Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafemuddy

Post to this Thread - Sort Descending - Printer Friendly - Home


pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song

DigiTrad:
FRIENDLY FAC AND GREEN BERET
TCHEPONE


Related threads:
Lyr Req: Herky Cannonball (Vietnam War Song) (12)
ADD: The Boonie Rat Song (Viet Nam War)-chords? (22)
Songs about Vietnam War (135)
help with song title-GI saved by ghost in Vietnam (10)
Lyr Req: Song about Vietnam Unknown Soldier (11)
Vietnam era protest songs (68)
Lyr Req: A Letter from Viet Nam (Hank Snow) (12)
Lyr Req/Add: CIA Dope Calypso (Alan Ginsberg) (13)
What are the best Vietnam era songs? (80)
Lyr Req: Soldier at Vietnam Memorial is a ghost (20)
happy? - Oct 16 (Vietnam War protest) (3)
Songs About Vietnam Part II (101)
soldiers Music from Viet Nam era (2)
Seek French songs mentioning VietNam (6)
(origins) Origins: Vietnam Era Music (5)
Lyr Add: The Fields of Vietnam (MacColl) (34)
Lyr Add: Teterboro Tower (8)
Help: 1970's song=in VietNam & the DMZ (5)


John M. 18 Jun 05 - 03:10 PM
Peace 18 Jun 05 - 05:31 PM
harpgirl 18 Jun 05 - 05:42 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 18 Jun 05 - 05:48 PM
Peace 18 Jun 05 - 06:06 PM
dick greenhaus 18 Jun 05 - 06:07 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 18 Jun 05 - 06:15 PM
Peace 18 Jun 05 - 06:21 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 18 Jun 05 - 06:28 PM
Rapparee 18 Jun 05 - 07:22 PM
Peace 18 Jun 05 - 08:24 PM
Peace 18 Jun 05 - 08:27 PM
Rapparee 18 Jun 05 - 10:38 PM
artbrooks 18 Jun 05 - 11:18 PM
Tam the man 19 Jun 05 - 11:43 AM
akenaton 19 Jun 05 - 12:42 PM
DMcG 19 Jun 05 - 12:52 PM
dwditty 19 Jun 05 - 01:24 PM
Big Mick 19 Jun 05 - 02:04 PM
Peace 19 Jun 05 - 02:17 PM
Matt_R 19 Jun 05 - 02:23 PM
GUEST 19 Jun 05 - 03:27 PM
Peace 19 Jun 05 - 03:32 PM
GUEST 19 Jun 05 - 06:36 PM
Peace 19 Jun 05 - 06:39 PM
harpgirl 20 Jun 05 - 09:13 AM
Rapparee 20 Jun 05 - 09:29 AM
Rapparee 20 Jun 05 - 09:30 AM
GUEST,Art Thieme 20 Jun 05 - 10:37 AM
Matt_R 21 Jun 05 - 02:13 AM
GUEST 21 Jun 05 - 07:21 AM
Little Hawk 21 Jun 05 - 08:37 AM
GUEST 21 Jun 05 - 08:55 AM
GUEST 21 Jun 05 - 09:42 AM
Tracey Dragonsfriend 21 Jun 05 - 10:59 AM
Big Mick 21 Jun 05 - 10:33 PM
Peace 21 Jun 05 - 10:37 PM
Wolfgang 22 Jun 05 - 06:32 AM
dick greenhaus 22 Jun 05 - 12:20 PM
Bill D 22 Jun 05 - 01:46 PM
Joe Offer 22 Jun 05 - 07:57 PM
Wilfried Schaum 23 Jun 05 - 03:16 AM
The Fooles Troupe 23 Jun 05 - 07:06 AM
Tracey Dragonsfriend 23 Jun 05 - 07:33 AM
GUEST 23 Jun 05 - 04:10 PM
Tracey Dragonsfriend 24 Jun 05 - 07:55 AM
Bill D 24 Jun 05 - 03:34 PM
GUEST,jcm969 03 Aug 10 - 08:10 PM
GUEST,Patsy Warren 04 Aug 10 - 07:21 AM
GUEST,mg 04 Aug 10 - 01:24 PM
Amos 04 Aug 10 - 02:36 PM
GUEST,999 04 Aug 10 - 03:01 PM
McGrath of Harlow 04 Aug 10 - 07:09 PM
GUEST,Skivee, cookie eaten by grues 04 Aug 10 - 10:21 PM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:









Subject: Lyr Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: John M.
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 03:10 PM

I hope to have this thread off of the forum list by Sunday night...so please DO NOT POST TO THIS THREAD unless you are contributing.  

