BS: Annexe and Folkinfo

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 02 Nov 05 - 04:16 AM

Kaleela, I'll second that

sandra

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: Kaleea
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 09:41 PM

Technotalk aside, I truly appreciate the work of fine folks who attempt to maintain sites for we who love & seek knowledge of Folk/Traditional Music.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 09:34 PM

I think I understood about five words of the last fifteen posts.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: MMario
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 11:18 AM

yes jon - you are correct.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 11:16 AM

Actually, the way these things communicate with the database is one small belessing for me at the moment. Rewriting folkinfo from asp to php involves no change to the mySQL database and the SQL statements remain the same (although I have to be a little more careful over case).

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 11:09 AM

Interesting, I've not heard too many bad things about CF, although I'm not disputing the MC case or yours.

I'll pick you up on one point though. Cold Fusion isn't the database, it communicates with the database. I don't know what your place would use but in the case of Mudcat, to the best of my knowledge, I believe it communcates using ODBC for a MS SQLServer database for the main forum and a MS Acess database for the help forum.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: MMario
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 10:46 AM

*grin* my employers hired a third party to write and host our web page (why- we peons can't figure out...after all - that is a service *we* are selling to our clients - and we aren't doing our own??????) and they put the database into cold Fusion - which has crashed repeatedly.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 10:40 AM

I suppose I could explain my moves with folkinfo andother way, Susan.

You know the problem Mudcat is supposed to have with thier Cold Fusion and the costs of upgrading or the huge task to trying to convert to something else.

I am in a sense in a similar situation with folkinfo in that as it stands, I can not afford to run it from home because of software requirements - I can't test on PWS but it is too restricted to host a real site. The options would be to nuy IIS ($1000+) or Sun/Chilliesoft at about $500. Also my need for both php and asp does limit my choice of potential hosts.

I've opted for what would be effectively the same as writing Mudcat into something else, a job I knew would take time (but not this time) in the hope that it works out better than a short term fix in terms of providing a more flexible solution.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 10:23 AM

Well they can once in a while Susan although we have ridden through a lot, ibcluding me being in hospital without adversly affecting our users ans have at least got one site running reliably (and I could have had the other running but I want to change things to guard against events like ISPs doing a runner leaving you high and dey with no contol) very quickly and have tried to keep others informed of where the problems and hold ups have been.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 08:56 AM

How very interesting! ....that the same real-life issues that hinder Mudcat from fulfilling every user's fantasy of a perfect site, appear to affect other sites as well.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: Azizi
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 08:24 AM

I'm glad to see this thread again.

I just hopped over to the Annexe to say "howdy". I guess I should have written some more hip form of hello like Hey!! or Whassup!!
but any way you get my meaning.

;o))

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 06:05 AM

Just thinking of the memory. I'm sure others could do better but when I finaly set the box that blew up for what I had intended, Apache, php, mysql, NFS, NTP, cron. Linux was reporting I was using 80K with the services running. Makes me wonder just how much graphics and other "niceties" add.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 01 Nov 05 - 05:53 AM

Just another update, the box I had planned on using unexpectedly blew up yesterday (motherboard or processor)... this has been fun... started with an eye infection which prevented me from looking at a screen more than 5 minutes at a time.

That will be more time, getting and installing another box (which I can pass on to Pip if I this doesn't work and sell her old one). When trying to run from home, I will always have the option of switching to this box if there is a breakdown but I don't want to start off with only the backup available.

I'm going to try one of these with a S-ATA hard disk and 512Mb Ram.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 29 Oct 05 - 02:26 PM

Sorry about the long delay in providing any more information. Matters were not helped by me being ill for the best part of a month and not up to doing any work on the sites... Anyway, I have started working again and:

I have moved the Annexe back to it's original address, http://www.jonbanjo.com/forum

I have placed redirections on the access routes to the main forum so requests to jonbanjo.org for the main forum page should take people to the right place but if anyone has bookmarks set, I' d suggest they are updated.

I'm sorry if this casues any confusion but I wanted to provide someting fairl quickly with Mudcat being down a long while and it was not possible for me to set up at that time using jonbnjo.com. Now I have got the domain transer started and the nameservers already set to my new host, my life will be easier reverting to the old address (old links, existing email accounts, etc.)

