BS: Dreams

Subject: BS: Dreams
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 03:01 AM

I was cleaning a drawer out this morning and I found a staurolite (fairy cross) and suddenly I realized I had dreamt of finding a staurolite in the driveway and showing it to someone in my dream that very morning. It immediatly reminded me of the dream. I held it in my hand and said hmmm...I wonder if this means something. Then I put it back in my drawer.
(I hunted staurolites down in New Mexico and we actually have them here on the banks of the Mississippi around Little Falls, MN. The one I picked up today had garnet inclusions that came from NM. They are a silicate of iron, aluminum, mag zinc. unattractive yet mysterious crystals that form into a cross)
In the dream I found it and showed it to a friend (can't remember who) and they said, "what is it?". I said, "It's a staurolite. Look it is a little cross." And in the dream I saw the perfect fairy cross.
Weird is all I have to say. I love dreaming.

Does anyone want to talk about dreams?
Peace, Rustic

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 03:20 AM

I just did a search and see there are many threads on dreams.
Dream a little dream of me...
So does anyone want to talk about dreams anyway? How about a discussion on prophetic dreams or dreams that have become a reality or what did you dream last night?
Do you dream in color? I would say most people do. Color is the key after all.
I once had a dream of nothing but color. It scared me. It was nothing but vivid, swirling colors that overwhelmed me and I went and asked my mom if I could sleep with her because it scared me so much. I was about 6 years old.
I once had a dream that I was flying and I had wings and I woke up on the floor. I slept on the top bunk and fell out of bed!
Another dream I had when I was very young, I was tied on a post and burned alive. That one I dreamt several times.
Me again-Rustic

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: SueB
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 03:34 AM

I'd love to talk about dreams, but mine lately have been the kind where you wake up a say "Whew!" but in a split second you've forgot what it was about and all you have left is the sensation of having dreamed something very interesting or weird that might indicate a need for intensive psychotherapy. I had recurring dreams as a teenager, and I would go to sleep hoping to have another replay, as they were so interesting. Wish I could remember my dreams nowadays -
do you know of any method by which to improve the remembering of dreams?

I don't know if I dream in color or not - of the dreams that have impressed me, color wasn't the salient detail. Your dream of being tied to a post and burned alive makes me shiver to think about. Do you have any idea what a dream like that might symbolize? --Suzanne

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 03:50 AM

Hi Suzanne, (I'm a Susanne too!)
I'm not sure. Because I had that dream at such an early age I thought maybe it was a dream of a past life and I was a witch or persecuted for something, being burned alive.They just scared me when I was a kid, but later I remembered them and tryed to figure out what it meant.
I think if you go to sleep tonight and pay attention you will see that you dream in color. All you have to do is tell yourself to pay attention.
I love those vivid dreams now-a-days. They don't scare me anymore.
I love it when I can have a good dream and wake up for awhile and tell myself to go back to them and it happens. It's a bummer when I can't find them again.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: SueB
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 04:16 AM

I don't know anything about past lives, but I found this in an online dream "dictionary" -
******
Fire

Depending on the context of your dream, to see fire in your dream can symbolizes destruction, passion, desire, illumination, transformation, enlightenment, or anger. It may suggest that something old is passing and something new is entering your life. Your thoughts and views are changing. In particular, if the fire is under control or contained in one area, it is a metaphor of your own internal fire and inner transformation. It also represents your drive and motivation.

To dream of that you are being burned by fire, indicates that your temper is getting out of control. Some issue or situation is burning you up inside.

To dream that a house is on fire, signifies passion and loving companions.

To dream that you put out a fire, signifies that you will overcome your obstacles in your life through much work and effort.
******


SOme of my memorable dreams involved entering a room to find that it was actually underwater, and swimming through it trying to find some sort of path - back to the dream dictionary in a moment to find out what that might mean...

I've tried that before, where you just tell yourself before going to sleep that you'll remember your dreams, but it's never worked in the past. I might have to try self-hypnosis, and then give myself the suggestion that I'll remember my dreams when I wake up - sort of the same thing as just telling yourself something, but with a little more hocus-pocus - Suzanne

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 04:30 AM

The thing is Suzy, I had that dream when I was about 5 years old so I don't know about trying to work things out, or changing, but maybe I was being enlightened after the color dream! ha!
It's funny how you mentioned the water dreams though, because I had an urge to talk about a dream where I was swimming in a huge pool of water that seemed like it was in someones backyard and there where huge goldfish swimming around me. The color of the pool was intense blue. The fish were intense orange.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Jeanie
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 05:43 AM

I find that if I don't remember my dreams when I wake up, the images may come back to me out-of-the-blue during the day, or even when I am just lying down to go to sleep the *next* night, and I think "Oh yes, *that's* what I was dreaming about...It can even be a dream I had had some time before and something during a day's events revives that image.

