BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Iona
Date: 14 Mar 12 - 05:21 PM

Sure, Paul, The Bible says it, I believe it to be right and good. I think my next post will be on stoning, because you all seem to want an explanation on why I think it's righteous.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: TheSnail
Date: 14 Mar 12 - 08:34 PM

Interesting that all talk of science seems to have disappeared from this discussion to be replaced by the pros and cons of adultery.

I really wanted to stay clear of the religious arguments but this one intrigues me -

If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbor's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.

Doesn't that put Mary and her extra-marital dalliance in a difficult position?

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Mar 12 - 08:42 PM

Naaawww, Shimrod... in the Bible, if you seem to get a contradictory notion, you have simply mis-interpreted it! Nothing in the Bible is wrong or contradictory... you just need to pray to God for clarification...or visit various churches until someone gives you an answer that fits!

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 04:51 AM

Oh right, Bill, so that's how it works! So you mean I don't have to think for myself any more - if I have a problem I just open the Bible at random, pick out a passage which seems to fit my particular problem, and, hey presto, there's the answer ... once it's been 'adjusted' with a bit of praying etc.

Thanks, Bill! That's great! I was never fond of that troublesome old thinking for myself anyway!

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 06:04 AM

Doesn't that put Mary and her extra-marital dalliance in a difficult position?

Splendid!

As for stoning, Iona, I think Jesus had it covered in John 8:7 and Luke 6:31.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Musket
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 06:20 AM

Iona is about to give her views on why stoning is a good thing.

I'm all for free speech, but in this temporal world, where superstition is tolerated rather than believed, isn't advancing the cause for stoning conspiracy to murder?

I've a track record in my past, having girlfriends before my divorce came through and if Iona wants me stoned, she can either buy me some dope or keep her silly thoughts out of my reality.

If the bible is the word of god, it is because god is a word to describe the net output of the humans who wrote it. I don't have a hang up with that. I have a hang up with how it is used as a powerful mind altering tool to brain wash the weak, promise jam tomorrow and justify extreme bigotry. Oh and my dismissing of it is not because I fear it, although I fear the consequences of those influenced by it sometimes.

And reading Iona's diatribe, I don't think I'm far wrong, which is a shame for those who are capable of using it as a metaphor, as it sounds as if I am dismissing some good people. Sorry.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Greg F.
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 01:55 PM

Naahh.ts just criminal stupidity. If we could get a criminal stupidity law on the books with appropriate penalties- institutionalization, assigning a minder, house arrest with tracking bracelet, would save a lot of trouble AND money.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 03:29 PM

Jesus repudiated the laws about stoning in John 8. And with good reason.

A very good article about the history of the brutal practice of STONING.

Anyone who considers himself or herself to be a Christian and STILL advocates this kind of barbaraism:

CLICK,

is NOT a Christian! If they persist in advocating this, then they are

EVIL.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 05:34 PM

I just remembered....Shirley Jackson's short story- "The Lottery". I haven't read it for 40 years.... It's about 'stoning' as a remnant of old superstitions for ensuring harvest..etc.

[from wikipedia]
"Many readers demanded an explanation of the situation described in the story, and a month after the initial publication, Shirley Jackson responded in the San Francisco Chronicle (July 22, 1948):
Explaining just what I had hoped the story to say is very difficult. I suppose, I hoped, by setting a particularly brutal ancient rite in the present and in my own village to shock the story's readers with a graphic dramatization of the pointless violence and general inhumanity in their own lives."

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 07:41 PM

In the 1952 Hollywood rendition of Sir Walter Scott's epic novel, Ivanhoe, early in the movie, Cedric the Saxon and members of his household are gathered in the dining hall. There are few others there, including two Norman knights who have requested hospitality for the night. The doorman announces that there is yet another who seeks sanctuary for the night: Isaac of York. The Norman nights raise objections to his being admitted, informing Cedric that "Isaac of York is not a Christian! He is a Jew!"

Cedric waves away their objections, saying, "Any person who comes in peace and is in need of shelter shall be welcomed under this roof." Actually, being a Saxon, Cedric is not all that happy about the two Norman knights. He tells the doorman to usher Isaac into the dining hall.

As the two Norman knights sit there muttering to themselves, Wamba, the Jester speaks up, his comments directed at them.

