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Lyr Req: The Creel (Paul Brady)

DigiTrad:
KEACH ON THE CREEL
PRETTY PEG
THE LITTLE SCOTCH GIRL
THE RIDE IN THE CREEL (2)


Related threads:
what do the words mean?Child Ballad 281(The Creel) (31)
Lyr Req: Pretty Peg (from The Bothy Band) (53)
Lyr Req: packie manus byrne's the creel #281 (3)
DT Correction: Pretty Peg (from The Bothy Band) (8)
Lyr Req: Pretty Peg (from Howling Gael) (12)


Phil Hession 24 May 05 - 03:56 PM
GUEST,Allen 24 May 05 - 06:25 PM
Peace 24 May 05 - 11:22 PM
Peace 24 May 05 - 11:23 PM
Malcolm Douglas 24 May 05 - 11:37 PM
Peace 25 May 05 - 12:04 AM
Malcolm Douglas 25 May 05 - 12:50 AM
GUEST,Allen 25 May 05 - 12:56 AM
Malcolm Douglas 25 May 05 - 01:29 AM
GUEST,Allen 25 May 05 - 01:48 AM
Phil Hession 25 May 05 - 11:55 AM
Matthew Edwards 25 May 05 - 12:08 PM
Phil Hession 25 May 05 - 12:17 PM
Matthew Edwards 25 May 05 - 12:39 PM
GUEST,Allen 25 May 05 - 01:06 PM
GUEST,Allen 25 May 05 - 01:31 PM
Stewie 25 May 05 - 09:18 PM
GUEST,Allen 26 May 05 - 01:59 AM
GUEST,Henry 26 May 05 - 08:35 AM
Dave Ruch 02 Jun 06 - 03:45 PM
Declan 03 Jun 06 - 05:03 AM
Dave Ruch 03 Jun 06 - 08:40 AM
GUEST,paul 18 Nov 08 - 02:57 PM
Declan 18 Nov 08 - 05:21 PM
GUEST 02 Sep 09 - 10:12 AM
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Subject: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Phil Hession
Date: 24 May 05 - 03:56 PM

I've been searching for the lyrics for Paul Bradys version of The Creel to be found on his album Welcome here Kind Stranger with no success. I've had a go at listening to the song and writing down what i think are the lyrics but I'm not positive I've got them right, if anyone has the correct lyrics I'd be grateful if you could fire them my way.

Ta

Phil


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 24 May 05 - 06:25 PM

Havent heard the song, but imagine it's a version of the Keach (or Ride) in the Creel, so do a search here.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Peace
Date: 24 May 05 - 11:22 PM

http://ingeb.org/songs/afairyou.html


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Peace
Date: 24 May 05 - 11:23 PM

I went to the DT with Keach in the Creel--but it shows a different song.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 24 May 05 - 11:37 PM

A very popular song in its time; there are many versions. The Ingeb.org text is Scottish. Unfortunately the source is not acknowledged, though it shouldn't be particularly hard to identify. Brady is more likely to have recorded an Irish or American form. There are three examples in the DT, I think, but only one seems to be from a traditional source. Most of the numerous Forum threads concentrate on the version recorded by the Bothy Band: Triona's tendency to mumble has caused all sorts of difficulties for people who wanted to know exactly what she was singing.

Phil: did Brady happen to mention in his sleeve notes where he got the song? That's the sort of thing people need to know if they're to help.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Peace
Date: 25 May 05 - 12:04 AM

Malcolm,

There is a sound sample on this link. Maybe from that you can determine which song is in question.

http://www.paulbrady.com/discog/liberty.asp

I don't get sound bites here, but I also don't know enough to have the bit mean anything even if I did. I think you would, though.

BM


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 25 May 05 - 12:50 AM

The sound sample didn't seem to be accessible any longer, but I did find somebody's transcription of the Brady arrangement, as The Ride in the Creel, at  http://www.ismargad.com/Creel.html

Not having heard the recording (so far as I remember), I couldn't say how accurate it might be; it looks reasonable enough. From the wording, I'd guess it to be an Ulster form of the song, but could easily be wrong. Brady seems just to have described it as "trad arr", for which laziness I've always felt professional performers ought to be strangled.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 25 May 05 - 12:56 AM

Malcolm, the Ingeb text appears in MacColl's "Folk Songs and Ballads of Sctoland". He credits it to Jimmie MacBeath of Elgin.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 25 May 05 - 01:29 AM

Thanks. Is it definitely the same? I have a recording of Jimmie McBeath (his name gets spelled both ways; don't know why) singing it to very different words, though that distinctive final verse is the same. I wonder if Ewan might have made a few wee modifications on the side?

