BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: The Curator
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 05:42 AM

Agreed brucie.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 05:52 AM

Curator do you think the recent elections in Africa will bring about changes in how the relief aid is channeled?

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 05:59 AM

O.K. so we're all in agreement that the debt will never be paid.

Now, why not suspend the debt, with very stringent conditions, e.g. The governments concerned must accept financial oversight, through the UN, for a specified period, or until specified targets are met.

Failure to comply would mean reinstatement of the debt, whereas compliance would, when all targets were achieved, be followed by a total write off.

This would ensure that the savings would be used to better the lot of the people, and of course, the West would benefit from the removal of need for further financial aid.

How does that sound to you guys?

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: breezy
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 07:52 AM

Please check the spelling of Sir Bob's surname. Some of you chaps have been reading too much Tolkien.

Last night's programme on the Live aid gave us all a greater insight to the man.


True some 'pop' musicians, - they aint stars - begin to have ideas above their station , but ony due to the fact that many of us allow them that status by buying their often poorly written ,sung what they claim songs on overpriced Cds and albums after high powered marketing in th world of dross that is commercial, mostly throw away 'music. maybe thats why its ony the real musicians that shone through like Queen and Status, mac, Jaggs and Bowie and Dire streets!! [joke]

Curator is only a wind up merchant.Met better.

The question of black performers is an interesting one, its mostly all rapp and crap over here in the U K., so where will their appeal be to those with money to donate? I for one will be switching over if the music isnt good ole rock and roll

Simply the best

Oh and while I'm here.
Spotlight folk club at the Legion in St Albans tonight with
Andy Smythe

then next Friday 24th june

its Fran McGillivray and Mike Burke

at the Windward club
at the Duke of Marlborough
Holywell Hill
St Albans
www.folk4all.net

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: The Curator
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 07:53 AM

No I don't think the recent elections will see much in the line of change Guest. There has to be outside intervention from the developed world which is more than throwing a few deliveries of food at the problem and walking away. Don what you have come up with could work, excellent idea. Is any one out there in a position to put Don's idea to someone in a position of power ? If so please get moving.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: s6k
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 09:16 AM

there is another concert in the eden project garden or something - featuring all African stars. it will be hosted by Yossou N'Dour and also features Salif Keita, an amazing guy, i have his albums, if you can get a hold of his song "Ana Na Ming" do so, it is one of the most beautiful things i have heard.

you can read more about this on the official live 8 website, and Geldof is also announcing 3 more Live 8 concerts, in Tokyo and 2 other places, bringing the number of concerts to, appropriately, 8

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 06:44 PM

Did you know Geldolf is an anagram of old gelf.

Might be of some significance to someone...

:D

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Peace
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 06:55 PM

http://www.bobgeldof.info/happening.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 07:13 PM

Thankyou Curator,

I genuinely appreciate that. Now, as you say, how do we put the idea forward in a way that will make them listen?

Ideas please folks.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Peace
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 03:01 AM

The kids (mostly) who have been protesting G8 conferences need to be joined by us: adults. We have to put our bodies where we have put our philosophies. If there's another G8 in Canada, I am going, and with any luck I'll spend another night in jail, courtesy of the State. Talk the talk is one thing; walk the walk is another. If the economic shape of this world is not our concern and if we will let our childern and grandchildren inherit this mess, then we just ain't worth the time our parents spent making us. IMO.

BM

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: akenaton
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 04:46 AM

Bravo Brucie!!

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: The Curator
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 04:50 AM

We are in agreement brucie, now there's a first !

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: GUEST,John McLean
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 06:54 AM

So I'll see you all at Gleneagles, then ?

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 07:33 AM

I support Geldof . At least he is brave enough to put his head above the parapet and say what he feels.
If only people would listen and think of WHY and not how hegets us aware of what is happening.

END POVERTY

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: The Curator
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 07:42 AM

Don't think they would allow us in John, as I said someone with a little pull needs to put Don's proposal to them, again I say deliveries of food help, but are not the long term answer.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 09:32 AM

Where has it been said that the countries have not thought of this themselves and are working on a long term solution. They need to be debt free first to enable it.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 05:36 PM

That's the point, GUEST.

The West has the power to make them debt free, and control their governments to ensure that the money is used for the betterment of their lot.

Without that, they cannot ever be debt free because they don't have sufficient Gross National Product to service the interest on that money, let alone pay off the capital.

Let's face fact. That money can't, and won't, be repaid. So why not make a virtue of necessity, and use the carrot to make the donkey go, while holding the stick of re-instatement to ensure his progress in the right (i.e. moral, and ethical) direction.

I don't see a flaw in the reasoning. If you do, I would consider it a kindness if you would point it out for me.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Peace
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 05:42 PM

I would watch Wolfowitz's moves in the coming two years. The World Bank will be a big player in this 'control the world' game that will soon be acting out. Fuckin' banks do NOT just let debts go--they want their flesh and one way or the otrher, they'll get it. IMO.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 05:45 PM

No I don't think the recent elections will see much in the line of change Guest. There has to be outside intervention from the developed world which is more than throwing a few deliveries of food at the problem and walking away. Don what you have come up with could work, excellent idea. Is any one out there in a position to put Don's idea to someone in a position of power ? If so please get moving.

Don I was thinking about this post. It infers (to me) that nobody in those affected countries have already thought of the longterm planning necessary. They may need their debts written off, but I think it is presumptious of us to think they also need us to think for them.

I hope this agreement re the debts will signal the new start needed to get these countries into the 21st century. I also hope their elected politicians show the integrity to make that succeed.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: akenaton
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 06:15 PM

I wonder if it's in the long term good of the African people to join the 21st century.
Perhaps if Africa could have escaped the effects of the last couple of centuries it's people might not now be in need of our charity or our modern day missionaries....Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 06:33 PM

OK, conceded, kind of true, but you know what I mean.:)

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 08:55 PM

Personally, i quite like the guy. I do think he's coked out his nut, though.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 09:44 PM

It's precisely because you can't trust their governments to make the right decisions that a measure of control is necessary. Give them aid, and they buy weapons with it. That's why their people are starving.

I don't advocate making their decisions for them, merely the threat of re-instating the loans if they do not use the saving to stop their people starving.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: The Curator
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 06:51 AM

sadly making the decisions for them may be the only solution. There are a lot of tin pot self appointed tribal leaders at the heart of this problem, and they won't go away.Some may say they are there because the larger tribes want them there, whoever holds the gun calls the shots is the reality.If anyone thinks writing off debts and a supply of food is the answer, I don't, yes help is needed but we need to see the core of this problem resolved, and that is at local leadership level.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: alanabit
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 07:34 AM

I think it is right to point out both sides of the problem. Indeed, there are the self inflicted wounds of tribalism and poor leadership on the one side, along with the crippling burden of international debt on the other. Although I agree that we cannot solve the former problem for those countries, it also appears that the debt problem does nothing to help those countries to find better leadership. (This does not only apply to African nations. I recall reading that something similar happened in Europe in the thirties.)
Most of us would like to see Western style, multi party democracy instituted in all countries. The fact is, not all countries want it or have any chance of sustaining it. The rallying cry of the fundamentalists in Algeria was, "We don't want democracy. We want Islam". I have very little liking for fundamentalists of all persuasions (not least of all the Christian variety). However, I really can't assert that we know how to run their countries better than they do. We can't dictate how they must act. We can simply try to act with kindness and mercy ourselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Enough of mouthpiece Geldolf
From: The Curator
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 08:16 AM

Greater education would help alanabit, I have also heard similar calls from the people that you speak of.They chant what their leaders dictate.