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TECH HELP Please

MikeL2 27 Jan 11 - 07:58 AM
GUEST,Grishka 27 Jan 11 - 02:13 PM
MikeL2 27 Jan 11 - 03:30 PM
GUEST 27 Jan 11 - 03:48 PM
GUEST 27 Jan 11 - 03:48 PM
Cluin 27 Jan 11 - 04:04 PM
Cluin 27 Jan 11 - 04:06 PM
GUEST,Grishka 27 Jan 11 - 04:16 PM
josepp 27 Jan 11 - 04:29 PM
Acme 27 Jan 11 - 04:37 PM
EBarnacle 27 Jan 11 - 07:05 PM
Amergin 27 Jan 11 - 07:11 PM
Bernard 27 Jan 11 - 07:35 PM
GUEST 27 Jan 11 - 08:05 PM
The Fooles Troupe 27 Jan 11 - 08:18 PM
Don Firth 27 Jan 11 - 08:23 PM
olddude 27 Jan 11 - 08:27 PM
Amos 27 Jan 11 - 09:16 PM
olddude 27 Jan 11 - 09:22 PM
olddude 27 Jan 11 - 10:20 PM
josepp 27 Jan 11 - 10:43 PM
The Fooles Troupe 28 Jan 11 - 12:20 AM
JohnInKansas 28 Jan 11 - 12:46 AM
GUEST,leeneia 28 Jan 11 - 01:10 AM
JohnInKansas 28 Jan 11 - 01:43 AM
The Fooles Troupe 28 Jan 11 - 03:09 AM
My guru always said 28 Jan 11 - 04:12 AM
JohnInKansas 28 Jan 11 - 05:05 AM
MikeL2 28 Jan 11 - 05:37 AM
MikeL2 28 Jan 11 - 05:41 AM
My guru always said 28 Jan 11 - 05:42 AM
MikeL2 28 Jan 11 - 05:51 AM
MikeL2 28 Jan 11 - 06:03 AM
MikeL2 28 Jan 11 - 06:47 AM
GUEST,Jon 28 Jan 11 - 09:20 AM
MikeL2 28 Jan 11 - 09:46 AM
GUEST,Jon 28 Jan 11 - 09:56 AM
GUEST,Grishka 28 Jan 11 - 10:04 AM
olddude 28 Jan 11 - 10:29 AM
Bernard 28 Jan 11 - 01:40 PM
MikeL2 28 Jan 11 - 03:06 PM
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Subject: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 07:58 AM

hi

I have a Sony Viao VPCF12S1E which I have had for a few months only. It runs on Windows 7.

Today as I went into the system to check my Email. I read one mail and deleted it and read another. After I had read it I tried to delete it which appeared to stop the computer.

I haven't added any software or hardware recently or any other changes to the system that I know of.

It switched itself out of the Email program and gave me a message on a black screen saying something like " switching out of Windows to protect your computer. It gave me some instructions which was to switch off and the on again and then......other instructions that I can't really remember.

However after I switched off and then back on again all I get is a black screen with sometimes a message at the top that says " can't find operating system".

Can anyone help me understand ( non tecchy here) what has happened and what I need to do to get back up.

Many thanks

Cheers

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 02:13 PM

I'm not a real expert; I would reinstall Windows. If you didn't backup your valuable data, try to save them using a live OS, or a harddisk-USB interface on another computer. If this is the case but you don't know how to, ask us again.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 03:30 PM

Hi Griska

Many thanks for your response.

Please excuse me if my answers appear naive but I am a non-teccie.

This Laptop is quite new and it came with Windows 7 already installed and running. I was given no Windows disk so I don't know how to re-install it.

I had some problems backing up on this machine but I backed up my data regularly on an external disk.
This has I presume saved all of my personal data like Photos,documents etc but not program files etc ?? I suppose I can restore this data on the laptop once I can get it back up with Windows installed.???

Re-installing Windows ( once I manage to be able to do it) will be like the state when I first received the computer from the store ??

Regards

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 03:48 PM

Phone the store Mike and find out what they tell you to do.

There is normally a hidden section that restores everything back to it's original state adn then you can at least re-install your work data.

Just wondering if you have a virus, or whether the hard disk has packed up.