"Sirs, for every Jew you show me who is not a Christian, I can show you a Christian who is not a Christian!"

The two knights don't think Cedric's jester is all that funny.

Terrific movie, by the way. Lots of pageantry, jousting, hackin' and hewin', general skullduggery, Robert Taylor handsome and heroic as Wilfred of Ivanhoe, Joan Fontaine as the lovely Rowena, George Sanders, suitably menacing as the Norman knight Sir Brian de Bois Guilbert, and an almost painfully beautiful Elizabeth Taylor, age 20 at the time the movie was being filmed, as Isaac of York's daughter, Rebecca. Sigh. Culminates in a Trial by Combat between Ivanhoe and Bois Guilbert to save Rebecca from being burned at the stake as a witch. Really white-knuckle!!

But we don't do that—Trial by Combat in the belief that God will favor the Just Cause—anymore either. Bit by bit, we humans are striving to rid ourselves of our primitive barbarism.

But it appears that there are those around who really don't want to see it go.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: John P
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 10:59 PM

I just noticed that Iona, like pete, refers to people who "believe" in evolution as evolutionists. Just to make sure that I'm not here under false pretenses, I'd like to come out and say that I am also a gravitist. I think anyone who has two feet planted on the ground must agree with me that gravity is absolutely true. Those who doubt this are engaging in flights of fancy. I'm also an electricist, and I'm shocked at those who try to pretend that electricity isn't 100% the word of God. Well, OK, if I'm being honest, I'll go all the way and come right and say that I'm also a magnetist! Now there's a belief system that pulls people together! I confess that I'm a bit unsure about electro-magnetism, since most examples I've seen of it are man made. And last time I mentioned my credentials as a chemicalist, you should have seen the reactions I got! Just like pouring a little sulfuric acid into . . . well, I'm not really supposed to talk about that outside the inner lab, although I've heard that people can get on the internet these days and find all the formulas they want. Ooh, it's so great to get all this off my chest! I'M AN ASTRONIMIST! There, I've come right out and said it. I know that a lot of people think it's disgusting to talk about red dwarfs and black holes and coronas and stuff, but I have faith that one day they will join me in my starry-eyed beliefs.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Mar 12 - 11:15 PM

An electricist!

I find that shocking, John!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Iona
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 02:56 AM

On your terms, John.....

I'm a Creationist

I'm a Thiest,

I'm a Six-Day Creationist.

And now we're on the same plain we started on.........

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Paul Burke
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 03:16 AM

The icy beauty of sterility. But having returned to the topic of the thread, I think Iona has done us a favour by ably presenting the evidence for young earth creationsim. There are teachers in some jurisdictions who find themselves mandated to "teach the controversy", and as an aid to them I will give the scientific evidence for the young- earth position in my next post. You may print and distribute it, royalty free, provided you do not change the content.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Paul Burke
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 03:16 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 04:38 AM

I know that 'wilfully ignorant' doesn't have an '-ist' on the end, Iona, but I think that you should add that to your 'l - ist'.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 05:21 AM

We may all be on the same plain Iona, but not neccessarily the same planet.

Dave H

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 07:15 AM

Iona,

You continue to fail to address the know flaws of the KJV. Are you saying you don't care what God REALLY said?

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Musket
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 07:45 AM

I'm a beerist, ex adulterist, footballist, gadgetist, windupist,

Funnily enough, I don't consider myself an atheist though.

Before pete and Iona slaughter a lamb for me, it's not because I am suddenly superstitious, it's because, (returning to labels) that the term atheist, same as evolutionist, is a term used by some to describe everybody who isn't them.

Also, as Albert pointed out, atheism by definition means chaos, and as the laws of physics seem to be in place each and every morning you wake up, chaos certainly isn't the answer.

(As opposed to chaos theory, before somebody starts us off on yet another tangent.)

Now.. Are you SURE you don't want me to uTube my impersonation of Jesus on a rubber cross? That's the beauty of blasphemy, it's a victimless crime....

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 09:12 AM

Jesus on a Rubber Cross is one of my things too; I caused mortal offence once sequing into it from my impersonation of The Gateshead Angel at a gig down south once. Ever seen The Gateshead Angel? Looks like this - but in a strong wind it becomes...

