Pop Goes The Folk Singer

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:47 PM

Okay, Snail - late-night folk-singarounds.
Okay, Mole. - may we say probably Shakespear's bithday, as well as his death-day?

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:37 PM

and your point is what...I mean apart from more of the same. I mean all these things you list are all stereo-types of the 'English way of life'.
ummmm..and that bit about Shakespeare? William Shakespeare (baptised 26 April 1564 – 23 April 1616)seems we only have his baptismal date, not his actual birthdate, sooooo

Charlotte R

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: TheSnail
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:33 PM

walkaboutsverse

...and should be celebrated, as I said on the other thread, for those who missed it, with midday Morris dancing, afternoon teas, Evensongs, Shakespeare suppers, and red-eye folk-singarounds!

Indeed it should. Unfortunately it has been usurped by the far right, lunatic fringe of White Anglo-Saxon, Ethnic-English bigots who disapprove of the BNP because "British" is far too cosmopolitan for them.

"red-eye folk-singarounds"?

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:14 PM

As I was quoted on the local news, "St. George's (yes, CR, from what is now Turkey, they say) Day is also England's National Day and Shakespeare's birth- and death-day."...and should be celebrated, as I said on the other thread, for those who missed it, with midday Morris dancing, afternoon teas, Evensongs, Shakespeare suppers, and red-eye folk-singarounds!

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:01 PM

Lions as well...they're not English, mind you neither's St. George...

Charlotte R

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: TheSnail
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 02:59 PM

Yeah! Bloody chrysanthemums! Ought to go back where they came from.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 01:00 PM

WAV, no matter how many of your ancestors hailed from England, you yourself are NOT a native plant. If you are against immigration, why don't you set the example and repatriate yourself??
As pepople have said, please share an example of a culture in the UK, especially one recently, which has been lost because of immigration.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:25 PM

To CV, again, I didn't make that "metaphor." And "Who wouldn't enjoy travelling through 40 contries"...perhaps someone who didn't like the world being multicultural..?

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:15 PM

" is it such a bad/evil/demon/extreme thing if FROM NOW ON immigration is slowed down , via the UN? "

Yes, it would be a bad/evil/demon/extreme thing if immigration was slowed down - in any country.   

Immigration and a supposed "loss of culture" are completely separate and one does not impact on the other. Sounds like you are trying to find a scapegoat for a lack of interest.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Confrontation Viper
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:10 PM

I DID enjoy travelling through about 40 countries, I DID major in anthropology as part of a degree in HUMANITIES and I DO love the world being multicultural

Who wouldn't enjoy travelling through 40 countries, even on your proverbial shoestring? And haven't some of the most extreme racist thinkers in history used anthropology to justify their odious claims? And is not one of the classic racist arguments that whilst they love a multi-cultural world, they wouldn't like the buggers living next door? None of this proves anything, WAV - it's just hot-air and specious rhetoric; nor does it in anyway challenge any of the claims that have been against you, which you seem to quite purposefully avoiding.

Gardening is an indulgence, not a necessity; however, a broader consideration of natural / native ecology can in no way be used as a metaphor for human culture unless you're suggesting that different ethnicities would somehow run rampant, much as certain non-native plant species have done, Rhododendrons and Himalayan Balsam to name but two.

People aren't plants and different ethnicities are not different species. If anything, I'd say this argument only serves to double-dig your racist trench even deeper.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:02 PM

I love the comparison - removing foreign weeds from your garden, to removing foreign migrant workers from the fields. Perhaps we should burn them on a bonfire? Monty Don would be proud.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:55 AM

You didn't read it sarcastic, Snail! - vegetables and other consumables were deemed exempt from the native-plants rule, in order to limit food-miles, etc.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: M.Ted
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:44 AM

You might be surprised by this, but we knew you were not a certified anthropologist--not to imply that you aren't certified or certifiable in other ways, though--

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: TheSnail
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:39 AM

Yeah! Bloody potatoes! Ought to go back where they came from.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:25 AM

On a BBC gardening forum about 2 years ago, it was just me and a chap nicknamed Ken-70 arguing for native-gardening (for several "green" reasons summarised in my Blog) with virtually everyone-else using similar false criticism to some of those on this thread. However, I went back there early this year and found the TV presenter, Monty Don, keen on forming a native-only garden, and others giving links to lists of native-English plants and mentioning doing similar to Monty, etc - in other words, attitudes/fashions had changed dramatically...perhaps more thought was given while I was away..?
...To CV - I DID enjoy travelling through about 40 countries, I DID major in anthropology as part of a degree in HUMANITIES and I DO love the world being multicultural.....................

