Is there a folk club mafia ?

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Damon
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 05:49 AM

ho ho ho

way to go children...is 192 posts in 3 days a record?

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 05:34 AM

Fair enough...no need to say sorry.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 05:17 AM

No smile. Am cross. Feel no obligation to find it funny - sorry.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 04:55 AM

Good for you for worrying, GUEST, that makes you "good people". But don't feel so bad about it. See, I've just been called an arsehole by you, and I am smiling. Follow Ellenpoly's example.

Moses, REALLY! I blush...sort of.

The fact is, like MGAS I know people with elements of Avril in their makeup. And the positive advice that was given by Treewind/Eliza (McCartney! well, that's one you'll never get to your club, Breezy) and others is actually very useful.

So, less arsing and more smiling, please...

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 04:42 AM

Thanks a bunch arseholes for wasting my time & getting me genuinely worried about the lady.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,Ova Le Hill
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 04:31 AM

Dave Bryant, I'll pay for your dry cleaning. my apologies and

best wishes

Ova

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 04:29 AM

I am SO GLAD this was a wind-up! I have been following Avril's journey through mudcat, and my mouth hung open a few too many times. But at least brucie will sleep easier knowing that this poor lady wasn't seduced by her singing teacher, I will go back to knowing that you guys are good folk, with the kind of bent humour that appealed to me in the first place..(One of your April Fools' fools)..xx..e

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: breezy
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 04:23 AM

And to think the plug was nearly pulled early on.

did anyone thank Tree wind?


who do you mean guru?


Liza is Paul Macartney's daughter and she does what?

She hasnt asked me for a floor spot, she any cop?

Should I give her one if she does?

And I've booked Dave Bryant for the 9th May, I wonder who'll turn up with him?

El Greko , see you friday for Tommy Sands?

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Moses
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 04:21 AM

And we were all looking forward so much to seeing you at Herga. I was about to say not to worry about your pussie. In my experience, so long as it is not left alone too long it will be OK.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: My guru always said
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 04:04 AM

Ah, poor Breezy...

As I happen to know someone almost exactly like the Avril described I wondered for a while. Great thread - entertaining and, as you say, could be useful!!

Thanks AllCatsInvolved

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 03:58 AM

Nah, it was real, Breezy - I will explain later

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: breezy
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 03:56 AM

You mean all this was a wind-up?

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Avril Betts
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 03:55 AM

Perhaps I should spell my name properly - as many of you have guessed it's really:

                                                      April Bêtes


Although as a GUEST pointed out, the French would actually say:


                                                 Poisson d'Avril

Although we would usually say:

                                                   April Fool


I do exist on the Folk Scene though (in both sexes) - or rather various facets of me do - perhaps you don't come across my 40DD bust so often (well I had to keep you fellers interested somehow and give the girls something to bitch about).

Thank you to everyone from Eliza Carthy onwards who gave such excellent advice - if you wonder why you don't get spots or the club organiser looks worried when you walk in the door - then there's a wealth of useful information in this thread, please read it.

Must be off now - my pussie is making demands again !

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 03:48 AM

Whaddayamean, I was propositioned by a SPOOF? Seriously though, it was fun. Even before I was let into the "know". I thought indeed that Eliza's advice was great, I nearly emailed her to give her the gen but then thought "up to Dave".

El Inglese's (Vanessa's) postings and one of Breezy's were mine (you really must change that password, Breezy mate). On the way I got hands slapped for doing so by our diligent moderators (boy, they ARE on the ball!)

For me the best bit was when "Avril" PMed me with a "thank you-come-on" message, before I knew the truth. I kept the faith, thank God!

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 03:45 AM

"Good one Dave" my arse, he's a bloody pervert, "earpiece up her twat" what the hell is going on, its disgusting.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Dipsodeb
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 03:22 AM

Good one Dave and Linda I thoroughly enjoyed it. I am so glad that I knew it was a spoof all along as I definitely wouldn't want to be on the wrong side of your Mafiosso. It does make you wonder though about the reality of some peoples experiences at folk clubs, it happens!!
LOL :o)

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,Billy
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 01:41 AM

Well, I guess it is now April Fools Day and Avril (French for April or even Chaucer's old English, get it?) and all the others are now going to reveal that this was all a big SPOOF!

