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What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?

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GUEST,Eric 19 Oct 04 - 04:17 AM
GUEST,suz 06 Nov 04 - 12:40 PM
GUEST,michele 30 Dec 04 - 11:58 PM
Sorcha 31 Dec 04 - 12:16 AM
Pauline L 31 Dec 04 - 10:17 PM
Pauline L 31 Dec 04 - 10:21 PM
freda underhill 31 Dec 04 - 11:50 PM
GUEST,Judy Maloney 17 Oct 06 - 04:38 PM
Sorcha 17 Oct 06 - 05:19 PM
frogprince 17 Oct 06 - 09:45 PM
The Fooles Troupe 17 Oct 06 - 10:07 PM
treewind 18 Oct 06 - 05:07 AM
The Fooles Troupe 18 Oct 06 - 10:11 AM
Sorcha 18 Oct 06 - 12:12 PM
GUEST,Jody 21 Nov 06 - 08:35 PM
Scrump 22 Nov 06 - 06:16 AM
Sorcha 22 Nov 06 - 07:31 AM
The Fooles Troupe 22 Nov 06 - 08:47 AM
Mo the caller 22 Nov 06 - 11:17 AM
GUEST,thurg 22 Nov 06 - 07:20 PM
GUEST,guest2 22 Mar 08 - 09:07 PM
GUEST,maloar 28 Apr 09 - 03:30 PM
Joe Offer 04 Jul 09 - 05:55 PM
Mark Clark 05 Jul 09 - 12:38 PM
GUEST 27 Sep 15 - 12:59 AM
Mark Ross 27 Sep 15 - 02:02 PM
Joe Offer 19 Jan 20 - 02:31 AM
Joe Offer 19 Jan 20 - 02:40 AM
Newport Boy 19 Jan 20 - 06:06 AM
Hagman 19 Jan 20 - 06:49 PM
Joe Offer 19 Jan 20 - 08:40 PM
Hagman 19 Jan 20 - 11:25 PM
Steve Shaw 20 Jan 20 - 08:36 PM
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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST,Eric
Date: 19 Oct 04 - 04:17 AM

Treewind hit the nail on the head about wood from germany.

All the ebony is found from germany, been sitting around for ages.All the best woods wether maple, fiddle back ect all comes from germany.

I found a violin maker here in australia a while back with ebony that was 100 yo.I bought his last 6 planks , each blank only big enough for 1 guitar finger board , he gave me a discount price of $200 each if i bought the 6.
Bargain, you cannot buy ebony that old.The ebony fingerboard on an old strad is probally the most important piece of the violin, it is irriplaceable.The rest of the body could be repaired.
Once you have worked with 100 yo ebony or older you will know what i mean.
A true violinist will pay big bucks for old instruments on the age of the instrument, the older the violin, the better it should sound.
Theoredically, a 200 yo copy strad would sound as good as a real strad if it was a real copy and made of similar wood and dimensions.
I have a strad copy, it says its a copy, but there is no made in germany or the likes.I know it is hand made by all the mistakes, it sounds fantastic as well.
The only way to tell is to have the wood tested for age, you may find your 200 yo copy would also be worth big bucks.
I know a 1719 yo strad sold for $16 million recently, id be real happy if my copy, which may be as old was worth $100,000.00
and im betting a true violinist would pay that for a 200yo strad copy.
Any takers :)


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST,suz
Date: 06 Nov 04 - 12:40 PM

I used to play my grandfather's violin...alas many years have past..and by just counting those years my violin is atleast 100 years old..inside it says antonio stradavarious 1734..what have I got? a $100 violin or a $1000 violin..any guesses? where can I get it appraised by a reputable appraiser...denver area??

very good shape..need new strings..hard varnish I think keeps it intact and coolish place..


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST,michele
Date: 30 Dec 04 - 11:58 PM

i was given a strad violin by my family the marking say

copie de antonius stradiuarius
facie anno 1620

could you please let me know a little about it and the cost value


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Sorcha
Date: 31 Dec 04 - 12:16 AM

Lable means it is a copy of a Strad originally made in 1620. Loads and tons of these copies out there....depends on where and when and by whom it was really made by. The sound has NO bearing on value, just the above. I have a Strad copy, machine made by Lyon and Healy in Chicago, US in the 1920's....moneytary value...NONE. Sentimental value....irreplaceable.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Pauline L
Date: 31 Dec 04 - 10:17 PM

I've seen so many posts on so many sites by people who wonder whether that cheap violin they got at a pawn shop or yard sale or their grandmother's attic might really be a Strad. The answer is NO!!! In your dreams! BTW, a real Strad would be worth considerably more than $1K, more like a few $100K. For $1K, you can get a violin which is better than student grade, but nowhere near as good as one played by a professional in a symphony orchestra, which would probably be worth $50-100K.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Pauline L
Date: 31 Dec 04 - 10:21 PM

