US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?

Subject: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:39 AM

The thread title should have said "US Elections 2010 What effect will it have on Obama running the country?" , but unfortunately Mudcat does not allow such long titles.

OK I am in the UK, and am curious to know what effect the elections will have on Obama running the country. From what I read and hear, the Democrats will get a hammering today and the Republicans will win quite heavily.

How will this effect Obama?
Will he still be able to run as President?

Why have a Mid term election? Surely that creates instabilty in the running of the country. At this moment, it doesn't make much sense to me, especially as the President has no control over who wins the seats. It would be different if he was making changes from his own party.

Anyway, is it possible that you USA mudcatters can explain to us UK,ers what gives, in simple unbiased lay mans terms. Please refrain from vitriol and slagging off, of mudcatters please. Everybody has a viewpoint and that should be respected.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 08:06 AM

IF the Tea Party Nutters get too many elected it will put a lot of things back 100 years !
But Obama will have a harder job getting his reforms through unless the Dems keep their edge

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: catspaw49
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 09:08 AM

Saw Jimmy Carter the other night on Bill Maher's program and he said this would give the GOP control of one part of the government (the House) that they would be reponsible for. During the past two years the only thing the GOP has done is bitch. Now, if Obama puts forth good and well reasoned legislation and they stop it, he can go to the people and say, "Look who is stopping the changes you asked for."

If the Dems are smart enough to use this, it could work out for them.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 09:31 AM

If th USA sleepwalks into the arms of the lunatic theocratic right numpties (as seems likely) then a large part of the consequence is going to depend on just HOW moronic the numpties can and will be. Since their entire platform appears to be rooted in kneejerk naysaying I think there is a real risk that they will block everything without any rationality. That could reduce the USA to "failed state" status in about 6 months if all budgetary measures were blocked.

They might just be stupid enough to do it.

That would necessitate immediate unconditional withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan (no money - no firepower, no troops).

It would rein in US cultural imperialism.

Within a year "The Grapes of Wrath" would be the norm again.

Within two, parts of the USA would be the Wild West again (although the private armies are much bigger, more powerful, and more dangerous right now).

It's likely to be disastrous for biodiversity.

I can't see the restriction of Federal power helping with the drugs wars in Mexico.

It could be the beginning of the apocalypse.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 11:13 AM

Gee, Richard....that sounds scary! Should I emigrate to the UK, where elections and politics is always fair, sane & reasonable?

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 11:21 AM

That being said, the crazies (some of whom are going to be elected) can only run in circles, hold hearings and look foolish. The Senate will NOT have enough idiots to pass stupid stuff, and Obama is unlikely to sign it if they did.
The Republicans spent the last 2 years refusing to cooperate on almost ANY reasonable legislation, and there will not be enough of a power shift to allow them to run rough-shod over the Democrats.
Sadly, what it may lead to is gridlock....with very little of ANY significant stuff being passed.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: catspaw49
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 11:49 AM

Which was Carter's point as well Bill. But the part of Carter's statement I enjoyed was how Obama could actually use that to start things moving. Taking his case to the people is what got Obama elected but when he took office he swapped and took a very modified to Congress.

Although his Congress was Dem controlled, Obama immediately started to try and sell his programs by modifying them, watering them down, and in essence starting from a middle position instead of what he claimed he wanted. It made no sense and simply gave the GOP a head start on shooting them down. Obama and company became more afraid of a minority than they were confident in their own plans. All the Republicans had to say was "possible filibster" and the Dems with Obama ran off screaming the sky was falling.

So now perhaps Obama can submit legislation the people want and when the Republicans kill it he can say to America,, "We're doing our best but they are stopping what you want done." Frankly I think Barack may lack the balls to do it. He lost a lot of stature from my view when he decded the place to begin health care changes was from some overly compromised, watered down, centrist position, rather than what he had put forth during the campaign.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 12:42 PM

"The Senate will NOT have enough idiots to pass stupid stuff, and Obama is unlikely to sign it if they did. "



BillD,

You have made a false statement- For the LAST two years, there has been, and he has.


"Have to pass the bill before we can find out what is in it."

( yes, I know that was the House- The Senate just locked out the minority party and then complained when they did not support what the Dems had come up with with NO Rep input.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 12:48 PM

Hmmm,

Let me answer the question as a Canadian who studied the US system many years ago and who is in the US now.