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,Ova Dunne
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 09:30 PM

oh hi avril

i think perhaps it could be time to branch out into some pub poetry. this is always very much appreciated in the folk scene.

best wishes

Ova Dunne

(Poet Lorikeet)

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,Anne Croucher
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 08:45 PM

I have read this thread with increasing amusement - having always been the one who stayed sober and decanted the rest off my motor cycle or its side car and onto their doorsteps then went round next day to deliver their amps, guitars,jackets, wallets etc., I have to say that I was not in the least surprised at the reports of what went on last night.

No sense in rolling ones eyes to Heaven - someone is obviously either reliving a mis spent youth, or looking to catch up on what has been missed before it is too late.

It is the first day of the Real New Year here - 2.30 in the morning of 1st April - maybe a few new year resolutions should be made - or maybe you are just going to have to live with someone enjoying life a little too fully for some.

I think I shall just take a little look outside to smell the Spring, and then go to bed - still smiling.

Anne

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Essex Girl
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 08:12 PM

Khat got it right when she said that the reason that Avril has trouble getting songs into her brain is because it isn't between her ears, and that she should try sticking an earpiece up her twat and she might be able to learn them that way !

I knew that it wasn't a good idea taking Avril over there !

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 08:05 PM

Let's just say that tonight was somewhat of a disaster, but I suppopse it was partly our fault. Avril had drunk a few glasses of wine when we picked her up, but she seemed OK. She did quite well with her first song although we all had to prompt her a bit. There were a a crowd of men in the corner who were probably more inpressed with her physical assets than her singing and we didn't realise how many drinks they were buying her. The landlord predictably showed interest as well and ended up having a row with the men who were getting very friendly with her. Later on one of the men, an australian, started singing "My one-eyed Trouser Snake" and she said that she'd learnt it from her ex-husband and joined in with him. When it looked as though she was going to undo his trousers, Hilda the landlady went ballistic and threw us all out.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,emily rain
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 07:57 PM

oh fuck. nevermind.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Guy Wolff
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 07:36 PM

PS If i get to London can i play some music with you all . !!! All the best , PPS   I dont realy drink much so your car will be safe with me . Yours , Guy

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Guy Wolff
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 07:29 PM

I hope all this has worked itself out. I thought Eliza wrote a very nice bit of advice and everyone seems to be trying to stretch .\, so maybe all of this has done some good after all . Good luck . I cant beleave i just read all this .

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Avril Betts
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 07:23 PM

I don't feel very well at the moment, I've just been sick. I had quite a lot of trouble logging in. Everthing seemed to be going so well. We picked up Micca and Khat and it didn't take very long to get to the pub which seemes quite nice really. There were a few people playing tunes when we got there and we all joined in, Dave playing his guitar and I started off with my bodran, but they were plaing too fast for me, so I used one of Linda's shaky egg things. After a while Dave and Linda sang a song, and we played some more tunes then I sang Lord of the dance and remembered nearly all of it - dave and somebody else, I think it was Richard, played along with me after we'd found the right key. Some men in the corner liked it a lot and bought me a drink. Micca sang a funny song which every one liked and we played more tunes. A bit later I tried to sing Yesterday, but I got the words abit wrong, but two of the men bought me some more drinks. I can't remember much after that, I know that Mike the landlord bought me a drink as well, but I don't remember much else except that the landlady who was a little miserable lady started shouting at me an telling me to go home. We all had to go then and I was sick in Dave's car when we went through the tunnel. I don't think I did anything wrong, but Micca and Dave weren't very pleased with me and Linda called me stupid. I hope I haven't spoiled things.

