BS: Sausage bagels?

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Bev and Jerry
Date: 17 Nov 01 - 08:14 PM

Mark:

We missed the one in Ashland. Actually we missed a lot of them because bagel stores are very transitive. They open and close with great frequency so it's hard to catalog them all.

Our candidate for the best name for a bagel store is "Los Bagels" in Eureka, California. They got a 4-1/2 bagel rating, too.

Bev and Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Mark Cohen
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 10:39 PM

Bev and Jerry, I had just tried to post something with a similar thrust to yours (but not nearly as clear or comprehensive--bravo!), but my ISP ate it. Did you find the bagel place in Ashland, OR, by the way? There was somebody I met at Fiddle Tunes in 1989, can't remember her name but you probably know her as she's from San Francisco, whose uncle had opened a bagel store there. Or something like that.

You can definitely NOT find good bagels in Hawaii. Now that our island economy is on life support, the State government is putting out radio ads telling all of us to call our friends on the Mainland to come and visit. So when you do, BRING BAGELS!! In fact, if someone wanted to open a bagel store on the Big Island, I would be first in line on Sunday morning! Actually, you would probably do quite well on the Kona side of the island. So I'd just have to get up at 5AM and drive over there!

I agree with you, Alex, but it's a little like music. (See! I'm making this a music thread!) I might enjoy listening to an eclectic rock band like the Otters playing Amazing Grace, but I still know what is and is not a traditional arrangement of a song. Yes, I do eat cinnamon-raisin bagels sometimes...but I grew up eating plain and poppy and sesame seed bagels, that fought back, alone or with lox and cream cheese; that's the tradition I know, and that's the tradition I honor. (SFX: "Havah Nagila" up and out.)

Aloha,
Mark

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: SINSULL
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 07:28 PM

Sad but true - it is tough to find "real" NY bagels in NY! I blame it all on the Lenders brothers who should have known better. Old fashioned bagels also contained a small amount of malt syrup for leavening, flavor, and color. Now bagel makers throw in anything from brown sugar to corn syrup solids, then wonder why it tastes like crap!
There is a tiny place on Henry Street that mkaes fresh bagels and bialy which are sold hot from the oven to a waiting line of people. No need for butter or cream cheese. Can't wait anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: catspaw49
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 07:18 PM

Yeah Alex, you are.

Bev and Jerry...great article!! And yes I too am one who detests both the designer bagels and cream cheese as well. When it comes to really wanting a great bagel,you can also take all of those lower fat/no fat cream cheeses as well....and the whipped stuff sucks too!!!!

Heaven is a place where you get a great Salt Bagel perfectly toasted, with a full cup of room temperature cream cheese........and you no longer have to worry about arterial disease.

On the other hand, I've been known, in complete desperation mind you, to eat some really hideous bagels with a white stuff purporting to be cream cheese. If you haven't tried one yet, my vote for the worst freakin' bagel ever goes to those same folks who screwed up bread......Wonder Bagels!

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: mousethief
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 06:50 PM

I choose my foods by how much *I* enjoy their flavor and texture -- not by adherence to some ridiculous standard (e.g. real Jewish bagels don't have cinnamon). I suppose I'm a culinary philistine. So be it.

Alex

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: RangerSteve
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 06:41 PM

The hole in a bagel should be so small that a baby's littlest finger won't fit through it. And as far as the designer flavors that someone above mentioned, I recently came across another abomination: designer cream cheese - blueberry, raspberry, every other fruit and CHOCOLATE for Pete's sake. Cream cheese, like bagels need to be left alone. These were probably invented by the same infidels who put cauliflower and brocoli on pizza.

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Bev and Jerry
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 04:00 PM

Here's an excerpt from a paper we wrote which rated bagels available on the west coast of North America from San Diego to Vancouver:

A proper bagel is fresh, large and has the correct texture. That is, it has a hard crust and a very chewy inside and eating one should pose a threat to your dental work. This is normally achieved by boiling the bagels prior to baking and by using high gluten flour. "State of the art" bagelries inject steam into the oven to get a similar but inferior effect which is considerably cheaper to produce. The best bagels are still produced by hand and boiled before baking. If you don't see armies of people doing hand work in the kitchen, go somewhere else.

Traditionally, bagels can be plain (or water), egg, garlic, salt, onion, rye, poppy seed, or sesame seed. Non-Jewish flavors introduced recently include cinnamon-raisin, whole wheat, pizza, cheese, jalapeno, apple-raisin, bran, and blueberry. These "designer flavors" are to be detested!

Bagel prices range from about $3.00 per dozen to about $6.00 per dozen. It is theoretically possible to buy less than a dozen but why would you? Price is not necessarily an indicator of quality. If you buy more than you can eat today (several dozen, for example) ask for free freezer bags. Bagels will keep for weeks in the freezer unless eaten. Thirty seconds in the microwave will restore them to life and you can then toast them (or not). Never put warm bagels into freezer bags because moisture will condense on the inside of the bag and the bagels will become wet.