Quite often, I can recognize the elements of a dream as being something that I have seen/heard/read during that day and are part of some kind of brain/experience processing system. I reckon a lot of dreams are like that. Now and again, though, I think we can all be blessed with what I call "Dreams that are More-Than-Dreams", where you are taken to some other dimension or place of awareness. You somehow know, even while you are 'dreaming' it, that this is more than a dream.

The most wonderful and powerful "dream" I had like that happened to me many years ago, but the picture of it and the feeling of it has stayed with me. I was born with a stillborn twin sister (this is the reality, not the dream). At the time when I had this "dream" I was an adult, life was trundling along and although every so often something would make me think of her, she had not been in my conscious awareness. That day, I had been reading a passage in a book about forgiveness, which involved making and signing a kind of declaration of forgiveness to all the people in your life you felt you needed to forgive. In the forefront of my mind, at the time, was my (now ex-) mother-in-law ! My twin did not figure on this list at all - but somehow, subconciously, I suppose she must have, too deeply for me ever to want to admit to myself.

The dream was so beautiful. Some people came to "collect" me and they were very excited. They took me to a wide open space and somewhere in the distance I could see a speck of a figure coming nearer. I walked, and then ran, nearer and nearer to this person, and they did likewise. I remember thinking in the dream "This is just like in the films, cue the background orchestra !" Between me and this person there was such a recognition, such a joy, such an incredible amount of laughter, I could never describe it. All I can say is that it is something I have never, ever felt on this earth. From both of us, there was this kind of unspoken "Is it you ? No ! Really ?" and then the wonderful peals of laughter and recognition. The strange thing is, I could never say what this person looked like, even whether they were male or female, it was just the recognition and the joy of our being with each other, and that we had not been with each other for a long, long time. That was more than enough.

No doubt someone could come along with a logical or psychoanalytical interpretation of all this. I don't care ! The experience I had left an imprint on me that no words or "logic" could ever erase, and I am so grateful for it.

There is a fabulous sequel to this story. A few years after this dream experience, I went to an open audition for a production of Shakespeare's "Twelfth Night" (storyline in a nutshell: twins parted in shipwreck, both think the other dead, re-united at the end). I had gone for a totally different part, a character in the sub-plot, and would *never* have put myself forward for the part of the female twin - afraid my own emotions would get in the way. Well..... I was offered that part, too great a change to miss, playing Viola, I took it ! It turned out to be the most fantastic completion to that dream experience and the connection with my twin. I like to feel that someone (or some several) up there (or wherever they are) were and are looking after me.

I feel I have gone on enough...Thanks for starting this topic. I have lots more I would like to say about the world of dreams...No doubt I'll be coming back, and very interested to hear of other people's experiences.

With Love,
- jeanie

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,hag
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 05:47 AM

Anyone else get hypnogogic/hypnopompic hallucinations? They're really scarey til you understand what they are, then they are really amazing! Associated with sleep paralysis they are the basis of a lot of claims of night-visits by witches and aliens. You really believe there is someone in your room, and you can really feel them touching you, holding you down, sitting on your chest etc. All the more terrifying because you are awake and concious at the time - its like your subconcious rises up & dreams, your concious mind is still wide awake, but you can't move or call out because whatever it is that inhibits movement when dreaming (so that we don't generally act out our dreams physically) has kicked in.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 06:11 AM

I dreamt one night that I was eating a big marsh-mallow, when I woke the next morning my pillow had gone.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: freda underhill
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 07:44 AM

i have had dreams which were significant in some way at different times. At the times of most grief or stress in my life, I have not been able to remember any dreams.

Occasionally I have dreams which seem to relate to events in my life or in a friends life. for example..

in the 80s i had a good friend (Aldo) a Chilean drama therapist. Very flamoyant, handsome, charismatic, and gay. I worked as his assistant for a while, helping him run workshops for people with & without disabilities. I helped with the face & body painting, with costumes and materials, and in other ways. Aldo was an exceptional person - the first in the 70s in australia to advocate for mentally and physically disabled people who were kept controlled by unnecessary use of valium & other medications, by suggesting that they were being unnecessarily medicated. He advocated that they should be allowed to have sexual relations like anyone else. Its hard to believe this was happening still in those days, but he broke down a lot of barriers. he put on an opera performed by people with Downs Syndrome at the sydney opera house.