Posting to this thread will move it to the top of the forum...Please do not post to this thread unless you wish to contribute!

 

Below is a traditional bawdy song titled:  "Fuck You Jane Fonda"  (recording)


              1.  Do you sing this song? 
              2.  If yes, when and where did you learn it?
              3.  Would you be willing to sing it for folklore purposes over the phone?



Knowledge of this song is very rare according to this google search.  So any help is appreciated.

Sincerely,

John Mehlberg
john@mehlberg.com
~
Afternoons:  314.647.3883
Evenings:     314.381.0492
~
My website: www.immortalia.com
~

FUCK YOU, JANE FONDA  (recording)

For years and years and years 'round the country,
Everybody thought that girl was swell,
After saying what she said, we wish that she were dead,
Jane Fonda, you should go straight to hell.

Chorus:

Fuck you, Jane Fonda, and Tom Hayden, too,
Fuck you, Jane Fonda, you're screwed up through and through,
Fuck you, Jane Fonda, you really have been had,
Fuck you, Jane Fonda, you're the shame of your poor dad.

Not long ago Jane went to see the commies,
Like Joan Baez and Ramsey Clark had done,
As they'd done in the past, they blew smoke right up her ass,
The Yankee Air Pirates are the guilty ones.

Jane said the POWs were liars,
Not only that they're hypocrites and pawns
"I know that those are lies, for I've seen with my own eyes.
They had good chow, they were not treated wrong."

Jane went up north to make a movie,
To demonstrate their peaceful, earnest pleas,
Although it isn't war, they're sending thousands more,
To help save Vietnam from the Vietnamese.

Sister Jane met Uncle Ho at Christmas,
To show us how the VC never sin,
She said her prayers that night, for a 0-9 mercy flight,
But Ho arrived instead, and slipped it in.

Jane Fonda, you're a bitch who's quite unique,
You've seen things that no other girl has seen,
Yeas, they showed you on the dike how it had been ruined by 20 mike-mike,
An asshole, you believed the rod machine,

Back in the states, our commie cunt vocal,
Describing all the horrors of the war,
But what she did not say, was exactly where she lay,
On top or underneath Ho, yelling "More!"

In keeping with the spirit of rebellion,
You helped the Indians at Wounded Knee,
But what a boring place, No CBU-just Mace,
Just not enough the keep you in the spree.


Notes: This is from pg. 20 of _The Raven_ which was "Published by The Edgar Allen Poe Literary Society of Texas Inc."   This is the 1990 Raven FAC reunion songbook.
 


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 05:31 PM

Good Lord, is that supposed to be a song lyric? It's bloody awful.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: harpgirl
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 05:42 PM

I hate this one too, John.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 05:48 PM

Garbage


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 06:06 PM

Words are just words, but that song is very poorly written, IMO.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 06:07 PM

C'mon fellers. Neither "FOLK" nor "TRADITIONAL" has anything to do with GOOD.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 06:15 PM

Garbage is garbage.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 06:21 PM

True, Dick, but it is a terrible lyric. I don't care about the politics involed or the cuss words, etc. As a piece of poetry set to music--well, it ain't good poetry. That, sir, is what I mean.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 06:28 PM

Substitute Bush and Laura and would this be accepted? I doubt it. This drool is slanderous to both Tom Hayden, representing Californians in the Statehouse, and Jame Fonda, a tireless worker for the disadvantaged.
It has nothing to do with bawdy song.
This is the first thread that I have seen at Mudcat that I believe should be deleted.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 07:22 PM

I believe that it was written and sung in Vietnam. I know many, many, many Vietnam veterans who would, like the guy recently in Missouri, spit on Jane Fonda. They call her "America's Traitor Bitch" when they are in a good mood.