Bagels can be eaten whole (especially if they are still warm from the oven) or they can be sliced in half horizontally. Slicing them vertically is considered bad form and is a sure sign of a novice. If you have sliced the bagel correctly, you should be able to make a sandwich out of the two halves. After toasting, they should be slathered with butter, margarine, or (preferably) cream cheese. Don't spread hummus, peanut butter or jelly on them or you'll be drummed out of the corps.

What the ratings mean:

One bagel - round bread, only the shape is correct

Two bagels - What you find in Safeway's in-store bakery

Three bagels - Beginning to approximate a real bagel. Typical of automated factories.

Four bagels - Close but definitely lacking in flavor, texture or size

Five bagels - A culinary masterpiece ready for the Olympic bagel competition

Only west coast bagels have been considered in this study. In Chicago, Miami, and (especially) New York the ratings extend to six, seven or even eight bagels.

Our daughter brought us genuine, honest-to-God, New York bagels. We cut one in half and put it in our toaster oven. Now when our toaster oven is finished, it not only turns off and opens, but the rack moves out and up towards you as if it is proudly serving its results to you. However, it could not lift this bagel! Our toaster oven developed a hernia and we had to take it to the small appliance hospital for treatment. It is expected to recover but let this be a lesson.

Bev and Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Don Firth
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 01:19 AM

Tragic! I ran out of roast garlic mayo last week. As a cook, my absolute peak was the peanut butter and grape jelly sandwich. I was also a master-chef with a frozen dinner and a microwave. But then, I discovered bagels. I'm still experimenting. This is the next frontier!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 11:31 PM

DF, You A**hole! *G* Thanks for making me drool all over the keyboard!

What, no roast-garlic mayonnaise? No roasted and peeled red peppers? Maybe you said that-- I dunno and I ain't gonna read it again-- I had to skim it for my own good!

~Susan

PS, so you're cooking for the next MudGather, right?

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 01:03 PM

Take one good-sized bagel and split it. Lather the bottom half with Dijon mustard, layer on the pastrami, add a slice of mozzarella cheese, top off with a slice of onion. Spread a dollop of baba ghanoush or hummus (loaded with garlic) on the top half of the bagel, then assemble. It leaves you with a breath you can peel paint with, but o-o-o-o-o-o-h my!!

I have all the necessary ingredients in the kitchen, and since it's about 10:00 a.m. here, in a couple of hours that's what I'm gonna have for lunch.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 12:20 PM

Okay radriano.......Let's go find some real bread and bagels!!! I'm getting hungry reading this thread and your description of what I agree is "proper rye" was graphic.....I can smell it!!! I can feel it!!! And I wish I had some to taste...........and maybe some first cut Hebrew National corned beef and.................

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: radriano
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 12:12 PM

In San Francisco we have a lot of "Noah's Bagels" shops which really piss me off. They advertise their product as old style New York bagels which is bull. First of all they're not really bagels and then there is nothing old style about them. They are steamed instead of boiled so the texture is all wrong.

Rye bread is another story. I'm sorry but a bit of brown food coloring does not make a bread rye. I grew up in a Polish neighborhood in Chicago. The local Polish bakery opened at 5 AM. - there was always a line but you came out with a fresh and still steaming loaf of rye bread with that deliciously crunchy crust that was lucky to last past breakfast. As far as I'm concerned once bread is packaged in plastic it's ruined.

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Mr Red
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 12:11 PM

Yea you can get lamb suasages in NZ. Actually trying to get any other kind is quite a problem. I once remrked that I was getting lambed-out (mutton actually) when a lass insisted she knew a pork butcher in Karori. The suasages were pink, and fleshy and tasted - like NZ sausage. Hard lesson, - the market expects. If its bland you want don't "sausage in NZ". BTW they have this wondouress thing they call mutton ham - did have I don't think it caught on. Looked more like cold beef.

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 11:58 AM

I like venison. But I think it's dead deer....

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 11:55 AM

Ya' know 'Fox, it makes me think of Bill Sables and his "proper" Yorkshire tea. Certain foods have spread themselves out over the world and people readily eat them and yet they are poor imitations of the "proper ________."

It's hard to find a proper bagel. And, in Columbus, I can find only two "proper delis." There is one good bagel shop. Maybe you have to be in NYC to find them in any numbers.....or Boca Raton.(:<))

I do feel fortunate to be reasonably close to a real Italian meat shop. And we have a great butcher shop in this tiny village where you can get several midwestern specialties......like decent sausage and trail bologna......and they process a lot of deer too and if you provide them a deer, among the otherfine cuts you get several pounds of the most wonderful deer sausage.........

And why is so much of the rye bread on the market so damn weak in flavor?

