BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Riginslinger
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 02:08 PM

Well, Jack got the Obama/Biden part right. Now McCain needs to carry out his reputation as a maverick, and choose Hillary to be his VP pick.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Big Mick
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 02:14 PM

Here we go again. The Repubs, lacking a candidate of substance, now will do the swift boat approach. McCain spoke of a high minded approach to the campaign, but when he realized the issues and his approach to them would kill him, he hires the Rove Battallion, and waddaya know?...... the swift boat stuff starts. And so it goes.

Why stick with honor and integrity when sleeze and throwing shit works better.

See you in November.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: pdq
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 02:33 PM

Congratulations to Ebbie for the following post (note date). Perhaps she should be Mudcat's official augur:


Subject: RE: BS: Obama/____________ '08???
From: Ebbie - PM
Date: 09 Jul 08 - 06:54 PM

It just occurs to me that the best fit for Obama is Joe Biden. Lots of reasons but tops among them is his knowledge and familiarity with foreign policy. Because of the process of presidential campaigning he is already well vetted. Not likely to be many unexamined skeletons in his closet.

{shortened}

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 02:59 PM

Hillary would have been a bad choice for VP. Among other things, we don't need three presidents in the White House.

But, Hillary fans, fret not! I'll bet a cookie that Obama has her in mind for something big, quite probably a heavy-duty cabinet position.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 03:14 PM

See if she takes the nomination to the convention floor....
..Also, new allegations have been renewed, about Obama's birthplace, whether or not he is qualified to run for president...The plot thickens..

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 03:45 PM

Just listened to it. Obama did a great job of introducing Joe Biden. And Joe Biden delivered one helluva speech!

Allegations about Barack Obama's birthplace? Sounds like a bit of desperation on someone's part. Hawaii became a state on August 21st, 1959. Barack Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii on August 4th, 1961.

So what's the problem?

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 04:12 PM

Biden is a lovable Rotweiller and blowhard that will not allow any swiftboat to go unchallenged.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Joe Offer
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 04:47 PM

Now, if McCain would pick Lieberman, we'd have a 100 percent chance on having a Guy Named Joe as Vice President. I can't believe that in all this time, we haven't had a Guy Named Joe as President or Vice President. I still would have preferred Hillary for President, but an Obama-Biden ticket looks pretty good.

-A Guy Named Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 06:15 PM

pdq,

You tend to say some dumb things. But are you going for some sort of record today?

Romney, son of a politician made his 200 million as a turn around specialist. Buying "undervalued" companies and "improving the bottom line" through layoffs and raiding the pension funds.

Biden and Obama are an affront because they got law degrees and use them to fight for people?

What about the politician parasite who made his money by lawing hard working people off and the professional politician whose resume, consists of crashing four multimillion dollar airplanes, albeit with help from the enemy in one of those crashes, followed by confinement, heroic confinement, yes, then 35 years of Washington politics married to a beer heiress.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 06:39 PM

Since when was Illinois part of the Northeast?

Donuel, I hope you are right about Biden.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Fife
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 06:48 PM

It's strange to see an American politician without his hair dyed, teeth capped and wearing a corset. Why do American politicians smile at amassed groups, point into the crowd and wave as if they spotted someone they know ?

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 06:58 PM

John McCain crashed 4 planes, Jack??? Geeze, me and my brother crashed a Piper Cub once and that was nuff of that crashin' for me but at the time it was old and beat and it weren't no great loss... But four muti-million dollar planes??? Hey, had I been his CO I wouldn't have given Charlie a shot at him after the 2nd crash... No sir, he woulda been sittin' behind a desk fir the next 32 years...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: CarolC
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 07:02 PM

Four planes and only one of the crashes wasn't his fault? Sounds like something people ought to know about.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 07:03 PM

Yeah, four fighter/bomber jets. But give the North Vietnamese and Russian munitions industry credit for one.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: pdq
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 07:10 PM

JtS,

With all due respect, the cartoon characters you are trying to portray as McCain and Romney are evidence that you spend too much time visiting websites designed to stir hatred and foster divisions in the voting people of our country.

George Romney was a very respected business man. He made an heroic effort to build an auto maker that could compete with the Big Three and came close. Even Chrysler is not very competitive anymore, even after they acquired Romney's American Motors (done largely to get the Jeep name). We have a Big Two, located behind Toyota. So Romney had money. That is not a crime, or FDR and JFK would be more guilty than other presidents.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 07:36 PM

pdq,

With as much respect as I can muster, your ignorance of subjects you choose to talk about is sometimes nothing short of staggering. Mitt Romney's money did not come from his father. It came from his work as a "consultant" and a corporate raider. His 200 million dollar personal fortune came in very large part from engineering layoffs.

