BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 14 Jan 16 - 04:48 AM

The fact that Arabs are also a semitic people is a semantic irrelevance. The term 'Antisemitism', by long usage which to any linguist trumps adventitious & factitious etymology, only means prejudice against Jews -- consult any decent dictionary*. The affectation that it must mean Arabs too is a profoundly irritating bit issue-muddying smartarsery.

≈M≈

*eg in online Dictionary.com, the sole definition is

noun
1.
discrimination against or prejudice or hostility toward Jews.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Jan 16 - 04:10 AM

"Arabs are Semites."
And I'm not supporting any antisemitism - but accusations of "antisemitism" whenever the behaviour of the Israeli regime is brought up is both damaging to the Jewish people and is antisemitic according to the definition of the term accepted by the Jewish people - the right wing extremist government in Israel does not represent 'the Jewish people' and linking their behaviour to them is as bad as the activities of the worst antisemetics
"However, criticism of Israel similar to that leveled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic."
From 'Zionism on the web'
Jim Carroll

A FURTHER NATIONAL CAMPAIGN
MORE STILL
IS THERE NO END TO THIS PERSECUTION

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 11:46 PM

Jim Carroll: "Perhaps it might help if the Antisemites among us stop accusing The Jews for the Israeli regimes terrorism."

Arabs are Semites. Your bias is misplaced, and therefore fictional.

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 08:21 PM

"Only Jews are singled out for death."
Perhaps it might help if the Antisemites among us stop accusing The Jews for the Israeli regimes terrorism.
No backers for your "Ben Gurion didn't say it campaign" yet Keith?
Must be lonely up there.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 02:27 PM

I believe that Greg, in his usual inimitable fashion, is trying to make an equivalence between the attack on the Dawabsha family by a gang of Israeli extremists, who have been caught and arrested, with the national terror campaign targeting Jews orchestrated by the Palestinian Government of Abbas. Nice try there Greg but it don't wash.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 02:12 PM

Greg,
Have any Arab Israelis been targeted?
If not, what is your point?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 02:06 PM

Unless, of course, they happen to be Muslim/Palestinian Israelis....... ???????

I haven't heard of Palestinian terrorists targeting Muslim/Palestinian Israelis. If it has happened it was a case of mistaken identity - the killers thinking the victim was a Jew.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 02:00 PM

The victims are not just Israelis. Only Jews are singled out for death.

Unless, of course, they happen to be Muslim/Palestinian Israelis.......

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 01:47 PM

Only Jews are singled out for death.

Exactly, this is from Haaretz, don't forget.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 01:23 PM

he wave of knifings and car-rammings against Israelis is a national campaign

Surely some mistake.
The victims are not just Israelis. Only Jews are singled out for death.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 12:52 PM

"is a national campaign "
ANOTHER NATIONAL CAMPAIGN
AND ANOTHER
AND YET ANOTHER
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 12:50 PM

Jim, I have not denied that he said it. I just pointed out that it was very unconvincing, and that even if he did say it, he was only stating the well known Arab view.
My question, given all that, is why you think it worth posting?!
It is about three times now.
Why?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 12:12 PM

"Mahmoud Abbas' recent statements, unreported in the West, show that the wave of knifings and car-rammings against Israelis is a national campaign whose fighters act according to the directives of their leadership."

Haaretz

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 10:47 AM

Do you actually have any grounds for claiming that Ben Gurion didn't make the statement - if so, what are they - so far you have just denied it because it doesn't suit your arguments in favour of State terrorism
Jim Carroll
Another interesting quote from a Zionist Rabbi
"Speaking of quotes, here is one from Vladimir Jabotinsky, father of Revisionist Zionism: "The Arabs loved their country as much as the Jews did. Instinctively,
they understood Zionist aspirations very well, and their decision to resist them
was only natural ….. There was no misunderstanding between Jew and Arab, but
a natural conflict. …. No Agreement was possible with the Palestinian Arab;
they would accept Zionism only when they found themselves up against an 'iron wall,' when they realize they had no alternative but to accept Jewish settlement."