In the UK the executive (cabinet) and legislative branches are are in parliament.

In the US Congress does legislation and the President appoints the cabinet form outside congress.

If Congress becomes Republican then Obama will still run the cabinet departments but he will not be able to get new laws passed.

At this time the Republicans are threatening to refuse funding to laws that previous Congresses have passed and to refuse funding to support Supreme Court decisions with which they disagree. If they do this, things will be bad.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 12:50 PM

No, I wasn't saying that the numpties could pass what they wanted. I was saying that they could block anything they didn't want.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 12:53 PM

http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2010/11/02/the-us-midterm-elections-reasons-to-be-cheerful/

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 01:11 PM

""Have to pass the bill before we can find out what is in it."

Taken totally out of context, as I said before.

"The Senate just locked out the minority party and then complained when they did not support what the Dems had come up with with NO Rep input."

THAT is something between a distortion and an outright lie. Even when the Dems DID attempt to compromise and include the input the Reps said they wanted, the Reps voted against it! Many times they voted against their own stated positions. The whole point was to to deny Obama ANY victories, and then call him a failure.

You will remember that when Bush was in, he used signing statements and other 'legal' but sneaky tricks to shove thru almost anything he wanted...and even after a narrow victory in 2004, he stated that he "had a mandate" to run things HIS way. I can just imagine the apoplectic Repub faces if Obama had tried that!

You, Bruce, go on at length about 'double-standards', but you never seem to see that the phrase "we are the current majority party, and it is OUR turn to legislate" seems to apply only to Republicans. IF they again become the majority party, we will see how they interpret 'being in power'.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 01:27 PM

I'm a bit puzzled why it should make such a big difference. Even with a Democratic majority, it appears that with pretty well everything that majority has tried to do, the minority opposition has been able to stop it in its track. Presumably the same would be true if there was a Republican majority now. You'll still have a gridlock.

I would imagine that one consequence might be to bring about a reaction against the victorious Republicans which would help Obama get back, and give him a majority in Congress in two years time...

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 01:33 PM

Actually McGrath, this Congress has got as much done as any Congress in history.

Ted Kennedy's death and Brown's election changed that.

It is a certainty that Obama will get almost nothing done which requires legislation in the next Congress. The Democrats saw that train coming down the track when Paulson and Bush scuttled the economy on the way out. They got as much done as they could, while they could.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 01:38 PM

Things are working out just fine for Hill n' Bill.
Watch them go!

Who will be the "numpties" then?

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 01:50 PM

Maddow lists what this Congress has done.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 02:10 PM

In answer to the poster of this thread- answering without throwing in political postures.
At polling time today, it looks like the House of Representatives will have a Republican majority but the Democrats will probably keep the Senate by a slim majority.
If the Republicans see an advantage in blocking Obama's programs, likely there will be gridlock. By making Obama a 'lame duck', without ability to push programs forward, they would hope that voters would turn to the Republicans, who would then be able to push their programs forward and win the 2012 presidency.

Older line Republicans will use the noises of Tea-party types to their advantage, but the few elected will not have any weight in committees.

Obama has made some important gains. Along with other major nations, the stimulus packages and temporary buy-outs halted the descent into depression. Of course it will take time for jobs, income levels and hubris to return world-wide.
General Motors, etc., and major banking concerns are repaying loans as they get back on their feet.
The health bill, although too complicated, is quite an advance.
Involvement in the useless wars is being reduced although much too slowly.
Stimulus packages are helping in some areas.

Major failure- education for the future. Little hope of a turn-around under the Republicans if they gain control.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 02:59 PM

Major failure- education for the future

The Democrats put through affordable student loans and saved tens of thousands of teaching positions with the stimulus. Maybe not a major success, but certainly not a major failure.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 03:32 PM

a Republican House could probably be effective in blocking funding. Not sure what else. The existing Senate has already been a prett damn effective roadblock.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Donuel
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 03:39 PM

We only had a taste of gridlock with the historic number of filibusters.

THe new gridlock will be even deeper and more profound if the house goes repub.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 03:40 PM

Obama had a few interesting things to say about these things in his Daily Show interview.