If I had $1 for each post I've seen by someone who wonders whether their cheap violin is really a Strad, I could buy myself a fine fiddle. :-)


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: freda underhill
Date: 31 Dec 04 - 11:50 PM

for anyone interested in getting a beautifully made violin, its worth checking out Graham Caldersmith's site at Graham Caldersmith Caldersmith

www.luth.org/calder/

the sound is beautiful, violins are made individually on commission and he has sold to some of the world's great violinists.

graham is an Australian scientist and music lover. he has applied his understanding of physics to guitar and violin making. he is a very talented instrument maker and has published over 30 papers in various respected journals concerning music, lutherie, and his accumulated physics-acoustical research.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST,Judy Maloney
Date: 17 Oct 06 - 04:38 PM

I have a violin that belonged to my grandfather and I need some information on it, please. On the back are the initials 'F.R.'with a star above the initials. There are no labels on the inside. Any help would be appreciated.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Sorcha
Date: 17 Oct 06 - 05:19 PM

Nowhere near enough info....where are you, do you know how granfer got it, and I doubt you will ever find out much. Too many 'home luthiers' out there.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: frogprince
Date: 17 Oct 06 - 09:45 PM

"a 200 yo copy strad would sound as good as a real strad if it was a real copy and made of similar wood and dimensions"

I wish I could cite the source for this now, but a few years ago I read an article by someone who surmised that Stradivarius used wood salvaged from construction beams that were already centuries old.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 17 Oct 06 - 10:07 PM

Also allegedly the wood had been stored in the water for years - it was drifted down river and stored until sold.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: treewind
Date: 18 Oct 06 - 05:07 AM

The only way to value a violin is to take it to an expert. They won't take much notice of labels, they'll looks at the type of wood used, quality of construction, and check various alignments for distortion and warping.

Anahata


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 18 Oct 06 - 10:11 AM

Yes treewind

a modest well made instrument by an unknown maker that is in good shape, and that plays and sounds well, is worth more than a 'name' one that is in bad condition - unless it is for 'display'.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Sorcha
Date: 18 Oct 06 - 12:12 PM

And how they sound has NO bearing on the value. It's all in who made it, when, and where.


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Subject: Antonio Stradavariou violin
From: GUEST,Jody
Date: 21 Nov 06 - 08:35 PM

we have an old violin that reads antonio stradavarious, made in czechoslovakia. It was my husband's grandmother's who was born in 1900. We were wondering if it is of any value.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Scrump
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 06:16 AM

Stradavarious? It sounds like a fake to me, like those "Rollex" watches :-)


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Sorcha
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 07:31 AM

Means its a Strad MODEL and probably not worth much money. If it sounds nice, enjoy it for the family treasure it is.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 08:47 AM

Many 'copies' have been made - of varying quality - using the shapes and often thickness and shaping measurements of famous old violins.

Mr Llellwyn - who was well know in Aussie circles at one time, had templates made from genuine Strads - his grandsons still have those. He made some istruments which have 'turned out nice' and are still highly valued, due to their tone and playability - due to his careful workmanship.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Mo the caller
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 11:17 AM

Kim C said ".....me not knowing how to play up there. My teacher said that's the weakest part of the instrument... "

Sounds like the comment that the part of a car that's most often faulty is the nut behind the wheel!


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST,thurg
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 07:20 PM

Okay, I might as well join the party. My fiddle has the name LOWENDALL'S CELEBRATED CONSERVATORY VIOLIN. stamped on the head. Inside label give 1893 as year it was made; Berlin the place. Anyone know anything about Louis Lowendall? Any chance he's going to come looking for his Celebrated Conservatory Violin?


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST,guest2
Date: 22 Mar 08 - 09:07 PM

I also have one of his celebrated conservatory violin marked berlin 1893, can't say it sounds so rare anymore.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST,maloar
Date: 28 Apr 09 - 03:30 PM

Hy!I have a fiddle Amati. If somebody can told me where can i sold it (an how much is aprox. an amati fiddle)... please contact me: maloar@freemail.hu   Thanks


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Jul 09 - 05:55 PM

Are there fiddle players who actually use a Stradivarius or Amati violin, or are the ancient and noble violins used only by classical musicians?
-Joe-


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Mark Clark
Date: 05 Jul 09 - 12:38 PM

As I recall, Kenny Baker's main fiddle is an origial Stainer. He bought it for a song (less than $100) many years ago.