As for folkinfo, I have just started work on it again. The task is proving harder than I had initialy and I won't give a projected completion date at the moment.

My initial plan for folkinfo is to try to host it from home and I now have a spare PC that should do the job. It's a funny site - it doesn;t get an awful lot of traffic but in the relative terms of these music type forums, it does a fair bit of other processing like creation of pdf from abc. It may be more suited to running from home rather than looking for somewhere else to run executables under cgi. Also, although I've no ideas at present, it is possible running from home would open up possibilities I might not want to try on a shared hosting package.

Whatever, if it doesn't work out, the option to host elsewhere remains.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 20 Sep 05 - 10:21 AM

Given the ongoing instability everywhere, I've had a slight change of plans.

Annexe is running at http://www.jonbanjo.org/forum, at least until I sort a few other things out.

Note, it is jonbanjo.org, not jonbanjo.com. I've taken a new domain as it will take me a while to get my old ones.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 08:00 PM

I've put it back up again in case any of the ones who replied didn't get in and I'm going to bed. I think the biggest planned change so far is rather than the Annexe 2 views, one of which "no one" used, 2 views can be obtained from my version of a "forum filter" where it says "sort" instead.

Oh well, I'll keep on trying. If all else fails, I still have the ASP code...

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 02:29 PM

Thanks.

Mr Red, I own 2 domain names, the only problem is they are registered by 38h, the company that's gone...

Whatever I do, it's likely that I will end up the the domians with a company who offer some dns services, but with not whoever I may use for any web hosting, seems to me now like too many eggs in one basket.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: gnu
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 01:26 PM

Thanks for the info and for all your effort Jon.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 01:24 PM

Thanks for keeping us up to date, Jon, and good luck with whatever you decide to do,

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: Mr Red
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 01:06 PM

Jon - tell the people who link to you when the URL changes - like the homepage of ME

I had a broken link for months when you slipped a 1 into the address.

If you spent a few bob on uk2.net (eg etc) and had a domain name with redirection then all you have to do is choose a reliable DNS (domain name server). It works for me more than 99%. If Waitrose ever lose the plot I still have the memorable URL to fall back on.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 18 Sep 05 - 10:43 AM

In case anyone is wondering. Have made a start and have been revising a couple of ideas over layout/ function but overall, most will be pretty much the same.

A "preview (just forum, and topic view) is running for an hour or two while I take a break at:

http://jonbanjo.homedns.org/forum.php

I'm planning on the same for the Annexe.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Mr Happy
Date: 16 Sep 05 - 10:09 AM

Jon& Pip,

I wish u both the very best in your endeavours to resume 'normal service'.

I [amongst all other folkinfoe+ annexe 'fans']appreciate the splendid & usually most reliable fora [or is that 'forii'?- anyone kno the plural of 'forum'?] for us.


Cheers once again,

Mr H

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 16 Sep 05 - 09:49 AM

It looks like they have gone. No phones now. It also looks like the level of problems some customers were having were greater than I'd realised. See here

I wish I'd have gone by my own gut feelings a few months back... but I didn't and things kept recovering...

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 16 Sep 05 - 09:20 AM

Jon & Pip, I will patiently wait till you get back on line after dealing with this very un-communicative business.

good luck

sandra

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 08:09 PM

It will come right, rangrer1. I could get more running more quickly BTW, but having learned the lesson of the unreliable ISP, etc. I'd rather take the extra time out which should in theory give me more control.

I always find when things go wrong, it is much harder being at the mercy of others. Although I will openly admit, in this game while the control is desirable in one sense, there is the day to day hassle factor and feel that route when possible gives the easier ride by far when things are working...

The hope is that I'll establish a better balance of both worlds.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: ranger1
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 07:53 PM

Darn! I just made my first successfull blue clickie thingie there, too. I don't understand any of the techie stuff, Jon, but I have faith that you'll get it sorted out, whatever it takes. I'll be waiting patiently.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 07:14 PM

...and not just with computers....

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 07:10 PM

but that they honestly might not have a clue what is going on/causing the failures -- which isn't something any tech is usually willing to admit.

