BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Grab
Date: 12 Apr 06 - 07:33 AM

Chequered pasts 2-3 generations back, maybe I could believe things have changed. This same generation, I think not. Unless every racist from the BNP in the 80s and 90s has left (aerial pigs and Satan skating to work kind of likelihood), then I really doubt it.

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Apr 06 - 03:33 AM

Let us know your findings bobert. I keep hearing these guys mentioned all the time on mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 07:55 PM

Ummmm, harmony made one very good point... She or he said soemthing along ther lines that most parties have checkered pasts... This is very much true... Look at the Democratic Party which enjoyed a lot of success in the 40's and 50's with a Southern coilition of Dixiecrats who were not much more than a bunch of redneck racists...

And look at the Republican party... It actively recruited former Nazis and Nazi sympathizers after World War II into its ranks... Google "History of the Heritage Council" fir details...

As fir the BNP I must confess to not knowing much about them as a here & now party.... Maybe I'll do a search and see what they satnd for *today*....

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 03:42 PM

mocker

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 01:46 PM

stalker

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GEUST
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 12:49 PM

just to keep the record streight..

"GUEST,GUEST,GEUST - PM
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 11:20 AM"

is not me..


but "GUEST,GEUST - PM
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 12:27 AM"

&

"GUEST,GEUST - PM
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 12:33 AM"

definitely is me !



. and this is now me formaly logged in !!!

though why anyone would bother to impersonate me,
a registered [though mostly cookieless] GEUST,
is too daft beyond measure !?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST,GUEST,GEUST
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 11:20 AM

Well i have only seen her make appearances on a zionist thread and this BNP one.

She is BNP.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 10:22 AM

Up front, I do not think Harmony is a BNP person. They are one helluva lot more disingenuous than that. People make honest mistakes. Let it go at that, OK?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 07:43 AM

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Grab
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 05:22 PM

The BNP are *not* the worst to be seen - there are worse people than the BNP out there. However, that's rather like seeing someone up to their waist in shit and saying "well at least it's not up to your neck". At some point you have to realise that it's an awfully large quantity of shit and their situation is not a pleasant one, and rationalising that things could be worse does not decrease the amount of shit involved.

Graham.

It's hard to hate though i must admit. I think Harmony, or whoever SHE or HE is, is being naive about the BNP, (maybe intentionally so, hannam? zelger?) But i take his/her point. I have BNP canvassers coming to the door, and when you have a 70+pensioner at your door on behalf of those racist scumbags, it is hard to hate.

But make no mistake. Evil often comes in the form light.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 03:02 AM

The film referred to is possibly this one. The Believer 2001.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0247199/

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 12:40 AM

The name Richard ring a bell?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST,GEUST
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 12:33 AM

.. and also anyone here with a subscription to UK Channel 4 film..

theres a "true life" movie screening recently about
a young brutal yank nazi skinhead hiding the secret that he's jewish !

cant remember the title..

research and watch it yourself..

we live in a world of mixed up fuck ups !

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST,GEUST
Date: 11 Apr 06 - 12:27 AM

yeah right, "harmony" has been a member since 98 !

read harmony's input in all those years,..

and the language and phrasing is very reminiscent
of that hannam bellend sucking apologist
who's mudcat name begins with a "Z"
I've forgoten.. but can someone else please name and shame.

"Z" something or fascist other..


remembered !!!


zelger


and some of you softer libral lefties might want to check out
BNP linked "Redwatch" search & destroy website

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 08:09 PM

But it is far less clear why he would choose this party.

Insanity springs to mind.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Grab
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 05:22 PM

The BNP are *not* the worst to be seen - there are worse people than the BNP out there. However, that's rather like seeing someone up to their waist in shit and saying "well at least it's not up to your neck". At some point you have to realise that it's an awfully large quantity of shit and their situation is not a pleasant one, and rationalising that things could be worse does not decrease the amount of shit involved.