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Confrontation Viper
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:01 AM

I've never mentioned "racial purity", CB - I've only questioned multiculturalism and the loss of CULTURES here; and I keep saying the truth that I do love the world being multicultural, but most of my critics here seem to ignore that for some reason..?

i) By culture, you mean ethnicity - stop mincing your mealy-mouthed words.

ii) Kindly demonstrate any single instance of a 'loss of CULTURES here' as you put it.

iii - a) Your claims to love a multi-cultural world stand in stark contrast to your primary agenda of racial purity. Many racist claim to love a multi-cultural world, no doubt part of the 'dog-whistling' mentioned earlier, thus do I say that your claims in this respect are entirely specious, which is to say misleading given your central agenda of ethnic-cleansing.

iii - b) Also your espousal of fundamentalist Christianity does not square with a love of a multicultural world given that Christianity has done more in the name of oppressive colonial globalisation than all other colonial ideologies put together.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: M.Ted
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:47 AM

Just to sum things up, freedom of speech is a good thing , but some people shouldn't be encouraged to excercise it.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Confrontation Viper
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:43 AM

if WAV wants to write that way then it is a free speech site or supposed to be and yet there are some people who come onto this site and try and shoot down the free thinkers

Bollocks, Arran.

Free speech ends as soon as ideas run contrary to human interest. WAV is not a free thinker & he does not believe in free speech. WAV believes in a racist totalitarianism founded on his own extremely xenophobic view of human culture. From his writings (which are on-line for anyone to read in his much promoted 'Free Website') it would seem he is also (surprise, surprise) a homophobic Bible-basher, though how this squares with his multi-cultural view of the world is anyone's guess, but logic & consistency are most certainly not among his strong points.

As for his being from England, well, it's obvious to anyone who's listened to his myspace site, that his claims in this respect are as specious as his claims to love a nice multicultural world. The man is very obviously Australian - no matter where he claims to have been born - and whilst, of course, there's no harm in that it would seem ironic that WAV would appear to be as much an immigrant as those he would 'repatriate' if given half a chance.

Cast the first stone? Dear God, what sort of people would we be if we didn't?

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: goatfell
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:34 AM

I just Believe in Free speech by all people, but don't get angry with those that don't agree with you becasue it takes two to create an argument and just one, and I Don't have Paranoia, mind you sometimes I hear voices in my head.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:21 AM

I've never mentioned "racial purity", CB - I've only questioned multiculturalism and the loss of CULTURES here; and I keep saying the truth that I do love the world being multicultural, but most of my critics here seem to ignore that for some reason..?..and is it such a bad/evil/demon/extreme thing if FROM NOW ON immigration is slowed down , via the UN?

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:21 AM

Ron- I'm glad we agree, you must have read the posts above quite differently from how I read them.....excluding WAV's.

I was responding to this:

"The attack on "globalilzation" seems to be a simple-minded paranoia that truly doesn't understand what the term means. (I love it when someone from a country that for years called themselves the Empire where the sun never sets blames America for trying to force itself on the rest of the world!)."

I think the British Empire was responsible for some pretty awful things in the past and I think the USA/UK alliance is doing some pretty awful things right now.....I also think that this has little to do with what I know of English/ British / American culture and everything to do with the egos of a few "leaders".

Paul

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: TheSnail
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:19 AM

WFDU - Ron Olesko

a majority of posts on this thread have taken an England vs. USA stance and gone unchallenged?

Ron, as I tried to say to Charlotte, please don't think that WAV's views are representative.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:10 AM

Arran - free speech is exactly what everyone has. Free speech does not include the right to be free from challenge. You express an opinion, others express theirs. If you are not comfortable with your own position and feel that you are being attacked and shouted down, perhaps you need to do some self-exploration to see why you feel that way. Paranoia is not the answer.

Banjiman- I wonder why you felt it necessary to remind me that this is not a USA vs. England debate, when a majority of posts on this thread have taken an England vs. USA stance and gone unchallenged? I totally agree, it is not a debate pitting culture vs. culture - that was the point I was trying to make.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: TheSnail
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:02 AM

Ron, thanks for the good words about Bob Copper.

