BS: What do you like about Kerry?

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Ebbie
Date: 16 May 04 - 02:53 AM

There is no way that Kerry can say/do the right things in everyone's opinion at this stage of the game; he's damned whether he does or doesn't. Right now he needs as much support from any side that he can garner and he has to walk a knife's edge to do it.

Go to his website (www.johnkerry.com) and soak up some of his thinking and check out some of the people he has on board.

As for endorsements, here is one:

"The International Brotherhood of Police Officers (IBPO) endorsed John Kerry on Friday. The union endorsed George Bush in 2000. But IBPO President David Holway said that "after three and a half years of disappointing leadership under George Bush, we need to change course in November and elect a President with a real record of supporting police officers and a lifetime of standing with law enforcement."

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Ebbie
Date: 17 May 04 - 11:20 PM

(http://www.johnkerry.com/pressroom/speeches/spc_2003_0314.html)

"In a speech to the California Democratic State Convention, he referred to Robert Kennedy's famous quotation: "Some men dream things that are and ask why. I dream things that never were and ask why not?" Then Kerry said:


"That is the question at the heart of our campaign. That is our cause.
Why not have an economy where equal opportunity is a fact? Where people who work hard and do the right thing can not only make ends meet but can actually reach higher and hope for more?

"Why not give every working American access to high-quality, affordable health care?

"Why not have public schools where children set out on a lifetime of learning and possibility? Where "no child left behind" is a promise kept, not broken and forgotten.

"Why not preserve our environment so our great grandchildren can breathe clean air, drink clean water, and know that they too live in a land that can be called "America the beautiful."

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: GUEST,Frank
Date: 18 May 04 - 03:55 PM

I agree with Art on his appraisal of John Kerry.

He has proven courage.

I don't agree with Kerry on everything but I've been to a couple of rallies for him and find him consistent in what he believes.

I believe he has integrity which is totally lacking in the Bushes.

He listens and responds. He does not give out simplistic soundbite type answers.

I believe he can get us out of the royal mess that Bush has created in Iraq. Bush has lost the war.

What they will be handing over to the Iraqi people in the way of a government will be only those who answer to Bush's henchmen.
I believe that Bush doesn't care a fig about the Iraqi people.
Bush cares about his business cronies. His Adminstration has disgraced the name of America in the world.

Kerry can restore it. He will reach out to the former allies that Bush has alienated.

Since he knows much more about the act of war than Bush, he is much more qualified as a commander -in-chief.

Frank

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: GUEST,Teribus
Date: 19 May 04 - 10:39 AM

GUEST,Frank 18 May 04 - 03:55 PM on John Kerry:

"He does not give out simplistic soundbite type answers."

Frank did you read the post just before yours for Ebbie? Each and every thing quoted forms a simplistic soundbyte type answer. Where's the substance? Where are the policies? Where does he outline the means by which all those laudable statements can be translated into reality? To date there is nothing to be seen that could be scrutinised, questioned or argued through.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 May 04 - 12:37 PM

Guest, Teribus, it was I who cut and pasted the summary of Kerry's position. At his website you will find much more information and in depth.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 May 04 - 02:41 PM

Those who say that there is little difference between Bush and Kerry are either not sufficiently alert or are letting a habit of cynicism blind them to reality. There are plenty of obvious differences to be seen by anyone who cares to exert the mental effort to stop sulking and take a good, long look.

This is going to be one dirty campaign, full of lies, twisted half-truths, and attempts to take things out of context and use them to try to make you think Kerry is actually the way the Bush boosters want you to think he is. This is one of the reasons why it is important to be an informed electorate, know a few facts, and not just swallow what the TV set barfs out at you.

Commercials for Bush (actually negative ads against Kerry) are devoted to misinformation such as—to mention only two of the many things being hawked currently—claiming that Kerry favors a 50¢ increase in gasoline tax and that he voted against body armor for troops in Iraq.