As you say, Mitt grew up in an executive's mansion and his father lived in a governor's mansion. Romney, is a second generation politician.

It was you who started out with the characatures. If you are not willing to see the same standards applied to your candidates, you shouldn't have opened that door.

I did not get this information from websites. I got it from interviews with your candidates on conservative main stream media. Interviews with people like Joe Scarborough and Pat Buchanan.

>>I'll take a successful business man paired with a military man over a pair of mouthy lawyers. So will rural America. That don't mean they will win since cities have all the clout, but this ticket is an affront to much of the US.<<

McCain has been in Washington for a lot more time than he has been in the Military. Part of his time in the military was as a "liason" to Washington. By now McCain is 9 parts politician 1 part military man. Romney is a silver spoon fed, classic dyed in the wool, blow dried, elitist, country club, Republican.

If rural America gets to know these two, they won't vote for them.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Alice
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 07:56 PM

Allegations... that are total lies... have been spinning from the republican spin machine for decades.


http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 08:12 PM

Thanks for posting that link, Alice!

The ethics of some of the people who put out this kind of anti-Obama propaganda is enough to gag a maggot!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: pdq
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 08:34 PM

Mudcat is starting to sound like a cross between the Jerry Springer Show and a food fight.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Mrrzy
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 09:02 PM

Well, it will be two firsts if they win - first non-WASP veep *and* first non WAS (but not P) pres...

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: CarolC
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 10:15 PM

Even if he had been born in Hawaii before it became a state, he would still have been a legal US citizen as are citizens of all US territories.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: pdq
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 10:28 PM

John McCain was born in the Canal Zone (Panama) and Mitt Romney was born in Mexico. Obama was born in Hawaii. So what? Who is keeping this silly topic going?

The personal attacks in the Democratic primary were all from Bill Clinton and his front, Hillary. Questions about Obama's roots came from the Clintons. I hope they go away forever since that is the only way the Democrats can rebuild their image and become a respectable alternative to the Republicans.

McNormal for McPresident. Hope Liddy Dole is VP.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 10:37 PM

Maybe you should do some of your own research, guest. Biden is a mixed bag on pro-choice laws, but earned a big fat ZERO by the NRLC, being labelled pro-choice. If you read the informtaion HERE you will see where he stands on the various birth control/pro-choice issues.

He can hardly be said to be anti-gay, either...if you read his record at that same site. Here're a couple of things noted:

# Rated 78% by the HRC, indicating a pro-gay-rights stance. (Dec 2006)
# Rated 100% by the NAACP, indicating a pro-affirmative-action stance. (Dec 2006)
# Re-introduce the Equal Rights Amendment. (Mar 2007)

Lots more info on him which refutes most of guest's claims.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Peace
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 12:00 AM

Well, I figure that the next VP of the USA is gonna be a guy from Scranton, Pennsylvania.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 12:21 AM

Ol' Doom N' Gloom Janet is cherry-picking. Here's the full accounting of where Biden stands on abortion:

    * No public funding for abortion; it imposes a view. (Apr 2007)
    * Supports partial-birth abortion ban, but not undoing Roe. (Apr 2007)
    * Accepts Catholic church view that life begins at conception. (Apr 2007)
    * Nominees should agree on constitutional right to privacy. (Apr 2007)
    * Voted NO on defining unborn child as eligible for SCHIP. (Mar 2008)
    * Voted NO on prohibiting minors crossing state lines for abortion. (Mar 2008)
    * Voted YES on expanding research to more embryonic stem cell lines. (Apr 2007)
    * Voted NO on notifying parents of minors who get out-of-state abortions. (Jul 2006)
    * Voted YES on $100M to reduce teen pregnancy by education & contraceptives. (Mar 2005)
    * Voted NO on criminal penalty for harming unborn fetus during other crime. (Mar 2004)
    * Voted NO on maintaining ban on Military Base Abortions. (Jun 2000)
    * Voted YES on banning partial birth abortions. (Oct 1999)
    * Voted NO on banning human cloning. (Feb 1998)
    * Rated 36% by NARAL, indicating a mixed voting record on abortion. (Dec 2003)
    * Expand embryonic stem cell research. (Jun 2004)
    * Rated 0% by the NRLC, indicating a pro-choice stance. (Dec 2006)
    * Ensure access to and funding for contraception. (Feb 2007)

Like I said, a mixed bag. Also noted from the same site:

Religion informs my values; my reason dictates outcomes.
# Religious affiliation: Catholic. (Nov 2000)
# Rated 100% by the AU, indicating support of church-state separation. (Dec 2006)

It is possible to have a religious affiliation and NOT try to cram it down everyone else's throat. Are you trying to resurrect the anti-Catholic BS they tried to use against JFK?