Regardless of its artistic worth, regardless of its politics, these things should be archived.

Remember too, that after the US pulled out of Vietnam in 1975 and the Khmer Rouge were running berserk in Cambodia, Joan Baez asked her colleagues of the anti-war movement -- Fonda and Hayden among them -- to help look into the truth or falsity of the stories coming from Cambodia. Fonda and Hayden both rejected the offer, saying that it might make it look as if they'd been wrong about Pol Pot. No, I can't cite where I heard that, but I do remember that it was during the time of the "Killing Fields."

I applaud the Vietnames army for their work in invading Cambodia and driving the Khmer Rouge from power!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 08:24 PM

Heart-breaking read here.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 08:27 PM

Liberal or Conservative--this is shameful, IMO.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 10:38 PM

Steve Chang runs a restaurant here called "Chang's Garden." GOOD food. He came here from New York City. He came there from a camp in Thailand -- he escaped Cambodia by swimming across a river with his two sons on his back and his wife by his side under a hail of machine gun fire from the Khmer Rouge. Steve was a pianist and a good one. His fingers were broken by the Khmer Rouge and he was put to work planting rice.

He's one of the nicest people I know...and his wife makes WONDERFUL sweet-bean-paste dumplings (which are NOT on the menu!).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: artbrooks
Date: 18 Jun 05 - 11:18 PM

To answer the original question, I was in Vietnam in 1971, and never heard this song. While it's not exactly the thing you'd think reasonable, we did sing, and a lot of the songs were either filthy-dirty or political. I've never had any interest in professional veterans, aka service organizations (VFW, DAV, etc.), so I have no idea if they sing/sang it.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Tam the man
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 11:43 AM

no no no it is crap


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 12:42 PM

I agree, it wouldn't matter who the butt of the song was, as Brucie says lyrically its rubbish.    Embarrassing, on a par with a juvenile football chant ...Ake


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: DMcG
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 12:52 PM

The verse that's clearly stolen from Lyndon Johnson Told the Nation doesn't even fit the sentiments of the song either.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: dwditty
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 01:24 PM

Stupid

dw
Khanh Duong
1969


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Big Mick
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 02:04 PM

I agree that these threads are necessary. This place, after all, is about preserving all the music whether we agree or not. I remember the furor over the "Orange" songs. Given that my sentiments (in the Irish sense) are Republican, I still thought it important that these songs be preserved. Some of them are damn good.

But back to topic. This is a lousy example of songwriting. I never heard it while there, or since. I get a little tired of the Fonda bashing anyway. It made me sick to see the picture of her on the anti-aircraft gun, but that was on a visceral level. She has apologized time and again for it. But what makes me even sicker are those, in their zeal to bash this woman, that feel the necessity to make things up about her. In lying to denigrate her, they denigrate themselves. They don't hate Jane Fonda, they hate the icon of Ms. Fonda that is nothing but an idealistic kid of the 60's. Since that time she has matured into a beautiful woman, and intellectually she has blossomed and gained wisdom. While I don't admire her actions of 30 years ago, neither do I admire some of mine of that period either. Funny, isn't it, that George Bush and Dick Cheney can avoid service in Vietnam, later sending kids to fight in a war they lied about, and folks don't seem to mind. But Jane Fonda, as a young person, sees fit to follow her (sometimes misguided) conscience and she is still reviled for it. I admire that she is strong enough to speak frankly about those times, admitting mistakes, and claiming that which she has a right to take credit for.

And besides, she is still drop dead gorgeous!!!!

All the best,

Mick


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 02:17 PM

Mick,

That is one beautiful post.

As you are aware, I protested that war for years. However, even being on 'the other side' of the issue, I was never impressed by Jane's actions at that time. But as you said, she has changed. I also agree that songs have to be preserved. ALL songs--whether I like them or not. My remarks above are not to do with 'making the song go away' further into obscurity. The remarks were to say, simply, that as an example of the songwriter's art/craft--well, it ain't a good one.

Bruce Murdoch


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Matt_R
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 02:23 PM

I was just listening to "Lyndon Johnson Told The Nation" last night.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 03:27 PM

Not everything is worth preserving, even if it is reflective of the time, etc. Why people seem to think it is sacred and worth preserving just because somebody wrote it down (and I doubt this was ever sung as it is, as others have pointed out, very clumsy and doesn't really work as a song), I'll never know.

