Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 24 Aug 06 - 01:33 AM

The pennywhistle is a tough instrument to play accurately. I bet it's damn tough when you're drunk.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Bert
Date: 24 Aug 06 - 01:29 AM

Come on now folks, it's usually only ONE SONG. I remember the time, On Mudcat Radio no less, when I was singing 'The Barley Mow' and a dear friend joined in with a version she'd learned somewhere else (from Seamus Kennedy I think), which had a BOOM, BOOM, BOOM in it.

Ok! it didn't fit with MY version but it certainly wasn't worth upsetting her about it. And like a true professional I carried on and didn't say a word. And I also learned that some people sing it differently.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Skivee
Date: 24 Aug 06 - 12:22 AM

I was at a private party for performers after a local festival. A wonderful woman and her family like to open their house up after the show to hear us play with each other. In exchange, she feeds us very well and many stay over. There were about 20 local/ national musicians in attendence on one memorable night.
An ex-mudcatter, well known for his boorish behavior here, had somehow gotten wind of the party and invited himself over. He was drunk (as usual).
My brother (not a pro singer, but a nice enough guy) starts singing an old Irish ballad. "Banks of Red Roses" or the the like.
This boorish peasant pulls out a penny whistle and starts toodling along. Different key...not getting many notes on anyway...loud random notes.
My Bro eventually gave up.
So I asked the boor," Do you even know the tune that he was singing"?
He replied,"No".
He left the party soon after.
BTW. This fellow is quite proud of the contribution he imagines he makes to the local scene.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 10:46 PM

I remember a group of (Irish) folkies in Hull who used to do a little session, they were very cliquey and didn't like 'outsiders'. I heard that if anyone new tried to join in, they would employ little tricks to put them off like speeding up ridiculously fast or unexpectedly changing the time signature...this put me off folk sessions for a long while.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Artful Codger
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 09:58 PM

Oh stop that, Mother!

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 08:16 PM

My singing has been known to confound the most competent of musicians....

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Greg B
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 08:12 PM

"Och! Now ye're ontae me, ye swine! Ye'll be sorrrry. I plan tae show up at yer next singalong wi' ma bagpipes and a steamin' great bowl o' haggis, which I will eat and I will belch and fahrt noisily whilst others are tryin' tae sing!"

Now that'n reads more like Billy Connolly...

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 08:06 PM

Back in the early Sixties there was a trio called "The Talismen" singing around Seattle. The trio was composed of Jon Pfaff, who is still very much around, Carl Blanes (pronounce BLA-ness), and I can't recall the name of the third member. All three were good singers and well-trained musicians (I don't know about the other two, but Jon was going to the University of Washington School of Music at the time), and often their arrangements of folk songs were pretty elaborate, but very tasteful.

One night when they had a coffeehouse gig, some guy who appeared to be a bit sloshed was making loud comments while they were trying to sing. He wasn't heckling, he was just overly enthusiastic. He thought they were great. Then he insisted on coming up and singing with them. Jon told me that they picked one of their madrigal-style arrangements, with the three voices coming in at different times and singing contrapuntal lines. The guy was totally lost. He finally shut up, sat down, and just listened.

Nicely done.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Ref
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 08:00 PM

Seems like a fundamental problem is ground rules. I'd never intrude on a paid performer or "open-miker" unless harmonies or accompaniment was requested. Song circles need to be clear as to whether they are going to be sequential individual performances with each one getting to invite (or not) others to join or a rolling group sing with people sequentially choosing songs. In the latter case, the person choosing the song should generally get to set the tempo and tune. My own hate is getting my choice (I do sort of play guitar) and having others sing roughshod over my version.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Snuffy
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 07:37 PM

Solipsism - but what can he know?

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 06:04 PM

I had to look it up Richard! And I can assure you that solipsistism is not on the aganda at all. Now, can I tell you of an experience I had with someone saying it was...

