BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?

Subject: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 11:28 AM

Have you ever heard the term "alky eyes" which refers to a particularly wet-looking eye even when "sober" (some might say a "glassy eye"), and does anyone have actual scientific information about the physiological cause and the stage of alcoholism in which it occurs?

Links to solid info appreciated,

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Alice
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 11:40 AM

Yes, eyes watery, even when not drinking.

COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES AGENCY

DOCUMENTATION OF REASONABLE SUSPICION

Click here

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 11:43 AM

That's GREAT, Alice, thanks.

Have you heard it as he term "alky eyes"?

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Alice
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 11:51 AM

Not alky eyes, but I've mentioned to people before that I can usually recognize the alcoholic eyes.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 01:17 PM

What stage-- I mostly notice it with people who "appear" to be "functioning" quite well. People who, a year or two later, what a surprise-- they start to bottom out, with noticeable adverse effects in their lives. Is there literature that narrows in on this? (There is another professional application of the info I am researching.)

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Alice
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 01:22 PM

Every person is unique. It's more noticeable in someone who has years of binges.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Melissa
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 01:36 PM

are you talking about wet eyes that seem to show around the same time as the gunky-throat?

I don't have any real information/knowledge, but I always kind of thought it seemed like part of the stage where the body has had a lot of drink (or some drugs) and is still getting a chance to try making up for the blood/body effects. My (admittedly made-up) theory is that since bodies try hard to be healthy, and mucus/moisture is a way we clean out some impurities, the eyes/throat thing might be from a body trying to get rebalanced.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: GUEST,Anon.
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 02:48 PM

I'm 16 years clean and sober and I've never heard that term in AA. That doesn't mean it isn't in use.But most of us in the program seem to be able to spot active heavy drinkers more by their behavior than just looking at the eyes. The nose can be a giveaway too when you see the broken blood vessels that give the nose a "rosey" appearance. Think of the old photos of WC Fields for instence.

I'll PM you in a few days when I'm on a different computer.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: gnu
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 03:47 PM

Am I lookin at you?

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 04:24 PM

Gno, gnu, gnot me.

Thanks, Anon. Look forward to hearing from ya.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: LilyFestre
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 04:27 PM

Having grown up around my fair share of alcoholics, I can usually tell from looking at the eyes if someone has had/does have an issue with alcohol. I've never heard the term before but it makes sense. I don't know if it's common to be able to *see* this as both my husband and I are able to tell. Other family members, however, don't see it as readily.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: LilyFestre
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 04:29 PM

As to links with solid facts about this, I never really looked.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Ebbie
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 04:35 PM

Surely there are medical conditions, such as allergies or emphesema, that may present identical symptoms? I would hate to think that everybody has to be uptight about people's possible suspicions about them.

Reminds me too much of past dogma about being able to identify the criminal just from appearance.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Alice
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 04:39 PM

No one is saying watery eyes means you are an alcoholic!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: LilyFestre
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 04:43 PM

Ebbie,

    No one needs to be uptight about anything. Of course there are other things that have similar symptoms...just as with any other condition. For me, from what I can see usually proves to be true. Doesn't mean I'm never mistaken and it certainly doesn't mean I go around judging. It's a disease. Period.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 05:01 PM

Lighter, "Historical Dictionary of Americn Slang."
Alky stiff- a habitually drunken tramp or beggar. England, 1913, but later also American.

No entry for alky eyes.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: LilyFestre
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 08:10 PM

"Your Appearance - If you want to have clear skin and bright eyes, don't drink alcohol. According to researchers, more than one or two drinks a week promotes aging. Alcohol is considered a food with non-nutritional calories that quickly add up. When you abuse alcohol, you tend to be undernourished, making your hair dry, giving you cracked lips, aggravating acne, making your eyes look glassy, and giving your skin a puffy, broken vein look." ~found at www.drug-rehab.org

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 08:27 PM

Alice said,

No one is saying watery eyes means you are an alcoholic!!!!!!!

I thought that was EXACTLY what was being said!