Believing in fictitious deities & demons in one thing; believing that people should be killed for fictitious crimes is quite another. I wonder though, I've always doubted their existence but could Iona be the Uber Troll of Mudcat folklore?? I shudder to think that such an individual could be sincere in what they have written here, much less that there are more of them out there. A pox on them and their rancid cause. To paraphrase Zappa: If Hell there is, it awaits THEM not US.

Here's more:

http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/zappa.htm

I especially love:

My best advice to anyone who wants to raise a happy, mentally healthy child is: Keep him or her as far away from a church as you can.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: saulgoldie
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 09:21 AM

I guess I am a creationist. I believe that everything we experience was, in fact, created. Elstwise, we couldn't experience it. The *means* of its creation, however, that is another matter.

Yes, s/he could might be a troll. Iona, get the an identity sose we can PM you!

Saul

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: John P
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 09:31 AM

Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die . . .

Damn! No gates on my city! And there just isn't any money for large public works these days. I guess we'll have to put off the stoning until the economy is better and we can build walls around each city and put gates in them. Literally

Iona -- You are not even the same race as me, much less on the same plane. Somehow, as a non-Christian, I seem to have love and forgiveness in my heart. Please don't compare yourself to me in any way. I'm a lot more like a Christian than you are, and I am able to think at the same time.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Bill D
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 01:11 PM

No, Iona is not a troll. She has posted elsewhere..(both in Mudcat and other places) often enough to figure out that she is honest and sane. She likes Irish music and has 'other' interests...
What is interesting to me is that she is still relatively young. I wonder if she'll feel the same about all of this in 20-30-40 years.

(It can be fun and educational to sort out who people really are. It would be fairly easy for anyone who was interested to find ME...and drive right to my door.)

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 02:21 PM

If it walks like a troll & quacks like a troll & promotes ignorance and fear like a troll...

This is master trolling in the WAV sense - & WAV is a real live living breathing human being with a genuine love of folk music too, but we haven't seen such endless threads as this since the glory days of the great walkabout...

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don Firth
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 02:22 PM

Umm. . . .

Some years ago I was listening to a radio interview with a nuclear physicist. He was advocating the building of more nuclear power plants as a means of solving all future energy problems (Yeah, explain that to the folks who live around Fukushima). But all through the interview, he pronounced nuclear "nookyahler." When the interview was over, a listener called in and commented, "I have a great deal of difficulty having any confidence in someone who doesn't even know the correct pronunciation for his own occupation."

"I'm a Thiest. . . ."

Iona, it's spelled "THEIST."

Don Firth

P. S. By the way, I heard a very good interview this morning with author Alain de Botton, discussing his new book, Religion for Atheists: a non-believer's guide to the uses of religion. He made a number of very good points, and I decided I would get the book and read it. I checked with the Seattle Public Library. They have it. Twelve copies. But by the time I got on their web site, there were already 131 holds, so I guess it will be awhile. Unless I decide to buy it. About $15.00 at Amazon.

Among other things, he says that there are some very valuble things that non-believers can derived from religious practices without having to believe in all the goat-feathers.

I think that's where I fit in.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 03:40 PM

""Marriage is the second most holy covenant ever, after God's covenant with a Christian.""

Tell us Iona. Who performed the marriage of Adam and Eve?

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Bill D
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 03:58 PM

"If it walks like a troll & quacks like a troll .."etc

A troll is one who winds you up just to get responses. There is good reason to believe that Iona is totally serious. Most of us here have grave concerns about her logic and mindset, but we must always remember to debate the idea and not the person.
I asked her awhile back if she cared to divulge her history and religious background...and she declined. Therefore, all I can do is examine the details of her posts and point out MY opinion of the theological points involved. I would think that if some new person stumbles into this discussion, there is quite enough opinion of both sides...from Pete, Iona....and all the rest of 'us'... to see what the various arguments are.

It is VERY tempting to just yell "that's SO wrong!" ...especially in a text-based discussion... but it never convinces anyone.

The evidence FOR evolution and against creationism is available...and clear... It is hard to say 'exactly' why some choose to ignore it.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don Firth
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 04:01 PM

Thinking of the going's ons in the Garden of Eden. . . .

If God created everything, then He also created The Snake.

Now, if He was All Benevolent--indeed, the Creator of Benevolence itself--then why would He do THAT!?

Dirty work afoot somewhere!

