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Why are Americans so fat?
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: kendall Date: 31 May 00 - 08:34 AM I went on one of them two week diets and lost 14 days. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Grab Date: 31 May 00 - 09:02 AM Last verse of the Dire Straits song "My Parties":- Now don't talk to me about the polar bear, Don't talk to me about the ozone layer. Ain't so much of anything these days, even air - They're running out of rhinos, what do I care? Let's hear it for the dolphins, let's hear it for the trees, Ain't running out of nothing in my deep freeze. It's casual entertaining, we aim to please... At my parties all right, you do what you please. As to why Americans are fat, it's the same reason lazy, ill-educated and TV-addicted people everywhere get fat - cos they're lazy, ill-educated and TV-addicted. A programme on British TV last night showed an experiment removing all the TVs from a family for 2 weeks. And guess what - they went out walking, playing football, etc instead. Anyone care to draw the obvious conclusion...? Grab.
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Wesley S Date: 31 May 00 - 09:20 AM John - I don't know about you but I'm a direct desendent of Santa Claus. Would you care to tell us what you are doing to ease the plight of the hungry of the world? Can I assume that you work at your local food bank? Make sandwichs at a local nightshelter? Raise funds for infant formula programs?? Feel free to contact me if you need other suggestions on how to get active. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: catspaw49 Date: 31 May 00 - 09:21 AM I would conclude that its better to eat food than to eat your TV. TV's are probably hard to digest, plus you'd be stuck going out on walks making yourself a possible "innocent bystander" or playing football where you risk possible knee injury. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Kim C Date: 31 May 00 - 09:48 AM A simple philosophy to follow is, eat when you're hungry and stop when you're full. There is plenty of food available to feed everyone in the world but the real problem appears to be distribution. Don't you remember in Africa awhile back when we were sending grain down there but the warlords were taking it all to keep the people subjugated? Food is very often used as a political leveraging tool. People are overweight and unhealthy not only from a lack of exercise (I'm guilty there) but from excess sugars and preservatives and other chemicals in processed foods. Mister and I try to stay away from many processed foods but it can be expensive. Mac & cheese in a box is 4 for a dollar a lot of times, but salad greens are $6 a pound. I would rather pay the more money up front to avoid costly medical bills later.... plus, since diabetes runs in my family it's in my interest to be as healthy as I can. I do, however, enjoy a Sonic cheeseburger about twice a month. :)
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: alison Date: 31 May 00 - 10:45 AM Damn 'spaw ..... why didn't you think of this a few weeks back when I was taking photos at the festival.. I could have got everyone....... now you'll have to wait....... slainte alison |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bert Date: 31 May 00 - 11:01 AM Here's one reason. Fix that one first, COUSIN! |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Peg Date: 31 May 00 - 11:15 AM I agree with Baba and Kim C, mostly and with some of what many others here have said... I do not think meat is evil; humans are more or less built to eat it; though surely not built to eat meat that is pumped full of antibiotics and hormones from animals whose lives are miserable while they are alive...I believe we should all acknolwedge the sacrifice an animal makes when it gives its life for our nourishment--this is simply part of staying connected to the living world around us: something we have all but forgotten how to do in industrialized countries. We are also built to MOVE! as in hunting for our food and planting and digging up our food. Not to sit in chairs. Lack of physical activity is the NUMBER ONE reason Americans are overweight and unhealthy. We must escape our fortresses and take to the hills and forests and meadows and sidewalks and get off our asses and enjoy the outdoors more...no need to join a gym or buy fancy exercise gear. Walking is pleasurable, health-giving and a wonderful way to get somewhere (or nowhere). We are also built to eat fruits and grasses and roots and veggies; we are NOT built to eat grains and in fact added them to our diets rather late in our evolution. They are hard for humans to digest because they combine protein and carbohydrate in the same food. This is exacerbated when grains are refined and the fiber and nutrients removed. Some ethnic groups can eat grains more successfully than others, just as some are more prone to alcohol addiction, dairy allergies, etc.. (A fascinating book on this is Native Nutrition and it also details what has happened throughout history when refined foods, especially white sugar, is introduced to various indigenous populations: southwest Indians in the US are experiencing obesity and its concomitant diseases, especially diabetes, in staggering record numbers; their counterparts in South America, genetically identical but physically active people who eat plenty of beans and corn, are among the healthiest people on earth. As are the Masai in Africa, who literally live on meat, milk and marrow from their cattle, but who also run amny miles per day as part of their nomadic herding lifestyle). I think eating real food is the answer to the emptiness many Americans feel regarding their diets; real, live food, that is grown or raised near in one's own local area and with a minimum of chemicals and cruelty. Cooking one's own food or having it cooked for you by a loving person is also believed to impart better nutrition. Eating produce which has to travel several days before it hits the shelves insures most of the nutrients are dissipated. We can and should vote with our dollar and create a demand for humane food products. Better still, we should grow and kill our own food whenever possible. One individual cannot solve the world hunger crisis. But each of us can opt to treat ourselves and our loved ones as well as we can, and since not eating is not an option, I suggest we enjoy our food as much as we can while understanding that we must eat to live, not live to eat.