Subject: sean gagnier info?
From:
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 07:11 PM

mr. murdoch:

was looking around the web for information on sean gagnier and came across yr posts here. alwasy dug the hell of "33 revolutions" and am very pleased to see you've still got yr hand in it (as it were). i was curious, however, if you might be able to direct me to a source for any info on mr. gagnier. i'm currently working on a project involving he es-disk record label, for whom sean recorded a mostly-unreleased lp in '68 or so. any tips on where i might turn would be most appreciated.
thanks,
byron coley

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Hawker
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 06:07 PM

Bonjour Avril its 12.05 UK 1-4-2004 and time to come clean
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha!
Good One
Cheers, Lucy

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Peace
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 05:53 PM

El Greko:

I was not making the assumption that such was the case with Avril. It was a thing I did lots of years ago, and I tended to my side of the issue. It was a statement about me, not her. However. the mirror is not a bad place to stsrt. If the answer is not in the mirror, then maybe there is a mafia and she should seek out other venues or clubs.

Bruce Murdoch

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,emily rain
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 05:47 PM

avril, i see that you're still reading this thread, which tells me that you are a brave soul indeed. i don't know you personally, but the many venemous posts above make me never want to meet one of your critics. hang in there.

as a member in good standing of my local folk mafia, i'd like to point out that FMs also have a lot of self-examination to do. my ideal clique would be supportive, kind, and fair to everyone, regardless of taste or talent. i know that we do our best here on babinbridge... but i wonder how often we succeed?

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 04:58 PM

Agree, Brucie.
From a recent conversation with Mike Nicholson: "The best performers and songwriters are essentially good people". Nastiness, arrogance, selfishness etc can do nothing for your output, only harm it.

I also believe however that very few people are beyond redemption. Most have something good inside them, and the bad elements are mostly parts of some defense mechanism.

Perhaps that's another way of saying I'm a softie, but I don't care.

So I will not condemn Avril. If she was 18 years old, or even 30, and putting herself about because she needs a soulmate, nobody would bat an eyelid. Just because she's North side of 50 (60?) that changes nothing, in my eyes.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Peace
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 04:25 PM

Avril Betts:

In response to your initial question: There was a club that would not hire me or let me participate in open-stage nights, etc. I too felt at the time that there was a 'closed circle' or some sort of 'folk club mafia.' Eventually it struck me: I had behaved like an asshole and was subsequently treated as such. Always check the mirror first. I learned a very valuable lesson from that experience: BE NICE!

Bruce Murdoch

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: breezy
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 03:17 PM

Good luck Avril, hope you had your pussies well cared for tonight.

How was David towards you?

Sorry I couldnt come tonight but who knows maybe in the fullness of time I will find out for myself how poor a performer you really are and if you are making a complete idiot of yourself and if dave is really as bad as some people make him out to be.

But then theres always karioci with that spelling where they dont really know much about singing cos they are always usually enibriated.

Perhaps you ought to be just audience for a while , -- like a lifetime.

I dont think Treewind and Macartney can help you, you sound as if you are beyond the pale.pail.?
All the best, hope I havent offended you, but dont come near here, I think the Greek regrets his offers, or he's lost his marbles.

I'm off for fish and chips with lashings of vinegar.

And that Australian ref who let that forward pass go unpenalised which lead to a try against Wales was a wombat.

I'll sort out that Dave Bryant on Sunday 9th May when he comes to St Albans and peforms at the Spotlight club at the Britsh Legion -every sunday this week Keith Snodon

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: InOBU
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 12:37 PM

Hi Avril:
All the nonsence aside, there is a folk mafia, and I know I will get flamed about it, because they are a bunch of well meaning nice folks, who always tend to think of the same people when booking shows. There are a few extreme execptions... here in New York, I have to say, Joel Landy has been good enough to put me on the teli a fair number of times, but it has little to do with audience appreciation. I have brought houses down at my gigs, not bragging, but check the reviews for my band written by folks who actualy heard us. But, the small circle of friends is at work, and frankly, for me, I work too hard busking and flogging my music, as well as working for social change in the US (anti war - pro nomadic rights - anti racialist... etc...) to hang out with the "in crowd" so I just am not on their minds... though sometimes it seems more than that... but to give them the benifit of the doupt. I will go a little farther on the subject of my being overlooked, my complete lack of Pinewoods bookings looks to me like a blacklist.
Good luck and keep singing to the audiences not the bookers.
Larry Otway

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 11:44 AM

Freda I think I know who's behind Gloria and Ova - I think their postings were more rude to me than Avril - as I've said I've got a thick skin - and Avril is fairly well-cushioned.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 11:24 AM

Richard Bridge is coming too - have you spoken to Liz and Manitas ?

