BS: Guns & laws in the US

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 13 May 12 - 07:01 AM

""Martin was wearing a hoodie and returning from a convenience store with Skittles and tea when he was shot on February 26 in Sanford, Florida. Neighborhood watch volunteer George Zimmerman, 28, is awaiting trial for second-degree murder in the racially charged case.

"Obviously, we support Zimmerman and believe he is innocent and that he shot a thug," the seller wrote on the site, according to WKMG-TV.""

Of course!! Every gun toting halfwit in Florida knows that the implements of choice for black burglars are tea and Skittles.

Jesus H Christ. How do they manage to survive without brain cells?

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: bobad
Date: 19 May 12 - 05:47 PM

Friday night on Current TV's "The Young Turks," host Cenk Uygur charged that there's one party in the Trayvon Martin slaying that is truly, undeniably guilty, but it isn't a person.

"Guns are the real problem," he said.

Rolling recently released store camera video of 17-year-old Martin buying a pack of Skittles candy and an Arizona Iced Tea just moments before he encountered Zimmerman and was fatally shot, Uygur said, "That kid that you just saw — he's 17 years old — he would be alive today if George Zimmerman didn't have a gun."

Citing the Geneva-based Graduate Institute of International Studies's Small Arms Survey, Uyger pointed out that the United States is the most heavily armed nation in the world, with 90 guns per 100 people. Yemen is in second place, but only has 60 guns per 100 people. David Hemenway, director of the Harvard University Injury Control Research Center, authored a paper in 2011 called "Risks and Benefits of Guns in the Home," which stated that children in the U.S. are 11 times more likely to die in a gun-related accident than children in other developed nations. The Centers for Disease Control's statistics for gun fatalities in 2009 include 11,493 homicides, 18,735 suicides and 554 accidental deaths, a combined 31,347 gun deaths for the year.

"We've turned our country into the O.K. Corral," Uygur said, "We're sick with it, sick in the head with guns."

The host blames gun manufacturers and their powerful lobbying group, the National Rifle Association (NRA). "I know, I know — progressives aren't supposed to fight back on this. Nobody's supposed to fight back — we're just supposed to lie down and say, 'okay, NRA… I know you represent the gun manufacturers and then get rich off of all those people dying.' And you use all your fancy arguments and you've already bought all the politicians… But someone's gonna stand up to you and it's gonna happen right here. You don't like it, that's too bad."

Cenk Uygur: America is 'sick in the head with guns'

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 19 May 12 - 07:15 PM

Yup... We are a sick nation because if there is money involved then fuck free speech, certain conversation and sanity...

This is the free market of Ayn Rand...

100,000 Americans were shot last year and 100,000 more will be shot this year and 100,000 the year after that...

Guns in hands of otherwise sane people turn them into Rambo...

This is all very much insanity...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: gnu
Date: 19 May 12 - 07:22 PM

100,000? Got a source?

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 19 May 12 - 07:59 PM

Google it, Gn-ze... It ain't hard to find... It has been well reported... If I did clicky things I could give you 10 sources in 10 minutes...

But yer a smart guy so after you find the sources. please do a clicky, por favor...

The stats are 100% correct!!! I guarantee it or I will carry your jock strap fro a month... I'll even put it over my head...

Google it, please...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: gnu
Date: 19 May 12 - 08:06 PM

I googled it before I posted. Can't find any support for 100,000 shot. I'd say I am sorry but I think it's a good thing.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 19 May 12 - 08:48 PM

Google "Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence", Gn-ze...

Here's the deal with searches... The NRA clogs up the first 10 or so search pages so folks give up trying to get to real facts rather than their propaganda...

From the Brady link you make be able to find un-clogged info that substantiates what I have reported...