If so, it's not accurate, at least across the board. I have (and have had, for many a year) watery eyes. I'm no teetotaler, but at 78 I'm quite able to confidently state that I'm not an alcoholic, despite chronic watery eyes.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 09:22 PM

A friendly comment on the above posts:

I'm not surprised rabidly anti-authority folkie types (aren't we all here to one degree or another at Mudcat) would worry that snap judgments are being made. I am not at liberty to say why I am asking about this. (Respect that please.)

Of course you all know about the PM system....

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Ebbie
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 09:26 PM

"When you abuse alcohol, you tend to be undernourished, making your hair dry, giving you cracked lips, aggravating acne, making your eyes look glassy, and giving your skin a puffy, broken vein look."

So can cancer.

I'm not feeling as "rabid" as suggested but the notion of going by appearance does bother me.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Peace
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 09:28 PM

Another way to search for info about this in by googling

alcoholics, rheumy eyes

No quotation marks.

I've never heard the term 'alky eyes'. The word 'alky' used in reference to people who drank lots ('never knew he drank until I saw him sober once' kinda folks) was in usage when I was a kid, but seems to have disappeared when alcoholism was seen more as a disease than a social failing or character 'flaw'.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 09:51 PM

Eyes like two holes burned in a blanket-

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: LilyFestre
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 10:04 PM

And Ebbie, an insulin dependent diabetic can appear to be someone with a drug habit on many levels. I think there are all kinds of symptoms or signs that can be mistaken for one thing or another. You know what they say about assuming!!!

:) Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Aug 09 - 11:48 PM

Going by appearance ALONE is of course foolish. Rest assured, that's not where I'm going with this.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Ebbie
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 02:22 AM

We know that, WYSIWG.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 07:56 AM

OK then, I just want some more scientifically-based lit on this.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: LilyFestre
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 09:42 AM

I bet if you phoned a few rehabs or counseling centers they might be able to point you in the right direction.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Alice
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 10:36 AM

It's only part of a jigsaw of physical effects from a long time of binge drinking and isn't apparent in all alcoholics. As I said before, every person is unique. You have to know more about the behavior and other symptoms. In some people the physical effects that show in the face are part of the puzzle.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Alice
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 10:43 AM

The Facial Signs of Alcoholism

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Stringsinger
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 03:32 PM

Susan, this brings up the issue of closet drinkers of which there are quite a few.
One scientific way to determine this is to study the behavioral pattern of the "alky-eyed"
individual and find out what hidden addictions they may have.

Also, it might manifest itself in attitude. Alcoholics tend to be combative. The Elmer Dowd
character is a misnomer.

Frank

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 05:13 PM

"We're ignoring him, hoping he'll go away and stop staring at us with his old alkie eyes."
--from Hacker Cracker: A Journey from the Mean Streets of Brooklyn to the Frontiers, by Ejovi Nuwere with David Chanoff, 2002.

"Now, here, next to him, sat a middle-aged slut with bulging reddened alkie eyes, leering through rotten teeth, just beginning to go to fat in a serious way."
--from "Maggie May" by Lester Bangs, 1981; in Lit Riffs [a collection of short stories by various writers] edited by Matthew Miele, 2004.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Alice
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 05:54 PM

Oh, well... if you want literary references....

'He narrows his blue, codger alkie eyes at me and winks. "Not with the life I done led."' - riverwalkjournal.org

"GOAL: to survive both of my Mothers. The one who raised me for better or worse who is alive and well in Eugene Oregon...and the less fortunate less stable one who gave me my squinty, bloodshot alkie eyes you can see when I remove my sunglasses." - Whiskey Rebel's Diary

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 10:28 PM

www.riverwalkjournal.org is devoted partly to "creative nonfiction."

Some pretty creative stuff in this thread.

Thanks, Jim. WYSIWYG finally got something of substance.

Subject: RE: BS: Obscure Alcoholism Fact or Factoid?
From: bankley
Date: 01 Sep 09 - 09:37 AM

"I sit a fool upon a stool in the Alky Hall of Fame"

Alcoholics go to meetings.... drunks don't, but they still have last names...