Folk Programme Axed!

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Mark Dowding
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 01:59 PM

I don't think the Paul Graney programme was a "Sounds of Folk" production - it was done by someone else at GMR but Matthew's point is a good one. Whether the new remit of BBC Radio Talk Till We Drop will continue to commission these types of programmes remains to be seen. Paul Graney was someone I'd heard and read about on LP covers ("Song supplied by Paul Graney" "Thanks to Paul Graney for the words of this song", etc) but knew little about. This documentary was excellent in bringing Paul's work to the fore and I've since been in touch with the guy who's been doing the digitising of the tapes and documents for archiving. Hopefully there will be more information about what is happening to the files and how we can access them in due course.

Community Radio is fine for the immediate area around the transmitter and they do a good job but for broadcasting to a wider audience the BBC holds the trump cards and now they've just thrown their hand in!

I wish Ali and Bernard all the best at Oldham and Britfolk if it goes ahead - Britfolk Radio is streamed on the web so at least we can listen in once a month - the programmes are also archived and accessible by subscription after a week or so after transmission. Not sure about Community Radio - AllFM can be heard on the internet - from what "Community Collage" presenter Geli was saying on Sunday when I was there, they have quite a following in Bombay with one of the presenters! Their immediate transmission area is Levenshulme, Longsight and Ardwick although when conditions are right it can be picked up further afield.

Things must move on and there at least seems to be a future for folk broadcasting in one form or another.

I'd like to thank Ali and Bernard for the chance they've given me to bring the projects that I've been involved in over the past few years to a larger audience than I could have got without the show - The "Harry Boardman" and "Manchester Ballads" projects have been popular when Chris Harvey and I have performed the songs thanks in no small part to "Sounds of Folk"

Let's look forward to the future - there may be one at the BBC in time but at least there are other opportunities available.

Cheers
Mark

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 01:09 PM

Out in the wilds of Wirral it isn't easy to listen to GMR but I've managed to catch some of the 'Sounds of Folk' programmes. I was very impressed by the programme about Paul Graney's collection of tapes from the 1950's onwards; not only were these a fascinating collection of songs and music, but they also were invaluable documents of social history including memories of hunger marchers in the 1930's. I felt moved enough to send a small donation to the Paul Graney Memorial Folk Trust at the Greater Manchester County Record Office, whose website has more information about the Paul Graney Project which aims to preserve the tapes.

This seemed to me a perfect example of the BBC fulfilling its public service remit; here is a programme which presents material of interest to all the community. In its place Manchester will now be served with cheap "drivetime" talk shows - no doubt the rest of the country can expect the same in the future.

Good luck to Ali and Bernard, and thanks for all you have achieved with Sounds of Folk.

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Alan Day
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 12:31 PM

I understand from good authority that Folk Music is starting to become cool in some areas and we could be looking at another Folk revival.
If this is the case the BBC programmers will have to come creeping back cap in hand and start all these programmes again.It would be lovely to tell them to F Off but for the good of Folk I suppose we shall have to go with it.I hope it happens quickly.
Al

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: greg stephens
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 09:32 AM

So, the new folk revival is starting(BBC Folk Britannia) so we'll close down the folk shows(BBC GMR). Grand to know they've got some clever people at the tiller.

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Alio
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 08:57 AM

I've had some wonderful emails - loads of support from around the world, which is great.

I think the options I'll be given will be very limited - in his letter John Ryan only talks about clubs and events. No mention of music at all! I really wouldn't want to be part of anything as prescriptive as that...but I'll wait to see what he has to offer.

On the last programme, we have got just 1 interview to do (David Wright of Lancaster Maritime Festival) but we'll also be playing some of our favourite tracks from the 3 years of the programme.

I'm sure I will be very emotional....but also looking forward to the move to Oldham Community Radio.

Ali x

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: treewind
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 04:27 AM

Re Bernard's BBC news link...
One photo caption on that page read:
"BBC Radio 4's I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue was praised in the White Paper"
Sums up the BBC management quite well, I think!

Sorry to hear about your show Ali, and more power to your collective creative elbows on the new Radio Britfolk show - getting some professional programme makers on board means GMR's loss is RBF's gain! (no disrepect to Genevieve who's done some already for RBF, a few more can't do any harm)

Anahata

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Rasener
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 01:41 AM

Sorry it should have said "Just so that everybody understands"

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Rasener
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 01:08 AM

Just so that everybody unstands and doesn't drop the two of you in it.

Can we complain to anybody, and how much can we say - or should we stay mum on this ?

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Mark Dowding
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:58 PM

So it's going to be Sport and Spout radio from now on!

I shall be registering my official protest with John Ryan and telling him he's lost a listener. No doubt he won't give a proverbial as he's done the job he was probably brought in for.

The interesting thing will be what options will be available to Ali and Bernard after the last programme.

I did a spot on AllFM on Sunday - they want and encourage specialist music - more than the BBC obviously want!

Go out with a bang team! Tell the listeners officially at the beginning of the programme and wait for the emails to come in.

Mark

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: andrewq
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:43 PM

Sorry that the wreckers have got at the show. Babble is cheaper than a quality music show, no doubt. Thanks to Ali and Bernard for all your hard work. I've really enjoyed listening.

