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Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??

DigiTrad:
BARD OF ARMAGH
PILLS OF WHITE MERCURY
STREETS OF LAREDO (Cowboy's Lament)
THE DYING LUMBERMAN
THE LINEMAN'S HYMN
THE STREETS OF LOREDO
THE TROOPER CUT DOWN IN HIS PRIME
UNFORTUNATE LASS


Related threads:
Lyr Add: Tom Sherman's Barroom (12)
Streets of Stavanger aka The Seasick Norwegian (12)
Tune Req: Streets of Laredo alternate tune (35)
Streets of Laredo (38)
H M Belden. Ballads and Songs-Unfortunate Rake (47)
Lyr Req: Trooper Cut Down in His Prime (Roy Palmer (47)
Lyr Req: Handful of Laurel (9)
Lyr Add: Pills of White Mercury (26)
Lyr Req: Streets of Toledo (Paul Clayton) (18)
(origins) Origins: Pills of White Mercury (36) (closed)
Chords Req: Pills of White Mercury (Old Blind Dogs (16)
(origins) ...all wrapped in white linen. (63)
Lyr Add: The Buck's Elegy (corrupt text?) (65)
Lyr Req: Pills of White Mercury (5)
Lyr Req: The Pills of White Mercury (2)


In Mudcat MIDIs:
The Streets of Laredo (Cowboy's Lament) (from Cowboy & Western Songs, Fife & Fife, 1969 (from Myra Hull's "Cowboy Ballads"))


MGM·Lion 21 Feb 10 - 01:12 AM
Q (Frank Staplin) 21 Feb 10 - 01:01 PM
GUEST,Mike in Jersey 13 Apr 10 - 07:11 AM
banjoman 14 Apr 10 - 05:53 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Apr 10 - 10:13 AM
IanC 14 Apr 10 - 11:07 AM
Lighter 06 Jan 16 - 05:41 PM
Lighter 04 Jan 19 - 10:23 AM
Lighter 02 Jun 19 - 08:24 PM
GUEST,Randall 08 Dec 21 - 11:28 AM
GUEST,Randall Landfair 21 Dec 21 - 05:23 PM
GUEST 22 Dec 21 - 06:15 AM
Lighter 22 Dec 21 - 09:52 AM
GUEST 22 Dec 21 - 08:24 PM
GUEST 22 Dec 21 - 09:30 PM
Lighter 23 Dec 21 - 11:30 AM
GUEST 24 Dec 21 - 05:35 AM
GUEST 24 Dec 21 - 06:41 AM
Lighter 24 Dec 21 - 09:29 AM
GUEST 24 Dec 21 - 04:08 PM
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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 21 Feb 10 - 01:12 AM

And has anyone any comment on the way the full-military-honours funeral motif, with its uniformed pall-bearers, muffled drum & fife &c, has so incongruously, &, it would appear, universally, survived into this cowboy context from the earlier 'Young soldier/sailor' British versions ~~ tho, as I have remarked before on other threads, why a young serviceman should ever have considered himself entitled to such an honour for dying, not gloriously in battle, but from a dose of the pox, I have never understood. Why, what vain & conceited impertinence, to be sure!


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 21 Feb 10 - 01:01 PM

1. Perhaps Hoy's book will answer some of the questions about 'Tom Sherman's' bar room. Various singers have changed the name and the lyric in the last 100 and some years since the song came into popular use.

2. The form of the funeral may have roots in the old country, but many aspects as portrayed in the song were in use in civilian funerals in the US, esp. the West.
Pall bearers wore 'Sunday best' or their best work clothes. I have read of cowboy funerals where the 'best' were western dress with boots, Stetson, etc. The song has from six to sixteen pall-bearers, the number depending on the imagination and inventiveness of the singer.
Some funerals in the West had musicians, usually just a drum or fife and drum, but some western frontier towns had bands, e. g., Dodge City, which were well known.
One funeral in Dodge City, led by the band, was reported in papers across the country- although I vaguely remember that it was for a dog, or was it a female saloon-owner? My memory is poor and I would have to go back to the literature.

3. Did the song descend from the UK versions? Probably, but remember that many customs, military and civil, were brought across the pond, but changed and modified in various ways as time passed.


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo
From: GUEST,Mike in Jersey
Date: 13 Apr 10 - 07:11 AM

Back in the late 50's and early 60's we used to sing the "Cloggy" version.
The next verses went something like this:-

He said "From your attire I see you're a climber
I see you're a climber and so once was I
But I went out a climbing on the Great Slab of Clogwen
And fell from the Bow and I'm going to die"

Give me six stalwart climbers to carry my coffin
And six pretty maidens to weep at my head
.............(I can't remember the next two lines.

