BS: Aphid control help

Subject: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 01:59 PM

Any recommendations? Got em in my flowers (hanging baskets).

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,sturgeon
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 02:03 PM

Use a mild soap solution - a few drops of washing up liquid in a spray bottle of water.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: pdq
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 02:07 PM

Hold your thumb over the end of the garden hose and make a spray that is strong enough to wash the aphids off but not enough to damage plants. They are weak fliers and will not be able to get back to the plants.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 02:16 PM

Aphids mean your plants are under stress - too much or too little water is a common problem. Soapy water and water under pressure will help. If you have food-grade diatomaceous earth (not the type for swimming pools) you can puff some of that onto the plants and the powder will dry up their little exoskeletons and kill them. Let your plants dry out between waterings.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,999
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 02:34 PM

Do the above stuff and then put lady bugs on the plants. They dine on aphids.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,999
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 03:11 PM

Ladybug dining.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 03:53 PM

Great stuff. SRS, too much water could be the culprit AND the food-grade diatomaceous earth is about $40 for a 50 pound bag. I can buy it at $7/kg but that just seems stunned. Especially when I can breed aphids and then sell the food-grade diatomaceous earth by the kg to my neighbours... >;-)

Thanks all! I have a plan. Soap tonight and the earth tomorrow.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 08:29 PM

Fifty pounds of DE is a lot. There are places that will sell a couple of pounds and you can get it by mail if your local feed stores don't have it. Here is some information about DE.

This is the one I use. It's supposed to be an even finer grind, drying up bugs faster. It is feed grade - cattle, dogs, people, I suppose - but you don't want to inhale it (though the really bad stuff to inhale is the pool DE that has a lot of silica in the mix. That's toxic all around, not for animals or plants.) The applicator container (called the 7 oz duster) comes with a long skinny straw (like the one that comes on WD-40)that you use to puff this onto plants. It doesn't take much. All of the Soil Mender products are very good, recommended for organic gardening.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 08:37 PM

50#s is a lot. Yeah. I am known fer goin overboard... >;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: Beer
Date: 15 Aug 12 - 08:52 PM

Burn the plants and grow mara-ja-wa-na.
a.....

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 05:44 AM

Really the only sure way to get rid of these pests is to give in and use a permethrin spray. This is a relatively low-toxicity chemical (used also as an ointment on skin to kill scabies etc) I've tried all the soapy stuff and the things come back laughing. Pyrethrum and permethrin are very similar to the natural insecticide found in marigolds an other daisy-like flowers. A small aerosol or plastic hand-sprayer is the easiest way.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST, topsie
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 06:25 AM

I haven't had problems with aphids since I started hanging up fat balls for the bluetits and great-tits. When they get bored with the fat balls they go and eat a few aphids for a bit of variety.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: maeve
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 07:05 AM

gnu- I first check for beneficial insects such as Ladybug beetles, Lacewings, etc. If none are present, water spray and soap solutions, DE, etc. as described above; regarding insecticidal soaps, only use out of direct sunlight to avoid leaf burn, and spray undersides of leaf surfaces as well as topsides.

I prefer to let the treated plant drip nearly dry in shade, then follow it up with a plain water spray to wash off the soap, honeydew (plant sap leaked by aphids can attract disease and other pests) and dead aphids. Check daily and re-treat as needed. If sooty mold develops (black fungas on aphid "honeydew"), a rag moistened with rubbing alcohol will clean it off. On woody plants, horticultural oils will effectively smother the aphids.

Pyrethrum and permethrin sprays can indeed be used to combat aphids, but are also toxic to beneficial insects. We find it most effective to begin with the least environmentally hazardous control (in this case, water spray, then soap solution) repeated as needed before using permethrin-based (or stronger) products whether from natural or laboratory sources. As they are mild carcinogesns and neurotoxins we use them rarely and with caution.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: maeve
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 07:21 AM

Corrected...

gnu- I first check for beneficial insects such as Ladybug beetles, Lacewings, etc. If none are present, water spray and soap solutions, DE, etc. as described above; regarding insecticidal soaps, only use out of direct sunlight to avoid leaf burn, and spray undersides of leaf surfaces as well as topsides.

