Just say NO to Hollywood!

Subject: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 20 Aug 01 - 10:25 PM

I saw this bumper sticker yesterday, and I instantly loved it... though I'm not sure why. It is written in what looks like "kindergarden crayon" and is multicolored; ala rainbow. Do you love it too? If you do, I'd like to know why! Live long and phosphor...ttr

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 20 Aug 01 - 11:37 PM

I'll tell you why I've said no to Hollywood -- it's the source of violent films, cliches, crude dialog and stereotypes. Also movies almost always make me motion sick. I have to be forced to go to one.

Just to show you how strongly I feel about this, I walked out on "Shakespeare in Love" because it disgusted me.

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:00 AM

Hi leenia,... why did it disgust you? I'd like to know... I enjoyed it, and it seemed more like my life than most... yet it was histically speaking; absurd. Like a rewrite of what never was... tell it like it is... what drove you away?

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Peg
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:27 AM

I loved that film. Very clever. A witty and wonderful parody of Shakspeare, the theatre, Elizabethan England, etc. And a nice love story too, I thought.

It was Tom Stoppard, a very wry and satirical playwright, who wrote the script...which showed an impressive comprehension of Shakespeare, I might add...

I am amazed anyone would be "disgusted" by that film...

So much crap out of Hollywood, I find myself evry tickled when something GOOD comes out of there...

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:38 AM

Go Girl! I readily concur. The romance of it got me good.

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Peg
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:41 AM

I especially loved the ending; envisioning Viola as being in a shipwreck so she would not have to marry that jerk, then beginning life anew and falling in love with the handsome captain in "Twelfth Night"...

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: MAG
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:51 AM

Not to mention that her stage name was the name of an actual actor in Shakespeare's company, leaving one with the pleasant impression that the ship actually got wrecked and she made it back to be an actor ...

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:51 AM

I thought Queen Elizabeth was so perfect in her role; sage that she was. An Exquisite ruler. And so poignant too!

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: MAG
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:55 AM

This was a ploy to get us to singits praises, no? Tho' in general I like the slogan, in spite of being an absolute movie junkie.

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Peg
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 01:02 AM

well usually I think Hollywood films are CRAP! (I have to watch a lot of them for my job)

So, I guess when something as wonderfully intelligent and effervescent as Shakespeare in Love comes along and is, ostensibly, a Hollywood film, I wish to celebrate it, for reminding me of the great things Hollywood used to be known for, and is still, occasionally, capable of...

BTW, just saw a NON Hollywood film today and highly recommend it: Session 9. Probably one of the scariest damn films I have seen in a long time (and I am a horror film buff).

Also saw the newly restored print of Fellini's Juliet of the Spirits and it is lovely...do see it if it comes to your area...

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 01:04 AM

Disgusted by the re-write? Hell, Disney made his fortune re-writing stuff - it's all his fault that 3 generations think lemmings throw themselves off cliffs, because he'd heard of the story of their population control, decided it was true and forced thousands of lemmings to watery graves in the name of movie making.

And what about that one about the Enigma machine? Hell, at least Shakespeare in love wasn't about a VERY WELL DOCUMENTED event, and could plausibly have happened... but the Enigma machine - WE BLOODY FOUND IT!!! GET USED TO IT!

If you need to walk out, walk out because it is crap, not because it is a different interpretation of life. And it doesn't matter anyway. Walking out only has an effect if you demand your money back, and how many cinemas/movie theatres are going to give you back your money just because you thought it wasn't a nice film?

As for Hollywood being the source of violence and the like - come to London and have a walk round. I can show you more violence, robbery, degradation, filth, disease and sex than any Hollywood offering, and that is just with the pigeons in Trafalgar Square!

LTS

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 01:24 AM

If you want violence, I think Hollywood has got it, and more of it. But it is not real. It only seems real. If we could only understand better the degradation and violence that the ecosystem suffers for our vanity; and hollywood could help... but it just avoids the real issues...

I wonder what we can do for the streets of London...ttr

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: JedMarum
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 09:26 AM

Hollywood has some terrific film making tools at its disposal these days, thanks to such wonderful high tech advances and some very talented artists - but they waste it on such crap as historical corrections and stories that press their political perspectives.

What's wrong with just telling a story? Why do they feel I need a lesson in morality from Ben Affleck or a new understanding of the true meaning of life from Catherine Zeta Jones?

I find the historical rewrites extremely insulting. They insist on putting their heros back in time with a 21 century mindset and they totally ignore any of the facts that get in the way - they even ignore all the cultural understanding we have of the period.

Hollywood is NOT concerned with art. It is concerned with box office smash hits. Lowest common demononator wins.