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Shambles
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 05:03 PM

It is possible to see why (some of) the BNP would see that adopting this candidate as giving them some credibilty and perhaps he is also giving them some money? But it is far less clear why he would choose this party.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST,M.Ted
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 01:20 PM

Azzizi, I was speaking to the fact that you thought that Harmony might be a plant from BNP, and clarifying why that wasn't an unreasonable conjecture, given the circumstances here.

I wasn't addressing your thought that Harmony was naive about the nature of the BNP at all--but I will now--People who say, "Well, there are lots of bad people out there, so why make such a fuss about...." rationalize inaction in the face of evil, and in this way, facilitate the evil--

I think that the fact that Harmony bailed out of the discussion when challenged, tells a a lot about the "I know what's happening is wrong, but they've never given me any trouble, and I don't want to get involved" mindset--

Truth be told Harmony, from your own account, the BNP know who you are, they know where you live, and we all know what they are capable of--

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 12:37 PM

"Do we assume he is one of our enemies that Azizi says we are to know?"

And who's this 'we' you be talkin' about?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 12:34 PM

If he's BNP he's definitely one of my enemies.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Shambles
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 12:33 PM

Do we assume he is one of our enemies that Azizi says we are to know?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 10:14 AM

"So why would Mr Sharif Abdel Gawad want to stand for this party?"

Maybe he's got issues?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 03:37 AM

There were Jews who supported Hitler. Same distorted thinking.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Shambles
Date: 10 Apr 06 - 02:50 AM

So why would Mr Sharif Abdel Gawad want to stand for this party?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 10:16 PM

"The BNP don't field ethnic candidates and are accused of racism, and when they do field ethnic candidates they are still accused of racism?"

The BNP are racist bastards not because of the candidates they do or don't field but because of their party platform. It has been well documented and linked to--many times in the recent past. Take a few minutes and inform yourself and you won't comme across as being totally vacuous and uninformed.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 10:07 PM

"Well done Azizi. A new member gone before they even got started."

Harmony has been a Mudcat member since 1998. Which is likely more than can be said for you, GUEST.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 08:34 PM

The BNP member who planted the nail bomb in the soho pub and killed a man must have escaped your attention?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Badger
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 08:02 PM

Before you all blow a fuse trying to outdo each other in outrageous sanctimony - be thankful that the BNP are not Fundamaentaist Muslim -
BOOM!

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Shambles
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 06:54 PM

If you always try to show tolerance and harmony it could give you some right to criticise those who may not.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 06:47 PM

I think Azizi's done very well indeed- by speaking the truth about this sorry collection of racist psychopaths calling themselves the BNP.

If that offends someone to the point of leaving, that's as they say, "on them" & good riddance.

Tolerance and harmony can be taken to the point of idiocy.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 05:49 PM

Well done Azizi. A new member gone before they even got started

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Azizi
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 05:23 PM

GUEST,M.Ted,

I can speak for myself and I will.

I did not misunderstand harmony's comments.

I stand by my posts on this thread.

Needless to say, [since it is a free forum], harmony can stay or go as she {or he] desires.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST,M.Ted
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 04:09 PM

Harmony,

Please don't leave because of Azzizi's comments, she misunderstood your comment--the BNP show up here in force from time to time(and, no doubt, will be arriving soon) so it is fairly common for posters to suddenly take their side without acknowledging that they are affiliated--so it is a natural(though unfortunate) thing to wonder if something that seems to support BNP is really coming from a BNP member who has not been identified--

Also,unfortunately, as in all polarized discussions, failure to denounce loudly enough is can be interpreted as sympathy--

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 02:53 PM

"06/04/06: BNP in turmoil over candidate. Bradford organiser resigns.
Category: General Posted by: Antifascist
The British National Party has raced straight into trouble almost as soon as the nomination date for the local council elections has passed - but this time the trouble comes not from its opposition but from its fellow fascists both inside and outside the party.