On a positive note....
Time now to start praising those other local BBC folk shows while we still have them. Just up the road in Blackburn, Phil Brown has been making a very good job of The Drift on BBC Radio Lancashire. Perhaps e-mails of support to his station manager ([e-mail]) would encourage that station to continue supporting his show? He seems quite enthusiastic at the moment, so let's provide a bit of encouragement to stay that way! If you're not from the area you can listen live on the web on Thursday evenings (and on the Sunday repeat). The Drift is shortly to be available on the BBC's Listen Again player for 7 days after broadcast. (Martyn Joseph did a splendid concert for the whole show last week.)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/lancashire/

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Bernard
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:41 PM

So what does this really mean?!

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Bernard
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:18 PM

My worry now is that it isn't going to stop here... Genevieve and all the others must also be at risk... the rot must be stopped - and quickly.

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Bernard
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:10 PM

My thoughts exactly... though I haven't said it, you understand...!!

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: GUEST,clogger
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:09 PM

"that makes them accountable"
Dont make me laugh! The whole setup STINKS!
Theoreticaly WE own the Beeb .... but it must be keped secret from US untill too late! Even Beswick would not let anyone talk about it beforehand..... but the decision has just been made?
The only concilation, is that Folkies have a long memory and although we tend to be quiet, we do hold opinions! Maybe a "letter to my local M.P." would do some good? worth a try anyway!
All the best Alli + Bernard
yours 1 naffed off folk1e

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: nutty
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:40 PM

So sorry to hear this news.

BUT, I keep wondering why there is a need for secrecy, unless they know that what they ae doing will be unpopular with the public at large or else the management are trying to appear more important than they really are.

This is not a matter of state .... What are the press saying about this??
Sounds like Folk is not the only programme affected.

Sod the management .....this is a community Radio and the Community should be able to have its say.

Sod the management (again) we all pay a license fee ....that makes them accountable, in which case they should be prepared to answer questions.

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Bernard
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:31 PM

We aren't at liberty to reveal the 'new' name GMR will have, though the words 'Radio' and 'Manchester' feature heavily... and 'Greatewr' has been relegated to obscurity!

A giant leap - backwards!! Either it will cost a fortune to 're-brand', or they have been saving all the old letterheads, etc., for such an eventuality.

How can they justify their actions in the light of the recent negotiations for retaining the licence fees for another ten years?

I'm still at a loss the understand why we had to wait to be told two weeks before our last broadcast, when decisions like this are made months, probably years in advance.

Answers on a postcard...

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: MoorleyMan
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 05:32 PM

Yes, that's exactly what Henry Ayrton was forced into when his show was axed by BBC North (Leeds/Sheffield)... don't tell the listeners. History repeats itself in the most insidious way don't it?

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 05:17 PM

This is on the understanding that you make no reference to the programme changes on the air until your final programme

Or in other words "Make no attempt to let listeners demonstrate support for your programme, or you are out now." Such confidence on the part of management that they are doing the right thing.

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Rasener
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 03:15 PM

Svinehunds.

One door closes and another opens.

Good luck for the future Ali and Bernard

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: HipflaskAndy
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 03:01 PM

So very sad indeed.
Much sympathy to Ali & Bernard - thanks for all your sterling good service.
You know you have my full support for whatever you can produce next.
The very best of luck to you.
Duncan

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:41 PM

Bugger!

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Alio
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:31 PM

Cheers MM - tho' whether me and my team resemble a phoenix, I'm not sure!! Possibly Bernard?

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: MoorleyMan
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:23 PM

Ali,
Sorry to hear the inevitable but there we go.
But very well done for keeping the folk flag flying so strongly, and I'm sure some kind of phoenix will rise from the ashes (cricketing metaphor - lost on a determinedly non-sports-minded sensible folky audience!)...
Luv ya!
MM
x

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: DebC
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:19 PM

Ali,

I am so sorry to hear this. I know I speak for many artists when I say thanks for all that you have done for us on your show.

See you at Lancaster,
Debra

Subject: RE: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:09 PM

So, thanks for everything, it was a great programme and it will be much missed. Hard to see how:

"The station is withdrawing from specialist music shows to concentrate on our core talk-based programming"

will add to the utter joy of GMR - what ever it is to be called. I guess north Manchester will talk tripe to south Manchester with odd jewels of whit and wisdom, so few programmes are as good as Beswick.

Subject: Folk Programme Axed!
From: Alio
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 01:25 PM

If you've been following the other thread, this will come as no surprise I suspect.

I received this letter today from John Ryan, Managing Editor for BBC GMR (soon to be called something different!!):

The time has come to announce the future of evening programming on BBC GMR. I know there has been much speculation recently following preliminary discussions, and I wanted to let you know as soon as a final decision was made (I don't believe he knew only 2 weeks before the end of March!!).
I am sorry to tell you that we will have no further requirement for Sounds of Folk. The station is withdrawing from specialist music shows to concentrate on our core talk-based programming.
We would like to find a way of reflecting Folk events and clubs in the output (no mention of music then?). I will call you soon to see if you would like to maintain a a paid relationship with the station to achieve this.
I would like your show to continue up to and including the end of March. This is on the understanding that you make no reference to the programme changes on the air until your final programme (there may not be a show next week anyway because of football!!).
I know this has been a tricky and uncertain period for everyone involved in specialist and community programming on BBC GMR, and that losing your show will be a blow.
Thank you for the hard work and effort you have invested in Sounds of Folk.

So there you have it! Very sad - what will I do now with my evenings? I normally spend 2 /3 of them preparing the show, emailing artists, finding out about all the diary dates etc.! The good news is that my team and I have been invited to do a regular programme for Radio Brit Folk, and also a weekly programme for the new Oldham Community Radio station from the autumn.

Thanks everyone for all your support.

Ali x