:D (tG)

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,Jon W.
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 06:03 PM

I don't know if this counts, but I'll relate the story anyway. I am a member of a instrument builder's association. We decided that our meeting last month would be a picnic in a park to celebrate the fact that our little club had not yet self-destructed. About seven of us showed up and sat around eating, telling lies, and looking through old issues of "Guitarmaker" magazine. About the time we finished dinner and were about to pull out our instruments for a little jam session, a couple of Native American youth, one with a little drum and the other with a large rattle, sat down about 30 yards away from us. The one fellow began to beat the drum (which had surprising volume), and the other to shake the rattle and loudly chant in (presumably) his native language. While at first slightly interesting, within a few minutes this got so monotonous, and then went on so long, that all hope of our little jam session disipated rapidly. Why, in a park of 100 acres size, did they have to park themselves right there, right then?

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,bluebird
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:54 PM

I was at a song circle in upstate new york and this spooky guy started singing his own song. It was a campfire during a dark night, and a wide ring of maybe 5o others waiting their turn, but it was a moonless night, so no one could see him.He sang a song. Then he asked. Could I sing another. Everyone was too polite to say no. He sang another and another of his self written songs, political in nature and perhaps to not everyone's taste. He was singing his own songs for a half hour before I left.

This guy is famous in his own mind, but in mine, he is the rudest person I've ever had the misfortune to have at a round robin.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:47 PM

There is an unpleasant smell of solipsism emerging.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:41 PM

Worst one I saw was a duo who came to our club. They set up a PA (something we never usualy see) played a few Shadows numbers and then started to dismantle the PA and leave while other singers were still on! Not seen them since I'm glad to say:-)

Best I saw at dealing with an off-key loud accompanist. At a session we ran in a public bar a very enthusiastic but drunken bloke insisted on joining in with a very soft and tender version of an Irish ballad.

"Can you do lot's of stuff from Ireland?" asked the agreived performer.

"Yesh" slurred the drunken man.

"Well, f**k of and do it then..."

:D (tG)

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Barry Finn
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:29 PM

Ah, again. Body language, it doesn't even have to be tasteful body language, sometimes even a gental slap will do......On the back.......On a smallguy.......If you're big guy.

If the jester trying to join in is seated & you're standing (if not stand) while singing walk over & from behind gently (smile now as you sing now) put your hands on their shoulders rub gently, if they don't stop, rub harder if they continue in a friendly gester type of way put one hand over their mouth (do not smother!) & the other hand over their instrument (do not break!). I have no advice if they're standing except maybe to get beside them lift up your foot higher than knee high then stomp your foot into the side of there knee........& keep on singing as if nothing happened.

Thanks Bert, anytime?

Barry

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,I'll neaverrr tell!
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:26 PM

Och! Now ye're ontae me, ye swine! Ye'll be sorrrry. I plan tae show up at yer next singalong wi' ma bagpipes and a steamin' great bowl o' haggis, which I will eat and I will belch and fahrt noisily whilst others are tryin' tae sing!

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Greg B
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:17 PM

"Whit d' ye say when a daft drunken highland Scot comes aroond tae the
singaroond..."

Is anyone else picturing 'Fat Bastard' as both the teller and
the subject?

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:07 PM

Ah, how this takes me back... I've asked people in the audience to stop singing along (out of key) and I've asked others to desist from playing along. If I wanted to hear the penny whistle whilst I was singing, I'd grow another mouth and play it myself.

As for others taking over the song... the best way that I've ever seen that dealt with was to make 'handing over' gestures to the carpetbagger and sit down.

LTS

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 05:03 PM

From my own experience and I think I mentioned this at the beginning of may 06, The session at the endeavour is one to be avoided mainly because the background noise is not in the background.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: kendall
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 04:49 PM

The boorish Scot? I don't believe that story, no one is that stupid!

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,maire-aine
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 04:49 PM

When I learned to play the bodhran, the first thing I was told was "
Don't play on a slow air" and "Don't play on a vocal", although I could play on the chorus if it was a "rouser". I have no problem asking an over-eager bodhraner to quiet down.