The final verse went:-

"Bury me deep at the foot of great Clogwen
Deep in the sound of the wild ravens' call
Put a sod on my feet and one on my head
To deaden the screams of my friends as they fall"

Cloggy refers to Clogwy d'ur Arddu ( described in the book "The Black Cliff". It stands under the Snowdon railway and is the backwall of Cwm d'ur Arddu. The "Bow" and "Great Slab" are famous climbing routes on the crag.


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo
From: banjoman
Date: 14 Apr 10 - 05:53 AM

Somewhere in my old record collection I have a recording of Roy Guest (remember him) singing Streets of Laredo.


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Apr 10 - 10:13 AM

Folkways did a whole album devoted to the song, entitled 'The Unfortunate Rake'.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo
From: IanC
Date: 14 Apr 10 - 11:07 AM

The use of Mercury as a cure for syphilis was known to Shakespeare. The treatment was evidently introduced at the end of the 15th Century ...

Mercury as a therapeutic agent was introduced as early as 1497. Before that it had been used by the Arabs in the treatment of scabies, psoriasis, leprosy and other skin diseases.


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE DYING COWBOY
From: Lighter
Date: 06 Jan 16 - 05:41 PM

A whole book has been written on the song family in question:

"I Went Down to St. James Infirmary," by Robert W. Harwood (Kitchener, Ont.: Harland, 2008).

Harwood asserts that cowboy Francis Henry Maynard "copyrighted" the cowboy version in 1876. While supporting Maynard's claim, his biography by Jim Hoy, Cowboy's Lament (2010), makes no mention of a copyright, which would seem highly improbable anyway.

Maynard published a booklet of his verse titled "Rhymes of the Range and Trail" (1911) which included the following:


THE DYING COWBOY

As I rode down by Tom Sherman's bar-room,
Tom Sherman's bar-room so early one day,
There I espied a handsome young ranger
All wrapped in white linen, as cold as the clay.
"I see by your outfit that you are a ranger,"
The words that he said as I went riding by,
"Come sit down beside me, and hear my sad story,
I'm shot through the breast and I know I must die.

Chorus:
Then muffle the drums and play the dead marches;
Play the dead marches as I'm carried along;
Take me to the church-yard and lay the sod o'er me,
I'm a young ranger and I know I've done wrong.

"Go bear a message to my grey-haired mother
Go break the news to gently to my sister so dear,
But never a word of this place do you mention,
As they gather around you my story to hear.
Then there is another as dear as a sister,
Who will bitterly weep when she knows I am gone,
But another more worthy may win her affection,
For I'm a young ranger — I know I've done wrong."

Chorus

"Once in my saddle I used to be dashing;
Once in my saddle, I used to be brave;
But I first took to gambling, from that to drinking,
And now in my prime, I must go to my grave.
Go gather around you a crowd of gay rangers,
Go tell them the tale of their comrade's sad fate,
Tell each and all to take timely warning,
And leave their wild ways before it's too late."

Chorus

"Go, now, and bring me a cup of cold water,
To bathe my flushed temples," the poor fellow said.
But ere I returned, the spirit had left him,
Had gone to is Giver — the ranger was dead.
So we muffled the drums and played the dead marches,
We bitterly wept as we bore him along,
For we all loved the ranger, so brave and so handsome,
We all loved our comrade, although he'd done wrong.


Maynard told a journalist in 1924:

"During the winter of 1876 I was working for a Grimes outfit which had started north with a trail herd [from Texas]...We were wintering on the Salt Fork of the Arkansas river on the border of Kansas....

"One of the favorite songs of the cowboys in those days was called 'The Dying Girl's Lament,' the story of a girl who had been betrayed by her lover...

"I had often amused myself by trying to write verses, and one dull winter day in camp to while away the time I began writing a poem which could be sung to the tune of 'The Dying Girl's Lament.' I made it a dying ranger or a cowboy....

"After I had finished the new words to the song I sang it to the boys in the outfit. They liked it and began singing it. It became popular with boys in other outfits ...and from that time on I heard it sung everywhere on the range and the trail."

Not long after this interview, Maynard told song collector Ina Sires that "he wrote the words to fit the tune of an old song that used to be sung by the cowboys called 'The Dying Girl's Lament,' which was the story of a girl dying in a hospital, and which began like this:

"'As I walked down by St. James Hospital, St. James Hospital so early one day, etc.' The song was accepted by the cowboys."

