scratch Morris sides
From: Bernard
Date: 03 Sep 04 - 04:49 PM

Rather pompous... making a valid point, but badly...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: Scratch Morris sides
From: Wyrd Sister
Date: 03 Sep 04 - 04:43 PM

Here is a letter sent to the Morris Ring Circular Number 46, Spring this year and therefore referring to 2003.
Comments please!


"This is the time of year that we review the highs and lows of last season and make plans for next year. There is ( quite rightly) some debate within the morris movement about how we maintain standards. However, most of us agree that we should avoid giving ammunition to those members of the public who are all too ready to mock morris dancing. In this regard, two events last summer caused concern to a number of dance sides and festival organisers. Both involved unscheduled performances by 'ad hoc' dance teams. Neither did anything to enhance the reputation of Cotswold Morris. We witnessed both, and have been encouraged by a number of people to raise this matter openly.
The first event, at Sidmouth Festival, involved 'Motley Morris'. Not the established border side of the same name, but a random group of dancers who were not even in kit and who had clearly made little or no effort to standardise their dancing. Nevertheless, they danced at an official performance spot alongside invited teams, from England and overseas. Sidmouth calls itself 'First Amongst Festivals' and has a justified reputation at home and abroad. Consequently, members of the public, and international dance teams, could assume that the cheerful shambles of Motley Morris represents an acceptable standard for English traditional dance reinforcing the poor public image of Morris dancing.
Although their stunt backfired, at least Motley were well-meaning. The same cannot be said of 'Scratch Morris' who disrupted another excellent festival at Whitby. In past years their stunts at Whitby have included 'gatecrashing' the 1999 dance finale photo (which was meant to be used as the millennium programme front cover), and offending many by starting to carry a mock coffin in the parade. This year, they invaded the parade, barracked and attempted to trip dancers from another team, and 'gatecrashed' the finale at the bandstand after being explicitly told by the dance coordinator not to perform there. They had clearly set out to annoy Organisers and performers alike.
There is a long history of fooling in Morris and the best teams (Great Western, Windsor etc) can hardly be accused of lacking in humour. Their comedy, however, is an adjunct to the dance. The clown on the high wire is the best acrobat, not someone larking about and bringing the show into disrepute. As the squire of one team said to us ' there are enough people taking the mickey out of Morris dancing without morris dancers doing it'. Every experienced Morris Fool knows that there is a fine line between being funny and silly. This stuff is well the wrong side of the line.
There may be debate about the value of such performances on aesthetic or historical grounds. After all, some of these folks are experienced dancers. They may genuinely believe that what others regard as their tatty kit and their erratic dancing are representations of the anarchic, anti-authority spirit of the "real" Morris tradition. We should try to avoid becoming embroiled in a sterile internal wrangle, and think instead about what the public might want to see. Roy Dommett wisely observed (albeit in a different context) that what matters is not so much what dancers think, but whether they perform what the audience enjoys watching. Judging by the hostile reception they received from the crowd at Whitby, Scratch Morris still have a good deal to learn about pleasing audiences. Be that as it may, their habit of wilfully disrupting performances by booked teams at public dance events is wholly unforgivable.
Best wishes"


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
  Share Thread:
More...

Reply to Thread
Subject:  Help
From:
Preview   Automatic Linebreaks   Make a link ("blue clicky")


Mudcat time: 16 June 3:34 PM EDT

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 2022 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.