Maryanne

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: growler
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 04:37 PM

I was in Whitby six weeks ago. Having enjoyed a splendid meal in the Old Bee Hive, went into the bar to be confronted by an Australian Folk sing asking where he could sing. I am know to be on the loud side, ( hence the Mudcat name ) and my 12 string doesn,t help and our Australian friend sang in a similar volume, after several pints of fine ale, we descided that this was the very place for a 'folk thash.
After about four songs, ( including Shouls of Herring }, the Landlady
asked us to stop as she couldn't here the phone ring.
I'm not sure wether it was rude or practicle

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Bert
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 04:35 PM

Hey Barry, you can play along anytime when I sing.


Another problem with coffe houses is this...

Espresso Machine (Tune: Spinning Wheel ) - (Bert Hansell)


Last Wednesday night at the famous Steel City
It came to my turn to sing a short ditty
In the midst of a song of a maid and her lover
The Espresso machine goes
Shhhh, shuff, shuff, shuff, shweeee shoooooooow shhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

My turn came again, thought I'd try something loud
A song of our flag that would make us all proud
When I got to the part where the flag started wavi-Shew
Shew shew shew shew shew
Shhhh, shuff, shuff, shuff, shweeee shoooooooow shhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Now came my last chance it was almost nine thirty
A song that was funny, perhaps a bit dirty
and right at the part where they all roar with laughter
that blasted machine goes
Shew shew shew shew shew
Shhhh, shuff, shuff, shuff, shweeee shoooooooow shhhhhhhhhhhhhh.


Copyright Bert Hansell, 2004

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Nick
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 03:48 PM

There is an 'interesting' mandolin player locally to where we live and play who turns up at some singarounds sometimes. I have walked out on him and a friend has stopped mid song and asked him to desist. Keeps bouncing back though undaunted. Now he suffers from the delusion that bad off key and off tempo mandolin playing is a bonus to any track.

But it still doesn't approach yesterdays thing.

(Omigod - perhaps it's me attracting them! A bit like Jasper Carrott's thing of always having the nutter on the bus sit next to him)

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: SINSULL
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 03:35 PM

Explains a lot, Don. My Whale Tambourine goes missing every time I play it. Once it was even harpooned. HARUMPH!

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 03:22 PM

One of the coffeehouses where I sang regularly during the early Sixties was a place called Pamir House. The fellow who started it intended it to be a Indian restaurant (Pamir houses were wayside inns on the Silk Road where it passed through the Pamir Mountains), but about two weeks after it opened, a group of Indian exchange students at the University of Washington tried the place and declared the food to be a) less than authentic, and b) the word "swill" figured prominently in their comments. Not to be deterred, the owner deep-sixed the ersatz Indian cuisine, put in a line of snacks and pastries, got an espresso machine, hired several singers, and turned it into a coffeehouse. At that, it was pretty successful.

It was fun singing there because there were usually three or four singers going on any weekend evening. We didn't do sets as such, we just perched on stools up front and swapped songs, complete with banter, as if we were at a party or hoot. The audiences loved the informality and the off-the-cuff quality of it.

Anyway, an occasional audience member seemed to get the idea that it was sort of a free-for-all, apparently not realizing that we hadn't just dropped in, we were regular singers and were getting paid. One guy started coming around regularly with a pair of bongos. [I can't think of a quicker way to commit suicide than to show up at a place like Pamir House with a set of bongos.]   He was tolerated for about three songs, but when he tried to assist me on "Greensleeves" (with my carefully arranged lute-style classic guitar accompaniment), the owner of the place put a word in his ear and confiscated the bongos until he was ready to leave.

It has always amazed me that people who try to play the bongos always have such an iffy sense of rhythm. We don't run into all that many bodhrans around here, but I image a similar problem might occur with them.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 02:53 PM

The best way to handle that kind of rudeness is for all hands to go to the bar, or leave the pub.