I saw somewhere an account of a speech that Moshe Dayan gave, back in the '50's, at a funeral of an Israeli killed in a terrorist attack. I wish I could find the source. But his speech was described as starting out sounding like an eloquent defense of the right of Palestinians to resist. He talked of how they lost land and homes, and spoke poignantly of what it must be like to look across a border at your home, but not be allowed to go back to it. But then he went on to say basically what Jabotinsky said – some version of, "They may have a right to fight us but we have to win."

As I frequently point out in arguments about the history of the I/P situation, such quotes prove that the facts are not really in dispute. No serious historian believes that the Zionists just settled on empty land, or even that the Palestinians didn't have valid reasons to resist. The dispute is all about values. Benny Morris was one of the first Israeli mainstream historians to expose the ethnic cleansing of Palestine (Palestinian historians, of course, were saying this from the beginning). But Morris then concludes by saying basically the same thing as Ben Gurion, Jabotinsky, Dayan and the others – "Yeah, we did it, but it was necessary and we had to win."

It is both necessary to be educated about the facts, as well as to look at with what system of values we view them. Thankfully, we have the Henry Cliffords, the Phil Weiss's and the Adam Horowitz's of the world around to remind us of both.

To understand the history of Palestinian dispossession look to the words of Zion

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 10:18 AM

"Wrong. He is supposed to have said it in an uncorroborated private conversation in 1956."
Which has never been denied by anybody other than you - a touch of meglomaia, I think.
Do you not find irt a bit lonely to be th only person on the planet to deny he ever made the statement? It would worry me.
"Anyway, he only gave the Arab view,"
There you go - two for the price of one - he didn't say it but he meant something else ----- get help
Even David Irving makes a better fist of Holocaust denial
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 09:17 AM

Jim,
You have supplied not one shred of evidence (despite you two contradictory reasons) for David Ben Gurion's statement either being a fake or his not meaning what he said

Wrong. He is supposed to have said it in an uncorroborated private conversation in 1956.
It was first related in 1978.
That would not stand up in court Jim.

Anyway, he only gave the Arab view, which we all know so what is your point in posting it?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 08:36 AM

Keith
You have supplied not one shred of evidence (despite you two contradictory reasons) for David Ben Gurion's statement either being a fake or his not meaning what he said.
It is a one man campaign to debunk the words of the Father of Israel - there's dedication for you.
You are the self-appointed David Irving of Israeli State Terrorism.
"Scandinavian countries, EU and other European countries, countries like Canada, Australia and India, do not make those wild accusations against Israel.
They have friendly relations and trade."
The Us is one of Israel's strongest supporters yet for 14 years it bombed a South East Asian country with missiles containing napalm and toxic Agent Orange which even gave its own pilots cancer.
No country, certainly those you mention, openly supports Israel,s behaviour in the Middle East - not one - and the Israeli regime is condemned worldwide by every human rights group - yet you go with the politicians - why wouldn't you?
Wot - no historians!!!!! I have no doubt they're waiting in the wings to be called.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 07:54 AM

I believe we have us an imposter folks. I do not believe that Mr. Bridge, in spite of the disdain he has expressed towards Israel and Jews, would link to such a hateful and virulently antisemitic blog as evidenced above. I hope I am not proven wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 05:25 AM

Terrorism, Again (Israel)

Terrorism, Again (Philadelphia).

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Jan 16 - 01:53 AM

"Anti western". Evidence please.

Most regimes in the world, and so most in UN, are corrupt dictatorships and/or irrational theocracies.
They easily outvote the liberal democracies.

Scandinavian countries, EU and other European countries, countries like Canada, Australia and India, do not make those wild accusations against Israel.
They have friendly relations and trade.

In 1956 the UN had not accused Israel of stealing any Arab land.

It is only in recent years that the UN has become predominantly anti Western.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge on the network
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 10:51 PM

https://truthdox.wordpress.com/2015/08/28/israelis-raping-children-report/

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge on the network
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 10:46 PM

Let's see, what are the stats currently doing the rounds on facebook? 40% of Arab children arrested by Israeli forces are sexually molested and 100% are tortured - are those the stated statistics?