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: RWilhelm
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 11:18 AM

I'd be happy if 10% of what comes out of Hollywood was as good as "Shakespeare in Love". I don't mind a little inaccuracy for the sake of good fun. What I can't stand is characters saying and doing stupid and contrived things in the guise of realism.

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:41 PM

I read somewhere that 60% of North American "Hollywood" films are now made in Canada. (because of lower wages and more accomidating locals)

Just say no to Toronto!! (just kidding, Hollywood has final say over content)

Hollywood is just like the soft drink industry. Most people just want caffine, sugar and fizzy water. So those are the ingredients they get.

As for "Historical" rewrites, accuracy is not possible in a movie. I just finished reading "Seven Pillars of Wisdom" by T.E. Lawrence and watching "Lawrence of Arabia" by David Lien. In the movie, a homosexual couple becomes a couple of cute teenagers and a whole buch of historical Arabs are rolled up into Anthony Quin's and Omar Sharif's characters. I think the spirit of the book is captured but all most all of the information in the book is obscured.

Liz when you speak of the enigma machine are you refering to the movie U571? If so, I sort of agree. But I don't blame them for doing so. It was a US Movie for a US audience. They did have a disclaimer at the end of the movie saying that the Royal Navy actualy did captuire Enigma.

I am a little irritated by "The great escape" where the real pricipals were Canadian and British and the movie "heros" are USAF. I though "Chicken run" was closer to the historical facts. ***BG***

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: DougR
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:52 PM

I think the best films appearing in theaters today are Independents, free of Hollywood control.

I enjoyed "Shakespeare in Love," though, which only shows that Hollywood can do it when it really tries.

I also think Hollywood "aims" its movies at about the 14 or 15 age level.

DougR

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: paddymac
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 12:54 PM

IMHO, the mistake many people make is in thinking "Hollywood" is about art and creativity. Not so. Its sole reason for existence is making money. Whatever art and creativity are allowed to flourish there do so only in service to the "filthy lucre." All of us need to make money in one way or another, but we mostly look to the arts from a different perspective, and then may be disappointed when it appears as it is (at least in the case of Hollywod) rather than as we wish to see it.

There are probably people out there who could find nothing positive to say about "Oh, Brother," "Songcatcher,", "Down From The Mountain", and "Shakespeare In Love," etc., etc., etc.

(time to go put a little more tay in my whiskey)

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Kim C
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 01:59 PM

I like movies. I wait till they come out on video, though, so I can cuddle up in the privacy of my home with my fuzzy slippers on, for the mere price of $3.79. I know what kind of stories I like, and sometimes they include violence, and sometimes they don't.

Last weekend we rented Shadow of the Vampire, Unbreakable, and Space Cowboys. All three, lots of fun. Willem Dafoe as the ugly vampire is probably the single best piece of true acting I have seen in eons.

I agree, though, that Hollywood is about money. Always has been, always will be. Sometimes, though, they do put out something really good, and surprise everyone.

It's like a gal pal of mine used to say: I just assume all men are gay. That way, when I find out he's not, I can be pleasantly surprised.

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Linda Kelly
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 03:54 PM

I did not particularly enjoy Shakespseare in Love as I found it contrived and the performances overdone save for Judi Dench. Also will somebody please give that bloody Paltrow woman a sandwich-she doesn't look like she's eaten for a month!!!

Subject: Just say NO to Hollywon't
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 04:22 PM

Shakespeare in Love bored me to tears... holy yawnfest Batman!!

The more indy or foreign films I see, the more and more Hollywood stuff reaks of crap...IE, Crouching Tiger... what an absolutely amazing piece of film... The Matrix could have been that good, but wasn't even close...

Peg, if you liked Session 9, look for a film called CUBE... WOW!!!

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: JedMarum
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 05:50 PM

I really enjoyed Shakespseare in Love, and thought Gwinneth was quite good, skinny or not - and, dare I say, quite nice to look at! She looks a bit like my wife, actually (lucky girl).

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 06:04 PM

It was a US Movie for a US audience.

What's that got to do with it? If someone over here made a film of the OK Corral and made all the characters Geordies, I don't think "it was a UK Movie for a UK audience" would be a very plausible explanation. (Mind, it might make a great film done that way... Johnny Handle as a Singing Cowboy.)

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: catspaw49
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 06:22 PM

LMAO....Geeziz Mac, if they're still making films at Pinewood or wherever, you need to call them and suggest a Geordie "Gunfight at OK Corral"........It's be a riot....I'd sure as hell watch it!