Seen that happen once but in a folk club. One floor singer (who was a little pissed) who decided to wind the PA up to full. It was a nice summer evening and someone suggested we should take our drinks outside which we did until he finished his set.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Barry Finn
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 02:29 PM

It's not just a UK thing, sh it happens. That's about the rudest I've ever heard though. To walk away & get a beer Kendall & leave them to ru(i)n the session? You know you'd have to say your 2 cents worth first. More to you Betsy, they'd deserve much worst & gotten it too. I was at my local (50 miles away, ha,ha) session & there was a konga player sitting in & he played just every tune AND song. Now I play only the bodhran & usually play it lightly if there's another one in the session or simply sit it out while they're playing (too many drums ruin the stew) & some times I accompy myself with it while singing. So I started singing, unaccompanied & this konga player starts in & he's not doing a very good job at it either, if he were I might've let it pass. I give him a look but he goes on. After 2 verses I just put my hands on his drum heads & silenced him until after I finished & told him straight out that if I wanted accompanyment I'd have played my drum that was resting on my lap. Never saw him again & was thanked by others for dealing with what's normally a delicate situation. I do ask others to back me up if I want them & they're not already doing it & I don't really mind much if they do back me up & I don't want them to. In general though I find that most have the sensability to know when is the right song & time, when they're left to make the choice on their own. I think it also depends on the singer to take on the responsablity for the song to go be done as they'd like to sing it & to not be railroaded by others. If I sing a song where the song has no call for an instrument & were the voice's timing, phrasing is as important as the story I think it's up to the singer to put that over, either by saying something in the beginning, by using some kind of body language, or just be the way the singer put the song's style over. Really the song should speak for it's self. Most musicians will jell weither or not it's meant for accompanyment.
Barry

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Peace
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 02:21 PM

"The most satisfying way would be to pour a beer over the asshole's head."

I agree, but have to note that Kendall's remark is the best mixed metaphor I have seen in ages.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 02:02 PM

Could I just publicly state that I wasn't in the Endeavour on Tuesday night. It was the Tap & Spile on Saturday night, I think.........

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Bert
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 01:53 PM

It happens a lot in the States. Mostly though it is intended to be helpful. A lot of guitar players don't understand that many folk songs don't have a strict tempo and the tempo is changed for emphasis and to follow the story.

Often it's friends just trying to be nice, so I just put up with it and afterwards politely ask them not to do it again.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 01:50 PM

The vast majority of the songs I sing, I accompany on the guitar. But I have a small repertoire of songs that I sing unaccompanied. It happens all too often at songfests and hoots that when I launch into one of these, someone starts to accompany me, having failed to pick up the obvious clue that I am a perfectly competent guitarist and if I wanted the song to be accompanied, I would accompany it myself, thank you very much.. This has happened often enough that now I have no qualms about stopping and letting the eager accompanist know—politely, but firmly—that I prefer to sing this song without accompaniment, thanks. If Bob Nelson (Deckman) is there and I start an unaccompanied song or ballad and someone even looks like they're going to start, he simply reaches over and puts a hand on their guitar strings, silencing them. Bob is cool.

I recall on one occasion, at an informal gathering during one of the Northwest Folklife Festivals, I was in the middle of a sea chantey when a small group, including a fairly well-known singer from a nearby municipality walked in. He jumped in with his quarterdeck bellow, in a different key and tempo, and simply took over. Basically, I like the guy. He's a good singer and pretty knowledgeable about the songs he sings, but he made it quite plain that he thought I was doing the chantey all wrong. Maybe so, but that still doesn't excuse outright rudeness. He's one of these people who doesn't wear a watch, because he figures that nothing of importance is going to happen until he gets there.

I will never try to accompany anyone singing unaccompanied unless they ask. And if others are playing and I feel impelled to play along, I always keep an eye on the lead singer to be sure it's okay with him or her.   Sometimes, someone has worked out an accompaniment that, in combination with the song, is a sort of stand-alone set piece. In that case, I stay out of it and just enjoy what they're doing.