I'd never say censor it by deleting the thread. That would be just silly and immature. The language and political ideology aren't remarkable in any way for songs of this ilk.

But considering how unremarkable a song this is, I am definitely questioning the original poster's intent to "preserve" crap. It ain't worth the waste of disk space.

Now if it were clever or something...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 03:32 PM

I could be preserved as an example of what NOT to do in a song.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 06:36 PM

There are far too many examples of that sort already preserved though. So what's the point? Smug satisfaction of seeing "Fuck You Jane Fonda" in a headline?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 19 Jun 05 - 06:39 PM

Have to agree with you there, GUEST.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: harpgirl
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 09:13 AM

...hey Mickster, if you want to call this music, that's your perogative. I don't.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 09:29 AM

Mick expresses my feelings a lot better than I could.

And I'm a reluctant member of the American Legion. Doesn't mean I agree with their politics, but it's payback to a local group that did something for the library I couldn't afford to do. And hey, it's $25 a year -- I can be a member for loooooooooooooong time to pay back the four grand they put in.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 09:30 AM

Let me add that I've been singing "My Son John" and "Sergeant I'm a Draftee" and "What Did You Learn In School Today" a lot recently....


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 20 Jun 05 - 10:37 AM

I remember well the bad blood clouding the eyes of all concerned when Jane went to N. Viet Nam and stridently spoke out. She has said, in looking back, that it went, and was, very wrong.----We, on the anti-war side then thought it was, at best, a tactical mistake she was making---and there is no excuse except stupidity for those mistakes---then or now. It polarized people, and it hurt the sincere work being done by many who simply thought that the best way to be anti-war was to bring the soldiers home from an agonizing and insanely wrong-headed war on people who, like today, had a right to do things their own way---even if it wasn't our way.

The song, like all books, deserves to be noted and archived where others can find it as a document, and, as such, indicative of the strong passions of this absolutely terrible quagmire/war/era that killed so many young men so needlessly. (Deja vu all over again.)

MUDCAT is exactly the right place, in the light of this strange cyber-age we are now in, for the song to be located. Lousy song that it is aside, we ought not ban it -- just like we have, hopefully, learned not to burn books.

I'm proud to, again, agree with Mick---like I usually do! He knows, in his role as a union organizer, how catastrophic innocent tactical errors can backfire with the intensity of nuclear fart!

Art Thieme


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Matt_R
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 02:13 AM

^^ Funny how songs from 40-odd years ago fit perfectly with the current times, isn't it?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 07:21 AM

It doesn't take an idiot or a loyalist to know there are many damn fine Orange songs. All conflicts begat good songs and great songs, mediocre songs and bad songs.

This one falls under the final category--bad songs. Not because of it's content or ideology, but it's bloody awful attempt at writing a lyric and making sense.

I also have my doubts this song is a Vietnam era song. But apparently, verifying those sorts of details isn't part of the "folklore research" being done by this fellow. Rather, there seems to be a presumption by people here that if this guy has it on his website, it must be authentic and he must be a genuine folklore scholar.

I fear Kenny Goldstein may be spinning in his grave over the claims of "legitimate scholarly research" being tossed around so cavalierly in this forum. People here wouldn't know legitimate scholarly folklore research methodology if it bit them in the ass.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 08:37 AM

Didn't the Nazis have a song like that about Marlene Dietrich too?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 08:55 AM

Guest of 21/Jun 7:21 - isn't verifying the details what this chap is trying to do by posting here? He's asking here, in a music forum, if anyone here remembers this and can help him. A perfectly good question...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 09:42 AM

I've read the guy's website, 8:55. He is a hobbyist who enjoys collecting things that shock and dismay people.

He is also quite crafty--he posted an interview with the forum's narcissist general, Joe Offer, on his website. He started right at the top, in order to protect his "right" (as the forum narcissists perceive rights, that is) to post here as "a scholar". No one sucks up flattery around here more than Mr. Offer, as this clever man sussed out before he ever posted his "dirty ditties" (as he refers to them) here for posterity.