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Sep 15 - 12:59 AM

I have Jacobus stainer in obsom prope onilpon

tom 17and littly65 made in Czechs love orig a Violion marled in thaleabbel tel details


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Mark Ross
Date: 27 Sep 15 - 02:02 PM

Here's some film from YouTube (a short piece, around 14 minutes from les Blank) of Tommy Jarrell playing a genuine Strad at the Library of Congress. It doesn't sound like a strad, it sounds like Tommy Jarrell. It's the player not the instrument. There was recently a double blind test of great violinists playing different instruments. they coldn't agree as to what was better the old ones or the modrn copies.

My Old Fiddle


Mark Ross


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Jan 20 - 02:31 AM

Our local symphony did the Dvorak Cello concerto this evening. The soloist played the Servais Stradivarius. I'm wondering if this is the most precious musical instrument I will ever hear. It was a real thrill to hear it.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrien-Fran%C3%A7ois_Servais


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Jan 20 - 02:40 AM

OK, so did I hear a Strad, or a copy of a Strad?
The cellist was Amit Peled.
http://www.amitpeled.com/biography

Raised on a kibbutz in Israel, Amit Peled began playing the cello at age 10. He lives in Baltimore, Maryland with his wife and children and now performs on the only known copy of the “Servais” Stradivarius by Vuillaume ca. 1865.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Newport Boy
Date: 19 Jan 20 - 06:06 AM

Joe - you need to come to Europe. Last season I heard Ning Feng play in Bath and I'm going to hear him again in Cardiff in June. His biography is here and the last paragraph says:

Ning Feng plays a 1721 Stradivari violin, known as the ‘MacMillan’, on private loan, kindly arranged by Premiere Performances of Hong Kong, and plays on strings by Thomastik-Infeld, Vienna.

Over the past 15 years, I've heard at least a dozen of the great instruments, all of them on loan to top performers.

BTW, Ning Feng's encore solo in Bath was Ricci's transcription for violin of Recerdos de la Alhambra by Tarrega.

Phil


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Hagman
Date: 19 Jan 20 - 06:49 PM

Some nice research/info here


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Jan 20 - 08:40 PM

Studying a little further, I gather that our cellist's instrument is the only known copy of the “Servais” Stradivarius by Vuillaume ca. 1865. Jean-Baptiste Vuillaume (1798–1875) was a French luthier whose workshop built over 30,000 instruments - and he built over 3,000 instruments himself over a lifetime.
His Wikipedia article says:
    Vuillaume was an innovative violin maker and restorer, and a tradesman who traveled all of Europe in search of instruments. Due to this fact, most instruments by the great Italian violin makers passed through his workshop. Vuillaume then made accurate measurements of their dimensions and made copies of them.

    He drew his inspiration from two violin makers and their instruments: Antonio Stradivari and his "Le Messie" (Messiah), and Giuseppe Guarneri del Gesù and his "Il Cannone" which belonged to Niccolò Paganini; others such as Maggini, Da Salò and Nicola Amati were also imitated, but to a lesser extent....

    When making these copies, Vuillaume always remained faithful to the essential qualities of the instruments he imitated – their thickness, the choice of the woods, and the shape of the arching. The only differences, always the result of a personal decision, were the colour of the varnish, the height of the ribs or the length of the instruments.

    His most beautiful violins were often named after the people who owned them (Caraman de Chimay, Cheremetoff, Doria)[



So, the Vuillaume instruments were copies, not forgeries - and they were fine instruments, indeed. The cello was extraordinary last night - deep, rich tones on the low notes and unbelievably clear on the high notes.

Can't say I really liked the Dvorak cello concerto all that much, but it was a good way to show of the cellist and his instrument. I suppose those are two major purposes of concertos. But give me a symphony any old time.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Hagman
Date: 19 Jan 20 - 11:25 PM

Try the Elgar concerto, Joe. Never fails to amaze.


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Subject: RE: What's a Strad, Amati etc fiddle?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Jan 20 - 08:36 PM

In m'humble the Dvorak concerto is by streets the best concerto written for cello. The version that brings tears to my eyes is the August 21 1968 Proms one which had a Russian orchestra (the USSR State Symphony) and conductor (Svetlanov) with Slava Rostropovich on cello. It was far from the technical best ever but what context: that same day Russian tanks had rolled into Prague, snuffing out Dubcek's Prague Spring. Slava was completely out of sync with the Soviet action and his performance was, to say the least, intense and angry. The concert only went ahead with difficulty, after vociferous protests both inside and outside the hall.

As for the Elgar concerto, I've always thought that, uniquely, a definitive performance was given, the one by Jackie Du Pre and John Barbirolli on record. Nothing I've heard since I first heard that one comes anywhere near, and I get fed of its being severely overplayed on Classic FM.

For a very nice piece which features the cello, try Tchaikovsky's Rococo Variations. Now that isn't played anywhere near enough! (Oh, and those Bach cello suites of course...)

Now back to talking woodwork...!


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