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 10:48 AM

Taco Pizza. Don't get the one at Pizza Hut. If you have a Fox's Pizza, those are good.

Also, never put buffalo-wing-flavored chicken and bleu cheese dressing on a cheese pizza. {S{h{u{d}d}e}r}

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Hollowfox
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 10:45 AM

DtG, a friend who was up on such things pointed out to me that in her words "the highest form of kosher is vegetarianism". I don't know about it being the highest form, but it cuts down on inadvertent mistakes, and dishes to wash.
'Spaw, I'm with you. I lived in New York State long enough to know that a proper bagel needs to be boiled before it's baked. These cakey things they have around here are not anywhere near the right consistency; I'm not ready to gum my bagels yet! And what about every #$%^ place that sells a sandwich calling it a delicatessen? Everybody knows a proper deli serves cole slaw in the sandwich! (rant, snort) (You know the definition of a real New York deli? If somebody comes in wearing a mask and demands all the money in the cash register, the employee asks,"Is this to go?")

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: lamarca
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 10:39 AM

My former boss, who is non-religious Jewish, once claimed that agronomists in Israel were raising Kosher pigs. Since the law forbidding pork said something to the effect of "thou shalt not eat of a beast that trods the ground on cloven hooves and does not chew the cud", these farmers were raising their pigs on little raised platforms so their little piggy feet never touched the ground... This story came from a man that used to complain when he couldn't get matzoh at our workplace cafeteria during Passover...so he could eat it along with his pork and beef hotdog on a standard bun!

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: MMario
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 10:16 AM

beef bacon - comes in two types - one made from the short ribs (cured etc just like bacon) and one made from the loin - which is more like "Canadian bacon"

I've only seen it in specialty shops.

You can also occasionally find Beef Ham - which is usually a cured smoked "boneless rump" roast.

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 09:45 AM

I've never tried a Taco Pizza! Sounds delicious and just as daft as the Hawaiian Pizza (Pinapple), The Irish Pizza (Potato) and the German Pizza (Sausage) our local Pizza place serves up!

Beef bacon MM? Tell me more! Anyone know if it is available in the UK? I am not off pork for any religious reasons btw. It's just my doctor said I had to stop eating pig. (Or was it like a pig??? Hmmmm.)

My daughter-in-law is both Jewish and vegitarian btw. We used to have great fun trying to juggle two lots of all the cooking impliments for Sunday breakfast when she stopped over until we discovered Toasted bagels with sauted mushrooms, tomato and a host of other ingredients suitable for all! Aaaaagh. I'm starving now and it's only 14:46:-(

Cheers

Dave the multi-epicureal Gnome

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 09:09 AM

two words: taco pizza

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 08:46 AM

Turkey sausage?

Mit sauerkraut?

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: MMario
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 08:35 AM

use beef bacon - fantastic stuff not found often enough.

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 05:17 AM

Breakfast bagel? Does the runny egg yolk not drip out of the hole? Or do you stuff the sausage through the hole to stop that happening? I couldn't eat one. Not for any religious or cultural reason. It's just too confusing first thing in the morning!

Getting back to the point, I had some wonderful Aberdeen Angus beef suasages the other day. Surely you could still have a kosher meal on your hands is you used something similar. Not sure how you would get around the bacon though \:-?

Cheers

Dave the Gnome

Subject: RE: BS: Sausage bagels?
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 05:03 AM

Yeah Mark, they do.....and there are a number of others that have gotten into the "Breakfast Bagel" idea too. I saw this starting in sandwich shops and a few years ago with the advent of the ham and cheese bagel. Karen and I have laughed about this for years but I guess it just shows the cross culture thing or whatever you want to call it. Interestingly, I never see lox or corned beef on Wonder bread on anyone's menu though. Truly, the bagel has forgotten it's roots...........and I am guilty of really liking bacon/egg/cheese on bagel....just not at McDonalds.....they have really pathetic bagels. every time I have one though, I feel like I'm having something illegal, almost like smoking a joint!

funny story.......nothing to do with religion or bagels, but it kinda' relates in the "lack of respect" or "dumbass American" angle.........Fran Liebowitz wrote that she was pissed about at the number of places that had croissants. everywhere you went, they wanted to serve up whatever it was on a damn croissant. She ended the rant with, "On this block alone they have about 800 places that sell croissants. They even have a place called "Bon Jour Croissant." Makes me want to go to Paris and open a joint called "Hello Toast."

Spaw

Subject: Sausage bagels?
From: Mark Cohen
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 04:22 AM

I heard recently that ever-trendy McDonald's is offering a Bacon and Sausage Bagel. There's got to be a song in there somewhere.

(If you don't see the humor in this, check out the origin of the bagel, and ask me if you still have questions.)

Aloha,
Mark (who really should be getting some sleep since he's obviously not getting any work done)