I mentioned Kenny Goldstein, because this fellow didn't. For those with even minimal knowledge of folklore research and collecting of bawdy material, that lack speaks volumes.
    Well, I suppose it does take a little narcissism for anybody to have the guts to sing a song to anybody else. Don't worry, though - with attacks from Shambles on on side, and from you and the Martin Gibson lynch mob on the other, my narcissism is kept well in check.
    -Joe Offer-


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Tracey Dragonsfriend
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 10:59 AM

Well, I guess everyone's gotta have a hobby! Collecting shocking or dirty songs isn't SO bad, is it?
He's even added a prefix to the thread indicating that some might find it offensive, to help you decide whether to read it. You don't HAVE to, after all. He's even given it a time-limit!

And regards his scholarship or otherwise, everyone's gotta start somewhere to acquire knowledge... where better than here?

I can't say I personally like this song, and I don't think it's especially well written, BUT I can understand why it would have appeared, and why it would have been popular at the time. It's an insight into the times they were written in, and into the minds of those who sing them. And I've learned something from the comments, too.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Big Mick
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 10:33 PM

If I posted such an arrogant post, you would rail about royals, and how the sycophants are all ignorant sheep. Why don't you try contributing some of the scholarship instead of talking about what is wrong with others.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Peace
Date: 21 Jun 05 - 10:37 PM

I beg to differ with you, GUEST. I do understand the nature and criteria of 'scholarly research'; however, I could care less about this particular song. Stop being so damned nasty with everyone.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Wolfgang
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 06:32 AM

21 Jun 05 - 07:21 AM,
how comes it you know so much about scholarship but are unable to find where K. Goldstein is mentioned on J. Mehlberg's website?

Wolfgang


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 12:20 PM

Come to think of it, what is "minimal knowledge of folklore research and collecting of bawdy material". From my experience (half-vast as it may be) it consists of recording (on paper or audio equipment) that material which one hears, and trying to find antecedents, variants and means of transmission..


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 01:46 PM

seems we still mix up what ought to be the issue *HERE* at Mudcat...

It IS a bad song, poorly written and lousy sentiments, but John M. can collect it if he wants, for historical completeness. No one is likely to be corrupted by glancing at it.....

All I would like to see, (though it seems I am overruled, by both John M. and Joe Offer, is a standard for thread **TITLES** which would help keep Mudcat from being filtered out by censorship programs.

It would be easy to create a thread title...such as "Viet Nam era song critical of Jane Fonda" with the lyrics inside the thread, but John M. has this principle to uphold, weakly defended by his claim that if he doesn't SAY 'fuck' in the title, no one will guess what he is referring to. ANYONE who was in 'Nam and/or ever heard the song would know!

But, once again, I am hollering down a well, as most of you would rather debate the value of the song and its sentiments, instead of the pragmatic issue of how Mudcat will function when threads like this are current.

(yes, John M, I know that my one more post keeps it alive one more day.....I avoided posting until it was obvious that it was gonna stay up anyway..)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Joe Offer
Date: 22 Jun 05 - 07:57 PM

Bill, we can't do anything until Mudcat settles down technically. My proposal is to have the default setting filter out objectionable thread titles. Those who don't care can set themselves to full access. In the meantime, I don't think it's fair to require John to euphemize thread titles. The PG13 labels and the link on the Help Forum are a temporary fix.
-Joe Offer-


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 03:16 AM

Oh my god - you mustn't hold a degree to do scholarly work.
Mr Mehlberg collects songs considered bawdy - now what? Such songs sung by the people ARE folk songs, like them or not. In writing history as seen by the mighty they also make a good contrast what people really think.
There are only a few collectors of this sort of songs, and we should be glad to have them.
When I needed money as a student I worked sometimes on construction sites. There you could hear songs from the masons and carpenters your ears would fall of when you heard them. But a true philologus must be accustomed to all levels of speech, even if it is concerned with a lot of sexual intercourse and venereal diseases.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 07:06 AM

Oh F***, not this f****** argment again over a s*** awful song!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Tracey Dragonsfriend
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 07:33 AM

I have no problems with the "Fuck" in the thread title being replaced by "F**k", to help out those with filter problem - why not!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Jun 05 - 04:10 PM

New around here, are you Tracey?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Tracey Dragonsfriend
Date: 24 Jun 05 - 07:55 AM

No, but a sane word never hurts...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Bill D
Date: 24 Jun 05 - 03:34 PM

Joe...just for clarity's sake, what is your precise proposal about the default filter? Do you mean that people could post using any language they wish, but I would not even see the thread unless I turned OFF the filter? Or do you mean that bawdy titles would somehow be 'fixed' with a search & replace action...changing 'fuck' to 'f**k'.?