Don Firth

P. S. Gee whiz! They didn't even have a wedding ceremony and there was no one else around to give them a toaster.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,pete from seven stars link
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 04:46 PM

bill-is not the assertion that there is overwhelming evidence for evolution[which i take to mean the whole process from abiogenesis ,macro change etc]not something like an argument from authority.may not be the exact category!
either way ,though some points made i have conceded, and some beyond my abilities;that does not mean that any convincing evidence has been presented.
i'm not likely to drive to your door unless you are uk resident but i expect it would be interesting to meet you.
regards pete.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Penny S.
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 05:34 PM

In my case, pete, as in the case of most geologists I know, it is not argument from authority, but from evidence which is open to anyone to see and examine. Quarries and cliffs can be interpreted by anyone (with a hard hat - rocks tend to drop off vertical faces) (Oh, and you need permission from the owners with quarries.) prepared to look and think. That is actually how the argument began.

If a student is presented with a face which is supposed to look as if it were formed in a particular way according to the tutor, and they can't see that it fits, they are entitled to ask why, and how, and even to reject the explanation if they really cannot get it. Though they are expected to come up with a reasonable alternative which fits all the evidence if they do.

It isn't very easy to present rock faces, hand specimens, microscope slides and all the other plethora of evidence here, but I do feel you aren't convinced because you are not prepared to be convinced.

A ditty - tune from Glenn Miller...

I've found another quarry, let me give you a lift,
Loads of chalk and flint with spoil on top we must shift,
Then there's rusty sandstone to be ground and to sift,
I'm hoping that you'll get the drift.*

Sediments, so multifarious,
Formed in situations various,
Sub-aerially**, perhaps aquarious***,
Show that time flows very slow not swift.


*geological in joke. Drift is the loose stuff on top from the Ice Age.
**on dry land, like deserts, or scree on mountains
*** not a word, I made it up for watery environments

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Bill D
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 05:39 PM

No Pete... "argument from authority" is the assertion that someone in authority should be believed because they have some 'status'.

An example would be .."because I'm your mother, and I SAY so!"....or if someone tells you "the prime minister says "It is useful to fight in Afghanistan"

Science tries to sort out facts...no matter who likes or dislikes them.

"but i expect it would be interesting to meet you." Yes.. I think it would be interesting to chat awhile in the pub. I wish it were not so far away.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 07:09 PM

" - is not the assertion that there is overwhelming evidence for evolution ... not something like an argument from authority."

No, pete, it's not! It's time you stopped wilfully and deliberately confusing science/evidence and religion/faith.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Mrrzy
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 07:13 PM

I put back up my Atheist Alliance sign that had fallen behind the couch and within less than 10 mn had an evangelical couple on my doorstep... we had a great talk, I had a great time, but the man was so upset with me he was positively vibrating, when I tried to explain that gravity was a theory - the LAW is that it is approx 10 meters per second per second. On this planet, now, at least. Well, *I* had a great time - I always tell them sure, you can try to convert me, and I'll try to convert you. If they stay, we talk. They don't usually stay long... and when it's the kind that comes around in pairs of men, one young and one older, if you flirt with the younger one they don't come back for YEARS.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 07:18 PM

Pete, the only genuine "argument from authority" on this thread is Iona's claim that the bible is true "because God says so!"

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,BanjoRay
Date: 16 Mar 12 - 07:47 PM

There's real evidence about the age of the universe all around us. It's not difficult to determine the distances of other stars and galaxys from the Earth, and the speed of light is a well known and well proven constant. Most of the objects we can see in the night sky are glowing with light that originated very much further in the past than the Bishop Usher version of the biblical age of the universe, which must therefore be wrong.

Simples

Ray

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Penny S.
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 05:32 AM

Unfortunately, Ray, the sources that feed creationist ideas have a way round that, postulating, without any evidence, that the speed of light was different in the past. Or that the distances we see are built in as part of the necessary appearance of the universe in the same way as Adam's navel.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 06:48 AM

" ... postulating, without any evidence, that the speed of light was different in the past."

I wonder what effect that had on the curvature of space-time and many other aspects of the theories of Special and General Relativity? By opening that particular 'can of worms' the creationists have more explaining to do than they probably bargained for!

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 07:36 AM

The point, Shimrod, is that they explain everything with the well worn catchphrase "God made it that way".

This enables them to slide round the necessity to produce evidence or in fact even consider the evidence of their own eyes, while allowing them to avoid rational thinking.