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 07:47 PM

"Anti western". Evidence please.

1956. Fuck all to do with my post. Apology please

The diatribe by braidedbeardedbruce. - Nobody gives a fuck about Zionism and its criminal terrorist aims inspired by Sky pixies. To equate the disgusting mindset of the Israeli government to the plight of Europeand who happened to be Jews is not only repugnant but shows your ignorance of a situation and geography you know absolutely nothing about but have some ancestory claim on, judging by your post.

Fine. I have ancestors who rolled in shit.

How does it feel and smell? I have no fucking idea.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again (Israel)
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 06:56 PM

all fellow Jew haters to hop onto the thread to perform their usual Israel bashing song and dance number

"Jew-Haters" like Shin Bet, obviously.

Seems the usual Israeli apologist crowd crowd is still pushing "Its not my fault, Mommie - it all started when Johnnie hit me back!!!"

Plus c'est la même chose...

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 03:21 PM

In 1956 Musket?
The UN had only created Israel eleven years previously.
In 1956 the UN had not accused Israel of stealing any Arab land.

It is only in recent years that the UN has become predominantly anti Western.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 02:42 PM

I'm with The UN on this one

No surprise there: Anti-Semitism in the UN

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 02:29 PM

"He was supposed to have said it in a private conversation in 1956. (1956!!)"
So ***** what Keith - you went through somersaults and finally landed on "he said it but he didn't mean it"
Go off and find one of your "real historians" who sell their books in "real bookshops" to show us he didn't say it - it's a world-wide, well known quote which has never been denied by anyone other than you.
Are you insane to take it on yourself to deny a quote from someone like Ben Gurion?
Of course they stole Arab lands and are still stealing it, and are slaughtering men women and children in order to do so - or maybe that's another myth!!!!!
What are you on Keith - atrocity-denial overdrive, it would appear
Sheeesh!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 02:25 PM

"They had not stolen any land"

I'm with The UN on this one, rather than Keith.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Wolfgang
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 02:25 PM

But Israelis and Arabs can have so much in common...

After the events in Cologne (mentioned in at least two deleted threads) some Germans feel that they have to take the law in their own hands. Among several attacks there was one in Dresden where two Israelis were beaten up and injured by half a dozen most likely right wing (Neonazi?) youngsters screaming "Fucking Arabs".
I ponder if it would have helped them to tell their attackers that they are mistaken or if that would have increased their plight.

Wolfgang (off topic)

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 01:15 PM

Not true Jim.
He was supposed to have said it in a private conversation in 1956. (1956!!)
It was related in a book published in 1978, but no-one else can corroborate it.
Deny any of that?

If he did say it, he is only giving his perception of the Arab view, and we all know that was the Arab view anyway.

So what is your point Jim. He may or may not have said that, in 1956, Arabs thought Jews had stolen their land.
They had not stolen any land.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 08:17 AM

Just a reminder Keith
When I first raised this, you denied it was ever said because the source was not verified.
You then did an about turn and agreed he said it, but didn't mean it - he was "only pitting the Arabs' point of view"
Now, it appears, you have done another about face and are claiming that the quote has not been verified.
You are not very good at your terrorism appeasement, are you - you can't even stick to your own script.
What kind of rrjits do you take us for when you can't even remember your own excuses.
Jeeezzz-us
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 08:00 AM

"You should be prepared to verify your quotes Jim."
Done that Keith - you have had the indisputable source and bent over backwards to show either it was a fake, or Ben Gurion didn't mean what he said - two different arguments - take your pick
It's about time you started explaining you persistent support for Israeli terrorism - it's inhumanly sickening.
"I am surprised you keep trying to get away with it."
Jim Caroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 07:49 AM

that sickening, undemocratic pro-Israel lobby in America

There are 3,700 registered lobbies in the US, are they all undemocratic or just the Jewish ones?