Common courtesy.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: sciencegeek
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 01:48 PM

Bud lite!!!! ...oh, I thought you meant beer.... snicker. Probably one of the better uses for the stuff.

And as for the boorish Scot... may I suggest that it be passed through the kidney's first. Yeah, bad bad me....

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Janie
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 01:14 PM

Boorish!

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,Geoffrey Curtain
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 01:09 PM

Whit d' ye say when a daft drunken highland Scot comes aroond tae the singaroond wi' his bluidy bagepipes and insists on playin' along wi' every damn song, and that's nae all! The stupid git plays the damn thing off-key.

When his turn tae play comes up he raises bluidy hell if anyone plays along wi' him! He says, "Dinna be playin' over ma song! I cannae tolerate that!"

This particular damn Scot has a personal hygeine problem whit ye would have tae experience tae ken whit it's like. Tae puit nae too fine a point on it, he stinks.

He also makes it a habit tae say, "That song of yours wis absolute rubbish! I hope you dinna play it again tae soon."

If there are any women at the singaroond, married or not, he flirts wi' them ootrageously. He thinks he is a combination of Sean Connery and William Wallace. He says, "I could fancy you...and I'm dead sexy! Want tae take a little stroll wi' me? Ye know ye do..."

When ye play a sad song he sneeringly pantomimes a crooning violin. When ye play a funny song, he yawns and says, "God! When does this one end?" Whey ye play a trad song, he says, "Ye stupid bastard! It's not 'hey, nonny, nonny' in that song. Ye've got it all wrong. Here! Let me show ye how it's done on the bagpipes."

When his turn comes he plays a song that's 25 minutes long. When you're playin' your own songs he keeps frowning and checking his watch. At the conclusion of the evening he says, "Well, that was what I call a piss poor singaroond. I may see ye next week, I may not. If nothin' else at all guid comes up, expect tae see me. Otherwise, not bluidy likely."

And then he does show up on the following week!

Whit d' ye call this kind of behaviour?

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: kendall
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 01:05 PM

I didn't mean GOOD beer, I meant Bud lite.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,maire-aine
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 12:45 PM

I can't claim to be a great singer, but I think I do OK. I try to pick songs that have meaningful lyrics and sing them clearly. I also play guitar, and supply my own accompaniment.

But if I put down my own guitar to sing un-accompanied, nobody else should join in unless I ASK them to. And I only do that with a few people who are top-notch guitarists.

I have no problem with giving a withering look, or holding up my hand. If that doesn't work, I'll escalate to "stop it" if need be.

Sometimes it's hard to get a song started in a session, because others aren't always paying attention to the other side of the circle. If I feel support from the rest of the group, I'll continue.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 12:41 PM

I would have waited until the rude SOBs had finished, thanked them for their accompaniment, then handed each of them a dollar bill (pound note in the UK) while advising them that it was their payment for not accompanying me while I sang the goddammed thing again my way.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 12:19 PM

A bum note indeed!

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Amos
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 12:17 PM

Well, it might be a novelty act, and make your fortune!


A

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Scrump
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 12:06 PM

Hmm, Betsy's suggestion is all very well, but I wouldn't want to be playing an accordion tune with my backside as I walked home afterwards ;-)

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Betsy
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 11:59 AM

Nick ,
The singer should have simply said " Why don't the three of you - shut the F*ck-up you ignorant bastards."
It would work if I or Ossonflags said it - Honest it would.!

Cheers,
Betsy.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Scoville
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 11:54 AM

What a jerk!

The general rule in the circles in which I've played is that whoever picks the song picks the key, tempo, and how long it lasts. We rarely sing so that's less of an issue, but if the person who called the song wants to sing, you do it his/her way or you shut up. You can do it your way when your turn comes.