I would prefer the latter in some form, so that I am not required to use a filter to know the basic content of the threads. I, personally, am not 'offended' by langauge, nor do I have small children...etc.... I DO favor reasonable good taste, but even that is not the issue, as it can't be defined easily.

I suppose that if watchfulness of clones and/or an automatic asterisk inserter is not feasible, then the default filter is the next best thing. It will be interesting to see how it is worked out.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST,jcm969
Date: 03 Aug 10 - 08:10 PM

Funny...if this was a song cussing and putting down George W. Bush, no matter how poorly written, I bet these wimps badmouthing would be giving rave reviews. I ain't fonda jane. JC McClain Nam Vet


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST,Patsy Warren
Date: 04 Aug 10 - 07:21 AM

The song makes uncomfortable reading but it did get a reaction. It is interesting to read every individual response to this whether it's about the bad language in the title, the war or the girl herself (woman now).

When I was a kid I thought she was an outspoken rebellious gutsy girl different to the Barberella character we saw. These days I wonder if it was just the war she was hitting out at or more at her father who she was at logger heads with for years and the circle of people he was clicky with. At one point I believe she was 'black-listed' which must have caused a great deal of embarrassment to Henry Fonda.

No I haven't been corrupted by the lyrics at all but my only concern is that there is going to be competition for folk to post something more rude or offensive than the last.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 04 Aug 10 - 01:24 PM

A girl? She was a grown woman as were many of us during those days. mg


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: Amos
Date: 04 Aug 10 - 02:36 PM

It is probably worth remembering, however contrary to public sentiment her actions were, that she was motivated by a desire to get the U.S. out of useless war--NOT to sell it down the river, as has been attributed to her by those with shorter fuses. Her actions were naive and perhaps ineffective, but she had laudable goals, not criminal ones.

A


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST,999
Date: 04 Aug 10 - 03:01 PM

``Funny...if this was a song cussing and putting down George W. Bush, no matter how poorly written, I bet these wimps badmouthing would be giving rave reviews. I ain't fonda jane. JC McClain Nam Vet``

You are a Vietnam vet--along with 2,600,000 other people. As for George W Bush, well, as you know, he didn`t have to serve in Vietnam. I guess you did it on his behalf. I`m sure he thanks you in his heart of hearts.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Aug 10 - 07:09 PM

It was an especially dirty war, and a permanent shame on the United States. Many countries have wars like that in their past.

That doesn't mean there weren't decent people who were trapped into taking part of it, but the same is true of those who fought for Germany in world War II, or France in Algeria, or Britain in a range of colonial wars.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: pg13 Add: 'Fuck You Jane Fonda' Vietnam Song
From: GUEST,Skivee, cookie eaten by grues
Date: 04 Aug 10 - 10:21 PM

JC McClain Nam Vet.
First, Thank you for your service.
Second, as a knee-jerk Liberal was against the VN war, I also agree that Jane Fonda was a tool. That being said, the song is stupid. It should be rejected (but not censored) on that basis only; but its context should also be aknowledged.
I've frequently sighed at the crappy, self-congratulatory tone of songs slamming GW Bush and Cheney.
Fonda, like many stars and performers across the political spectrum, seems to think that her opinions are important. Craig Nelson, Sean Penn, John Wayne, Jenny MacCarthy...Why listen to ANY of them? Just because they are trained to look like they know what they are talking about doesn't mean that they know what they are talking about.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
  Share Thread:
More...

Reply to Thread
Subject:  Help
From:
Preview   Automatic Linebreaks   Make a link ("blue clicky")


Mudcat time: 26 April 9:05 AM EDT

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.