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Tech: Computer jumps to previous page
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Tech: Computer jumps to previous page |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: JohnInKansas Date: 14 Dec 06 - 06:26 PM Since your EVO 4000 is obsolete, there's not a lot of detail at the Document ID: DS020117_CW02 Version: 0 Evo Workstation W4000 Hangs, Reboots, or Has Video Corruption on After Waking From Standby The issue may occur on Evo Workstation W4000 convertible minitower models operating in a Microsoft Windows XP Professional environment and having the following configuration: USB Mouse or USB Keyboard connected. Matrox G450 or G550 graphics controller installed. Microsoft admitted a problem with USB mouse vs sleep mode some time back, with their put that if the mouse is moved while the computer is entering sleep mode you might not be able to "wake" the machine with the mouse – i.e. the USB port died. There were some additional symptoms but I don't recall the details (my memory's full of shit too?). There is mention of some graphics card-associated problems for some EVO models, and updates to drivers and ROM; but I didn't see an EVO 4000 in the list. The search for "EVO 4000" reports "more than 200 hits" and I didn't look at all of them. The page linked above has the same search box I used to get that page at the top. With a more specific model description you might narrow the search and home in on something.(?) Using USB for both mouse and keyboard is a little suspect, depending on how the ports are wired. As mentioned above, having a particular number of USB sockets doesn't necessarily mean you have that many independent USB ports, since often it's two (or more) connectors to allow you to get to one port from different places. I don't have a "diagnostic" method for USB disfunctions to pass on without some research. Maybe later. A simple way of seeing if there's a USB interference/conflict would be to get an external "USB n-port Hub" (n is the number of ports) and plug both of your devices into it. I've got one 5-port and one 7-port hooked up, to isolate all my many accessories. If possible, get one with a plug in power wall-wart, since USB devices do draw power from the socket they're plugged into, and inadequate power is another problem often found when plugging "many things" into the existing USB holes in the computer. Question: Did you have both of these USB devices hooked up and working before the problem started; and have you added any other USB devices around the time that the instability first happened? IF you add an external hub, WinXP should detect it and take care of the bridging and anti-loop setup, assuming the device you use is typical PnP. My two Belkin hubs were around $20 US each, so it's not "coffee change" unless you frequent Starbucks etc, but everybody needs at least ten USB ports just to be "fashionable." John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 14 Dec 06 - 02:15 PM For whatever it's worth, I've cleaned both the keyboard and the trackball, and I find I'm getting some of the same behavior. Perhaps less of it, I can't tell yet. Both my keyboard and trackball are USB. Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 14 Dec 06 - 02:12 PM John said: It's possible that your memory's just full of shit and you're getting brain farts... John, that's probably true, but let's just talk about computers, shall we, and not get personal? Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: terrier Date: 14 Dec 06 - 12:18 PM ######## Another thought... are they PS2 or USB? USB keyboards can't be trusted, but USB mice are usually okay ##### (Bernard) My PS2 mouse was giving strange scrolling probs. I've just switched to a USB mouse and everything now works fine. In work, some file management software refused to work correctly until we got rid of the USB mouse and installed a PS2 mouse. Crazy!! |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Bernard Date: 14 Dec 06 - 11:39 AM I could be pedantic and point out that, historically, a mouse is an upside-down trackball, but I won't!! |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: JohnInKansas Date: 14 Dec 06 - 07:06 AM Scrump - There are vast numbers of "pointing devices" of exotic kinds that can be substituted for a mouse, or for a track-ball (an upside down mouse). Mostly they're less convenient in some ways than a mouse for general purpose use, and are used only when there's a specific reason. Often they are a lot more expensive. The expensive part may be just because the market is small(er) than for what people are used to. Many of the most exotic are specifically associated with particular programs that require that they be used. CATIA (graphics modelling program) requires a "CATIA PEN PAD" in most installations. AutoCadd can benefit from one, and most operators expect one. Graphic arts users frequently use "touch pads" or "stylus pads" and a few use "screen styli" where you pick a spot by touching the monitor. (Device names are often proprietary, and sometimes exotic too.) For Uncle DaveO - Since this is an intermittent/erratic thing, it's really hard to speculate about which of many possible things might be your inquisitor. Don't rule out that "you've been bad and the spirits are punishing you" (an explanation I've heard more than one support tech use) but I'd guess that there's a more mundane cause. We will assume that you have rebooted - (probably several times). Driver/.dll corruption often is "in RAM" and a reboot will load fresh controls. Your browser, regardless of kind, makes Temporary Internet Files that have a limit on total memory/drive space, and an accumulation of old bits can cause deviant behaviour. Usually your browser will be set to delete temps when the browser is closed, but you might have made a change, or your browser settings may have been mangled (just like mouse and keyboard drivers can be). In your browser, you can generally click somewhere to delete "offline content." In IE, it's at Tools|Internet Settings, General Tab, click the Delete button, and check All files. (This won't dump cookies, but you can do that separately.) This isn't 100% perfect, since files associated with pages that are open in your browser