I only had this happen once, and it wasn't nearly that bad. It was a particularly slow night at the local Irish session so the guy who was sort of leading the jam called me up to play, mic'ed, on my Appalachian dulcimer (which is, of course, not Irish, but the tune he asked me to play was a crowd favorite learned from another session regular, who had left his concertina at home that night but told me I was welcome to play "his" tune. I even play it in "his" key and tempo.) Session "leader" is an excellent bodhran player and played quietly behind me for a bit until one of the flute players decided this would be a good time to teach the guy next to him a completely different tune--on stage, mind you, about three feet away from my left elbow. Bodhran suddenly got a lot louder and "leader" gave the guy a look that would have curdled milk, which got the point across.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 11:50 AM

This seems to be mainly a U.K. problem, judging by the posts.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Scrump
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 11:46 AM

John J wrote: "I was singing unaccompanied in the Tap & Spile on Saturday afternoon. Apart from there being a VERY high ambient noise level, a box player behind me tried to accompany me. This threw me, I just can't sing accompanied. Apart from anything else I find if I want to tweak the pitch / alter the tempo during the song...well I just can't. I'm sure these people mean well but they're really just a damned nuisance."

As a band member as well as a soloist I always try to fit in with the leader on any particular song or tune. If I know it well I will know when the leader is likely to slow down (e.g. at the end of a song) and do likewise. One thing that's good about solo work is that it's up to me to vary the tempo as I feel like, to fit in with the mood of the song (it also helps if I forget the words of a verse, as I can play a little bit more while I rack my brains). At singarounds I will just do the same (i.e. vary the tempo as suits me), and if someone has taken it upon themselves to join me without invitation, it's up to them to keep to my tempo. If they don't it's their problem, not mine. But like I said, it's just a singaround and not to be taken too seriously.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,Bee
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 11:33 AM

Unaccompanied singing is regarded as a bit of a freak show in one small group of musicians that I regularly sing with. I actually prefer some accompaniment, which is one of the reasons I'm learning to play guitar, but this particular group plays mostly old country and western songs, while I am inclined towards folk and ballads. They rarely know the songs I know. I used to try singing a non c&w number with them now and then, but gave up after one time they actually started playing a c&w standard before I'd finished singing. These musicians are my friends!

They will ask me to solo (with accompaniment) various country songs, so they like my voice well enough. But they are diehard c&w -ers; no other genre exists for them.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 11:29 AM

I wasn't even playing when I fell out (permanently so far) with an old friend at a session. Another guy was doing a very sensitive, slow solo on the fiddle. My friend (drop taken) joined in, "improvising" loudly with respect to none of tempo, rhytm nor melodic structure. I asked him to stop, he threw a huge wobbly that ended up with him threatening to hit me. That was over a year ago, I haven't seen him since.

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: John J
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 11:06 AM

I was singing unaccompanied in the Tap & Spile on Saturday afternoon. Apart from there being a VERY high ambient noise level, a box player behind me tried to accompany me. This threw me, I just can't sing accompanied. Apart from anything else I find if I want to tweak the pitch / alter the tempo during the song...well I just can't. I'm sure these people mean well but they're really just a damned nuisance.

Some years ago I was singing unaccompanied at the Railway Folk Club in Lymm, a man with a bodhran started playing along. I had to ask him to stop and in consequence he saw his a*se (big time). It didn't help that he'd had more than enough beer. This guy gave me such a bollocking for not singing 'properly' that a now rarely go to what was a really good club. Sadly the club has changed it's title now and includes more 'pop' stuff than folk song & music.

On a brighter note, the Railway now has a most excellent sing a couple of times a month (Songs in the Snug, second and fourth Wednesday evenings))where a dozen or so singers gather to sing traditional (mainly unaccompanied) folk songs from the British Isles & further afield. Interestingly the change in direction of the Thursday former folk club night has spawned an excellent music session on the same night in a downstairs room of the pub. We often get good audiences!

I'm wandering.

John

Subject: RE: Worst singaround/session rudeness ever?
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 10:47 AM

Nick said,"I suppose the only thing they didn't do was actually play a different song over him so it could have been worse I guess."

No, it couldn't have been worse. Changing the key and tempo... is just as bad as or worse than changing the song.