Perhaps Brady got the song from Packie Byrne? Packie's is the only example of the song listed in Roud at the moment that has that first line.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 25 May 05 - 01:48 AM

Well I haven't heard MacBeath, but the comment on that page is identical and so are the words to those in Ewan's book.
I think I read somewhere that one of Paul Brady's influences was Packie Byrne, but don't quote me on that.


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE CREEL (Paul Brady)
From: Phil Hession
Date: 25 May 05 - 11:55 AM

Malcom: I don't have the original but rather a copy of Welcome Here Kind Stranger so unfortunately I'm not in possession of the sleeve notes. However I do have the Liberty Tapes (Paul Brady Live) again another copy, in which Andy Irvine describes what is happening in the song and tells the audience that Paul sings the Donegal version of The Creel. Paul goes on to tell the audience that he composed a piece of music which the band plays immediately after The Creel for which he had no title, he explains that Donal Lunny provided the title Out the Door and Over the Wall.

Unfortunately thats all the info I have on Bradys version.

Anyway here's what I came up with from listening to the song.
It's the last verse that I'm a bit hazy about particularly the line
"And every old woman that refuse or dabble".

The Creel/Out the Door and Over the Wall

As I roved out on a moonlit night
excitement for to find
I met on the way with a pretty little girl
and I asked her to be mine
With me

Chorus: Too ray a fother riddle da
       Me too ray a ray fother riddle da tonight oh

How can I get to your fathers house
How can I get to your bed
Oh me father locks the door at night
and the keys lie under his head
With me

Chorus

If you get a ladder thirty foot
Thirty foot and three
And place it up to the chimney top
Come down in a creel to me
With your

Chorus

So I got me a ladder thirty foot
Thirty foot and three
And I placed it up to the chimney top
And down in a creel came me
With me

Chorus

But the old one she being still awake
Heard something that was said
I'll lay me life says the silly old wife
There's a man in your daughters bed.
With me

Chorus

And the old man he got out of bed
For to see if it was true
But she's pushed me down with her lily white arms
And under the cover let loo
With me

Chorus

Where are you going father dear
Where are you going so late
You've disturbed me at me evening prayers
And oh but they were sweet
With me

Chorus

For the devil take you silly old wife
An ill death may you die
For your daughters lying with a book in her arms
And she's praying for you and I
With me

Chorus

But the old one she being still awake
When something else was said
You can say what you like you silly old fool
There's a man in your daughters bed
With me

Chorus

No rest or peace could the old one get
Til she got up to see
But her foot gave a shot to the chamber pot
And into the creel fell she
With me

Chorus

Well its Rise and help me husband dear
Rise and help me now
For the one that you have wished me to
I fear he has me now
With me

Chorus

For the hold he's got I hope he keeps
And never lets it go
For between yourself and your daughter dear
Its time for the cock to crow
With me

Chorus

Well I rocked her up and I rocked her down
And I gave her a great old fall
Til every rail in the old womans sides
Played knick knack against the wall
With me

Chorus

Oh the blue the bonny blue
And may the blue do well
And every old woman that refuse or dabble
Go rock in the creel to hell
With me

Chorus


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 25 May 05 - 12:08 PM

In his notes to the original 1978 Mulligan LP, Paul Brady fully ackowledged Packie Byrne as his main source, besides giving the full lyrics of his own version.
Paul Brady wrote:
"This is another version of 'The Keach in the Creel' (Child 281). The tune and most of the words come from Packie Manus Byrne, a native of Corkermore, Killybegs, Co. Donegal, now living in England. I have fleshed out his basic story by adding verses from other versions in the Child Collection where I saw fit and in some cases by adding a line or two of my own. Packie learnt his version some forty years ago from a farm labourer in Corkermore who probably brought it back from Scotland where the song originates."


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: Phil Hession
Date: 25 May 05 - 12:17 PM

Thanks for the info Matthew. Do you know if the lyrics I have written above are accurate? What does Brady mean when he talks of the "Child Collection"?