are "open," and open files can't be deleted. With your browser CLOSED/TURNED OFF/NOTHING OPEN, you can click Start|Settings, Control Panel, double-click Internet Options, and on the General tab get the same "Delete" button. Since there will (should) be no temp files open, you get a more reliable cleanup. In IE, Tools|Internet Options, or in Internet Options in Control Panel, next to the "Delete" button, there's a "Settings" button where you can specifiy how much space is allowed for Temporary Internet Files. I had a rather high setting since I had "disk space to spare" but when IE4 installed it told me my setting was "illegal." I suspect it was "illegal" with IE6, but IE6 just didn't bother to tell me, and probably just mumbled about me to its friends. The setting IE7 imposed was a max of 1024 MB. The "recommended" setting is 50 to 250 MB (and don't tell anyone I set it higher to snatch pictures from the browser temp folder when the museums block saving direct from the browser). My impression is that other browsers use the same "Temporary Internet Files" folder that IE/Windows controls can clear, and where IE/Control Panel can set limits; but you'll have to check the innards of your own browser to be sure if it's something else. It's possible that your memory's just full of shit and you're getting brain farts..., although this is just another of the "could-be" things. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Scrump Date: 14 Dec 06 - 06:19 AM I replaced my "balled" mouse a few years ago with one of those "castrated" ones (ouch!) and never have any of the problems formerly caused by dirty, sticky or fluffy balls (ooerr missus!) If you have a track-ball, isn't there an equivalent such as a touch-pad or some such, that would allow you to work free of balls? (The pointing device, that is!) |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: JohnInKansas Date: 14 Dec 06 - 02:13 AM 4. Both mouse and keyboard are PnP devices and require drivers. Every time your computer boots, it scans all the devices and looks to see if drivers are installed. If it doesn't find the driver, it snatches one from the CAB files and installs one. This means that if the PnP identity of a device isn't read correctly, a new and different driver may get dropped in place. Many drivers can be "modified" during computer use, as when you change the scroll rate, mouse-click/double-click separation etc. The changes generally get written to a .dll script, but since the mouse uses a sepcific script that the driver looks for, this can result in a "corrupt driver." This is fairly rare, but can happen so one must assume it does. The solution here usually is just to uninstall the driver and then reboot and let Windows pick and install a new one. In Control Panel, double click either Mouse or Keyboard, on the Hardware tab click Properties, click the driver and then uninstall. Reboot. NOTE: Never change more than one thing at a time when you're trying to get something fixed. NOTE: If the mouse quits working when you uninstall the mouse driver, it means you've done what you came for, so don't worry about not being able to back all the way out of Control Panel. You can do it with just the keyboard; but Ctl-Alt-Delete will open Task Manager, and a second Ctl-Alt-Del should shut you down so you can restart. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: JohnInKansas Date: 14 Dec 06 - 01:57 AM 3. The keyboard is the next suspect, since it shares the same (logical) serial port commonly used for the mouse. A sticky or intermittent key can cause all sorts of erratic behaviour. Rather than "blowing it out," which - like my neighbor's leaf blower - just moves the crud somewhere else, I'd recommend a mini-vac. You can get an attachement set of nozzles that slip over the hose of any vacuum cleaner you have handy. Computer shops should have them, but the most reliable sources are places that sell "shop vacuums" like Home Depot etc. ~$10 US(?) and you never run out of air. Especially with WinXP and recent office versions, there are an immense number of ways you can program your keyboard to act in abnormal ways. Most of these things are helpful when needed, but accidentally turning something on can produce lots of frustration. "Sticky Keys" and "Serial Keys" and "Filter Keys" are three functions that are "amusing," flipped on at a co-worker's desk (if you're into really juvenile behaviour). At START | HELP AND SUPPORT, click the INDEX icon at the top and type "keyboard" in the search box. A little down on the list, at "keyboard combinations, " click on "walkthrough: personalizing your computer" and click the "Display" button at the bottom. This will open the "setup" routine where you can look at/for and "fancy stuff" that may have gotten turned on by accident. As illustration of how complex this can be, my (came with the computer) keyboard is the "Microsoft Office" version that has individual buttons to turn on any office program, launch browser to normal home, hookup to the Office website, popup a calculator or calendar, etc. It also has a Back and Fwd buttons and scroll wheel built into the keyboard. I've covered most of them with duct tape. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: JohnInKansas Date: 14 Dec 06 - 01:51 AM Since the jump happens when you click, that makes the clicker (the mouse) the first suspect. 1. Conventional mouses get their balls dirty. When "mice had balls of steel" this just made the ball slip, and washing the ball or replacing it would fix lots (some said at leat half) of the problems IBM service people got called for, so a few decades ago IBM reps had lots of balls. Most rep offices posted a sign: "Have you checked your balls," at the exit door to remind their travelling reps to have lots of balls when they went out to do their rounds. Since the rubber (coated) balls appeared, the dirt doesn't stick to the balls. The dirt gets on the rollers where it can accumulate, or can get distributed to where it interferes with the switches. The rollers can usually be cleaned. Rubbing the dirt loose with a toothpick or "cuticle stick" is a useful method. Once the switches get dirty, replacement of the mouse is the safest solution. 