As I said call the store first.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 03:48 PM

oops that was me Arthur_itus


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Cluin
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:04 PM


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Cluin
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:06 PM

http://forum.notebookreview.com/sony/355715-vaio-fw-clean-windows-7-install-guide.html


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:16 PM

I agree with Arthur, FWIW. It only takes a few seconds to catch a virus or ruin some sectors of a harddisk. The latter can often be neutralized by reformatting (while reinstalling), but not always.

Obviously your Windows feels incomplete and cannot recover even with its self-repair mechanism (internal backup). Are you sure you don't have any CD, perhaps labeled "Recovery" or "System CD/DVD" etc.? Otherwise, as Arthur writes, call the place where you bought the machine.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: josepp
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:29 PM

What are these emails you're reading and then deleting? You're not just opening any old email that comes your way, are you? If you have no idea what it is or who it's from, don't open it. The way you describe it, it sounds like you opened an email which uncorked a virus. I never open anything I don't recognize, I delete it right off the bat.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Acme
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:37 PM

Don't reinstall your operating system until you have exhausted all possible solutions. It's a pain in the ass and the computer ends up with the Old Version taking up a lot of space, and you have to punch holes through to find the files and give yourself permission to "own" them.

If it is still under warranty, then see what they can do, and insist they rescue your data, even if it means a new hard drive and software and the former hard drive in an enclosure as an external drive so you can reach the data.

Meanwhile, turn on the computer and look for the brief BIOS screen (that first little blip before the OS kicks in). There's usually a key you press as that appears - F8 in some, F10 in others - you'll glimpse a message saying something about setup or safe mode and the corresponding F key (you may have to turn it on a couple of times to see it completely, it's so fast). When you're able to press that F-key during the BIOS screen, hold it or press it several times (may not help, but you'll feel better!) A screen you would usually never see should come up and you can then explore what trouble-shooting moves or scans you can run in the safe mode. If it will let you do a system restore from there, that's what you need to do.

SRS


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: EBarnacle
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 07:05 PM

Also, go back to the store and get source disks for your OS and other software. Insist on it. If they will not give it to you, return the computer.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Amergin
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 07:11 PM

Most new computers anymore do not come with a O/S disk....you have to order those extra, as the installation files are on a separate partition....however, if you can't get in at all, it would be a problem.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Bernard
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 07:35 PM

It sounds more like a hard disk failure to me. Take it back where it came from! You're unlikely to acheive anything lasting by trying to do a system restore of any sort, as it's probably not a software problem.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:05 PM

It is a slippery slope, an angle of decline.

Mudcat - the frontier forerunner of American folk and blues digital ...mushed into "world" tunes ... into "good thoughts aka healing" .... and slowly slides into "expertise" on anything TECH from "home acoustics-scanners-cameras-printers-OS (Lynix to UNIX - MAC to PC)

The same "wicked ones" will do anything to dilute this forum.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

MAX - return to your Most Recent Mission Statement (2006?)
Call Dick/Susan/Joe/John into a conference call - decide the future of Mudcat...or just let go...everything that could be added has been ... and WayBack has it all.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:18 PM

So it's lucky there's a few of us experts around then eh? :-P


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Don Firth
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:23 PM

Gargoyle, I'm planning on posting recipes soon

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: olddude
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:27 PM

Mike
here is what I would do, download the bootable CD rescue disk from Kapersky labs. You can boot your computer from this disk, you need an internet connection but the disk will clean off the crap. You got a virus from that email. I have used it several times and it works like a charm. It is free you can get it here for windows 7 (haven't used the windows 7 version yet but I am sure I will sometime) Kapersky is the finest and most expensive of the anti virus softwares out there. But their rescue disk is free. I wouldn't buy it since it is pricey for servers. don't know the cost of a home PC

kaspersky labs


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Amos
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 09:16 PM

Dan: I wonder how he's gonna DL the rescue disk with a bum puder?


A


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: olddude
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 09:22 PM

True but he is on the mudcat so he has to have access somehow. maybe his old one. You download the rescue disk and then burn a CD so it is bootable for the other computer


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: olddude
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 10:20 PM

by the way Mike, if you cannot get it or don't understand let me know and I will make a boot CD for you and mail it off

Dan


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: josepp
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 10:43 PM

Mike, here's what you do--don't listen to all this stuff people are telling you on this thread and take your computer to either the place you bought it or a reputable repair shop and have them assess the damage. If you're not a techie, as you say, then all this advice about looking as BIOS and going into safe mode and getting an O/S disk aren't going to be much help to you. There are computer repair and troubleshooting places for people in just your predicament. Take your computer there.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 12:20 AM

I agree with the previous poster, and I'm an ex-techie ...