To our UK friends, I would say that if you can watch it, do. I won't bother posting the link on Comedy Central (thedailyshow.com) for you. You probably can't see it over there.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 04:00 PM

Flaws in the education stimulus-
No provision for more than two-year period.
Large sums go to charter schools, to the detriment of public eduation.
States tend to put the money toward structures rather than toward improving education levels. States determine thrust; one (South Carolina) refuses the money.
Link between poor parental background and student achievement not addressed.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 04:34 PM

Precisely, Dick. Down the route of no-funding to the wild west.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 04:39 PM

Good points Q.

But way more than the Republicans would have done / did do.

That was a Major failure.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:08 PM

Very interesting and thanks to one and all for posting and keeping it as a debate and allowing each other to make their point without flaming.

So it looks as though, if you want to do anything that will happen, you need to do things before the mid term. If those things are good you will retain the momentum. However if they are not good, the opposition will step in and make life damn difficult.

Wouldn't like to be Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Donuel
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:15 PM

The US could always outsource its education by hiring folks from India and China to do highly technical work. The wealthy class will still have access to higher education and eventually fill the adademic institutions with plutarchs. Soon the populist point of view will be historicly revised and slowly die. Of course society would take on a rather Orwellian police state quality. ;)

Public education is in certain peril as is with unfunded mandates and poor student results. The push to disband portions of public education or even eliminate it entirely is ludicrous.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:19 PM

No not really.

What happened this time can't really be applied generally. I am not sure they will be rewarded for the momentum. The economic woes have been nearly without precedent. What the Democrats have been hoping (or at least saying that they have been hoping) is that Republicans in control of one or both houses that Republicans will be forced to do something other than obstruct and thus for the next two years will share responsibility for the bad economy. In 2012 Obama will be facing a Republican party, split by the Tea Party base, alienating moderates and probably nominating some semi-intelligent, slogan spewing Fox employed Yahoo who will have to scratch an claw for every vote beyond the 23% of the country that watches Fox "News" and believes anything that station puts forth.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:26 PM

Assuming the Republicans do well, it will mean that over the next two years both parties would be simultaneously trying to present themselves as at one and the same time being the government and being the opposition - trying to appeal to the instinct people have to back any incumbent, and the instinct other people have to throw out any incumbent.

There's a thing called "the luxury of opposition" - and neither party is going to be able to enjoy it.

If you has a different electoral system, this would be an opportunity for a third party to make a breakthrough.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:36 PM

", this would be an opportunity for a third party to make a breakthrough."

It would indeed..but both major parties have their entire procedures tied up in THIS silly system....and the only mechanisms for changing it would be boycotted by both, probably...surely by the Republicans. We have too many positions to cram into two parties, and most 3rd party attempts simply deny a win to someone.

It is a real problem.

Subject: RE: BS: US Elections2010 What effect do it have?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:36 PM

This year the Republicans were clever. Their most loyal elements invented (co-opted whatever) a false third party called the Tea Party and channeled that anger into Republican support in this election. I know they were Republicans because they claimed to be against Big Government and for strict adherence to the Constitution, they were only for those things when applied to Democrat policies.

My hope is that such an obvious con cannot work for two elections in a row.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:47 PM

The extremist bunch who 'formed' the Tea Party coalition knew that a 3rd party would just founder, and that many of them were already Republicans, so just coopting the closest existing party made more sense.
The real hope is that they will behave SO stupidly in the next year or two that it will be obvious what has happened.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:48 PM

As far as I can see, the Republican Party hates Mrs Palins faction even more than the Democrats do.

Any action not sanctioned by either member of the two party system is viewed as an extreme danger.

They have a dislike for people who think for themselves.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 05:57 PM

LOL...the Republicans are scared s**tless that Palin will try seriously to run.

*I* think, as I have for 2 years, that she has NO intention of BEING president...she just intends to keep making noises that bring her millions in speaking fees and power to influence other candidates.

She knows that BEING president is way too much work!

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 06:34 PM

Frankly, I can't see Palin being nominated in Convention. Candidates, to be viable, need a broader base than, I think, she has. Makes a good 'pepper' speaker, however.
Sidebar-
(and Michelle Obama has a much better speech delivery than her husband).

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 06:37 PM

I think she will run, especially if Hill n' Bill manage to shove Mr Obama out of the nest.