It enables them, for example, to insist that evolution is just another belief system.

I sometimes wonder if we aren't perhaps seeing a previously unnoticed species of primate with a regressive gene.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Mr Happy
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 08:33 AM

Would gravity have been different in the past as well?

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Penny S.
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 08:41 AM

I don't think you have grasped the levity of the situation.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 08:50 AM

No need to make light of the situation, in either sense

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Mr Happy
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 08:57 AM

Methinks y'all need to lighten up! 8-)

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Musket
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 09:42 AM

This is getting rather intriguing...

Banjo Ray mentioned this thread in the pub the other night. We agreed that Iona was most likely a bloke from somewhere like Hartlepool having a laugh at our expense. Or at least, I said that and Ray nodded in order to humour me.

In any event, this thread is about young earth creationism, not the mental health needs of some of those posting. However...

It does indeed follow that one leads to another. Rational people may well wonder how the hell anybody can truthfully believe all the twaddle about the bible being fact, or that a big dude with a beard is more than just the metaphor brainwashing us as kids in order to control us as adults. (I note The Archbishop of Canterbury has said as part of his resignation that religion is facing fundamental issues if it is to remain relevant in this day and age.)

Young earth creationism, same as miracles, prayers doing more than relieving the mind of the prayee, use of the word benevolent when obviously he / she / it doesn't stop wars or Sheffield United winning.... It all requires faith and true belief.

Or in other words, a lack of rational approach.

Fine, no issues, whatever floats your boat. My mate reckons we never went to the moon and that MI5 read every email you ever send. He gets on with his life and is rational about football. the difference is that he has his views but never tries to influence others. If Iona had her way, people would be stoned for shagging the neighbour's missus. I take it she means only Christians can be stoned then? How can something be a crime for them and not for me?

If it became a crime for me, then as I said before.. So many Christians, never enough nails..

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Greg F.
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 09:51 AM

[Iona] ... is honest and sane.

Honest, possibly, but not proven. Sane? Obviously and apparently not.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Mr Happy
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 11:09 AM

I don't think she's honest, too many fabrications - the Noah thing to name just one!

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Paul Burke
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 11:21 AM

Speak for yourself Mr Happy, I think you wouldn't miss a stone or two yourself.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 12:26 PM

Alain de Botton - the author of Religion for Atheists.

Has some interesting things to say.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Mr Happy
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 12:52 PM

??????? you mean I need to shed a few stone?

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: TheSnail
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 01:11 PM

gravity is absolutely true

I tried to explain that gravity was a theory - the LAW is that it is approx 10 meters per second per second.

Oh dear. But I can't say anything or I'll be accused of being a "trolling twat" again.

Subject: RE: BS: Young Earth Creationism Eureka!
From: Penny S.
Date: 17 Mar 12 - 01:28 PM

New Scientist this week, "The God Issue", on the "science of religion".

The God issue: New science of religion
Can't live with him, can't live without him. In a special series of articles we lay out a new vision that resets the terms of the debate

The God issue: We are all born believers
Our minds solve fundamental problems in a way that leaves a god-shaped space just waiting to be filled by religion, explains Justin L. Barrett

The God issue: Religion is the key to civilisation
As early humans expanded beyond hunter-gatherer groups, religion was the glue that held societies full of strangers together, says Ara Norenzayan

The God issue: Science won't loosen religion's grip
Those who would dance on religion's grave are underestimating its staying power, says Robert N. McCauley

The God issue: God is a testable hypothesis
Whether an ultimate creator as envisaged by religion exists or not is a question that science can address, argues Victor J. Stenger

The God issue: Alain de Botton's religion for atheists
Religions are not literally true but neither are they total nonsense.
Alain de Botton explains why atheists need to reclaim the useful bits
Whether an ultimate creator as envisaged by religion exists or not is a question that science can address, argues Victor J. Stenger

Haven't read it yet, but the editorial has the headline "Know your enemy".

As to Iona's identity, this hypothetical Hartlepool bloke is a brilliant writer, not only able to talk the talk, but also able to imitate a rather female style - though I don't know what makes me recognise it. It obviously isn't my style. The excitability, perhaps. But it doesn't overdo it, like someone trying to fit a stereotype. And the early posts on other subjects don't look like a spoof.

Penny