Arran, free speech includes the right to reply.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:53 AM

Arran.....and we are free to contradict those views if we don't like them.

I have no problem with WAV expressing his (what I find distasteful) views....but they do need to be (I think) forcefully challenged.

Paul

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: goatfell
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:46 AM

what happened to free speech eh!

Pc and all that crap that these people can away with, if WAV wants to write that way then it is a free speech site or supposed to be and yet there are some people who come onto this site and try and shoot down the free thinkers

so good on you WAV for having the guts to put over your views, some I might not agree with but they are your views and you are entitiled to them the same as I.

he who is without sin cast the first stone

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:45 AM

WFDU- Ron Olesko

Ron,

Let's not set this up as a Britain (England?) v USA thing, it isn't. We are all trying to deal with the views of one extremist here....we all have them, this one just happens to claim "Englishness"....though not a brand of Englishness that I buy into.

Paul

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:38 AM

"Bob Copper, in a documentary just before he passed away, admitted falling "hook-line-and-sinker" for American blues when it first reached England...but later went back to singing unaccompanied or in close-harmony with family"

I only had the honor of meeting Bob Copper once, and while I would never claim to know the man's thoughts, I think I can safely say that the above statement is probably the most twisted interpretation in an attempt to blame "globalization" that I've heard on these threads.

I did hear Bob Copper profess his love for the blues, and he was not apologizing for it.   From what I gather, Bob was open to new ideas and he realized that the culture that his family preserved was as important and as interesting as the culture that developed the blues. He had an open mind and did not allow himself to fall prey to bigoted thoughts that would have blinded him from experiencing other cultures. Yes, Bob Copper sang the blues, and yes he continued (not went back) to singing with his family as he did his whole life. He was not a one-trick pony and he did not look at life through blinders.

The attack on "globalilzation" seems to be a simple-minded paranoia that truly doesn't understand what the term means. (I love it when someone from a country that for years called themselves the Empire where the sun never sets blames America for trying to force itself on the rest of the world!).

Music and culture should be treated like a stew - it isn't run through a blender. You can always enjoy the bits and morsels of each ingredient and taste the distinct flavors that is added - when you finish a bowl of all these bits, you are fullfilled.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: The Sandman
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:12 AM

Walksabout,as someone that sings English Australian Scottish Irish and even occasionally American songs,I sing them because I like them.
most of the songs I sing happen to be traditional,although I have sung and recorded contemporary songs[some self composed].
I think the difference between you and I,is that you sing songs because they are English,I sing a song because I think it is a good song[it doesnt matter to me if A LLoyd wrote it].
now defining Englishness is very difficult,England is a country that has constantly,welcomed immigrants,and in its not so recent history has also been invaded a fair few times.
it is a nation that has been the result of many influences look at the language,there is no such thing in England as racial purity.
The royal family is a prime example.
my own family is part irish part german and part english.
Ithink you need to reevaulate your views.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 07:12 AM

Frankly, I've only heard bits of The Imagined Village, Joe, on radio and (you know what I'm going say) I genuinely did not like it. But I do like a lot of what Martin has done and said, and the same goes for Bob Copper (even though The Snail doesn't like me saying so).

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 07:04 AM

"It is neither possible nor desirable to set up musical border checkpoints anywhere." Martin Carthy

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 06:52 AM

Well said CV.

I don't mind people having opinions, but when someone's view of the world has some ideas similar to my own, (I believe in maintaining certain traditions that are coincidentally unique to England, but not because they are unique to England - anyway these traditions EVOLVE - with multicultural influence!!!)and are then extended to justify racial and cultural segregation, it is important for such views to be singled out and uncovered for the load of nonsense that they are.

WAV - what do you think of Martin Carthy's involvement with the Imagined Village?

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: The Sandman
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 06:51 AM

Perhaps we should change the name of this one to "The Personal Attack Permathread"?

As I said earlier, those that can, do
yes,quite right, I do,in fact I have been doing it for over thirty five years and if you would like to visit my website,youcan hear me and purchase cds /tutors etchttp://www.dickmiles.com

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Confrontation Viper
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 06:32 AM

Perhaps we should change the name of this one to "The Personal Attack Permathread"?