Facts (not opinions, Doug, facts):   a 50¢ gasoline tax was something that was proposed ten years ago in an attempt to get people to drive less. The person who proposed it was Harvard economist Gregory Mankiw, who is now the chairman of Bush's Council of Economic Advisers. Kerry neither voted for it, nor did he sponsor legislation favoring it. It is an outright lie. The same thing about weapons systems and body armor. Kerry did not vote against body armor for troops in Iraq. When he voted against the $87 billion to continue Bush's War, he knew that the money would be needed if the war wasn't going to become an even bigger cock-up than it already was, and he also knew that Congress would pass it by a wide margin even without his support, so he voted against it as a protest against the way the war was being handled. Incidentally, as far as the ceramic-based type of body armor (which made up one-third of one percent of the bill) is concerned, the troops had initially been sent to the Iraqi war without it.

These are only two of the many lies and twistings of the truth that the Bush boosters are trying to lay on Kerry, including the so-called "flip-flops." And it's interesting to note that when people talk about Kerry's "flip-flops," if you pin them down and ask them exactly which "flip-flops" they're talking about, they either babble incoherently, unable to think of anything specific, or quote one of the Bush-booster commercials.

When one takes a position, and then, in the light of new evidence, changes one's mind, this is the mark of an intelligent, thoughtful person. If that's "flip-flopping," then this country and the whole world would be a helluva lot better off right now if Bush had flip-flopped a bit before launching this country into "The Big Muddy" once again. Bush is a shining example of someone who ignores evidence, goes off half-cocked, and is afraid to change his mind for fear of looking indecisive, even when the disastrous consequences of his intended actions are obvious to everyone else. [This is the kind of "leadership" that the late historian Barbara Tuchman wrote about in her book The March of Folly.] In the meantime, of course, Bush is silly-putty in the hands of Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, et al.

By the way:

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not to their own facts.
                                                   —Sen, Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Kim C
Date: 19 May 04 - 02:46 PM

What do I like about Kerry?

Not one damn thing. I saw him on Meet the Press a few weeks ago and he didn't impress me at all. He seems to think he has a lot of Great New Ideas, when in fact, Presidents before him have said those same things.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Amos
Date: 19 May 04 - 02:50 PM

In a speech to the California Democratic State Convention, he referred to Robert Kennedy's famous quotation: "Some men dream things that are and ask why. I dream things that never were and ask why not?"

I believe that was John Fitzgerald Kennedy's quote, not Robert's.

A

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: dianavan
Date: 20 May 04 - 12:17 AM

Kerry may not be "our hero" but at least he has the courage to challenge Bush and his mob. He has a pretty good chance of winning if more people (like me) would flip flop from wanting significant change to voting to bury Bush.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: emjay
Date: 20 May 04 - 12:59 AM

Kerry can not be all things to all people, nor does he pretend that he is. Bush tells us one thing while he does another to convince us that he is everyman's best friend. Bush took this country into a war telling us it was all about terrorism, then ignored the country from which the terrorists came to attack someone against whom he had a personal vendetta. He lied knowingly about conditions in Iraq to convince Americans that we needed to go after Saddam Hussein. Why hasn't he been impeached for that?
Kerry has had the courage to change his mind as he learns more, as conditions change, or as times change. Bush can't remember ever making a mistake.
We all owe it to our country to learn more, to vote on real information, not bits we have heard in 15 to 30 econd commercials repeated ad infinitum. For a democracy to succeed its citizens must be informed, they must take the time to educate themselves, an ongoing process.
The Bush power brokers stole the last election in myriad ways, all calculated to give the election to Dubya. That is a statement, it is not whining. Use that term correctly. Whining refers to the tone in which a complaint is uttered, not the complaint itself. You will frequently hear our president whine when he speaks, he does it almost any time he isn't smirking.
What do I like about Kerry? His intelligence. His willingness to listen to reason and to learn. His ability to recognize other needs, other points of view, and changing situations. His ability to learn from experience, his own and others.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: el ted
Date: 20 May 04 - 11:11 AM

Who?

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: GUEST,Larry K
Date: 20 May 04 - 11:22 AM

First we need to define flip flop.   There is a HUGE difference between politicians that have core values (on any issue) and than by information/experience/maturity change their mind and take the opposite position and those who base their decisons on polls and by political correctness as to which position would by them the most votes at that time.