I prefer to let the treated plant drip nearly dry in shade, then follow it up with a plain water spray to wash off the soap, honeydew (plant sap leaked by aphids can attract disease and other pests) and dead aphids. Check daily and re-treat as needed. If sooty mold develops (black fungus on aphid "honeydew"), a rag moistened with rubbing alcohol will clean it off. On woody plants, horticultural oils will effectively smother the aphids.

Pyrethrum and permethrin sprays can indeed be used to combat aphids, but are also toxic to beneficial insects. We find it most effective to begin with the least environmentally hazardous control (in this case, water spray, then soap solution) repeated as needed before using permethrin-based (or stronger) products whether from natural or laboratory sources. As they are mild carcinogesns and neurotoxins we use them rarely and with caution.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 11:04 AM

Pyrethrum and permethrin are always a mistake. The idea that they "come from crysanthemums" as many of the labels state doesn't make them any less toxic - they are now synthetic and stronger and are a neurotoxin. In early days it was thought they were organic - but those days are long gone. If you need to use something like that just get rid of the plants and start over. Seriously.

Orange oil (delimonene) in water at 2 ounces per gallon will kill the bugs in the garden or on these plants. Spray from a pump sprayer. Add a little compost tea or molasses and you can make it a foliar feeding at the same time.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 01:14 PM

Rubbish! I've used pyrethrum for fifty years. I'm still here and so are the insects in my garden. It gets rid of the aphids in a hanging basket. You don't spray it all over the neighbourhood, just one one plant with a problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 01:39 PM

If you're an organic gardener it isn't "rubbish." It's toxic. And a bad one at that. If you have that bottle of stuff in the house you have to worry about what happens to it. Keep it up away from kids and pets, etc. Just not worth it.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: catspaw49
Date: 16 Aug 12 - 02:33 PM

Soap has never failed us and it works on some other pests as well. Spraying the back yard a time two with a soap solution also cuts the flea population as they crap themselves to death. You nedd to do it a few times to break up their life cycle but it will make your flea control a lot easier.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: The Sandman
Date: 17 Aug 12 - 11:18 AM

it is soft soap that is needed, there are two different knids of saop , soap made from caustic soda and soap from caustic potash, this soft soap is more effective, and more so if its mixed with quassia bark.this information came from henry doubleday association, i have tried and it kills aphids
ladybirds are good if they can be found and introduced

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 21 Aug 12 - 05:35 PM

After much in depth research, testing, field trials and analysis, I realized I had to "invent a better vacuum" (I learned that from the Dyson commercials).

Fluid and powder applications were "tedious" at best. Treating the underside of an estimated 17,567,981 tiny leaves per potted mini-petunia was a tad time consuming SOOOOO I have, being an engineer, invented a device to kill aphids which have infested potted plants.

The Aphidator 2012-1 (prototype) will, by empiricle extrapolation, work with many other pests. If I could catch that fucking squirrel that just pissed in my woodpile inSIDE MY GARAGE while I was fueling my lawnmower - the BRAZEN FURRY LITTLE RAT! - , I'd prove it.

I have a patent pending the results of the psych exam.

List of materials : one galvanized washtub; bricks as required; water.

Procedure : set plant in washtub; weight plant down with bricks; add water to cover; watch TV while little aphid bastards drown.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 21 Aug 12 - 07:03 PM

Squirting 'em with water is good on veg, broad beans for example, but you don't want to be wrecking all your flowers in a hanging basket for a fortnight. You could have a look in your basket and nip out affected shoots. If there are too many of them, use pyrethrum (not permethrin) last thing at night. The pyrethrum will be spent by morning and you'll spare most of the bees and other beneficial insects which will be safely tucked up in bed by late evening. In future, garden for wildlife: plenty of diversity and not too much tidiness. And take note of which plants always cop it. Pansies always get attacked in my garden so I grow 'em less and less these days. My big issue is vine weevil grubs. I never saw any until six or seven years ago but now I'm plagued with 'em every year in every container by September.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: paula t
Date: 21 Aug 12 - 08:52 PM

I don't have any problems with aphids at all. Years ago I used to spray them with soft soap. Now I just encourage ladybirds into my garden by not cutting back the herbaceous plants in the autumn and by refusing to use any sprays at all. I leave the leaves and stems in situ and don't cut back the old stems or clear the soil until about late April or May. The ladybirds settle down nicely in the old leaves and stems etc, keep warm over winter and then breed like mad from the spring. Their young eat the aphids.The garden looks stunning in the frosts of winter. It's a bit untidy in the spring for a little while - but it's worth it!