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 11:20 AM

I'm game.

(just so long as no-one has a shotgun)

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Micca
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 11:16 AM

Dave, we are up for this, thanks for the offer of a lift as khatt is not that mobile yet, remember the LandLady of that pub is very volatile tho' and prone to explode without warning, remember the incident with the "Guinness shampoo"? and she had only asked the Landlord for a light!!! see ya later

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: freda underhill
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 11:06 AM

personally, I'm shocked at these poissonous comments. Gloria and Ova, your comments, while well meaning, are insensitive to say the least.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,fishface
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 11:04 AM

Oh! Then perhaps the mafia have got it in for you too!

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Avril Betts
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 10:57 AM

Dave - yes I'd love to come with you and Linda as long as she and Khat don't mind. I've PMed you the address and Phone Number.

Fishface - at most of the clubs and sessions that I go to, two songs is all anyone expects - anyway I don't think I could manage more than two without reading the words. I know what Dave means about behaving - I got very drunk at a session recently and rather disgraced myself.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 10:45 AM

Fishface - In most sessions, I don't often get more than two songs - especially when it's a music session as well. In a recent club we visited Linda and I were offered 2 songs each if we sang separately but only two songs to gether - they wouldn't let us sing one song each and one together.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,fishface
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 09:58 AM

Gosh - that's very gracious of them. Be a good girl and you can sing a couple of songs. Tcha! If that were me I think I'd say sod 'em - in fact I'm getting heartily sick of the sound of some of that little pack. Fascinating thread though - in a horrible sort of a way.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 09:47 AM

Avril

The session is on for tonight there should be quite a few of us going.
Linda and I could pick you up at about 7.45 if you want to go - please PM us your phone number if you want to go - I think I can remember where you live. I think we'll be giving Micca and Khat a lift too. Khat needs the front seat at the moment so Linda can sit between you and Micca in the back.

The Pub's between Stratford and Leytonstone and can sometimes be a bit rough, but the locals seem to like a bit of entertainment. Be careful what you wear - the landlady was quite funny to Linda when she was wearing a low-cut top once - she thinks all women are after her husband - it's actually the other way round - he's ex-navy and "handy" as sailors are always supposed to be.

Manitas and Liz might make it and we're hoping that Richard Bridge will try and get down from Grain. I think that Breezy and El Greko are busy tonight, but they're welcome to try and make it if they can - I think they know the venue - if not they can PM me.

You've got to behave yourself - stay sober and none of that nonsense we got at "The Chequers" - then you can sing a couple of songs.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,KB
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 09:14 AM

And memorising lyrics gets easier and easier the more you do it.
Alice is right - find a good singing teacher. That will give you a much more impartial judgement than you are likely to find here.

Kris

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Alice
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 09:08 AM

Avril. Tape record your practicing at home, analyze how you sound, like going out of tune, etc. Really, a voice teacher is what you should find, if you naturally don't have good tone or control, you REALLY need someone else to guide you in what to do to get it. Listen, listen, listen, to your own voice on tape in private, and correct what you can.
Memorizing lyrics is very important.

Alice in Montana, USA

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,Concerned of Huddersfield
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 09:01 AM

Rattlesnakes are harmless provided you don't approach them and try to make their acquaintance

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 08:49 AM

"I've never had roots in folk music - I don't believe in mixing business and pleasure" Bod Dylan.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Essex Girl
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 08:40 AM

What's all this about Dave Bryant? I know he goes on a bit but he's quite harmless really. I thought this thread was supposed to be offering Avril advice,(although she doesn't seem to be taking it) not slagging other mudcatters off!!!

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: GUEST,Dave Webster
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 08:20 AM

I'm not sure if The Woodman's still Irish. Probly is, but better for singers, so I heard - more relaxed and friendly was the message I got.

Subject: RE: Is there a folk club mafia ?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 08:15 AM

Jim, it was Bob himself. So I am told.