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 12:46 AM

If you have an installation disk for any operating system, preferably a Windows one, you should be able to boot from the installation disk. You do NOT WANT to let it install anything from the disk, but it will turn on the computer, preferably to "Safe mode," and should give you some access to the hard drive.

The hard drive for any Win7 system will be NTFS format, so you'd want to boot up to an OS that's able to read that format. Any Windows XP, Vista, or Win7 should work.

You might want to do that BUT ONLY IF YOU THINK THERE MAY BE FILES YOU WANT TO SAVE THAT HAVEN'T BEEN BACKED UP.

Given the level of experience you've indicated, the ONLY OTHER THING YOU SHOULD DO probably is to take the computer back where you got it and ask them to get it back in operation for you. If you can't get it back to the seller, or if they refuse to help you (i.e. out of warranty etc.), you'll need to find a local "computer service" place to make the necessary repairs.

FOR FUTURE REFERENCE - and for others here who appear to not know - it has become common for computers to be sold without a reinstall disk. Almost universally, no installation disk comes with Windows 7, it was fairly common with Vista, and not really rare with Windows XP.

When Windows 7 is installed, and in nearly all cases where a "significant repair" is done, YOU SHOULD BE ASKED if you want to make a "Recovery Disk." If the computer (the Operating System) was not registered with Microsoft when you got it, Windows 7 should have asked, the first few times you rebooted, if you'd like to make a Recovery Disk. YOU NEED TO MAKE A RECOVERY DISK.

Every installation of Win7 has all the files needed to install or reinstall any version of Win7. "Making a recovery disk" transfers those files to "somewhere else," in effect making a "Copy of an Installation Disk" for you. Win7 instructions imply that you can make your Recovery Disk on a thumb drive (Flash Drive) or you can burn it to a DVD.

The instructions say that "you can only make one" but usually it appears to let you make more than one. It would be advisable to follow instructions carefully for the first attempt, just in case your installation does prevent making multiple copies.

It probably is possible to make a separate partition on a separate Hard Drive work as a Recovery Disk but Win7 instructions don't mention this as a possible method, and I haven't tried it.

My recommendation would be that you burn it to a DVD. Once "finalized" the DVD can't easily be corrupted, while a thumb drive can be "accidentally" overwritten fairly easily.

FOR THE PRESENT PROBLEM: When you take your computer in to have your current problem repaired, ask them to make you a Recovery DVD so you'll have it for "next time."

Others who have any Windows version installed for which you do not have an installation disk should make one. If you wait until you need it, it's too late to make it.

John


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 01:10 AM

I agree that Mikel2 should take his computer back to where he got it. A computer ought to work for more than a few months.

But I have something to share about a computer that's long out of warranty. We went on vacation recently, and I turned the computer off completely (shut it down and hit the Big Red Switch.) Came back, turned it on, and nothing happened. I thought I was looking at a trip to the shop.

However, I have a friend who has an IBM service person for many years. Her advice was to 'unplug everything but the keyboard and the mouse and turn it back on.' My husband was skeptical, asking how he could tell what the computer was doing without the monitor.

Obviously not a musical man. I told him we would recognize the sound of Windows coming up, (La da ta da TUM tum) and if it did, the first thing we would re-connect would be the monitor. He looked dumbfounded at the idea of using ears instead of eyes to run a computer.

Just for good measure, we unplugged everything and left the puder off all night to rest its fevered circuits.

In time we followed the friend's advice, and the computer came up and is now working fine. No trip to the shop, no $ for repairs.

This procedure might help somebody else in the future.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 01:43 AM

Since the earliest DOS, and possibly before, the BIOS boot has incorporated a "systems check" at the end of which it signals any errors found using a "beep code." Unfortunately the exact code varies with what BIOS chip the computer uses, and recent computers usually "mute" the beeps; but if turned on, and if you know the code for your computer, you can tell whether the keyboard is connected, usually whether a mouse is plugged in, whether the main processor has been found, and (sometimes) whether a boot sector is readable on at least one drive.