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE CREEL (Paul Brady)
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 25 May 05 - 12:39 PM

Here is the version as printed in the notes to the 1978 album:

The Creel

As I roved out on a moonlit night,
Excitement for to find,
I met on the way with a pretty little girl,
And I asked her to be mine, with me
Tooria folderiddle da
Me tooria right folderiddle - antin-ido.

How can I get to your father's house
How can I get to your bed?
Oh, my father locks the door at night
And the keys lie under his head, with me...

If you get a ladder, thirty foot,
Thirty foot and three,
And place it up to the chimney top
Come down in a creel to me, with your...

So I got me a ladder thirty foot
Thirty foot and three,
And I placed it up to the chimney top
And down in a creel came me, with me...

But the ould one she bein' still awake,
Heard something that was said,
'I'll lay me life' said the silly ould wife,
'There's a man in me daughters bed', with me...

The ould man he got out of bed
For to see if it was true,
But she's pushed me down with her lilly-white arms
In under the coverlet blue, with me...

'Where are you going father dear,
Where are you going so late?
You've disturbed me at me evening prayers
And, oh, but they were sweet', with me...

'Well the devil take you, you silly ould wife
And an ill death may you die
For your daughter's lyin' with the Book in her arms
And she's praying for you and I', with me...

But the ould one, she being still awake
When something else was said
'You can say what you like, you silly ould fool,
There's a man in your daughter's bed', with me...

No rest nor peace could the ould one get
'till she got up to see,
But her foot gave a shot to the chamber pot
And into the creel fell she, with me...

'Rise and help me, husband dear,
Rise and help me now,
For the one that you have wished me to
I fear he has me now!' with me...

'Well the hoult he's got, I hope he keeps
And never lets it go,
For between yourself and your daughter dear
Its time for the cock to crow', with me...

Well I rocked her up and I rocked her down
And I gave her a great downfall,
Till every rib in the ould woman's side
Played 'Nick-nack' against the wall, with me...

And it's Oh, the Blue, the bonny blue,
And may the blue do well,
And every ould woman 'd refuse her daughter
Be rocked in the creel to hell, with me...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 25 May 05 - 01:06 PM

Proffessor Francis J. Child published a monumental work called "The English and Scottish Popular Ballads".
It contains such songs as the Cruel Sister, the Elfin Knight, Lord Randal, Lady Isabel and the Elf-Knight, Twa Corbies, Edward, Tam Lin, Sir Patrick Spens, Dives and Lazarus, Willie O Winsbury, a slew of Robin Hood ballads, Border Ballads, and much more.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 25 May 05 - 01:31 PM

Oh, look. Eliza Carthy says she got it from Packie via Brady:
http://www.informatik.uni-hamburg.de/~zierke/martin.carthy/songs/therideinthecreel.html


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Subject: Lyr Add: A SHAKE IN THE BASKET (Andrew Calhoun)
From: Stewie
Date: 25 May 05 - 09:18 PM

There is also a recent recording of this tale by Andrew Calhoun on his 'Telfer's Cows: Folk Ballads from Scotland' album under the title 'A Shake in the Basket'. Although he uses the tune printed in Child Vol V, the lyrics are not close to any of the 4 texts in Child. It is probably a Calhoun reworking - good though! In his sleeve note to the album, he indicates his approach to the ballads:


I've cobbled these out of Scots dialect, sometimes rewriting to clarify the action, trying to keep a sense of antique syntax while making certain that all of the words - and hence the tales - are easily apprehended. They were always meant to be.



A SHAKE IN THE BASKET

A fair young maid went up the street
Some sweetmeats for to buy;
And a young clerk fell in love with her
And followed her on the sly

"O, where live ye, my bonnie lass?
I pray ye tell to me;
And though the night were never so dark
I'd come and visit thee!"

"My father locks the door at night
And my mother keeps the key
And though the night were ever so dark
You couldn't get in to me."

This clerk he had a true brother,
And a good square-wright was he;
And he has made a long ladder
With thirty steps and three.

He made a basket and a hook
With a long rope and a pin;
He's away to the chimney top
To lower the young clerk in.

The old wife, she lay wide awake
Though late late was the hour
"I'll lay my life, said the silly old wife,
There's a man in our daughter's bower!"

The old man he went down the stairs
To see if it were true;
She took the young clerk in her arms
In under the coverlet blue.

"O, what are you doing my daughter dear?
O, what are you doing my doo?"
"I'm prayin' on the bible here
For my dear old mother and you."