Spaw

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: The Walrus
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 06:37 PM

I remember at a Military Modellers show (One of the "Norther Militaire" series I think) where they had a "Western Gunfight" club (immediately nicknamed by everybody as "The Rochdale Coyboys") presenting a "gunfight at the OK Corral" scenario in a nearby shopping precinct with the commontater straight faced delivering lines like "...And here come the Earp Brothers past Tesco while the Clantons are in wait for them by the Launderette...". Not Geordie, by the effect was quite surreal, now I wish I had *that* on film

Regards

Walrus

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: catspaw49
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 06:39 PM

And if you did, you'd have to send ME a copy Walrus!!!

Spaw

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Peg
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 10:15 PM

Clinton, my pal Mike told me about "Cube"; sounds good!

I watched THREE press screeninsg today; my eyes and brain are fried! Some of the critics I saw all day today stayed on and watched a FOURTH film (Bubble Boy; no dout terrible; I was not interested.

Saw "Ghosts of Mars." Eh. Not too bad, not very good. Violent, glossy space thriller. Not recommended unless you like this sort of thing.

Saw "The Crimson Rivers." French thriller about a serial killer and rumors of Nazi eugenics at an elite college; rather good! Recommended.

Saw "Hearts in Atlantis." Based on Stephen King story. Anthony Hopkins as a mysterious man who comes into a young boy's life. Very funny and moving, a bit sentimental and manipulative, but nevertheless I enjoyed it! Something the whole family could enjoy, believe it or not; but not strictly a kid's movie at all...highly recommended.

peg

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 11:09 PM

Sounds good to me. Just say NO to most radio and TV too. And then there's the Internet...

Oops.

See ya.

- LH

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Sourdough
Date: 22 Aug 01 - 12:29 AM

I don't know what "The Bubble Boy" is about but it was suggested b the life of a child near Houston who was born with the rare condition of having no immunological defenses. As a result his only p[ossibilty of survival was to remain isolated in a bubble, actually a kind of tent in which he lived his life. Meanwhile, he doctors tried to find a cure. As he grew older, the tent was enlarged. His mother could hug him using sleeves that were attached to an outside port.

I was at the time, and as far as I know, I remained, the only journalist allowed into the boy's home. It was a lovely family who had learned to live with their unusual child. The boy was bright, alert, and had a wonderful sense of humor. His doctors, researchers from the University of Texas, were captivated with him. When I asked his younger sister how she felt about her brother getting all the attention from journalists all over the world, she showed her own resilience by saying proudly that she is the only one in her shchool whose brother lives in a bubble!

Some people felt that the million plus dollars that the March of Dimes had spent on "the bubble boy" could have been better spent. The UT researchers tried to make the case that the boy gave them an insight into the way the human body works. As you might expect, when the AIDS epidemic struck and people went looking for what research had been done on immune deficiencies, they were grateful for the studies that had been done with the little Texas boy.

It was too late for him though. When he reached puberty, the doctors and parents agreed that it was time to give him the best treatment they could to prepare hm for life outside the bubble. They spent a year getting his immune system working as best it could and then , after discussing all the alternatives with him, they moved him from the bubble into a protected environment. His immune system wasn't able to handle even that and he died.

He was a lovely, brave, bright kid. I dn't know how he is treated in the new film but I believe it is a comedy so I don't suppose that viewers will get much of a sense of the dignity and value of that boy's life.

Sourdough

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 22 Aug 01 - 02:54 AM

The current film Bubble Boy has NOTHING at all to do with the actual plight of the poor wee bugger who inspired the 1976 made for TV "The Boy In The Plastic Bubble, staring John Travolta as Tod Lubitch...

The bubble is simply a vehicle to create a road comedy... and the people who are getting their knickers in a knot over it need to feckin' chill!

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Aug 01 - 12:12 PM

Since we're on Hollywood here, let me nominate Reese Witherspoon for actress with the silliest name(s).

There has been a trend for some time now to dub children with common surnames (such as Taylor or Tyler, for example) as their given names. I believe "Reese" is another example of this ongoing search for coolness.

In a generation from now, there will probably be little girls running around named Witherspoon Jones, Withespoon Davies, Witherspoon Nicholson, etc. Well, that is if Reese makes it really BIG anyway...

Yuck!

- LH

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 22 Aug 01 - 03:17 PM

"Before the Rain" is quite intense, and blew my mind last night.
Is "songcatcher" any good? "Manon of Spring/Jean de Flourette" are fine films IMHO. I really like the "Blue/Red/White" trilogy, especially "Blue". "Zentropa" is great, and one of my favorites is "Wings of Desire". And for a special treat, try "The Big Labouski". "Ten Thousand Clowns" is also a fine film...

Subject: RE: Just say NO to Hollywood!
From: DougR
Date: 22 Aug 01 - 04:04 PM

Someone in another Thread mentioned the film, "The Nephew." Anybody know anything about that one? I never heard of it.

DougR