2. The communication between the mouse and the computer is a next suspect. Leadwires can develop intermittent wires that can drop a bit or add extraneous extra ones. "Remote" (wireless) mouses generally require an internal battery, and a "weak" battery can cause lots of unexpecteds. Connectors can get dirty and interrupt or modify the signals. USB mouses get power from the USB junction, and adding another USB device can sometimes cause "low voltage" to the mouse, or conflicts between devices. Recently sold computers often have four USB jacks that are really two USB ports with two jacks (front and rear) on each. Two devices on the same port often will work, but isn't really recommended. You've pretty much done the usual things related to these suspects, so this is just going down the checklist. John |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Stilly River Sage Date: 14 Dec 06 - 12:20 AM I use a track ball also--and have to pop the ball out of the socket and clean lint off of the little lens every so often. I can tell when it needs it because I find my thumb cranking the ball with less result, or the pointer drifts off where I don't want it to go. I haven't had the pages changing like you describe. My keyboard also has a wheel and it clicks like the trackball wheel, but I never think about using that one. It is possible to accidentally click that wheel and gotten odd results, I suppose, though it hasn't happened to me. I realized the other day that the functionality of my track ball is not all there--I used to be able to depress the wheel and get a whole menu of stuff. I'll have to revisit the installation disk and see if I actually want any of that back. SRS |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Bernard Date: 13 Dec 06 - 07:56 PM The sticky key thing depends entirely upon which key is sticking, and for how long... a ledger holding down the Ctrl key causes really wacky things to happen, but if the key only sticks briefly before releasing again, it can be harder to spot. The best way to eliminate them from the equation is by replacement - after all, they aren't expensive items. I work in IT by day, and firmly subscribe to the Sherlock Holmes method... when you've eliminated the possible, consider the impossible! Or summat like that...! Another thought... are they PS2 or USB? USB keyboards can't be trusted, but USB mice are usually okay. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 13 Dec 06 - 03:18 PM Okay, I've cleaned the trackball and the keyboard. Now it's a matter of waiting to see what happens. If the problem continues, I'll probably know tomorrow. Two or three days are probably necessary to prove a cure. Either way, I'll report here. Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Bert Date: 13 Dec 06 - 02:03 PM Try a different mouse and see if that helps. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: MMario Date: 13 Dec 06 - 01:40 PM Dave - the only reason I mentioned the keyboard is because (wierd as it may seem) I have had a very similar problem cured by cleaning the keyboard. We theorize the dust was causing a static charge . |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 13 Dec 06 - 01:28 PM I don't see how sticky keys could cause what I'm experiencing. I get the behavior in sessions where only mouse clicks have been used, from desktop to the page where I have the problem. Nonetheless, I've cleaned my mouse (actually, trackball), and will buy a can of compressed air. There is nothing (ledger, etc.) impinging on the keyboard. I called my knowledgeable computer guy and described the problem. He's as stumped as I. Incidentally, he discounted the keyboard stick, just as I did and do. He pointed out that usually if it's a board going bad, or something like that, he would expect it to throw me off the web, or shut down the computer entirely, rather than reverting to a previous page but allowing return by the right arrow. Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Bernard Date: 13 Dec 06 - 11:58 AM Come to think of it, we occasionally have a similar problem here in the office... someone leaves a ledger leaning on the keyboard, and wonders why the PC is acting wierd...! |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Bernard Date: 13 Dec 06 - 11:56 AM Have you extra buttons on your mouse? I have a Micro$haft Intellimouse, which has 'forward' and 'back' buttons positioned just where I'll accidentally catch them with my thumb or ring finger...! It's also possible you have a sticky key on your keyboard. The only way to be sure is to try a different mouse and/or keyboard... if the problem persists, you know to look elsewhere. |
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Subject: RE: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: MMario Date: 13 Dec 06 - 11:51 AM sounds like you may have a sticky key somewhere - try blowqing out your keyboard with compressed air. |
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Subject: Tech: Computer jumps to previous page From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 13 Dec 06 - 11:45 AM I have for some time been having a sporadic problem with stability on the web. That is, I'll change to a new window, and the moment I try to click anywhere on the page, I'm thrown back to the previous page, which may be a separate website or may be merely a different window in my current website. I can (usually) regain the place I was trying to work by using the forward arrow, but many times I'll have the same problem. I may have to return to the desired screen 3 or 4 times before I can do whatever I wanted to do there. I said I could "usually" regain the intended window, but when that is a Mudcat post I'm trying to submit, it will sometimes but not always lack my typed-in message when I come back via forward arrow. I am on a Compaq EVO W4000, running XP Pro. I use Netscape 7.1 ordinarily, but when I use FireFox I get the same thing. Netscape 8.1(2?), ditto. I don't know whether I would get it with IE too, because I almost NEVER use IE. I have lots of memory, and lots of disk space available. Norton (up to date) okays me for viruses, and Ad-Aware, Spybot, and Easy Spy Remover declare me clean. Registry Mechanic has no complaints about my registry. Wierder and wierderer! Dave Oesterreich |
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