"O wife, O wife, you silly old wife,
Cursed may you be!
She's got the bible in her arms
And she's praying for you and me."

The old wife lying wide awake
heard something that was said
"I'll lay my life," said the silly old wife
"There's a man in our daughter's bed"

"Get up, get up, my good old man
And see if it be true"
"Get up yourself, you silly old woman
And may the devil take you"

The old wife she went down the stairs
To see if it be true
But she slipped on the rope and reeled about
And into the basket she flew

The man that was at the chimney-top
Finding the basket full
He wrapped the rope his shoulder round
And swiftly he did pull

"Get up, get up, my good old man
O help me, husband do
For you wished me to the devil
And I fear he's got me now"

"Oh if the foul fiend's got you now
I hope he'll hold you fast
For between you and your pious daughter
I haven't had a wink of rest"

The man at the top he gave a cry
Then he let the basket fall
While every rib in the old wife's side
Went nick-nack on the wall

Here's to all a fond farewell
And a health to the lovers true
And may every old wife that wakes in the night
Get a shake in the basket too

--Stewie.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: GUEST,Allen
Date: 26 May 05 - 01:59 AM

These are the best lines from any of the texts:

O whit are ye daein', my ain dochter,
Whit are daein', my doo?"
"I'm prayin' on the muckle buik
For my silly auld mammie and you."
   
"Pray on, pray on, my ain dochter,
And see that you do it richt;
For if ever a woman has tint her reason,
Your mither has done this nicht."


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lyrics for Paul Bradys The Creel
From: GUEST,Henry
Date: 26 May 05 - 08:35 AM

Phil Hession wrote re The Liberty Tapes; Paul goes on to tell the audience that he composed a piece of music which the band plays immediately after The Creel for which he had no title, he explains that Donal Lunny provided the title Out the Door and Over the Wall.

That might have been what he was expecting. However, the piece that followed was one of Andy Irvine's Balkan tunes that Paul said he had never heard before!

The Liberty Tapes captured a high point of Irish music. It's one of the essential albums.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Creel (Paul Brady)
From: Dave Ruch
Date: 02 Jun 06 - 03:45 PM

Brady's singing on The Liberty Tapes recording (live in Philadelphia USA 1978) is absolutely superb. I've just been playing it over and over again in my car over the past month or so, and hence became interested in learning his version of The Creel. His version of Paddy's Green Shamrock Shore from this CD is great too.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Creel (Paul Brady)
From: Declan
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 05:03 AM

The Liberty tapes are so called because they were recorded at a concert in Liberty Hall, Dublin, Ireland in 1978. The concert was part of the Dublin Folk Festival in July of that year.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Creel (Paul Brady)
From: Dave Ruch
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 08:40 AM

Right you are, Declan. Not sure where I got Philadelphia USA from...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Creel (Paul Brady)
From: GUEST,paul
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 02:57 PM

"That might have been what he was expecting. However, the piece that followed was one of Andy Irvine's Balkan tunes that Paul said he had never heard before! " by Henry

This is wrong. The tune which follows the creel is indeed a Paul Brady one, he explains this before they play it. What he says after it is 'we've never done that one before, anything could have happend'


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Creel (Paul Brady)
From: Declan
Date: 18 Nov 08 - 05:21 PM

The piece that follows the Creel is a Paul Brady composition which also appears on the album "Welcome Here Kind Stranger" which if I recall correctly was launched on the nigth of the Liberty Hall Concert (which I attended).

in the notes for the WHKS album Brady wrote:

"The piece began almost as an excercise in compound time, but by the beginning of the second part it took on a life of its own and became a tune. It's no accident that it sounds vaguely Balkan as I used what I took to be harmonies, time signatures and chordal changes frequently employed in the music of the region. Beyond that it is entirely a work of the imagination and its musical structure does not conform to any existing one that I am aware of. THe tune breaks down into three distinct parts, each repeated once" He then goes on to give the time signatures of each bar of thwe tune which I won't bore you with and to say that the tune is played three times in all.

Donal's title is based on his imagined reaction of the man in the song having been found by the mother in bed with her daughter.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Creel (Paul Brady)
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Sep 09 - 10:12 AM

I love this song and am trying to play it simply on guitar. it sounds as if it is in b flat and the second chord is e flat but i can't quite figure out the rest. any ideas?


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