You can agree or disagree with Bush.   There is no question that he has a core value on religion, and terrorism.   You can agree with that or disagree with that but you know exactly where he stands.

The question is about Kerry.    What are John Kerry's core values.   Did he change his positions because he has core values about them or for political gain.    I say it is for political gain.   Kerry is a liberal.   He should be proud of that.    Instead he claims that he is running as a centerist.    How can you claim to have core values when you can't even run on who you are.

Lets look at Kerry on Iraq.    He voted against the first gulf war even though Iraq had invaded Kuwait and there were known rape and torture rooms.   Afterwards he claimed to have supported the war even though he voted against it.    In the second Gulf war he voted for the war even though he later claimed there were no proven WMD's.   Afterwards he stated that he opposed the war even though he voted for it.    What are Kerry's core values on Iraq.    I say he has none.   All of his positions are politically driven.

Even though he stated on the Senate floor that you shouldn't judge a man by how he served in viet nam (he was defending Clinton against Bob Dole) he now brings up his Viet Nam Service in every speech and article while discreting Bush for his national guard service.   A complete contradiction to what he said on public record.

That is why he is labeled a flipflopper.   And that is why the label has stuck.   Because it is true.   The vast majority of you reading this have values closer to Nader but will hold your nose and vote for Kerry.    Just think of how good it feels when you sell yourself out.

What do I like about Kerry.   He has a nice haircut.   At least he is not Dean.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: GUEST
Date: 20 May 04 - 11:38 AM

El Ted for president

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: GUEST
Date: 20 May 04 - 11:39 AM

No no El Greko for president

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: GUEST
Date: 20 May 04 - 11:40 AM

No no no jOhn from ull for pwesidunt

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Ebbie
Date: 20 May 04 - 01:04 PM

http://www.ariannaonline.com/columns/column.php?id=700

"As Bobby Kennedy often said, "Some men see things as they are and ask, 'Why?' I dream of things that never were and ask, 'Why not?'"


Evidently, it has been said variously by a number of people, notably by G.B. Shaw.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Kim C
Date: 21 May 04 - 12:37 PM

"Bush tells us one thing while he does another to convince us that he is everyman's best friend."

That's called Politics. They ALL do it. And remember, too, that while the President holds the highest office in the Nation, he doesn't wield ALL the power. The President may have a great idea, or even a bad idea, that gets shot down by the House & Senate; but ultimately, it's the President who gets the rap for everything. People said the same thing about Bill Clinton too.

I'm not defending anyone, just pointing out that what may seem like two-facedness sometimes may just be the system at work. Be glad it works, even though it doesn't always work to everyone's satisfaction.

Subject: RE: BS: What do you like about Kerry?
From: Frankham
Date: 21 May 04 - 04:50 PM

Teribus, you should really attend a Kerry rally. It's the news media that gives out the soundbites. Kerry makes a lot of sense. Do you think American news media will cover it accurately? If so, dream on.

HIs policy is simple. Bush screwed up in Iraq. The only way out is to replace American troops with UN and NATO troops. Build up American credibility in the world. If you pull out troops , there would be more chaos than there is now. Bush made America step in it and it's up to Kerry to scrape the boots. The only conceivable exit strategy is to pull in the UN, not through one Bush controlled figurehead but by enlisting the aid of all the countries that Bush has alienated.

Here's what I think. Kerry is playing it cool. He's not announcing
a VP yet. He has a plan but is careful not to alienate those who
are undecided. The Left is pissed at him because he refuses to go on the offensive. I think that's to his credit.

He doesn't want to become a Nader.

I don't agree with his support for Sharon. But, when he is in office,
there will be a radical change from the Bush agenda. He will actively seek a second Camp David Accord because he has had diplomatic experience unlike the current Occupier.

Right now, he is looking to get votes. That's the big flaw in our system. Those who know how to get elected don't know how to run the country. America has become a television nation. The screen has hypnotized and replaced gray matter. It's the get-elected medium.

Kerry is a politician. But if you get a chance to really hear him, I think your opinion of him might change. Unfortunately because of the news blackout on substantial information, don't rely on your TV to do the job.

Frank