I knew Aldo was HIV+, but I thought he had years to go. I hadn't seen him for a few months. One night I dreamt I went to his house in Ashfield to visit him. In reality the rooms were all painted white, and he had beautiful South American woven wall hangings, and some delicate paintings he had done on the walls, + furniture, books etc. In the dream, i went to visit him and there was no one home. the house was empty, all the walls had been painted a peach-pink colour, and there was nothing in the house except for a purple scarf on the wall.

When i woke up, i went to work and rang him to see if he was okay. I rang several times but there was no answer. At midday a friend answered his phone and told me that Aldo was in St Vincents Hospital, very ill. I went in to see him that afternoon after work. I walked into his room in the hospital. It was painted a peach-pink colour, and there was a purple scarf tied to the rails of his hospital bed.

That dream alerted me to the fact that Aldo had been hospitalised, and i was able to spend time with him in the last few weeks of his life.

when i have a problem, i ask myself for help before i go to sleep, and when i wake up in the morning the answer will have been in my dream or in my thoughts at the moment of waking up.

freda

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 08:32 AM

One thing I've had confirmed by other songwriters is that dreams sometimes have "soundtracks." I've had several songs come to me in great part in a dream, to the point where I wake up and write the lyrics down on a pad near the bed. One specific example:

I had played at a nursing home that day, and I was very touched by a woman who was sitting directly in front of me, no more than three feet away. She apparently had had a stroke because she was strapped into her wheelchair because she couldn't sit up on her own. Her face was completely paralyzed with no sign of life in there, except her eyes. The only movement she was able to make was to tap one finger in rhythm to the music. I was deeply moved by that, and had a dream about her that night. A beautiful line which I can't claim to have written came to me in the dream as part of a song:

"And somewhere inside her, there's still that young girl, with a tortise-shell comb in her hair." I don't believe I would ever have "written" that line while I was awake. Most of the two verses were in my head when I work up and I wrote them down. Then, I drifted back to sleep and got the rest:

Tortoise Shell Comb

She remembers the sweet smell of freshly baked apples
That came from the wood-burning stove
And the songs that her Mother would sing to herself
And the laughter when Father came home
And somewhere inside her, there's still that young girl
With a tortoise shell comb in her hair
And somehow the memories come back with a song
As surely as if she was there


She moves to the music, although she can't dance
With a far away look in her eye
And she's back once again on that warm summer night
As if none of the years have gone by
He bows so politely, and asks her to dance
And she smiles as she offers her hand
Then they balance and turn in three quarter time
And you swear she can still hear the band


And all of that came out of one finger tapping.

Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,KB
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 08:52 AM

I like that Jerry - really lovely. It does have that special quality that you get when something just emerges from within.

I sometimes hear wonderful music just when I'm drifting in or out of sleep - gorgeous orchestral stuff with horns & everything. Most annoying when I find out its not real....

Kris

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Amos
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 09:13 AM

The really compelling questions in my view are:

(1) why do we always wake up in the same reality no matter what we dream? Or do we? and

(2) what are the most effective techniques to achieve (and to use in) lucid-dream states?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Jeanie
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 09:38 AM

Amos - in answer to your first question, I think that when we have the kind of dream experiences that I call More-Than-Dreams, we don't wake up to the same reality. Reality, that is to say, our awake time, can never be the same again. That was certainly the case with my meeting with my twin, and with some other heightened dream experiences or dream meetings I have had.

In answer to the second question....I don't know...My initial instinct is to say not to *try*, to stop trying. The effort of trying to achieve a result (in so many areas of experience !) gets in the way of what is actually already there.

[Ommmm.....Jeanie's Zen Moment over for the time being... ;) ]

What an interesting subject this is. Lovely song, too, Jerry. Thanks everyone.

With Love,
- jeanie

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Rapparee
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 09:44 AM

The mind is so, so complex.

I've literally dreamt up solutions to problems I've been working on -- letting the mind free-wheel in sleep -- as have many others.

When I was young, perspective in dreams was all screwed up. Near objects would loom tiny, while distant ones were huge. I experienced the same thing years and years later. Why? My glasses were changed to near 20/20 and my brain was adjusting, just as it had all those years before.

I'm haunted by the I'm-naked-and-have-missed-the-entire-semester-of-classes-and-now-it's-exam-time dreams. Had one last night. But I don't think that there's any psychic meaning there -- just the bad dreams from college recurring.

Amos, you know that Chaos Theory says that everything that happens changes everything else.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,Why
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 09:53 AM

OK I'm also facinated by dreams, but come on then, the one you have all been avoiding - wet dreams - we know the HOW, but not WHY, any theories ?