love and simple pleasures to all! Single malt Scotch, Belgian chocolates, fresh bread with organic butter, locally-grown berries, free range leg of lamb roasted with rosemary and garlic, crumpets with apricot jam, farm-raised salmon baked with honey-lemon-garlic-olive oil-red pepper-cumin glaze---these are a few of my favorite things... |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bill D Date: 31 May 00 - 12:09 PM my, how things have progressed since I posted last night and went to bed..(well-fed).... Ceitagh...I, too, am wary of plans to 'contain population growth'...and I said 'third world', because growth HAS slowed a lot in the US and Europe...gradually, the ratio between the 'developed' and not-so-developed countries is changing...and the have-nots now HAVE TV & internet and can SEE what they are missing...I have no idea who is to say what the 'proper' ratio should be, either in population or calories.(Well, actually, I do...in a perfect world, EVERYONE would have enough room, food and fair access to what they needed for a fulfilling life...)but we passed the population level for that possibility about 1937. It ain't easy...there are NO simple ways to feed us all, even if catspaw mails ALL his spare spuds to poor folk, and...even if manna fell from Heaven every day...(anyone ever read Philip Jose Farmer's "Riverworld"?), there is simply a finite amount of room for malls, graves, golf courses, and condos. I sure don't want the job of **DECIDING** how to reduce the population, but at some point, the population WILL be reduced, if not by plan, then by nature. (ever follow the progress of a bunch of rats in a cage as they overbreed?...even when they are fed enough, it is not a pretty sight. And the Earth is simply a rat cage on a very large scale without an infinite food supply) Kim has a point, of sorts...better distribution of available food is a fine idea, but we cant GET food to central Ethiopia when we try!...and 'enough' food is even in doubt...have you read the articles about the overfishing of the Grand Banks?..Do you WANT to eat nothing but spiced soy and plankton?...Did you see the movie "Soylent Green"?....silly?..maybe in your lifetime, but your great-grandchildren may be asking "Why didn't they DO something back then?" ...and I'm telling you something you really need to be aware of...hungry, desperate, crowded, angry people will behave like rats in a cage in certain circumstances. If YOU have a potato, and HE has none and wants it...how far will YOU go to keep it from him? will you share it? Will he setttle for half a potato? Could I be wrong about how serious it is gonna be? Maybe...but we can't afford for me to be right, can we? Gee, I started out to throw a few jokes into this post, but it didn't seem to work that way, did it? Sorry, folks...I have several buttons. Definitions of folk music is the easy one.....this pushed the serious one... |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: keltcgrasshoppper Date: 31 May 00 - 01:36 PM Spaw... here in Mass we drink Berkshire Brewing Company.. better known as BBC...Great stuff full of calories.....KGH |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 31 May 00 - 01:45 PM Evolution will solve it all. Get too fat, you die sooner, and you don't breed. It all works out in the end.