Bradford BNP have a candidate standing in Bowling and Barkerend, by the name of Sharif Abdel Gawad. Gawad, who is apparently half Welsh-half Turkish has been in the BNP for a couple of years and has been both active and prominent with Griffin pushing him to the fore on every possible occasion, along with Griffin's one and only Sikh friend who he produces every now and then to 'prove' he's not racist. Gawad was very much to the front of the BNP crowd on the opening day of Griffin's trial back in January.

The moment the nominations were in and the white nationalists got wind of Gawad, all hell broke loose. One nazi forum called his nomination 'pointless', another reported that BNP activists in the area were refusing to canvass for him because he's 'not white'. Many more have attacked Nick Griffin's judgement in allowing Gawad to even join the party, with one supporter though non-member stating somewhat incoherently; 'For all those they convince that they [the BNP] aren't racist (which is a lie, as anyone who has spoken with average BNP activists will know) with these sort of moves, they disillusion just as many committed nationalists.'

Gawad's appearance on the nomination papers has caused massive controversy in the Bradford BNP branch itself, leading to the resignation of its branch organiser and thus throwing it into chaos just prior to what it regards as a crucial election, and prompting this comment from a fellow nazi; 'One saving grace in all this, is the Organiser has now resigned. I should bloody well hope so too How dare he.'

Insiders say that Griffin personally accepted Gawad's membership with the object of capitalising on his mixed parentage though why anyone would want to be used in this way by a party that has nothing but contempt for mixed-race offspring is beyond understanding.

Resignations, refusals to canvass, attacks from fellow nazis all over the place, fake assassination attempts - and this is just the start of the election campaign. One wonders what Griffin has up his sleeve for us next.

Update: The BNP writes; 'He is a staunch Bradford BNP activist, renowned for his strong anti-Islamic stance...'

Well, that's alright then. Let's hope the Muslims of Bowling and Barkerend ward in Bradford remember that on May 4th and vote accordingly."

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Shambles
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 02:46 PM

But while espousing that goal, don't forget to know your enemies.

I am not too sure what that means...Perhaps it could be explained a little more?

Given some of the strong opinions of the nature of the BNP that have been posted - I am suprised that no one has posted to question why Mr Sharif Abdel Gawad would want to stand for this party?

I know it is supposed to be a free country but are there any thoughts or suggestions as to why he would wish to?

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST,Ifor
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 12:22 PM

The BBC undercover programme on the BNP last year give a pretty good indication about the horrible racism of the BNP and what they get up to...with one of their leading activists in the north boasting and bragging how he pushed dog mess through the letter boxes of Asian shopkeepers.Others planned to attack a van belonging to a trade union.
One leading member of the BNP has a conviction for bomb making and for seriously assaulting a jewish teacher who was removing racist graffiti from a London tube wall while the Brixton and Soho nailbomber who murdered 2 people and maimed dozens of others was a BNP member who believed in the race war.
Dont allow these people to organise as they are very dangerous .
Unite Against Fascism is supported by trade unions and anti racist groups and is organising against the BNP and needs all the help it can. Check out its website!
for

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 10:27 AM

www.bnp.org.uk

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: harmony
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 10:16 AM

Azizi i resent your accusation that i am not who i am, just because i have put my views forward.

Do you now doubt who i am simply because i have a different opinion. You have a lot to learn.

I'm going to stay out of this now, as i am still fairly new to mudcat and did not join to fall out with people over the BNP.

I'll stay away from politics on here from now on and stick to music i think.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Azizi
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 09:57 AM

I wonder if the BNP and other such groups have members pretend to be swwetness & lighters on forums such as this and post such sap as this: "I just think it's fairly obvious the BNP has a marred past of racism and violence but on the other hand, so have most other parties, in some way or other, they have all had horrible dealings"...

But if Harmony is really who Harmony says she or he is, then in my definitely not humble opinion, Harmony has some SERIOUS learning to do about how groups like BNP function.