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: *daylia*
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 10:38 AM

Amos, I find myself in lucid-dream states quite a bit, especially since I started studying and recording my dreams several years ago. Others may scoff at these ideas, but these are the conclusions I've drawn to date about what dreams really are and how to glean the most benefit from them ...

1) Dreams are real experiences! While the physical body sleeps, our mental, emotional and soulful "bodies" (which do not require sleep) are free to "venture out" and have experiences on the more subtle levels of awareness (ie mental, emotional, soulful, spiritual). WHen these experiences are remembered, they are called "dreams". And because the subtle planes of awareness do not have the time/space limitations of physical reality, MUCH useful information can be accessed there.

2) People can train themselves to remember their dreams by setting that intention mentally before falling asleep, and leaving a notebook and pen beside the bed to record any dreams immediately upon awakening. This is a useful practice, because dreams don't lie, and often reveal hidden truths to the dreamer, especially regarding their true thoughts/feelings/desires about whatever is going on in their lives at the time.

3) Dreams can also reveal the truth about other people's feelings and intentions and plans, about future events, about past lives (if you're into that sort of thing) etc. If the dreamer asks for specific guidance about any concern they may have before falling asleep, and makes an effort to recall and record any information received, the answers will come through in dreams. This has happened to me many, many times!

And I have often regretted NOT trusting and following through on the insights received in dreams. For example, I remember asking for a "sign" once about a person I'd just met who had romantic interests in me. I liked him too, and I was very disappointed at the dream I had in response to my question.

In the dream, I was enthusiastically sharing some ideas with this person in the mall, when I noticed he was looking very angry. Suddenly there were two of him -- it was like he'd split into twins! One strode off in an angry silence, and I was hurt and confused ... couldn't figure out what I'd said that he took such offence to! WHile I was standing there wondering, the other "twin" came up behind me and slipped a knife between my ribs. I woke up with this really awful and VERY PHYSICAL pain in my back -- no kidding! IT took quite a while for the pain to subside so I could fall back to sleep.

Now if that's not a crystal-clear message about this person's true nature and intentions, what is? But would I listen? Oh no, not me ... it wasn't the answer I wanted, so I ignored it ( oh it's just a stupid dream, it's not real!) and went right ahead and dated him anyway.

Well, a few months later when I had to end that relationship, feeling very "used and abused" (won't get into details here but believe me that WAS what happened) I regretted very much not acting on what I'd been shown in that dream. It would have saved me a lot of time and grief, that's for sure!

So, I've learned to trust my dreams over the years, although interpretation sure can present quite the challenge at times!

4) In lucid dreaming, it's very important to remember that you are creating the experience with your own thoughts and feelings. If you are fearful, you will create the fearsome, and make yourself a real nightmare. If you expect something terrible is going to happen, guaranteed it will! But if you can train yourself to stay in a loving, "empowered" frame of mind while you dream, you will create awesome -- and highly valuable -- experiences for yourself.

I could go on and on, because dreaming is one of my FAVORITE areas of study, but I think that's enough for now.

"Dreamer, you're nothing but a dreamer; well can you put your hands in your head - oh NO!..."

(Supertramp, from Crime of the Century)

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,Buffy the hamster slayer
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 11:09 AM

I have wet dreams. But that is because I sleep in a river.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,wd
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 11:21 AM

Hmmm, sexdreams are very worrying sometimes. You can end up doing the most outrageous things with the most INAPPROPRIATE people!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,Hammy
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 11:38 AM

Buffy - don't make things hard for yourself and keep the wheels of industry turning.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: *daylia*
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 11:50 AM

Aw, not to worry about doing "outrageous" things with "inappropriate people" in your dreams, wd. That's one of the things dreams are for - a personal "release valve" for subconscious, suppressed drives and wishes and desires. Those energies (which are perfectly human, natural and normal, even if deemed "immoral" or "inappropiate" by polite society), if acted upon in physical reality, would cause a LOT of trouble. So dreams are an opportunity to "vent" them, that's all!

Have you ever noticed that the very best sex of all is to be had in dreams? "Dream bodies" are SO sensitive, so "perfect", so flexible, capable of doing the most amazing "gymnastics" (got no bones, after all), don't stink or sweat or have any weight to speak of!

Hmmmm, sex and music ... the "finer things" of life, and so much finer in dreams it seems ...

But the last time I thought I was having a wet dream, I woke up to find my cat was having her kittens all over my bed. That was a "wet" experience, alright!

daylia

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: SueB
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 12:04 PM

Amos, or somebody, could you clarify for me what is meant by a lucid dream state?