While Maynard was apparently responsible for *one* adaptation of 'The Dying Girl's Lament,' there's no way to know if he was truly the first to adapt the song to the American West. No text before Thorp's very different (and oddly "literary") one (1908) seems to survive.


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: Lighter
Date: 04 Jan 19 - 10:23 AM

Here's a pre-Thorp reference, from the Buffalo [N.Y.] Evening News (Oct. 14, 1904), p. 12:

SONGS AND POEMS ASKED FOR.

Editor Evening News:

Please ask for the following songs: "Barney McCoy," "The Old Sod Shanty on the Plain," "Dying Darkey," "Ship's Carpenter," "The Dying Cowboy's Lament." The chorus to the last one runs something like this:

Once in my saddle I used to go happy,
Once in my saddle I used to go gay;
I first took to drinking and then to card playing,
And shot in the heart and dying I now lay.

                                                    Mrs. F. M.

Perry, Oct. 12, 1904.


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: Lighter
Date: 02 Jun 19 - 08:24 PM

Back in the 1950s, Canadian folklorist Edith Fowke collected a version of the Civil War ballad "The Cumberland's Crew" from Orlo Brandon of Peterborough, Ontario, which he sang (surprisingly) to the "Tom Sherman's Barroom" tune:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQz6fi8-lO8


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST,Randall
Date: 08 Dec 21 - 11:28 AM

Ken Maynard


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST,Randall Landfair
Date: 21 Dec 21 - 05:23 PM

So the first version of The Cowboy's Lament to be copyrighted were handwritten by a cattle driver in 1876 who's name was Francis Henry Maynard, and 53 years later in 1929 another cowboy named Ken Maynard (The American Boy's Favorite Cowboy) pioneer's the first successful dubbing of his version of The Cowboy's Lament to become the first singing cowboy on the silver screen his version on the the Talkie Hit from Universal Picture "The Wagon Master". And that movie is nowhere to be found for viewing. And what's more strange to me is they are not blood related!


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Dec 21 - 06:15 AM

The 1833 Treaty fixed borders for what was to be a "Permanent home to the whole Creek "Nation" of Indians. 1833 Treaty, preamble, 7 stat. 418. It also established that the United States will grant a patent, in fee simple, to the Creek "Nation" of Indians for the land assigned said "Nation" by this treaty." ART. III, id. j
                   opinion of the court (2020)


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: Lighter
Date: 22 Dec 21 - 09:52 AM

"The nation" doesn't figure in Frank Maynard's version.

Since a number of current states were still territories after 1876, it may be that the "nation" refers in a loose way to "the states," especially since "nation" essentially rhymes with "relations."


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Dec 21 - 08:24 PM

And later acts of Congress left no doubt. In 1866, the United States entered yet another treaty with the Creek "nation" (written by the Supreme Court in 2020)


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Dec 21 - 09:30 PM

Act of 1909 and further still, Congress offered the Creek "Nation" a one-time opportunity to file suit in Federal Court Of Claims for any and all legal and equitable claims arising under or growing out of any treaty or agreement between the United States and The Creek Indian "Nation"
                United States V Creek "Nation"
Two years later Francis Henry Maynard published "Live in the "Nation


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: Lighter
Date: 23 Dec 21 - 11:30 AM

As mentioned, Maynard's song does not refer to "the nation."

The line could have appeared any time after 1875. Its intended meaning probably can't be ascertained for sure.

Here's an 1881 example where "the Nation" refers to the United States as a whole:

"There are Democrats in the South who mean to live in the Nation and not in any aggregate of petty provinces any longer." -Cleveland Leader, March 15, 1881.


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Dec 21 - 05:35 AM

Ken Maynard's song does mention "My friends and relation they live in the Nation> 1866, the United States entered yet another treaty with the Creek "nation"


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Dec 21 - 06:41 AM

Charles Goodnight invented the chuck wagon in 1866 I bet he knew when he left Texas where the Indian "NATION" was on his way to Colorado


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: Lighter
Date: 24 Dec 21 - 09:29 AM

The only text for which Maynard claimed authorship (upthread on Jan. 6, 2016) doesn't contain the phrase.


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Subject: RE: Streets of Laredo - 'Live in the Nation'??
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Dec 21 - 04:08 PM

I think Ken Maynard might have have thought it was the Indian Nation and trying to find a author of over 2,000 versions of over the pond ballad's sang by cowboy's around cattle and campfire's and growing as we speak is a daunting task to say the least. All I know is He pocketed the $1000.00 they paid him to croon it!. I see your point no one could know for sure


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