And that's all I'm gonna say on this matter.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 09:44 AM

I missed out the name of the anti fascist magazine SEARCHLIGHT ...which is a good source about the BNP and other racist groups.The BNP ,of course hates the magazine which has done sterling work in opposing the BNP and other racist groups.
Regards to Azizi!
Ifor

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: harmony
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 09:09 AM

It's not that i'm looking through rose tinted glasses. I just think it's fairly obvious the BNP has a marred past of racism and violence, but on the other hand, so have most other parties, in some way or other, they have all had horrible dealings. One only needs to think of the huge numbers of sex offenders in the other parties, or the terrorist links in Sinn fein, but they are accepted nowadays.

I think it is rose tinted glasses to look at the BNP and pretend they are not the only bad guys out there.

As for them hurting my family, i don't think that is likely. They always cavass around here come election times, (only time they bother) and i tell them a big resounding 'NO' but my family has never been attacked for not being white.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Azizi
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 09:03 AM

Ifor, sorry about my typo re your name.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Azizi
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 09:01 AM

Ifo, I didn't see your comment until I posted mine.

I hope that Harmony and others who want to give the BNP the benefit of the doubt really read what you have said and understand the background and nature of this group.

Thanks,

Azizi

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Azizi
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 08:56 AM

Harmony you said that the BNP "is not the worst to be seen."

What??!!!

So is this a contest as to which group of contemporary or historical thugs & racists is the all time worst in observable actions??? Not to mention the contemptable actions these groups do in secrecy.

Come on now, Harmony. Take off those rose colored glasses.

Be real.

Too much niceness and turn the other cheekisms can get you or your family or people who look like you badly beaten, or lynched or forced to take a one way trip to the gas chambers.

Harmony, by your name I gather that you believe that one's ethnic and racial background should not make any difference in how she or he is considered or is treated. I believe in that too.

But while espousing that goal, don't forget to know your enemies.

And by the way, Jesus got angry at the money changers in the temple. It's healthy to vent some righteous anger at those who mean you no good. And it is also important to work for the world you want to experience and not pretend it's that kind of world already.


Azizi,
who is definitely not in a pollyanna, sweetness & light mood today
if I ever am]

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: GUEST,ifor
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 08:41 AM

The BNP are a grisly bunch...racist,thuggish and bigoted to their rotten core. At the heart of their attitudes is a vicious racism and anti semitism that consciously harks back to their admiration for Hitler and his nazis.The BNP was founded by John Tyndall an open nazi .He died last year but ther are photos of him posing in nazi uniform and he was quite open about his fascism.He also had a string of convictions as long as your arm for violence,racial harassment and para military activities.
As a way of contrast the current fuehrer Nick Griffin only has a conviction for incitement to racial hatred, although he is facing a retrial on various charges .Griffin is a brute in a suit and thinks that by dashing about in a smart outfit he can fool the public into thinking he is just a nationalist.This man has been involved in race hatred and fascist circles since his youth and the anti racist magazine has the documentation to prove it.
His minions are a grisly bunch too ....thugs and criminals and nazis ...what a sad but dangerous bunch.
ifor

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: harmony
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 08:21 AM

Well i think it's a bit unfair. The BNP don't field ethnic candidates and are accused of racism, and when they do field ethnic candidates they are still accused of racism?

I don't support them, as i am mixed-race myself, but certainly think they are not the worst to be seen.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Van
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 08:09 AM

It's surprising that a party can limit its members to one "race" and not fall foul of the law.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: the one
Date: 09 Apr 06 - 04:11 AM

are we all not the rib of adam.

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: The Shambles
Date: 08 Apr 06 - 06:45 PM

Some Germans - perhaps?

Gentleness, self-sacrifice and generosity are the exclusive possession of no one race or religion.

Mohandas Gandhi

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Teribus
Date: 08 Apr 06 - 05:58 PM

Is there any such thing as someone who is, "of 100 per cent ethnic English descent." ??

Subject: RE: BS: BNP select 'ethnic' row.
From: Peace
Date: 08 Apr 06 - 03:02 PM

Another thread for those Nazi cocksuckers.