Even as recently as when I got my first computer (DOS 3.0 on an 8Mhz processor with a 30MB hard drive - a "screaming monster" for its day) the page for the "beeps" was almost always turned down on one corner or had a paper clip on it for quick reference in the User Manual, since lots of times the monitor didn't warm up enough to turn on until it was 'way too late to see anything that happened during the first (BIOS) bootup stages.

... ...

And an instruction published fairly recently by Microsoft for repairing a certain difficulty with USB devices - specifically for WinXP - instructed you to open Control Panel, go to Device Manager, DELETE all the USB device drivers, and reboot.

$#!%@^ IDIOTS don't tell you: when your mouse is a USB device (the only kind usually available since well before WinXP came out), your Keyboard is a USB device (the only kind usually available since well before WinXP came out), you've just deleted ALL USB DEVICES -

How the F*** %@$$#!@^## are you supposted to reboot without a mouse or a keyboard. The only thing left is the BRS (Big Red Switch = main power) that will always result in an abnormal restart when you turn it back on.

I guess they assumed that after an abnormal restart you'd just do it again(?) and hope for different results(???).

John


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 03:09 AM

Best error message I actually saw "No keyboard. Press F1 to reboot".


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: My guru always said
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 04:12 AM

Thanks for posting about the 'recovery disc' John. I'd been getting a little confused earlier in the thread by the concern about not getting a system disc with new machines. Making your own recovery disc seems to be normal now & my machine prompted me to do that when I got it. Glad I did the right thing.

I agree, take it back to the shop!!! And be careful of what emails you look at, it's surely a virus has knocked out your hard drive.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 05:05 AM

There is a reason for putting all the installation files in a separate place on all system hard drives. It's spelled M.O.N.E.Y in the real world, and "Instant Upgrades" in the Microsoft world.

By having all the files necessary to run any version of Windows on every hard drive, all you have to do is call Microsoft and give them access to your bank account, and they can tell you what "unlock code" will convert your "basic weenie" Windows version to "super-gold-plated-plays-every-game-in-the-book" Windows.

Since they figured out how to give you upgrades (for which you pay them money) without ever sending you a disk, they were clever enough to also figure out that they didn't have to ever give you a disk for any system.

They did make it possible, if you want a disk, to export a "disk image" of your original installation files and make your own. And it saves the "sellers" (actually mostly the OEM builders) about $1.38 per computer sold. (It all adds up over a few million computers, I suppose.)

The "Instant Upgrade" began to creep in with WinXP, and a default installation put all the files necessary for a new installation on the hard drive (mostly in .CAB files) for all versions at least since Win95; but earliest versions omitted the "install" program, so the .CAB files were available for some System Repair functions, and for some upgrades after WinXP, but you still needed the disk to do a new install. Disk cleanup also offers you the option to remove the system backup files to make more space available, and lots of people apparently do wipe them off the hard drive.

It's implied that for Win7, and possibly for Vista, the "recovery files" are sequestered where you can't delete them accidentally even with an "intentional accident," but details are vague.

It appears that Vista and Win7 have it all on the hard drive but, as in the present case, if you can't boot you can't reinstall, so you do need to make a "boot disk" for disaster recovery.

Those who use passwords (as everybody should) also need to look at whether they want to make a "Password Recovery Disk" (or flash drive). Corruption of the "password locker" is NOT a rare event with recent Win versions. A Password Recovery Disk can replace the corrupted file. Without one, you may have to reformat and reinstall from scratch in the event of what would otherwise be a few bad bits on a drive.

Bad clusters on hard drives are actually a fairly common thing, and most files can be repaired automatically and invisibly by the hard drive controller - by moving the file to a good cluster. Since the password locker is encrypted (with very strong encryption) the files cannot be moved and any localized defect corrupts them completely and can't be repaired.

The instructions for making a Password Recovery Disk are dependent on system details and also on what system passwords you've used for which access privileges, so consulting Help files on your machine are your best approach to making one. Note that you may have to log on as Administrator to make a Password Recovery Disk that repairs all the passwords for all users, although I believe each user can make one to repair only his/her own password.

John


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 05:37 AM

Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: josepp - PM
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:29 PM

Hi josepp

The Emails that I was deleting were not being opened I was just deleting them. However they are from sources that I know well and all my incoming mail is screened for viruses. I know that there are viruses that get through but I don't believe that this is the case here.