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bill D Date: 31 May 00 - 01:56 PM ah, McGrath...that would have to be REALLY fat!*grin*...you usually have a few years to breed before you get too fat to outrun the predators...or too big to mount |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Peter K (Fionn) Date: 31 May 00 - 02:08 PM To answer Gary T's point, way up the thread, it must be the ones with the most guns who get to choose how much of the world's grub they scoff. Which must be why the yanks (six per cent of the world population?) get through about 50 per cent of the world's finite resources. (I think I am understating.) Just heard on the good old BBC today that one in four are fat in the USA, but we Brits are catching up fast. Not sure if I'm the one in my five. I must be a bit overweight, but what what counts as fat? No coincidence of course, but the Yanks also lead the world with junk food and fast food. Again we Brits are catching up fast. Apparently the countries that have highest proportion of "low fat" "no added sugar" processed foods have the fattest people. Certainly my experience of the States (even Alaska) is that it can be impossible to find ordinary normal wholesome food, free of artificial sweeteners etc. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Grab Date: 31 May 00 - 02:11 PM Bill, evolution requires reproduction. Which requires being thin enough to find the appropriate organs and connect them together... (quote from Austin Powers II)
"How _could_ you do it with Fat Bastard?" |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: katlaughing Date: 31 May 00 - 02:22 PM Pretty deep subject isn't it, BillD? I am one of those who doesn't eat meat, not for health reasons as much as I just cannot stand the thought of the killing involved and find it repugnant. And, if everyone did grow and kill their own, as Peg suggests, I suspect we would have many more who would not eat meat. Even just a few pages of a book on factory farming etc. is enough to put a person off, imo. Each of us has a responsiblity to ourselves first. If we take an action, such as not eating meat, not reproducing, etc., we do effect some sort of change. Mostly, for Americans, esp. our children, I think we should follow the advice of one of my favourite bumper stickers and "kill your television." But, of course, I'd prefer we all adopt the "moderation in all things" philosophy. As for portions, I once attended a lecture in which the speaker, an expert, said we each of us should only eat an amount of nutritious food which equals the size of one of our fists in order to be adequately nourished. Now, I've lost almost 50 lbs in the past year being very creative at staying a vegetarian yet eating a high protein/low carb diet. That has become anathema to me, though, and ineffective, so, I've gone back to eating tons of fresh fruit and veggies and low fat non-processed food and feel much, much better. A good site which is helpful for motivation and explains calorie-density can be found here. kat |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bert Date: 31 May 00 - 02:38 PM Well done kat! We need to see a new picture now. Oh, and you'll lose another pound or two if you take that bloody cat off your head *BG*. A word of warning though to all dieters. Get a second or third opinion before starting any diet. The doctors put Lou on one drastic diet after another and she got very sick every time. It turned out that she was suffering from Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma. If those quacks had been treating her for that, instead of obesity, she might have survived. Bert. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Gary T Date: 31 May 00 - 02:51 PM Hi, Fionn. While we do use a startlingly disproportionate amount of resources, and probably have the most guns, I rather doubt that there's a direct link. I see it as more a juxtoposition of opportunity, national economy, human nature, and logistics. We're blessed with a bountiful, productive land, and it's simply possible and easy to be wasteful. Sharing it with the most needy (e.g. Ethiopia) is not easy, and perhaps not possible. I read a similar news item about Europe following our unfortunate example. I believe the definition of "obese" was 20% or more above ideal body weight. Of course, there was no definition of ideal body weight. (Then one could raise the questions: Medically ideal? Culturally ideal? In whose judgment? Is geography [climate, etc.] factored in? But that's a whole other kettle of fish.) It is sometimes amazing the lengths that are gone to in apparently futile gestures to "do something" about this (fat-free foods, etc.). The typical example is the overweight person having a hamburger, french fries, ice cream--and a diet soda. Diet soda--why bother? Reminds me of the story of the millionaire who spent tens of thousands of dollars having his mansion's ballroom built, with all sorts of lavish appointments--and a closet with the interior left unpainted to save money (maybe a couple hundred dollars). Ah, human nature! |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: catspaw49 Date: 31 May 00 - 02:59 PM I'm not too nationalistic frankly, but it gets a bit old when someone complains that we use too much here in the US. Yep...we do. We also PRODUCE a lot. We could produce a lot more, but who's going to buy it? Capitalism may be a bitch, but that's the way it works. Geeziz, we have farmers going belly-up all the time here even with government subsidies. And even when we try to get food to a lot of other countries (as Bill mentioned, ie., Ethiopia), it doesn't work. We've tried to pass on better techniques through assorted government funded programs but gawd knows none of them work either. Additionally, the US then gets accused of trying to shove our stuff down the throats of other peoples and cultures. Its like giving my son a Milky Way candy bar and he looks at me and says, "I wanted a Butterfinger." Sorry......A lot of the world's troubles could be easily solved if EVERYONE was willing to give up on the idea of freedoms and rights and cultural/religious differences and just work toward a simple living for all. Since that ain't too likely............... Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Kim C Date: 31 May 00 - 03:01 PM Maybe my hero John Prine said it best:
Blow up the TV or something like that, anyway.......... |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Jed at Work Date: 31 May 00 - 03:20 PM My first thoughts on this thread were "OK, here's another one of of those hateful, 'I've got some political or social axe to grind so I'll bait the forum with a bit of my nasty perspective' sort of threads. I'll stay out of it. But in spite of the original twisted comment, I see some thoughful responses here among the great Mudcat thinkers ... so I find it hard not to jump in. When I travelled in Bolivia, Peru, El Salvador I did not eat more than the locals, likewise when I travelled in China, England, or any of the other countries where I lived and worked with the average citizens. Nor did I see any less evidence of what our thread baiter is calling 'fat' people. Walk the streets of Cochobamba, walk the streets of Lima, walk the streets of San Salvador - I promise you you will see a very similar variety of body types, and people you might call 'fat'. Does American the marketplace 'consume' significantly more than that of the developing counties? Almost ceratinly so - does that mean that Americans eat five times the food of those in the rest of the world? Bullshit! Is this discussion not one more example of some asshole trying to prove that the American's are better off then those in (some) other countries because we "stole' their piece of the pie. Most assuredly! |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: katlaughing Date: 31 May 00 - 03:33 PM Thanks, Bert, ya'll get a new picture when I've lost the other 50! Thank you,also, for sharing with us some more about Lou. My doctor has left it up to me what I do; I ask his advice when I feel I need it, but I usually end of finding answers on the net which I share with him! As for diet sodas, I wish people would understand that some who are diabetic drink diet soda out of necessity. Clerks often think nothing of getting it wrong and handing someone a regular when they've ordered diet and, if they don't notice it and go ahead and drink it, there can be some serious repercussions. We do have a fast-food drive-in, here, locally owned, which offers real fruit smoothies, so there are some alternatives! As for abundance in America, I guess those homeless in Seatlle haven't heard about that, yet, as well as in other places. They have pulled together, though, in a common bond and were once again packing up their commune-like tent city to move to the next vacant lot. According to this NPR report "Seattle Homeless", they've come up with a fairly decent code of living which nurtures each of them as well as can be expected for living on the street. kat |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: catspaw49 Date: 31 May 00 - 04:09 PM Yeah...like my very first post said way back at the top, we got a few folks in pretty desparate need around here. Woody wrote "I Ain't Got No Home" about 65 years ago and things havent improved much have they? Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bert Date: 31 May 00 - 04:15 PM You didn't have a 'hundred' to lose kat. Take care now and don't overdo it. John Evans, one thing that I guess I should come out and say plainly, instead of just hinting at it, is that... Many people are fat, NOT because they eat too much, but because THEY ARE SICK. And for them to eat less just makes them more sick. PCOS and Lymphoma are just two reasons, there are many more. People go around accusing the obese of greed without ever considering other possibilities. I have been 'skinny' for most of my life even though I have a healthy appetite. That's because I had Graves disease. Since I've had treatment I've gradually been gaining weight even though I eat less than I did before. For most people, their body shape is caused by some medical condition or difference in metabolism, whether skinny or fat, and greed or overeating or even exercise often has nothing to do with it. Bert. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Peg Date: 31 May 00 - 04:21 PM re: diet soda, yes it is the only soda diabetics can drink (my mom, brother and niece all have Type 1) BUT Nutrasweet is VERY VERY bad for you! It causes headaches and nosebleeds for people who work in the plants that make it. It causes headaches and indigestion in many people that consume it (myself included but maybe because I am hypoglycemic). It turns into wood alcohol at high temperatures... Many people are addicted to diet soda because Nutrasweet is also slightly addictive (as is sugar). Best solution: don't drink soda. Selzter with juice is a very nice alternative, and there are many juice spritzers on the market... |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Fadac Date: 31 May 00 - 10:16 PM Yes, please use less. Turn off your fridge, turn off your heater, don't use your vacuume cleaner, drink raw milk, in fact don't use anything. This dosn't make much sence does it? Well Americans use the most, because by and large, they make the most. One American farmer supports them selves and how many more people? How does this compare with Germany?, the UK, India? Why are we fat? Because we CAN! |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bill D Date: 01 Jun 00 - 12:11 AM eating habits are many & varied...I have known vegetarians of all levels, from TOTAL abstention..(meaning concern over whether an egg was fertilized or not...religious grounds) to those who abstain for health reasons, to what a meat-eater friend of mine calls "BBES"...