BS: Army Discipline - UK

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: beardedbruce
Date: 29 Jun 06 - 07:29 AM

Take us above the line, will you?


Do you think this is a music site, or some such???



8-{E

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: skipy
Date: 29 Jun 06 - 07:20 AM

BUNTS!
Words & Music by Tom Lewis
(Recorded by Tom Lewis on Sea-Dog, See Dog!)
Bunts was a dachshund who sailed for the Queen;
Bahrain to Gibralter, and ports in between,
He'd not seen a lamp-post for three weeks or more,
So now he's determined to head for the shore.

Chorus:
Poor old Bunts, the nautical dog,
He's sure to be sentenced to Stoppage-Of-Grog;
Port old Bunts, for 'chokey' he's bound,
For falling in love with a French, Afghan Hound.

Now, this tale that I tell you might seem quite risqué,
But, when we sailed into the port of Marseille,
A poor, simple sea-dog was straightaway seduced,
By a saucy Mademoiselle who'd not been introduced.

Now, the Mayor and Mayoress and a French Admiral,
Arrived to extend some 'l'entent cordiàl',
But off the gangway they were nearly sideswiped,
'Cos Bunts wasn't waiting for leave to be piped!

He's lay'd alongside of this high-class French bitch,
And he's asked her politely if she'd scratch his itch,
With his sailor's allure she could not turn him down,
Consumation was in full view of the town!

So, the Ma'm'selle did her best to please the old salt
'Til a firehose brought their romance to a halt,
Then the shore patrol dragged poor old Bunts back on board,
While the crew gave three cheers for the first one who scored!

So, Bunts lost his good-conduct-stripes and his rate,
For putting the Queen's uniform in disgrace,
But now throughtout France a new dog-breed abounds,
The famous Marseilles-Afghan Short-Legged Hounds!

Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: HuwG
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:05 AM

Army discipline does depend as much on characters as it does on regulations and tradition.

One RSM I knew (oddly enough, from the Royal Welch Fusiliers) went by the nickname of "Porky"; undistinguished-looking, barely over minimum regulation height, mildly-spoken. Yet, when he raised an eyebrow, the battalion dared not breathe while in ranks; and if he frowned, nervous soldiers left puddles.

By contrast, another (Coldstream Guards) would spend hours bellowing purple-faced, send a steady stream of soldiers to the guardroom and contrive to leave the parade a mutinous shambles.

The same with officers; there are the strict but fair, the strict but unfair, the easy-going but fair, and Royal Corps of Signals Officers.

***

I do recall that the goats which were the regimental mascots of the Royal Regiment of Wales (one regular, two territorial battalions in those days) were kept at Maindy Barracks in Cardiff. Soldiers stationed there spoiled them rotten. I wondered why they were kept at Maindy (which isn't far from the city centre) when the actual regimental depot was at Crickhowell in the Black Mountains, lovely open country.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 07:24 AM

I lost weekend leave for having the second button undone on my Number 8 workshirt walking around the edge of the parade ground at HMS Raleigh. Makes you wish they still served Grog in the Navy don't it mates?

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Teribus
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 05:49 AM

My military Goat Story concerns the Naval Electrical Articifers training establishment at HMS Collingwood. Once upon a time the Captain of the place (Commanding Officer) was a Welshman. He got an invite to the Queens Birthday parade (Trooping the Colour) and the mob being 'trooped' was the Welsh Guards complete with their Goat Mascot.

The skipper of HMS Collingwood thought that a similar mascot would enhance the look of his stone frigate so wheels were put in motion to get a Billy Goat Mascot.

When the beast arrived, like all entering the gates of any naval establishment for the first time it required training. From this point on things only went down hill. The goat fell in with a bad crowd, or more accurately a bad crowd with a wicked sense of humour. They trained this rather active Billy Goat to charge at anything with more than two gold stripes on it's arm.

Come the first parade there's the Goat lined up with front and centre with the Colour and the Guard and off they step. The goat then sees the saluting dias and goes berserk, thinking that all his Christmasses have come at once. result, the Goat takes off dragging his 'handler' along with him and clears the senior staff from the parade ground. Ends up under punishment, and is given to the senior rates to correct his behaviour. Which they managed to in a round about way.

Before any parade where the goat was supposed to put in an appearance they would starve the animal for a couple of days and then on the great day the Goat knew that it would be fed once it got off the other end of the parade ground. Now this seemed to be a winner until one day a normal Saturday Divisions was postponed because some visiting VIP was going to be dropping by on a Sunday, so Sunday Divisions were decided on. Now instead of having had no food for two days the Goat was starved for three.

Once again the Goat, now ravenous, stands front and centre along with the colours, guard and band. As soon as the band strikes up the only thing on the goat's mind is making it to the end of the parade ground. Only thing was 'Quick March' tempo of the Royal Navy didn't appear to be fast enough for the Goat so he speeded up and accelerated. As he did so everyone else tried to keep up. The end result was that as the parade passed the VIP on the saluting dias everybody was going at the sprint, with the Goat still holding a respectable lead.

Well anyway that was it for the Goat as a Mascot, but he had been acquired officially so was therefore 'on the strength' so he couldn't just be killed and eaten. So he was drafted to Royal Naval Physiological Laboritories in Alverstoke where he was used for diving trials.