There is nothing personal about any of this; on the contrary, it's about as impersonal as it gets seeing as how, for whatever reason, the central protagonist seems to have eliminated actual living humanity from their somewhat perplexing philosophy of English Culture.

As for an attack, one would hope the only wish on anyone's mind here is to let said protagonist know just how misguided & ill-informed such ideas are in the hope something might be done about them.

When it comes to culture, living humanity is all that matters. It doesn't matter if the English people of 100 years ago sang their Traditional English Folk Songs unaccompanied, the fact is, barring a tiny minority of revivalist folk song enthusiasts, they don't now.

Why don't they? Well, because they're all dead for a start; notwithstanding some very serious questions over just how many of them sang these Traditional English Folk Songs in the first place, and how much of it is a myth perpetuated, however so unwittingly, by the revival. To go back to an earlier point on this thread (see above, Walkaboutsverse 24 Apr 08 - 01:27 PM) in a very real sense, as babies boomed, it was folk-year-zero.

I'm sure such issues have been dealt with elsewhere, but when entire lifetimes were spent without ever once encountering a single folk song in any sort of traditional context, then one must begin to wonder to what extent, if any, Traditional English Folk Song ever permeated English Culture as a whole. If it did, then it certainly didn't do so in a vacuum, though one might at least postulate the sort of circumstances in which it could well have done, but chances are we'll end up tripping along the leafy lane to Lark Rise.

Seductive as such idyllic visions undoubtedly are, they remain just that - idyllic visions with little or no baring on reality whatsoever; not then, and certainly not now. So to suggest that Our Own Good English Culture is any way, shape or form defined by Traditional English Folk Song is perhaps a little wide of the mark - but to then go on to advise on how said Traditional English Folk Song should (or more to the point should not) authentically be performed is surely to enter into realms of the absurd.

Worst of all, however, is to suggest that this barely legible footnote in the social history of a culturally impoverished lumpenproletariat is somehow good for our National Identity and Well-being. Good for the elite minority who love such things perhaps, but for the majority it is, and understandably so, absolutely meaningless - indeed, as ghastly, as the man said.

True English Folk Culture is out there doing whatever it is that people are doing; it's listening to whatever it is that they're listening to, and playing whatever it is that they're playing and, get this, it's loving every fecking minute of it. True English Folk Culture is getting on with the daily reality of multi-ethnic, multi-cultural, multi-faith life without ever once stopping to trouble over the anachronistic minutiae that might provide such endless fascination to the likes of us.

In fact, I dare say most of us are doing just that anyway...

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: TheSnail
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 06:11 AM

walkaboutsverse, you may have seen Bob Copper in a documentary; I knew him personally. Do not EVER use his name again to support your obnoxious ideas.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:53 AM

Whether or not we like it, and whether we call it globalisation or Americanisation, one cannot deny that it is happening.
Perhaps it's a good time for some name-drops to fall on this thread: the late great English folkie Bob Copper, in a documentary just before he passed away, admitted falling "hook-line-and-sinker" for American blues when it first reached England...but later went back to singing unaccompanied or in close-harmony with family, or with LIGHT self-accompaniment from an English concerina; similar could be said of the living folk-lengend Martin Carthy - only his LIGHT accompaniment comes from a guitar (I, for one, would love to hear him play the English cittern...has he..?).

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: Peter Beta
Date: 29 Apr 08 - 02:23 AM

Perhaps we should change the name of this one to "The Personal Attack Permathread"?

As I said earlier, those that can, do...

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: The Sandman
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 07:07 PM

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko - PM
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 09:26 AM

Walkaboutverse - you need to figure out why your "culture" is supposedly being lost and "replaced" by globalization/Americanisation. If you are importing a high percentage of children's programs, perhaps there is a reason? Are your own programs delivering the needed messages?   Why are people watching the shows they watch?

No matter how hard you stamp your feet and hold your breath until you turn blue, you cannot force people into a culture they do not want nor can you stop evolution. I hate to be the one to clue you in, but our own culture in the United States has changed as well. It is important to raise concerns, but unless you have a workable plan to change it, what is your point?
   walkabouts plan is that we should have a world of walkabout prose and walkabout recorder playing.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 05:58 PM

'Well, I know Walkaboutsverse's "poetry" is pretty awful but that's putting it a bit strong. Please don't mistake his incoherent ramblings for general opinion in the UK.'