A Hillary/ Sarah head to head would be interesting, as thge Clintons seem to be as divisive amongst Democrats as Mrs Palin is to Republicans.

Mrs Palins strong suit of course is the huge group of unaffiliated voters the ones who rightly or wrongly identify with "their Queen"

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Nov 10 - 10:33 PM

I doubt that Mrs. Palin has a single voter who was not Republican in 2008. But she can win the nomination if she gets the delegates in the primaries. That is why she scares the Republican leadership. She has no support at all outside of the GOP base.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 12:46 AM

Chances are, he will continue to 'rule' against the will of the American people, and try to push his agendas, through the regulatory means that were set up....and find whatever loophole he can to push his ideology through. If he does, the Democrats and he, should kiss their careers and influence 'Good-Bye'!

Again, We'll see.

GfS

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Slag
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 01:43 AM

If the "tea parties" are a joke, who's laughing now? Obama's agenda, rejected. Neo-marxiam, rejected. Thousand plus page legislation passed, unread-REJECTED. The insanity of the left, REJECTED.

Let's se if the stupid Republicans have gotten the message. Fat chance. The stupid fools probably think people voted FOR them and not AGAINST the incumbents.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 02:24 AM

I agree with Slag, on this one. The Democrats won big in '08 as a referendum on the Republicans. The Republicans won big tonight, as a referendum against the Democrats. It would be nice, for a change, to vote FOR a directions, instead of going around in circles!

GfS

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 03:56 AM

Neo-Marxism? Where?

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 04:12 AM

The latest at 08:08 GMT time

The house of representatives under Republican rule Democrats 182 - Republicans 238

Senate Democrats 59 - Republicans 41

Governors Democrats 15 - Republicans 27

Blimey, Obama is in the fertiliser.

What things won't get through now?

Will the health scheme really go ahead now, or is that ring fenced as such?

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Richie Black (misused acct, bad email)
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 04:22 AM

So glad to see Americans are finally starting to see sense. The guy was a novelty, nothing else.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 04:27 AM

Looking at some blogs and comments thereon it is quite noteworthy that the posters in favour of the Republicans (and more so Tea Party Republicans) seem to have three common threads: -

1. They want more jobs for the lower economic echelons - but they are ignoring two key facts: first that there would be far fewer such jobs absent Obama's rescue package (despite its flaws) and second that a "small government" programme must inevitably more disadvantage such echelons. Their position here is simply economic illiteracy.
2.   They have a range of ideological objectives (things to do for example with religion, an obsolete constitution, "freedom", and patriotism) none of which have any bearing on what is practically needed.
3. The purest fantasy - for example that Obama is a neoMarxist or that his programmes are "socialism".

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 11:29 AM

Richie Black; "So glad to see Americans are finally starting to see sense. The guy was a novelty, nothing else."

The big deal over the election of Obama, was the euphoric feeling a lot of Americans felt over voting for that novelty, and he won. It was nothing more than rooting for the winner on American Idol, on a grand scale....and Barack certainly wasn't a Frank Sinatra!
More like tossing a fresh piece of meat into the water, and watching the far left wing sharks go into a feeding frenzy.

As far as how it will effect Obama.....He probably called housekeeping, and had them clean his mirrors!

GfS

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Donuel
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 11:31 AM

There is no disaster or earthquake or tidal wave...there is the opposite. There will be a stagnant gridlock that will ensue as Congressman Issa will appoint 76 new investigators to establish blame soley on the white house and various goverment employees tha will make the lawsuits which plagued Clinton look like a parking ticket.

On the heels of ACORN's destruction, Issa will target unions and community groups that will face the stings and arrows of outrageous misfortune with false accusations and "corrupt liberal bastard" witch hunts.

So as the people will suffer the delays of investigations, it will allow banks to continue their forclosure feeding frenzy, the repeal of basic Obama Wall St. reforms and health care and will only go to prove that the Republicans are only starting their 2012 presidential campaign, as all of American's basic corporate corruption problems will continue unabbated.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Donuel
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 11:39 AM

Only the accusations investigations and 2012 campaign strategies will succeed. The rest will face veto despite all the time money and hoopla.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Greg F.
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 11:43 AM

The Republicans won big tonight, as a referendum against the Democrats.

Actually, the Republicans won big in a referendum that repudiated fact, reality and critivcal thinking.