Yes, it is getting harder and harder and harder to get over the NRA block of information but it still can be done...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: bobad
Date: 19 May 12 - 09:41 PM

There were 52,447 deliberate and 23,237 accidental non-fatal gunshot injuries in the United States during 2000.[4] The majority of gun-related deaths in the United States are suicides,[5] with 17,352 (55.6%) of the total 31,224 firearm-related deaths in 2007 due to suicide, while 12,632 (40.5%) were homicide deaths.[6]

That's from Wikipedia

Whatever the hell the numbers are they way too many and are reflective of the number and availability of guns in the US.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: gnu
Date: 19 May 12 - 11:04 PM

Guns don't kill people. Poverety, lack of education and ignorance kill people. Well educated and well fed people don't kill people. Guns are not the problem. People are the problem. If people were to take care of each other... oh, WTF... they won't... which is why the gun nuts think they need their guns. And, they have a right to their guns... just ask em. And ya know what? They are right. If they ain't doin anything wrong with their guns, they have a right to have their guns.

If all the "good" gun nuts and the anti-gun nuts got together and demanded that society addressed the poverty and social injustice that occurs EVERY minute of EVERY DAY we might see a solution to a serious problem. Until the real problems are addressed, bang bang shoot em up is bound to continue (with ILLEGAL guns). To cite legal and law abiding gun owners as the problem is just off the wall fuckin nuts. The longer this inane attitude is taken, the longer it will take to solve the real problem(s) and curtail this terrible affliction.

Ya wanna get guns off the street? Join the NRA and go to the meetings and SPEEK UP. Or start a new org... oh, gee, where have I heard that before?

C'mon... it ain't rocket science... get off yer ass and get the job done or stop that inane bullshit weening.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 20 May 12 - 08:42 AM

Google up the Brady site...

Remember, wikipedia isn't factual oib everything and the gun-nuts grind out a lot of energy pushing facts down, down, down... If you Google up just about anything related to guns the first 3 or 4 pages will be propaganda that right winged bloggers are paid to clog up...

The Brady site will give ya'll other soources should you be interested...

BTW, I wouldn't go to an NRA meeting any more than I would go to a KKK meeting... And this from a former NRA member and NRA shoot club participant...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 20 May 12 - 09:56 AM

BTW, my stats are for ***all*** shooting victims... Not just those who die...

BTW, Part 2... I learned "gun safety" and marksmanship from the NRA... Back when I was a member everyone in the organization were just regular folks without political agendas... Today??? Not your grandfather's (or my) NRA...

BTW, Part 3... The House of Representatives just passed a repeal of the "multiple gun purchase notification" where when someone purchased a number of guns at the same time that ATF would be notified... So if you want to buy a U-Haul truck's worth of AK-47, a million rounds of ammo and a $2 book on how to make them fire automatically then according to the House of Reps that ain't no one, especially the federal government's business... Wonder what these people are going to say when an entire right winged militia shows up at a po0litical rally and guns down a couple thousand people??? Opp!!! Guns don't kill people, people kill people??? And fully automatic AK-47s kill lots of people real fast... That is why they are military weapons...

Never mind... All the sane arguments in the world can't go up against the powerful NRA... And if you present too many of them then one of their bobble-head worshipers will just kill you...

And the beat goes on...

BTW, here in NC cops are reluctant to pull people over for minor traffic violations without backup for fear of being shot...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: gnu
Date: 20 May 12 - 02:11 PM

"The House of Representatives just passed a repeal of the "multiple gun purchase notification""

That is sickening!

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 20 May 12 - 04:27 PM

Yup, it is, gn-ze... I mean, here we are supposedly all worried about terrorism but any whacked out person or group of people can now arm themselves equal to or better than law enforcement and no one will know...

But, here's the deal... This ain't going into law... The Senate won't let it get to Obama's desk...

But it does show just how little the House respects our safety...

BTW, did ya find that Brady site???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: gnu
Date: 20 May 12 - 05:32 PM

Bobert... Brady site... nope... didn't go lookin fer it. Musta missed why I shoulda. Too busy messin with other shit. If it's important, I will but if it's just more a tha same, well...

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:58 PM

It's not... It is run by the wife of Jim Brady, the Reagan assistant who was shot and paralyzed the day Reagan was shot... It's about the only real site to be found that documents its stats... And the 100,000 number of people shot (not all killed) is accurate...