(big brown eyes syndrome)(do you eat fish, katlaughing? Or is it just 'higher' life forms that concern you...not judging, just curious) I have eaten delicious all-veggie meals. I just never felt it necessary ..just how I was raised, I guess...I suppose I could learn meatless cookery if necessary, but I'm pretty old to start now. I know that in some parts of the world, meat is a luxury simply because of availibility, and I am concerned that even vegetable protein will become scarce. We are descended from animals who did eat meat, and baboons & chimps still do on occasion, but...*shrug*...as humans, we get to debate and worry. (does anyone else remember the Gary Larson cartoon where 2 big lions are spitting in disgust after taking a bite from a weird carcass with no features & splayed legs?...the caption says..." In sudden disgust, the lionesses realize they have killed a Tofudebeast, one of the Seringhetti's ubiquitous health antelopes") |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Kelida Date: 01 Jun 00 - 12:13 AM Americans ARE "fat" in more than one way. But we also give more in charity, relief and aide to struggling nations than any other nation on earth. Of, course, this may be because (don't quote me on this, please) we are the richest and most populated of industrialized countries. However, I would advise Americans to look within before looking for troubles abroad. America has her own problems. Feel guilty about those first, if you really MUST feel guilty. Go buy a street person a burger--real fattening (joking, but you get the idea). The problems at home need attention before we should worry about everyone else's problems. If America produces enough to support most of the world, why can't she support herself? Peace--Keli |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: katlaughing Date: 01 Jun 00 - 12:23 AM Thanks, Bert, but I did too have that much to lose! Frightening, isn't it and thanks, too, for pointing out the hidden reasons that can cause obesity. I got spayed at 27 and had been 110 lbs. all of my life, even after three kids, until that; then I grew just like my spayed cats! Exercise is a bit difficult if I don't pace myself because of the dickie ticker, but I am getting there, which will help that problem, too. BillD, I eat fish on occasion, prefer not to and I was raised by a man who grew up on a homestead cattle ranch in Colorado! Didn't go veggie until I was in my 30's, about hmmmmm...oh well, a few years ago, so you're never too old, ya hear?**BG** And that Farside was one of my very favourite cartoons! I have one up right now of Mother Goose & Grimm, the cat and dog cartoon. It shows the dog sitting in a chair reading "To Kill A Mockingbird" and then he thinks in a balloon, "I thought it was an instruction manual!" |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: catspaw49 Date: 01 Jun 00 - 12:31 AM I figure there's a big Larson contingent around here......I always liked the lobster about to go into the pot screaming, "Auntie Em! Auntie Em!" Spaw (Sorry to bring up another joke in this thread which everyone's bitching about.......yeah, right) |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bill D Date: 01 Jun 00 - 12:32 AM *big grin*...a favotite |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler Date: 01 Jun 00 - 04:30 AM Following on from Grab's posting, for a birthday some years back someone gave me a bottle of Fat Bastard Chardonnay and someone else gave me Owd Roger beer! People can insult me like that any time they like! Why couldn't I post to this thread yesterday? It's OK today! RtS |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 01 Jun 00 - 06:18 AM "But we also give more in charity, relief and aide to struggling nations than any other nation on earth."
Well, proportionately, you don't actually. Ireland for one gives far more per head, and there are many others. If Americans gave the same proportion as the top ten countries or so, we'd be in sight of cracking a lot of the things wrong with the world. And that isn't meant to be knocking America. Big countries tend to be more inward looking than small countries, and they don't come a lot bigger than the United States. It's certainly not a matter of lack of generosity on an individual basis. It's a structural problem. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Peter K (Fionn) Date: 01 Jun 00 - 08:01 AM Thanks Gary T. I think we're on the same wavelength. I know you can't send doggy bags to Ethiopia, but don't forget that some of the neediest are right there in the states. Spaw, to justify consuming more on the basis that you produce more is a bit ingenuous. Do you all work that much harder than the rest of us? And in what about finite resources like fossil fuels and the global atmosphere - stuff you didn't produce and can't replace? Worse still, most of this consumption is down to only a small element in your population. If the rest caught up, then again the world would go bust. As for whether obesity can be caused by illness, the jury is still out on that. But I remember a consultant (oncologist I think) causing a furore by pointing out that there were no fat people at Auchwitz. Maybe obesity is too personal/emotive. Maybe someone could explain instead why well-off Americans have to swan around in ridiculously huge leisure utility trucks that do about six miles to a gallon? To the rest of us (including other Americans I assume) this looks like just another way of screwing up the planet for the sheer hell of it. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: katlaughing Date: 01 Jun 00 - 08:56 AM Peg, thanks for pointing out the horribleness of Nutrasweet, you are absolutely right. Also, while I have no hard evidence, my friend has noticed that her joints quit painfully aching after she quit drinking diet soda.