Now the routine for a Goat selcted for a trial was that it was isolated from the other goats for 24 hours. Kept apart and really pampered (fair enough as he was going to get bent the next day) and the ex-Mascot Goat loved Mars Bars. He never minded being selected for these jaunts because this Goat had noticed one thing. If having been selected and having eaten his fill of Mars Bars and god knows what other goodies when ever he saw a handler coming towards him with a lead he would start off towards the door of the building that housed the decompression chambers, then he would start to cough, or limp. He would immediately be turned loose amongst the other goats as only fit goats could be used for Trials. He spent many happy years at Alverstoke, where I believe, as far as I know, he died of natural causes.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 03:24 AM

Silly old bugger must have forgotten how it is to be young and in love. Whenever we were on the way in the evening I let my driver stop at a phone booth and phone his girl, and fuck the fuel. Sometimes I also phoned my wife. Same rights for free citizens, whether in BDU or not.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: NH Dave
Date: 27 Jun 06 - 06:34 PM

Military discipline has to be fair, rapid, and often brutal, or there will be little esprit des corps, or inclination to go forward against fire, or other dangerous task or duty.

Far too aften I have seen it degenerate to a petty squabble between a senior and a junior.

We were working beside some British troops from the South Cerney Barracks, when the Colonel had his driver drive him home for the night. The rest of the unit stayed on exercise at RAF Farnborough. The driver stopped off to see his girl, on the way back, thereby using some twenty ounces of petrol, for which he was charged with stealing by use, and lost a stripe as punishment. Somehow I don't see the point of this, as he wasn't supposed to be anywhere else, for the entire evening and only had to turn the Rover in and turn in himself.

As an American, I declined to comment on the issue at the time, but I thought it unfair back then too.

Dave

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 27 Jun 06 - 06:12 PM

There have been many such incidents in all branches of the military in Australia too.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: GUEST,hedd wyn
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 06:01 PM

We have had a taste of army discipline from the brutal events at Deepcut barracks where several raw recruits have committed suicide following bullying allegations in recent years.
hedd wyn

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: gnu
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 04:38 PM

Could be worse... could be a Bodhran.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Charmion
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 02:32 PM

And even in that state he could arrange to end up a spitshine to the good. Smart, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Dead Horse
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 02:17 PM

In my old unit in Germany, our RSM used to come in drunk on a regular basis every Sunday. He used to march himself into the guardroom and put himself in a cell (after removing his boots and belt - which were then polished by the guard). Monday morning he would appear in front of himself on diciplinary charges, fine himself £25, then carry on with his duties. He may appear to have been as daft as a brush, but he never left himself open to criticism or maybe even blackmail by any others. An old soldier to the core. (and a very fair bloke too)

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Barry Finn
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 01:57 PM

After reading this I need a drink.

1 Woolite on the rocks, please.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 11:52 AM

No, you'll never. When the battalion is falling in for parade the goat has to keep in step with the Goat Major.
Now what does induce the Regimental Goat to harrass the drummers' arses? Sexual deprivement?
Cpt. Robert Graves tells a wonderful story about the Goat Major in the orderly room when he was to be punished for selling the stud services of the Regimental Goat. He defended himself that he didn't do it for money's sake but to do the poor bugger a favour ...

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 10:16 AM

You can dress by the right, left and centre. I've never heard the command 'Byyyyyy The Goat' though.....

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Paul Burke
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 08:30 AM

This is a travesty of justice. The goat was right, the rest of the British Army was out of line.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 08:22 AM

Oh my God! Naturally, leek was the word I wanted to write. This bloody joke happend without purpose.
Nevertheless, I enjoyed your correction very much.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 04:08 AM

Yes, successive defence cuts have led to the replacement of leeks with leeches.
They do curry up nicely though.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 02:55 AM

What a painful impression! Demotion served the bugger right. He blamed the entire history of the Royal Welch Fusiliers. He had five years of training in the ranks, and then this!!!
Eric - not curried, but with the traditional leech. Best on St David's day.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 26 Jun 06 - 02:34 AM

DEMOTED IT !!!! I'd have had it curried.

eric

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 03:49 PM

In the barrel maybe :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 03:35 PM

Not a lot different than the US practice of having the President "pardon" a turkey at Thanksgiving time, I'd guess.

I think it's to establish/reassert a precedent in case of need by Cabinet members here...

I don't know if the attitude persists, but in past times some troop commanders considered a few demotions for someone in enlisted ranks as suggestive of possible "potential for showing initiative." The ones with the most yo-yo careers often got selected for "special duties." Maybe the goat did it on purpose to position himself for a new assignment.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 03:20 PM

LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 03:15 PM

I think it's called a sense of humour, villian. It's about all they've got left to deal with all the rubbish the politicains have dealt them out over the last few years....

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: akenaton
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 02:44 PM

The British Army has been recruiting goats for years....most of them are very good "officer material"...Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 02:33 PM

Now I know we have a big problem in the UK seeing this.

How absurd. I think the army chiefs need downgrading for being such tw*ts. Have they got nothing better to do.

What the hell is happening to this country.

Don't tell Osama Bin Laden

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: GUEST,Chupracabra
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 01:55 PM

If only Billy hadn't walked out of line I'd have had me mess. And I had the sauce all ready too.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 01:08 PM

Well done the goat.

Subject: RE: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: artbrooks
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 12:49 PM

Beats being sentenced to souvlaki.

Subject: BS: Army Discipline - UK
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 06 - 11:53 AM

"LONDON, England (AP) -- A British army regiment's ceremonial pet goat was demoted in disgrace after it marched out of line before a host of international dignitaries during a parade to mark Queen's Elizabeth II's birthday, a military spokesman said Saturday.

The military mascot, a 6-year-old male goat called Billy, was downgraded from the rank of lance corporal to fusilier -- the same status as a private -- after army chiefs ruled his poor display had ruined the ceremony June 16 at a British army base in Episkopi, western Cyprus."


http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe/06/24/goat.demoted.ap/index.html