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Peace
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 12:38 AM

http://www.ontheissues.org/senate/joe_biden.htm

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 01:58 AM

Though he boasts a 'liberal' voting record, his finest moments were around the Iran Contra affair...a situation that still haunts us today. If you have the information, you know. Not going to take the time to educate those who don't know.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Haruo
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 07:15 AM

Like mary garvey, I am from Washington State. Unlike her, I have voted for Republicans. And I always vote in Chinese. Generally I vote for the Republican candidate for Secretary of State of the State of Washington, but not for any other office. My grandmother Emmye Anne voted for Hoover in '28, and didn't make that mistake again until 1964 when she voted for Dan Evans.

Anybody have any good campaign (or other) songs about Biden, or Lieberman for that matter? It ought to be possible to do something with the phrase "Biden: His Time".

Haruo

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Riginslinger
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 07:55 AM

I think the reality of Bob Barr running along out there as a Libertarian makes the choice of Lieberman impossible. All the right-wing-religious-wakkos would run out and vote for Barr.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 10:20 AM

Pat Buchanan thinks that if Lieberman's name is put up for nomination it will be defeated on the floor of the Republic Party's convention. Now that would be fun to watch.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Ron Davies
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 10:40 AM

The best thing about Biden is he will not hurt Obama with any of the groups likely to support him--which most of the other choices could have possibly done. (Except Nunn.)

"First, do no harm".

Second thing about him is, as many have pointed out already, he can be a good attack dog. Anybody who complains about Biden being a divider, not a uniter, is evidently ignorant of the traditional VP role for quite a while now--rip the opposition. For a perfect example of somebody not precisely a uniter, I offer Mr. Cheney.



Best thing about this whole process is that it's now over, and the focus shifts to McCain. No matter who he picks as VP, he loses.

If he picks a conservative fire-eater, he loses the opportunity to appeal to independents, whose views on abortion, immigration, taxes, etc., do not fit with the Neanderthal right----but whose votes he desperately needs. McCain cannot win with just Republican votes.

If he doesn't pick a rock-hard right-wing VP, his own base, already not anywhere as enthusiastic about him as Obama's is about him, has yet another great reason to stay home in November.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Ron Davies
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 10:43 AM

McCain cannot win with just Republican votes. Especially since he already has lost some of these. Susan Eisenhower has just again publicly come out against him. And she is not alone.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Riginslinger
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 11:39 AM

McCain could do himself a lot of good by picking somebody with a good track record on the economy. Neither Obama or Biden have any standing there.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 11:44 AM

A Republican with a good track record on the economy!

HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

For that matter

A Congress person with a good track record on the economy!

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Ebbie
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 11:46 AM

I think McCain would do his chances a lot of good if he chose someone like Chuck Hagel. Hagel appears to think outside the box, and he criticizes his own party as freely as he does the opposition. With Hagel as a running mate, McCain would go a long way toward re-establishing himself in the public eye as an independent pol.

Not that I think he ever was.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Riginslinger
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 11:48 AM

Well, Jack, I agree with you again. The worst thing to happen to the economy since the Great Depression was Ronald Reagan. But they elected him twices and the great unwashed masses still think those policies are sound. So all the McCain folks have to do is to pay off the witch doctors in the churches to tell their constituencies that "supply-side" is a good idea, and they will win the election.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 12:25 PM

Its not going to be Hagel. Hagel went to The mid east with Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Riginslinger
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 02:29 PM

I still think he ought to pick Hillary!

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: pdq
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 02:54 PM

Does that mean she's ripe?

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 06:08 PM

Pawlwnty did cut his mullet. It would be a shame to let a haircut go to waste.

Subject: RE: BS: McCain/Lieberman v Obama/Biden
From: Charley Noble
Date: 25 Aug 08 - 01:59 PM

I'm still wondering why Bill Richardson didn't make the final cut. He's a well-respected governor in the Southwest, speaks fluent Spanish, served as Secretary of Energy and Ambassador to the United Nations in the Clinton Administration, and chaired other international committees. Is he being saved for a cabinet post or was there a problem?

Charley Noble