I once had a dream where I was at elementary school trying to cope with my child, who happened to be Calvin, of the Calvin and Hobbes cartoons - someone at the time told me that you are all the people in your dreams, which when I worked it out made alot of sense to me - I *was* Calvin the irrespressible child, I *was* the hapless parent, I *was* the disapproving (and smug) authority figures whose faces appeared through the doorways as I pursued Calvin down the hallways - at the dreams' end Calvin and I were handcuffed to each other and to a chainlink fence in some far corner of the schoolyard.

Years layer, I look back on that dream and say, oh, of course, how obvious...

The "naked in public" dream I think must be almost universal - who hasn't had one of those? Also the "unprepared for the exam" dream I have heard from so many people that I think it must be universal too - here's what dreammoods.com has to say about both of those situations:

****
Dreaming that you are completely or partially naked is very common. Nudity symbolizes a variety of things depending on your real life situation.

... Metaphorically clothes are a means of concealment. With clothes, you can hide your identity or be someone else. But without them, everything is hanging out for all to see. You are left without any defenses. If you are in a new relationship, you may have some fears or apprehension in revealing your true feelings.

Nudity also symbolizes being caught off guard. Finding yourself naked at work or in a classroom, suggests that you are unprepared for a project at work or school. You may be uninformed in making a well-formed decision. With all eyes on you, you have this fear of having some deed brought to public attention. You fear that people will see through your true self and you will be exposed as a fraud or a phony.

Many times, when you realize that you are naked in your dream, no one else seems to notice. Everyone else in the dream is going about their business without giving a second look at your nakedness. This implies that your fears are unfounded; no one will notice except you. You may be magnifying the situation and making an issue of nothing. On the other hand, such dreams may mean your desire (or failure) to get noticed.
*****
To dream that you are taking an exam, indicates that you are being put to the test or being scrutinized in some way. Such dreams highlight your feelings of being anxious and agitated. You may find that you cannot answer any of the questions on the test or that the test is in some foreign language. Is time running out and you find that you can not complete the exam in the allowed time? Or are you late to the exam? Does your pencil keep breaking during the exam? Such factors contribute to you failing this test. These dreams usually have to do with your self-esteem and confidence or your lack of. You are worried that you are not making the grade and measuring up to other people's expectations of you. You may also experience the fear of not being accepted, not being prepared, or not being good enough. You feel nervous, insecure and tend to believe the worst about yourself.

These dreams also suggest that you may feel unprepared for a challenge. Rarely, are these dreams about the content of the test, but rather the process and how you are feeling during the exam taking process. Generally, you feel distressed and frustrated. These feelings may parallel how you are feeling in a particular challenge or situation in your waking like.

Dreams of this nature are also an indication that you are being judged and this dream is a signal for you to examine an aspect of yourself that you may have been neglecting and need to pay attention to. You may harbor some guilt because of your neglect in preparation for a school exam, meeting, business project, or some challenge. Most of the time, though, people who have such dreams are unlikely to fail a test in real life. This dream goes back to their fear and own anxiety that they may not meet other's standards of them. They are afraid to let others down.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: SueB
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 12:09 PM

OH, and I meant to say, freda, what an interesting story, and Jerry what a beautiful song...

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,wd
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 12:29 PM

lucid dreaming is dreaming where you conciously control what happens in the dream. very handy I'd say.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: SueB
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 01:53 PM

Wow. I had no idea that could be done. Can people really do that?
How?

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,ClaireBear
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 01:53 PM

Hag -- yes, I have hypnopompic hallucinations! Thank you so much for telling me what they are. All these years of being held down at night by an unseen, terrifying foe, and I never realized it was a known halluncinatory pattern. This has been happening to me for at least 22 years, along with (evidently related) out-of-body experiences and flying episodes.

I admit to a little disappointment that I might not really be flying, but it's nice to know I'm not necessarily being singled out by a malevolent demonic entity, either...

(And no, I'm not nuts, this is exactly how it feels and it happens to a lot of folks!).

Claire

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 04:36 PM

Claire, maybe you have an entity hanging around you!
Jerry, that is a beautiful song you wrote. I love that it came from your dream.

My dream this morning was strange enough. My mom and Dad were together in the dream. When I woke up I thought to myself, "I knew mom was alive." I was feeling very happy about that and content. Then I woke up again and realized I was back into my now reality and it made me feel sad that I woke up to the realness.

Most of my dreams are of many places and people I haven't been to, or met. I think that is when I am either free spirit roaming or I am living a multi-dimensional existance and those lives I live are revealed in dreams.