Lets hear it for delusional, ignorant morons.

H.L. Mencken's Boobocracy is in the ascendency.

Again.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 12:02 PM

Greg F: "The Republicans won big tonight, as a referendum against the Democrats.
Actually, the Republicans won big in a referendum that repudiated fact, reality and critivcal thinking.
Lets hear it for delusional, ignorant morons."

I got a better idea, why don't you include the whole thought, MORON!

GfS: "The Democrats won big in '08 as a referendum on the Republicans. The Republicans won big tonight, as a referendum against the Democrats. It would be nice, for a change, to vote FOR a direction, instead of going around in circles!"

Only seeing what they want to see, hearing what they want to hear...selective stupidity!

GfS

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Sawzaw
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 12:08 PM

"We're gonna make the sun rise in the West and move on to the East,"

Yeah, Clap Clap Clap, Cheer, Attaboy Jerry.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 12:14 PM

Who's Jerry?

GfS

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 12:51 PM

Americans have an inborn distrust of government that goes back to the American Revolution. at its best, this instinct gives us a cynicism that causes us to question whether the government is acting on our behalf as a people, or on behalf of vested special interests and/or power-hungry individuals in elected office.
However, there are a large number of individuals who are convinced that a near-complete absence of government is desirable. These people are fully confident in the ability of business to regulate itself. These are the people who think that global warming is a world-wide liberal environmentalist plot. These are also people who, while calling for elimination of government regulation of the Savings and Loan and the Banking Industry, watched these industries milk the system and blamed their misbehavior on poor people who shouldn't have gotten loans in the first place.
These people will tell you that Gridlock- no government action at all-is preferrable. Some of the Tea Party folks were elected on just such a platform.
I think this concept is extremely difficult for Europeans to grasp. What lies at the basis of it is scepticism about ANY information which is disseminated by ANYONE, since all media are thought to be controlled by pro-government forces. These people are inclined to trust only information which supports their existing belief system, which means that the majority of their input comes from demagogues who feed them opinion based primarily on anecdotal evidence, since no real studies can be trusted (read talk radio and FOX tv pundits).

So to answer the question, yes, it will have an impact on Obama, since gridlock will become the ruling legislative paradigm, and I see no further legislation of any substance being made law. Instead of a forum for change, congress is likely to become a platform for posturing.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 02:17 PM

I just saw the Obama press conference. He said NOTHING of substance, and what he did say, on the most part was re-phrasing the questions, then answering them. He did look a little subdued, though...but I didn't get the impression that he 'got it'. I did get the impression that he was more concerned with his self image!
It will be interesting to see, as this sinks in, whether he will get angrier or more in touch, with the people, or his ideology.

That was, in fact, a fair and an objective look at it.

GfS

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 02:39 PM

Objective?
You said "He did look a little subdued, though...but I didn't get the impression that he 'got it'. I did get the impression that he was more concerned with his self image!" Your "impressions" are by their nature subjective, not objective.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Don Firth
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 02:56 PM

Looked to me like he was pretty well on top of things. Not dismayed, just assessing the situation, like any highly intelligent person.

Contrary to the fond beliefs of some folks here, Obama is no dummy.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 02:58 PM

Arthur_itus asked a question in the first post that I don't think was ever answered. Why mid-term elections? The over-simplified answer-
Early on, the originators and emenders of the Constitution believed that, to avoid upheavel, not all members of Congress should be elected all at once.
Senators serve a six-year term. Every two-years, one-third of the senators are elected. This is supposed to ensure some continuity.

Representatives serve a two-year term. All of them are up for election every two-years, thus for them, the term 'mid-term' really doesn't have meaning- it is the time for all of them to be elected or rejected.

The changing winds of politics almost always seem to blow more strongly in the period about two-years after a presidential election, thus the Congressional elections reflect the attitude of the voters at that time. More often than not, the winds have blown against the President and the congressional members who support him.

Now posters can get back to throwing knives at each other-

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 03:12 PM

Yes Q. Thanks for that little erudite interruption to the ongoing fray.
I think Brits and many others find our Executive/Legislative/Judicial seperation confusing, particularly the idea that independently elected legislature members may be in a majority against the executive. The idea of off-setting checks and balances is an attempt to eliminate a single overriding entity, and primarily a dominating executive branch. Despite the dangers of political enemies sabotaging each other to the point of stalemate, much has often been accomplished through compromise in this situation. Clinton's second term was a notable example of this, as was Harry Truman's.
We can only hope that a sense of shared responsibility will put a thaw on the rabid polarization that now characterizes political opposition in Congress and in our country in general.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 03:21 PM

Thanks Q

I am pleased that nobody has been flaming and hopefully it will stay that way.