That brings to mind this little gem I came across on Facebook from a couple of your fellow travelers:

Rik Little If I can I stay away from preloaded titles like Jew. It wastes too much time arguing with idiots. I say Zionists or AIPAC worshipers.


David Blomstrom The problem is that "Zionist" doesn't include Jewish bankers, the Jews who control the media, etc. A better term is actually "Jewish Mafia," but I still often use "Jews" simply because the Jewish Mafia is so big.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 07:23 AM

You should be prepared to verify your quotes Jim.
We have discussed this one before so you know you can not verify it.
I am surprised you keep trying to get away with it.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 06:59 AM

Prove othewise Keith - go away and appease your own paricular brand of terrorism
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 06:52 AM

Not verified Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 05:59 AM

"The blood of every man, woman and child killed in Gaza is on the hands of Hamas and Hamas alone. "
"If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign a contract with Israel. It's normal: We took their land. It's true, that it was promised to us by God, but why should they care? Our God is not their God. There were anti-Semites, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was it their fault? They only see one thing: We came and stole their land. Why should they accept that?"
David Ben Gurion
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 05:23 AM

Some say good old Michael
Some say 🐮💩👻

Right back to yer. Chat later when the sanatogen kicks in.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 04:00 AM

Howdee Popgun-Me-Darl'n'

Rambleramble·duffduff ritebak2U

x❤x❤x

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 03:29 AM

Your first sentence is where you should have stopped. It is as accurate as you have ever been.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 12 Jan 16 - 03:14 AM

Not much to add really. Other than pointing out to Lilo that I have never been there on holiday ever. So you see, rather than face up to the obscene image of families pushed out of their homes which were then bulldozed under a racist agenda, with the Israeli army keeping watch, our pro thug set prefer to make things up about those pointing out the repugnant Israeli program.

Shame on you Lilo. Braidedbeardedbruce is a fool and Michael is a rambling old duffer whose rants are irrelevant and at best, humoured. But I thought you preferred to be taken seriously.

Tosser.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 09:36 PM

The usual delusional bigots are all on your side Greg. Guess what, every thread you start ain't always gonna go your way !

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 09:26 PM

So Greg, I guess you were expecting your all fellow Jew haters to hop onto the thread to perform their usual Israel bashing song and dance number but they didn't show up so you're skulking off. Aw well, nite nite then.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Greg F.
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 09:05 PM

Yup- some old Low, High, and Bearded Bullshit in spades. Should have known better, I suppose, than expect rationality from the usual delusional bigots. Adios.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 09:00 PM

The only high ground they hold is the high ground they've stolen for their illegal settlements.

International Law Officially Recognizes Jewish Claims in Judea and Samaria

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 07:45 PM

Hi Greg , imagine you wanting something actually said,,, well, I never... You are so clever... !

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 07:14 PM

The blood of every man, woman and child killed in Gaza is on the hands of Hamas and Hamas alone. You know that but you are blinded by your hatred. That is obvious.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 07:06 PM

Well Mr Netanyahu would have had to work overtime to visit the bedsides of all the children that were maimed or killed under his command last time out in Gaza. This is not about superior knowledge. It's about clearing your head of all the pro-Israel lies and propaganda that you've been suckered into believing by the overwhelming mass of the media and by that sickening, undemocratic pro-Israel lobby in America. As for my demanding respect, I don't give a damn whether people like you with your obnoxious notions respect me or not, so why don't you just go and play on the railway. And, to be honest, this thread is probably going nowhere. The original point has already been swamped.   We've done it all to death and I for one have no desire to give bigots oxygen. You can carry on without me. Now back to the Bowie tribute shows if you don't mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST,Pete from seven stars link
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 07:06 PM

....amen....

Subject: RE: BS: Terrorism, Again
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Jan 16 - 06:52 PM

I find it so ironic how upset you people (that being Greg. F, Musket, and Steve Shaw) get when someone even remotely counters your views (not even to mention offends you or demeans you--heaven forbid!), and then you outright assault and demean others and act like it's totally not the same thing. If you demand respect, show it first and maybe it would be actually earned.