BTW, don't ever try to find out how many cops have been shot in the last 10 years... Might take some serious plowing of NRA sites before you find the real numbers...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: bobad
Date: 20 May 12 - 07:03 PM

Wikipedia documents it's stats. Look at my link - every stat is referenced.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 20 May 12 - 07:07 PM

They, if I read their stuff correctly, are talking about homicides, bobadz...

The Brady people are talking about all shootings...

But when it comes to anything controversial, Wikipedia has a tendency to not be all that reliable... The moderators there have come under fire for not allowing corrections by certain groups of people...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 20 May 12 - 07:11 PM

My bad... It was only 97,000 people shot last year... Not 100,000...

B;~)

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 20 May 12 - 07:30 PM

BTW, two other sources:

1. Legal Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

2. United States Crime Rates 1960-2010

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Stringsinger
Date: 21 May 12 - 11:21 AM

The crazy people have guns because of the NRA. The Founding Fathers had no idea that the Second Amendment would be turned on its head. They had no idea that gun violence would be an epidemic in the U.S. supported by trigger happy gun owners who irresponsibly defend their weak position.

The solution is simple. More regulations that have impact rather than the Congress being controlled by the NRA.

The U.S. is now Dodge City and the polls as usual are inaccurate.

The U.S. is now the most trigger happy nation in the world.

There are more regulations against abortion rights than there are guns, today.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 21 May 12 - 01:14 PM

Yup...

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: gnu
Date: 21 May 12 - 04:07 PM

Truly sad when the solutions with regard to legislation, although not perfect, could be implemented if all parties were reasonable about GOOD gun laws.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 21 May 12 - 07:02 PM

""Truly sad when the solutions with regard to legislation, although not perfect, could be implemented if all parties were reasonable about GOOD gun laws.""

There is only one party being unreasonable about Good Gun Laws Gnu, and that is the party which won't allow any change whatever, and has the money to buy politicians to enforce its will.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 21 May 12 - 07:20 PM

"GOOD gun laws"???

I'd settle with "fair gun laws"...

Right now??? There is not one single gun law that doesn't have a loophole... Not one... In other words, there are no real gun laws... Not one...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 May 12 - 07:27 PM

There is one good thing about the US gun law situation - the spectable of the nightmare you've got yourself trapped into provides a pretty solid safeguard against any nuts ever succeeding in watering down the gun regulations in my country.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: gnu
Date: 21 May 12 - 08:06 PM

Don... "There is only one party being unreasonable about Good Gun Laws..."

Wrong. They see what happened in Canada and they won't give an inch because they are scared it will happen in the US. We have VERY good gun laws and very BAD gun laws. The bad ones are VERY bad... they CREATE criminal opportunities and have "allowed" serious crimes... robbery and murder. The criminals like the bad laws because THEY do not follow the good laws. Surprise, surprise.

Anyway, I am not gonna explain it all for the tenth + time. Fact is, BOTH sides need to talk. By you saying you can't talk with the other side because they won't listen... well, that fucks that then, doesn't it? May as well just give up and let the criminals win.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 22 May 12 - 10:58 AM

""By you saying you can't talk with the other side because they won't listen... well, that fucks that then, doesn't it? May as well just give up and let the criminals win.""

America has already done that Gnu.

Show me just one example of the NRA or any of its members discussing any suggested change to the status quo.

Plenty changes have been suggested, some more reasonable than others, which proves that one side is open to discussion.

Show me anybody on the pro gun side who can say that.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: Bobert
Date: 22 May 12 - 01:01 PM

As with every other issue, the right wing in America won't compromise, won't listen and won't give an inch on anything... These people are as dogmatic as the Southern Democrats were in 1860... They want everything their way... You can't talk to people like this... What I can't believe is the number of Americans who go out and vote for these miserable people...

The worst part about these people is that they all seem to be eaten up with hatred for the government but when something bad happens to them have their hands out begging...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Guns & laws in the US
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 22 May 12 - 02:25 PM

Just noticed that "Gnu" is an anagram of "Gun". I'll be going now-)