One more thing I will reveal about my dreams. When I have those sex dreams I am always close to getting "some" but it almost never happens. Now what is up with that? I always feel cheated and those are the dreams I can never get back into! I must to to faithful to my man even in my dreams!

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Raedwulf
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 08:27 PM

For more on Lucid Dreaming try here.

I've a lot more to say about dreaming, but it'll be a longish post & I want to work on it a bit! Tomorrow maybe. It's about time I went & did some! ;)

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Amos
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 11:52 PM

Jeanie:

Your dream sounds like an amazingly uplifting experience.

Lucid dreaming: it is reported that people can learn to do it; the boundary of   separation modulates such that the individual remains conscious and in command, as he is while awake, but in the universe of his dream time. This can of course be risky, depending on how willing the being is to experience "extracurricular" reality. It can shake up your most cherished assumptions. On the othe rhand it can lead you into some very interesting corners and reportedly wreak cghanges in your life in real spacetime, as well.

Or so I am told...


A

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 12:17 AM

Recurrent dreams are fascinating to me. I have often visited landscapes and houses that I immediately recognize in my dream, although I couldn't describe them to you now. There is also a peculiar continuity to the bizarre nature of relationships in dreams. For example, in dreams I know Bob Dylan pretty well, not a close friendship but one that goes way back, at least through numerous dreams.
I'll share one recurring dream plot that is unsettling. This dream concerns me and two friends, and it seems that long ago we were involved in a burglary at the house of an elderly woman. During the robbery, one of my cohorts murdered her. I didn't witness this, and in fact I don't believe I ever actually dreamed the crime, although I know what happened. The police suspect our involvement, but have nothing to go on other than their suspicion. They refuse to close the case. In the recurring dream, the main sense is of fear and paranoia that one of the two others will talk, that we'll be arrested and imprisoned. Oddly, there is no real sense of deep guilt over the death of the woman on my part, but chiefly regret at having been involved, and the dread of discovery. It is interesting to speak objectively of this dream, especially knowing that, if I dream it tonight, I will recognize it as recurrent without the ability to step back from it and disengage emotionally.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: SueB
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 12:43 AM

Lonesome EJ, I could find references to what it might "mean" if, in a dream, you commit murder, witness murder or are murdered yourself, but not really anything so far about dreaming that you are an accessory to the crime - interesting stuff, though, you can see what I found in a dream dictionary by clicking here

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: LadyJean
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 12:44 AM

Last week I put in my application for a booth at the S.C.A's annual Pensic war, and, sure enough, I had my annual Pensic dream. It's always the same, I'm at the booth with nothing to sell, or next to nothing to sell. This year had me making my stuffed animals from sheepskin instead of fake fur.

An African American woman who cleaned for my mother claimed to be able to predict the future with her dreams. She more than once predicted my marriage. But I'm still single.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 02:53 AM

Jeanie: Just read your post and totally understand it. Forgiveness is a great liberator. The act of forgiveness does more for the person doing the forgiving than for the one being forgiven. Its a huge burden but you don't know until you get up off your knees and feel the light. Its like cleaning out the cobwebs and getting a fresh start. It allows you to move forward with clarity. I think thats why you were able to unite with your twin on a spiritual plane. When anyone tells me they are feeling depressed or confused, I always suggest a good session of plain old private forgiveness. It does wonders for me.

d

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Teresa
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 02:56 AM

What a great thread. ...

My lucid dream story:

In the dream, I am in an airplane, which suddenly starts to pitch violently and I can hear the sounds of stressed metal. I know we're about to crash. But suddenly, I realize that this is only a dream, and I don't need the plane to come down safely; I can just float down on my own. So that is exactly what I do. The plane dissolves and down I go, light as a feather.

Also, one technique I use when writing down my dreams is the present tense. This gives the dream a sense of immediacy and somehow helps me remember. Thanks for the thread, RR.
Teresa

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 03:08 AM

Dreams seems to come in all shapes and sizes. I used to have the same, recurring dream as my brother when were kids. Sometimes, a wolf visits me in my dreams. In another dream, I saw a distant, shimmering city of pink and gold. I saw it again 20 years later, from a beach. I live here now.

How about this one: I used to wander on the most beautiful piece of waterfront on any island anywhere. I lived there and used to worry about what would become of the land (365 acres of waterfront) when the owner died. I didn't want it to fall into private hands because I longed for it to belong to all people. When he died, it became a marine park and wildlife reserve. I did nothing to make it happen. I only dreamed it everyday for 10 years. Nobody knew my dream but through a series of very swift real estate deals by others, it actually happened.