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: catspaw49 Date: 01 Jun 00 - 09:23 AM Fionn, I'm not suggesting that we don't overconsume. But I would say that the sheer force of economics precludes this joint from addressing the problem in a more beneficial way. Show me a "workable" plan and I'll be all for it. We have lots of homeless and malnourished people here that we haven't provided much of a solution for either. The idea that those who can afford to consume generally do, is not uniquely American. This kind of discussion always leaves some of us sounding as though we are xenophobic and others sounding like sour grapes....neither of which is true. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Peg Date: 01 Jun 00 - 11:55 AM Fionn, excellent comment on those Stupid Useless Vehicles!!! I could not agree more. They are an excellent metaphor for what is wrong with America: have fun today, don't worry about tomorrow, and pay no attention to the horrid wastefulness you are contributing to...and be sure not to worry about the safety of the people in your immediate vicinity... I have yet to meet an SUV owner who used the vehicle for its designated purpose: most of them are used to schlep around kids, groceries and dry cleaning...and they cause more accidents, quite apart from their gas guzzling...how easily we forget the fuel crisis of the 1970s and 1980s! Now people grumble about high gasoline prices and are trading in those stupid monsters... |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Jed at Work Date: 01 Jun 00 - 02:59 PM ... and the myths keep rolling! |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Peter K (Fionn) Date: 01 Jun 00 - 04:16 PM I take your point Spaw, but it surely the US tax on gasoline could be a bit nearer EU levels and the revenue put to something useful? That said, it's crazy that aviation tax is not taxed anywhere, as far as I know. Aircraft emissions are far the biggest cause of the greenhouse effect. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Jed at Work Date: 01 Jun 00 - 05:14 PM You must be kidding, Fionn. Your airline tickets are taxed beyond belief already!! Airlines themselves generate BILLIONS of dollars each year in income taxes for Uncle Sam - and a large percentage of every ticket you buy is eaten up with additional Fed, state and local taxes.
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: GUEST,fadac Date: 01 Jun 00 - 08:00 PM Hmmm, airplane taxes. Vent mode on: As an airplane owner I pay. Sales tax, property tax, excise tax, then where I pay the city to tie it down, I pay property tax on the space under the wheels. On the fuel I burn, there is Fed. tax, state tax, county tax, city tax, and don't forget airport tax. God help you if you need a light bulb or a new tire. At this time the Avaition reserve has like 34 Billion dollars just sitting there. The FAA dosn't want to reliese the money to fix up airports, pay for new updated navagation systems, give the tower controlers a pay raise. In fact they want to tax us even more to get more money that they don't want to spend. There has been several attempts to raid the airport money, however there are some level heads that prevent it. So far. Anybody that thinks that small aircraft get a free ride, are welcome to my tax bills. Vent mode off: -fadac :) |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 01 Jun 00 - 09:19 PM When Europeans are critical of America it's a bit different from ordinary xenophobia. Americans are Europeans, freed from some of the restrictions that apply back here. Having bigger appetites, in all kinds of ways, is symbolic.
Of course in a way this makes the criticism harsher at times - in a sense it is selfcriticism, criticism of an aspect of ourself that has been realised in a foreign country. But it can disguise the fact that collectively we are doing our best to follow in the footsteps of the United States in consumption.
Clearly a world in which a few regions of the woprld consume so much that it is totally impossible for the rest of the world to match it, because the resources just are not there - that is not something which can go on permanently. Something will happen that restores the balance.