Interesting thread

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 04:37 PM

Greg F. may state it rather bluntly, but he is completely correct:

snippo

Eight False Things The Public "Knows" Prior To Election Day

By Dave Johnson

There are a number things the public "knows" as we head into the election that are just false. If people elect leaders based on false information, the things those leaders do in office will not be what the public expects or needs.

Here are eight of the biggest myths that are out there:

1) President Obama tripled the deficit.
Reality: Bush's last budget had a $1.416 trillion deficit. Obama's first budget reduced that to $1.29 trillion.

2) President Obama raised taxes, which hurt the economy.
Reality: Obama cut taxes. 40% of the "stimulus" was wasted on tax cuts which only create debt, which is why it was so much less effective than it could have been.

3) President Obama bailed out the banks.
Reality: While many people conflate the "stimulus" with the bank bailouts, the bank bailouts were requested by President Bush and his Treasury Secretary, former Goldman Sachs CEO Henry Paulson. (Paulson also wanted the bailouts to be "non-reviewable by any court or any agency.") The bailouts passed and began before the 2008 election of President Obama.

4) The stimulus didn't work.
Reality: The stimulus worked, but was not enough. In fact, according to the Congressional Budget Office, the stimulus raised employment by between 1.4 million and 3.3 million jobs.

5) Businesses will hire if they get tax cuts.
Reality: A business hires the right number of employees to meet demand. Having extra cash does not cause a business to hire, but a business that has a demand for what it does will find the money to hire. Businesses want customers, not tax cuts.

6) Health care reform costs $1 trillion.
Reality: The health care reform reduces government deficits by $138 billion.

7) Social Security is a Ponzi scheme, is "going broke," people live longer, fewer workers per retiree, etc.
Reality: Social Security has run a surplus since it began, has a trust fund in the trillions, is completely sound for at least 25 more years and cannot legally borrow so cannot contribute to the deficit (compare that to the military budget!) Life expectancy is only longer because fewer babies die; people who reach 65 live about the same number of years as they used to.

8) Government spending takes money out of the economy.
Reality: Government is We, the People and the money it spends is on We, the People. Many people do not know that it is government that builds the roads, airports, ports, courts, schools and other things that are the soil in which business thrives. Many people think that all government spending is on "welfare" and "foreign aid" when that is only a small part of the government's budget.

This stuff really matters.
If the public votes in a new Congress because a majority of voters think this one tripled the deficit, and as a result the new people follow the policies that actually tripled the deficit, the country could go broke.

If the public votes in a new Congress that rejects the idea of helping to create demand in the economy because they think it didn't work, then the new Congress could do things that cause a depression.
If the public votes in a new Congress because they think the health care reform will increase the deficit when it is actually projected to reduce the deficit, then the new Congress could repeal health care reform and thereby make the deficit worse. And on it goes.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 04:44 PM

The Republicans have not gone back on their pledges to do everything they can to drive Obama out of office.

I saw Michelle Bachman last night promise that the high income tax breaks, which did not directly create any jobs in ten years they have been in effect will create jobs NOW if extended. Obama is not dealing with a reality based opposition.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Greg F.
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 05:40 PM

Thanks for the assist, TIA.

But a friendly suggestion: don't waste your time trying to change the minds of morons with facts.

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 05:55 PM

TIA laid it out pretty succinctly. Those are the basic lies and exaggerations and distortions we have heard for almost 2 years. MOST of our problems were here when Obama took office, and expecting him to 'fix' someone else's screwups in 18 months is ridiculous...especially when all the Repubs did was drag their feet and vote "No".

GfS and Sawzaw and Richie Black are just parroting the conservative line... "Ridicule anything Obama says or does...we don't have to prove anything...we just need enough to swallow it!"

Subject: RE: US Elections2010What effect will it have on Obama?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 06:37 PM

Keep it clean you lot and no flaming or insulting each other.

Debate or don't bother