Snail I don't, I realise that there are the many who find racism every bit as disgusting.... and as for referring to WAV verse as a dreadful and loathsome state of affairs......wellllllll *LOL*

Charlotte R

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: TheSnail
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 05:47 PM

GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice

a dreadful and loathsome state of affairs.

Well, I know Walkaboutsverse's "poetry" is pretty awful but that's putting it a bit strong. Please don't mistake his incoherent ramblings for general opinion in the UK.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 04:48 PM

"Sorry to be pedantic, Ron, but it looks to me like at least some of the most, erm, execrable postings here have actually come from those who hail from YOUR side of the pond...just saying, loike."

I accept your apology Peter.

Re-read the thread and then HONESTLY tell me where the "execrable" postings are coming from. We certainly have our share of racists, but I think the jist of this thread comes from a Chicken Little paranoia that the sky is falling ontop of your traditions. It ain't, y'all.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 04:44 PM

You appear to be the one out of touch with reality. Considering my father is British I hardly think I have any prejudices against the British, as I also stated, I've resided in several British cities..the world revolving around me...?hardly, sunshine. I am one of many or have posted here that holds the same opinion, and there is nothing you can say that would alter my opinion. Get a grip. as they say over here. :-D

Charlotte R

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: Peter Beta
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 04:38 PM

"...the racism that prevails there."

Sounds a bit racist against Brits, that does.

Earth to Charlotte R: The world does not revolve around you!

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 04:30 PM

'actually come from those who hail from YOUR side of the pond...just saying, loike......'

Ohh, I think were more than just "saying loike" Can't speak for others but I believe I've posted, elsewhere, that I have resided in the UK and have experienced the racism that prevails there. While I may live "on this side" now I do not believe this bars me (or anyone else for that matter) from having an opinion about a dreadful and loathsome state of affairs.

Charlotte R

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: Peter Beta
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 04:16 PM

Love Morrissey too, but I think you'll find he ain't no multiculturalist!

Sorry to be pedantic, Ron, but it looks to me like at least some of the most, erm, execrable postings here have actually come from those who hail from YOUR side of the pond...just saying, loike.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Ewan Spawned a Monster
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 12:50 PM

WAV, I think you can't tell the difference between multiculturalism and tourism. Going on holiday, even on a shoestring and even to lots of exotic places has nothing to do with multiculturalism. It really is just going on holiday. Who was it who talked about "a cheap holiday in someone else's misery"? Ah, that great English icon Johnny Rotten. With his Irish roots and love of dub reggae.

Your sophorific English idyll never existed outside of the minds of the Pre-Raphaelites.

I prefer the place where another English icon with Irish roots said: "Where taxi drivers never stop talking under slate grey Victorian skies".

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Confrontation Viper
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 12:41 PM

Like what?

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 12:21 PM

I'm sure there are many citizens of America who, like me, don't like globalisation (they may, e.g., have enjoyed being in-among other cultures for a time on their travels), and are glad that some other nationals are at least trying to do something about it.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: goatfell
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 10:55 AM

what is the 'R' word is it rain, run, road or is it being truthful rascist, i mean this is political correctness gone mad.

say what is on your mind and the freedom of speech, oh and if you don't vote in an election then you're make the right parties ie the BNP more populour because you didn't vote against them.

if I remeber Ruth was saying some nasty things about me as wel, but I just don't read her posts anyway because I said that Bernard Manning was dead and that was a shame and then I got my head taken off because I showed him and his family some sympathy and they didn't.

Subject: RE: Pop Goes The Folk Singer
From: GUEST,Ewan Spawned A Monster
Date: 28 Apr 08 - 10:37 AM

"This looks like another thread that went down the crapper. Nice job by our friends on the other side of the pond.

People do not lose their culture, culture evolves."

Ron, it's a thread that started in the crapper. Most contributors (from this side of the pond - away wi' yer pondism!) are making entirely the same point as you, because they're embarassed to see someone with confused and repugnant views claiming to speak for them and their culture (or at least the part of it he believes is 'pure' enough. Don't get me started on the myth of cultural purity, though).

I agree entirely with what Sedayne has said. And if Ruth is a 'troll', I'm a goblin.