I am very careful about my mail and on that computer even more particular than usual.

Thanks for your interest - I do appreciate it.

Cheers

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 05:41 AM

Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Cluin - PM
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:06 PM

Hi cluin

Thanks for your response. There is a lot there for me to digest so it will be on the back boiler for the time being.

Regards

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: My guru always said
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 05:42 AM

Maybe it wasn't a virus then if the emails weren't at fault. Definitely take it back to the shop. If you've only had it a few months it ought to be in warranty. Good luck!


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 05:51 AM

hi Dan & Amos

Thanks for your replies. I do have another couple of lap tops so access to mudcat etc is no problem.

Dan - can I download the rescue disc to a disc on my spare laptop and then use that to try to rescusitate my new one???

cheers

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 06:03 AM

hi josepp & gang

I bought this machine from a reputable store on the internet!!

They are not however a computer dealer. so it is not easy just to take it back myself. I would need to post it etc etc etc.

I am trying to get hold of their suppoort team but this is not easy fro a "thickie" like me to understand what they are advising...plus the fact that my hearing is not good on the phone these days and my wife usually does it for me. She is even less teccie than me !!!

But I am trying to find a nearby branch that I can take it to physically.

I will try to see if any of the suggestions made here help, but I will take it very slowly so that I don't cock it all up completely.

Thanks for all of the time and effort you have all taken out to try to help me.

Cheers

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 06:47 AM

hi john in Kansas et al

I remember when I got this computer that it did ask me to create rescue disks. So I did what it said and it created 4 disks!!! - numbered 1-4.

I have looked them out and inserted Disk 1 but with no effect.

I have also tried to get into the Bios by using the F8 and &10 keys but no go either.

All that happens when I switch on is that I get the Viao logo and then a blank black screen. I can hear a low clicking noise and this goes on for several minutes and then I get the Viao logo again then the message " Operating system not found".

In view of this I think the way is to try the place where I bought it first. ...... and go from there.

So once again many thanks for your help and advice and I will keep you informed as to what happens.

The computer is well within warranty but no doubt I will hit the old "it's not the computer it's the software...etc etc "

Cheers

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 09:20 AM

F8 to bring up a menu with options like "Safe Mode" has nothing to do with the BIOS. It is part of the Windows Boot Loader (Bios starts, does it's bit then passes control to a boot loader which then loads the Operating System). In your case with "can't find operating system", I think it is failing to find this boot loader program, either because the hard disk is "missing" or (given your chain of events, I would suspect...) because the boot loader is missing or corrupted.

BIOS is more commonly entered by pressing F2 or the delete key (and again a message may come up to show you what to press). The one thing that you could look at in there is whether or not it is detecting the hard disk. If you try that, just escape or follow menus to quit the BIOS, do not change any settings.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 09:46 AM

Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST,Jon - PM
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 09:20 AM

Hi Jon

I think you have hit the button on the head.

I did F" and entered Bios. There on the first page under ( or across from) the Hard Disk heading it says NONE......

So......what do I do now???

Back to the store I think ???

Thanks for your help....it's not the answer I wanted to hear but it does explain the problem.....but not why it happened.

Thanks

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 09:56 AM

I think you are at a point where you should ask elsewhere. I'd probably try Sony technical support first in case there might be something for you to try.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 10:04 AM

Jon has an important point: F2 on most computers!

While you're in the BIOS, make sure that in the "boot order" list your CD/DVD drive comes before the harddisk. If this has not been the case before, retry your "disk 1". A disk to boot from must be in its place before switching on the puter.


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: olddude
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 10:29 AM

Forget the rescue disk, sounds like you lost the hard drive, maybe a bad motherboard, it is certainly still under warranty ... take it in my friend


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: Bernard
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 01:40 PM

Log on to the Sony website - register the laptop with them if you haven't already done so, then arrange for them to collect and repair it under warranty. It won't take more than a few days, and they will send a courier with appropriate packaging to pick it up... no worries there!

It may take a little ferreting around on their website, but Sony, Toshiba, HP et al are all very good like that. Dell... not so good!


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Subject: RE: TECH HELP Please
From: MikeL2
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 03:06 PM

hi bernard

Many thanks for the heads up. I can't remember if I registered or not but I will go there and see what transpires.....if I have any problems I will mention your name.....lol

Many thanks

MikeL2


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