But how that can be achieved without some kind of world catastrophe, and whether it can in fact be achieved - those are hard questions, and we haven't come up with the answers here, not surprisingly. "Cousins, please eat less" wrote the much (and in my few, unfairly) maligned John Evans, at the start of this thread. Clearly, taken literally, that won't in itself solve things - though it will help you live longer (and use up more resources - no simple answers, indeed...). |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: catspaw49 Date: 01 Jun 00 - 09:43 PM Well this oughta' be about post 92 and with any luck we can let this sucker die. No, there are no easy answers if indeed an answer exists. Revolution perhaps.... All we can do is to individually be as conseving as possible in what we do. Trying to get others to follow suit? People, we can't even get past the divisiveness this thread seemed to create here among friends............ Let's let this one go off to the archives to join the likes of "Armalite" and others. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 02 Jun 00 - 11:37 AM You're right there 'spaw. Until someone can come up with some bright ideas otherwise we'll be going round in circles. But it's funny the way talk about "fat" gets people as aerated as talk about reasons for killing people does. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: GUEST,Baba Date: 03 Jun 00 - 03:24 AM Thank you Bill D. For years, since I was about 11 years old, I have attempted to explain to others why I abstain from eating meat. I think I do have the BBES ("Big Brown Eyes Syndrome"), apart from not acquiring a "taste" for meat when I was growing up. I suppose I am a visual person - can't help seeing the dear little animals in their former frolicking glory as their naked bodies grill and sizzle. *Sorry to those of you who might be eating dinner* Vegetarian eating for me is a habit, and it is something my body thanks me for each day with its good health and natural energy. I hope one day that all the pressure to be thin, the fad diets, the damaging guilt and the feelings of inadequacy will disappear from this strange social construct we call "the Western World". Many people are walking around feeling disgusted by themselves due to the materialism of this culture. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Brendy Date: 03 Jun 00 - 04:12 AM There was this 'assistant' to Gerry Ryan (Irish disc-jockey) every morning, an effiminate Cork lad called Terence. One of his more endearing phrases ws that he "Could never eat anything with a face" B. |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: bbelle Date: 03 Jun 00 - 10:35 AM Perhaps the reason Americans are so "fat" is because when we got out from under British rule in 1776 the cooking got better? moonchild |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Margo Date: 03 Jun 00 - 12:04 PM To address the original post: I don't give a fig for your guilt(haha). It won't feed anyone or make anyone skinnier. As to why American's are fat: It is a matter of how things have evolved (as I see it) SUGAR: refined sugar being used in everything, in common everyday canned foods has a damaging effect (if you don't know why sugar makes you fat, go look it up)Pastries and sweets used to be only affordable by the very rich, but with technology, things have become cheaper and more affordable to produce I think that Hersheys was the first chocolate bar to be afforded by the masses. FAST FOOD LIFESTYLE: Our lifestyle has become a squeeze for time. We are expected to get more accomplished in less time. This phenomena is a result of the advances in technology. Foods that are "ready to go" are not only sold in fast food joints but also at the grocery store. It's so much easier to buy something that is ready made. Unfortunately, the lion's share of these products are indeed high in fat and sugars. It's a terrible price to pay for convenience. I'm sure that there are other factors playing upon the public in general that I am not aware of, but I think the ones I mentioned play a major part. John Evans, your accusation that the Americans simply are gluttonous and eat too much is inflamitory and self rightous. Get off your high horse. If you're really concerned about what makes people fat gather all the facts and then do something about it rather than pointing a finger. Margo |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: GUEST,Penny S. (elsewhere) Date: 03 Jun 00 - 12:21 PM British cooking, pre Industrial Revolution, was good - where do you think all those cooks over there learned those dishes that are suspiciously like our traditional dishes - they aren't all Indian recipes? British cooking, post Depression and with WWII rationing went through a bad patch. In the gap in between, there was good and bad, depending on where you fitted in society, or how close you were to the sources of food in the country. This is a calumny that should die, along with references to grits and chitterlings. Penny |
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 03 Jun 00 - 03:11 PM Food rationing for the English as a whole actually meant an improvement in nutrition, reflected in improved health. Might not have tasted too good, but nor did what most people had before. That's probably why, having been born then, I see food as fuel rather than a major thing in my life - I like it to taste good, but so long as it's edible and does the trick of keeping me going, that's the main thing
I'm still puzzled at how angry people seem to be feeling about all this. It seems that any suggestion that people eat too much is like accusing them of some depraved activity, and to use the word "fat" is the ulktimate insult. Obviously it'd be better if we were all a lot nmore equal round the world, and God willing somehow in time that'll come to be.
Now if John Evans' bit of mild breast-beating annoyed people, try this for size (and maybe change the identity countries round a bit to fit the turn of the Millennium) - A Modest Proposal
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Subject: RE: Why are Americans so fat? From: Bert Date: 04 Jun 00 - 01:03 PM LMAO Moonbaby, that was a good one. Bert. |
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