I will never stop dreaming. My dreams are so real and so true!

My dad used to tell me there was nothing wrong with being a dreamer but it was the quality of the dream that counted!

Now I know he was so right!

d

d

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,Why
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 04:16 AM

I dont think the above explains wet dreams, I dont believe they fall into the catagory of lucid dreams or am I missing the point ?

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Jeanie
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 05:01 AM

Amos, Dianavan: Thanks :) And you are so right, Dianavan, about the importance of forgiveness and about 'dream' meetings taking place on a spiritual plane.

Rustic - I know very well that feeling you had after waking up from your dream about your mother, and my heart goes out to you. Having these kinds of dreams can be a mixed blessing. For myself, my reconciliation with my twin showed me exactly what I had been missing and had never experienced in this 'real' world, because she has never lived in it. At the time, and even after writing about it here yesterday, there was a part of me that became very, very sad. I do believe these dreams happen, and the people you have lost come to you, out of a great love for you. They long to be with you as much as you long to be with them. It is painfully sad, but also breathtakingly wonderful at the same time.

As has been said by the people who are movingly recounting their dreams over on the 'Grieving' thread, these dream encounters can serve as a loving pointer for what may be to come, and that in the present, these people are only missing from *this* world.

I do believe that these very heightened dream meetings have the power to change your perception of your living in this 'real' world. For me, my dream accentuated for me what I was missing, but it also made me look for that in other places. I have consciously and deliberately never imposed a wanting of any other person in my life to replace my twin - that would be too much for any one person to take on, and anyway, an impossibility. What my dream has encouraged me to do is seek and find little bits of "twin-ness" spread around in lots of people, places, activities and things. Dreams are such wonderful and powerful events.

With Love,
- jeanie

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 05:20 AM

Here's one of my recurring dreams........

I am standing at the bottom of a hill by a natural pond looking up at a chruch on a hill. I am overcome by fear and at this point I wake up short of breath.

I spoke about this dream to a couple of catters......Mrs Cobble and Cobble and Micca. The Cobbles were kind enough to show me some pictures of churches in the area and when I was shown particular picture the feeling of fear swept over me again. The church actually exists and stands on top of a hill at Holme upon Spalding Moor in Yorkshire.

Well Mrs Cobble and Micca thought it would be a good idea for me to visit the church....I wasn't too keen!! When we got there I looked down from the top of the hill to the pond. We walked around the grounds and once again I had this uncontrolable fear and there was a strong smell of burning. After we had been around the grounds we went home for a stiff drink!

After visiting the church in reality I have only had the dream 3 or 4 times in the passed 18 months.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,Hag
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 05:51 AM

ClaireBear - there's loads of info on the internet about those hallucinations. They are particularly associated with narcolepsy - though you can have them without. The thing that clinched the recognition for me is that it is common to hear/feel a buzzing just at the start - which is a very prominent feature for me.

I was disapointed & relieved too when I found out that they are a well-known phenomena. But at least they're fun now instead of petrifying!

However I think that it is not completely proven that there isn't some real base beneath it all. Perhaps, in that special state of concious+subconcious we are more receptive to psychic or paranormal phenomena.

Anyway - the fact that our dream mechanism is out of kilter might mean we have a head start on achieving that lucid dreaming thing. Also we tend to be more creative - which is a good thing for musicians...

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Sttaw Legend
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 06:36 AM

catsPHiddle
Is the church at Holme on Spalding the All Saints Church ?, I seem to recall a story told to me when I was doing some walking round that area. It was told to me by one of the locals about an earthquake that was felt in the area years ago. A quick search on Google shows 18th of January, 1822, at 10 o'clock at night. Don't know if this is associated with your dream in any way, any ideas anyone ?

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST,Buffy the Hamster slayer
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 06:44 AM

What if ................. Hamsters were 11 foot tall? Oh, sorry, wrong thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 07:14 AM

I honestly cant remember the name of the church, it could well be all saints...if its the only church there on the top of a rather large hill! but Mrs Cobble or Cobble should be able to confirm the name. Interesting about the earthquake. Someone has offered to regress me and look at any past lives I have had to see if there is anything in the dream but the fear I felt in the dream and then in relaity I don't really want to have to find out why!

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: *daylia*
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 08:30 AM

RE lucid dreaming - as pointed out above, lucid dreams happen when the dreamer "wakes up" in the dream, and realizes that s/he's dreaming. With that awareness, the dreamer can learn to take control of the dream while it's happening, to consciously direct it via thoughts, emotions and expectations.