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 08:26 PM

I know a place where Ladybug nests abound. I understand a full nest is worth $5000. Is that true?

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 06:55 AM

soft soap is the job, plus quassia bark, but ladybirds are best

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 02:23 PM

I have seen that advice about blasting the aphids away with a hose many times. But I've never seen anybody write about how long the effect lasts and how often I'd have to repeat it.

Such writers often overlook that the flowers are often in the front of the house and the hose is usually in the back. Somebody 20-50 years old may be up to hauling the hose from front to back, fighting the kinks, getting around the corners and

"Watch out for that lily - you're you're gonna break it right off!"

But there comes a time in life when you have nobody to help you, you're kinda tired, and it's all just too much.

Gnu, I found a site from the Royal Botanic Garden of New South Wales. Probably not a bunch of nut cases. They say that aphids have a tough shell, and applying pesticides to them is a waste of time unless the p'cide is a systemic or has a strong, oily base. (The strong oily stuff is for trees in winter, so forget that.) So much for 'soap' and pyrethrins.

They do say that in the home garden, a blast from the hose can be helpful. If I had a hanging basket, I would fill up my big tea kettle, tip the plant on its side, and give it a nice wash. This would probably be as good as your aphidator, but less work.

Aphids don't lay eggs, so you don't have to worry about eggs in the soil or on the leaves. That's the good news.

I see that you have more than one basket. I hope you don't have a lot of them, because that would mean a lot of trips.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: pdq
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 03:28 PM

For most of the season, aphids are both parthenogenic and viviparous.

However, as the days become short in the Fall, they are triggered to produce winged variants, both male and female.

The last batch does lay eggs enabling them to go through the winter. That is the reason for the dormant oil on trees. The oil smothers eggs of many species, and kills the adults of scale insects.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 03:42 PM

leeneia... "They do say that in the home garden, a blast from the hose can be helpful. If I had a hanging basket, I would fill up my big tea kettle, tip the plant on its side, and give it a nice wash. This would probably be as good as your aphidator, but less work."

Nope. Just the opposite.

And, it seems to have worked. Not one little green bastard since. I am still waiting for several more days to see what happens. Then, fingers crossed, the infested plants go back with their mates.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 10:51 AM

So, you plunged them in the washtub and cackled evilly as they drowned? Good for you.

About eggs - I was thinking it might be a good idea to scrape off and discard the top of the soil in case they lay eggs in it.

The aphids in my yard are yellow, not green.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 02:20 PM

Green, yellow... same price.

Scraping off any soil is not an option in may case, of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 11:26 PM

I was only thinking of maybe 1/4 inch or I cm of soil. How much digging could an aphid do? However, your plants will probably be fine now.

Gnu, if Canadians call a kilometer a klik, what do you call a centimeter?

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: gnu
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 11:35 PM

Well, da girls I goes wit would say, "Nare enough, eh!"

Subject: RE: BS: Aphid control help
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Aug 12 - 05:18 AM

Some of the geraniums that I bring indoors for the winter end up with aphids on them before it's warm enough to put them back outdoors. Spraying with dish soap seems to slow the pests down a bit, but doesn't eliminate them. After the snow and ice is gone and it's safe to take the plants outside, I lay them down on the lawn and spray them with the hose on full blast, turning the plants a couple of times to make sure that each entire plant has been sprayed. When all the soap residue and foam seems to be gone, I plant the geraniums in flower beds. I've done this for several years. The plants do well in spite of the excessive blasts of cold water. I've never see an aphid on them in the garden.

Now, if I could just find out where the aphids come from after the plants have spent several winter months in the house...

rags