Aye MMario, I've seen that one often enough too.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 02:56 PM

As I know it's been used a lot while Mudcat has been up and down and this one is a simple task,..

folkchat can be reached from http://mysite.varteconline.net/coedfa/chat.html

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: Azizi
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 10:48 AM

Jon,

I have no clue about the technical stuff that you shared , but I do hope that both the Annexe and Folkinfo come back.

I have learned alot and enjoyed exchanging information with people on both of those sites, but particularly the Annexe.

My fingers and toes are crossed that things work out the best for you soon.


Azizi

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: MMario
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 09:15 AM

*grin* didn't mean that they were waitng on a reply Jon - but that they honestly might not have a clue what is going on/causing the failures -- which isn't something any tech is usually willing to admit.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 09:11 AM

Not as far as I understand it Mmario.

As far as I'm aware (and could make out through IP addresses), when I first started with them, they were resellers and when the Annexe first started, briefly it ran like this on my best guesses and memory:

They were using some bigger host in London docklands but were never reliable but that changed not long after I started.

They moved over to some company I think based in Florida US and things improved for a while although the same communication problems existed and levels of service dropped towards the end until.

For the last few years, they have had thier own servers, and really seemed to have got thier act together (apart from the still remaining communication problems).

Some of the communication problems can not be down to a 3rd party by my way of thinking and that does not include just the web availability. I currently show as owing them money for folkinfo. It's another issue I've tried to take up with them - why we pay by standing order and records our end show payements have been made but they are so slow to show on my "control panel".

Overall IMO, they have been a "YES we will do" (and sometimes have done) but on several issues, I do not think that them waiting for a reply to be able to pass on to someone else (have that with one Mudcatter at the moment BTW whose site I've hosted for the past couple of years but have been honest enough to say I don't know what is going on and I'll help in re-locating...) is the reason.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: MMario
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 08:53 AM

jon - speaking from experience - the people at 38H may be in the same boat - or more likely frantically trying to recover from something that SHOULDN'T have effected services at all - but has.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 08:50 AM

That has been the problem with them Dave! The uptime and availiblity records and generally speed have been excellent over at least the past couple of years - I could have made matters worse moving elsewhere to somewhere less competent at providing a good server... but as you say, "when it's bad, it is horrid" and from my position, when it's like that, I'm stuck playing guessing games.

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 08:16 AM

As you say, its probably time to move to a more reliable ISP. The service from 38H seems inspired by that nursery rhyme: When it is good, it is very, very good. But when it is bad, it is horrid."

Subject: RE: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: JennyO
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 07:02 AM

Hi Jon. Yes I noticed the Annexe was down. I agree with you that communication is important and thanks for letting us know as much as you can about what is happening. I'm glad you are going to persevere with the sites - they are valuable to a lot of us, and I think of the Annexe as a calm place to go when there are storms elsewhere. Good luck with sorting the problems!

Jenny

Subject: BS: Annexe and Folkinfo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 15 Sep 05 - 06:50 AM

Firstly, I am aware that the Annexe and Folkinfo are down and I apologise for that.

I do not know why the sites are down but our attempts at phoning 38h are not producing any replies. Pip and I have reached the point whereby we have decided we can no longer cope with the uncertanties that this ISP provides.

We have discussed matters at length, even to the point of dicussing whether we want to keep the sites going and Pip is in communication with a couple of people over one issue. Beyond that, all I can say is that we have agreed both sites will continue to operate.

There will be changes however. I intend looking for another host and may even attempt hosting from home, at least as a backup. I also intend a complete re-write of the forums into php as at the moment, my requirements of both asp and php does limit my options when looking at various hosting alternatives. I'm also planning on trying to "rationalise" the code used between the 2 sites - believe it or not, in many ways as things stand, I am maintaining 2 sets of code, not just one!

In the longer term folkinfo and the Annexe will be stronger placed in the event of future problems but these moves are far from trivial. I would estimate it will take me a month to achieve all this.

In the meanwhile, folkinfo and the Annexe may or may not come back - it's hard to say when people refuse to communicate... but if it does, I will continue to run in the shorter term on there. I've also got the problems of trying to get the latest Annexe database (I've had an ongoing problem with ftp - and emails not replied to since thier last big downtime) and questionmarks over transferring domain name registration (again, not as easy as one would like when one party does not communicate - why is it that people think communication is so unimportant?) to face.

We will get there and I apologise for being so vague as well as for this down time.

Jon