THis is why it's so important to stay in a positive, loving frame of mind during lucid dream experiences. If you can't do this, you'll be at the mercy of your own uncontrolled (and sometimes monstrous) fears/hatreds/guilts etc, instead of you controlling the experience to your own benefit.

If you want to learn lucid dreaming, my suggestion is to start by setting the mental intention to remember your dreams before you fall asleep. Record anything you remember as soon as you wake up, even if it's just an fleeting image or a feeling or seems nonsensical. Soon you'll find that your dream-life starts changing -- you remember your dreams better, they become more vivid, more meaningful. WIth practice, and again by setting that mental intention before sleep, you can train your conscious mind to "wake up" during a dream and take control of it.

This process takes time and patience, though. The subconscious mind functions as a "filter" or "censor", protecting the conscious mind from remembering upsetting dream experiences, or any "overload" of information that may cause the dreamer to become unbalanced in their everyday lives. (That's why a lot of people don't remember their dreams at ALL, although everyone dreams). It can take a lot of effort to convince the subconscious mind to relax the "censor" function, that it's safe to let dream information/experiences through, but it's definitely well worth the effort!

daylia

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: freda underhill
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 08:48 AM

i have never been able to experience lucid dreams, but i did eventually overcome a repeating nightmare.

For years, every now and then I would have a spider nightmare, dreaming that i was in bed, asleep, and woke up to find a giant black hairy spider - huge, metres across, leaping down on me from the ceiling.

Often, seeing a spider in the day would trigger the dream at night.

I would wake up paralysed with fear, so frightened i couldn't even scream, and would refuse to move until my then partner (Don, very patient guy) pulled back the sheets & blankets, inspected every part of the bed & room, & was able to assure me that there was no spider there.

after many years of this dream coming, maybe two or three times a year, i started to have dreams in which the spider was smaller, and crawling along the wall. They were still very scary and I still woke up in fright.

Then one night I dreamt I opened a small drawer in my cupboard. I looked in and saw the same, huge black hairy spider crouching in the drawer. in the dream i took the handle of the wooden drawer, and closed it, closing the spider in.

Í haven't had a spider dream since! (at least 5 years free!)

recovering nightmare survivor

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Cluin
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 09:09 AM

I used to keep a dream journal. The more I wrote my dreams down, the more vivid they became and the more I could remember when I woke up. I soon began spending a lot of time scribbling down dream stories. Too much time. So I gave it up. Then the dreams left me. By that, I mean, I stopped remembering them as much.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 11:19 AM

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz............

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: MAG
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 01:42 PM

The last time I had a lucid dream it was a bad one. I realized I didn't want to be where I was. and rubbed my arm on a brick wall until it woke me up. I have not had a lucid dream since. thank you for the info above, Daylia, so I can remember to take a different direction if I am blessed with this powerful experience again.

Jeannie, you probably know this, but there is one theory that if you lose a twin early, you are searching for that something in your life. It sounds like the dream helped you find it. Very early experiences unquestionable mark us; some say pre-birth experiences also influence us. Controlled studies with mothers reading to their in utero babies show the babies responding to their mothers reading the same material signifigantly. You could be looking for Your twin's heartbeat. My apologies if this is all old hat. Your experience was very powerful. I think we needed to ponder it a bit.

My 20 something dream group helped me learn to deal with the nightmares. To begin to respond the the frightening thing in them -- to shout, even if it was a croak at first, and to turn and defend myself. The effect in my waking life was profound.

I am in a dream study group now, at 50+. I highly recommend dream study to all introspective types.

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Peace
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 03:01 PM

Jeanie,

Regarding your second-above posting. Wow. Sure is a shocker to find there are other worlds just as real as this one. I loved your dream. The joy you felt with each other is as real as it gets. So many near-death experiences speak to a life beyond this. You are going to meet again. I think the dream was just a way to prepare you for that. Your sibling already knows. Than you so much for sharing that.

Bruce M

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 05:39 PM

Mag- What do you do in your dream study group? I'm curious about that, and would like to hear more.

I feel that every dream has a meaning for you as an individual. I can't really go for the idea that you can look at a book of meanings and that is exactly what your dream will signify. Does anyone understand what I'm getting at? Who is the person who makes up the rules on dreaming?

CatsPHiddle- that is one trippy story you tell. I would be interested to know the history of that church as well.

One more thing- if you believe in animal totems, it is said your totem will come to you in your dreams. The animal I dream most of is the bear.
Peace, Rustic

Subject: RE: BS: Dreams
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 05:42 PM

I got the Raven as my Totem Animal...had my Medicine Cards read and it came to me in meditation....