Folklore: Wearing of Kilts

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 17 Nov 03 - 01:48 PM

A good thick layer of mutton fat works wonders;smells a wee bit, but-----

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: smallpiper
Date: 17 Nov 03 - 10:56 AM

Nah they used to cover themselves with bog myrtle that keeps the little buggers away.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Grab
Date: 17 Nov 03 - 09:30 AM

Re the sub-kilt clothing, Scotland is notorious for its midges. Now either (a) the midges have got more venomous since the kilt stopped being a standard item of clothing, (b) Scots wore underwear back then, or (c) this was a form of Scottish population control by making a man's bits too sore to do anything with!

Graham.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Jim McLean
Date: 17 Nov 03 - 04:17 AM

Yes, Boab, In Paisley where I grew up, they were sometimes just called 'Tartan shawls' but lots of woman used them.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 17 Nov 03 - 12:30 AM

"Guest Normal" ---I'll get my sixty-year old Gordon army kilt an' the big buits on the feet, black knife doon the stockin leg, an meet you any where o' yer choosin'---preferably in public. Ye can ask me for a kiss---an' wait a split second for the reply------
    Any Ayrshire wifie over a certain age [most grannies, I'd say]are familiar with the plaid [pronounced "plide"] in its most common use up to around the mid fifties. Kiddie-carts and prams were mostly given second place to the plaid--wrapped around the youngsters and slung in such a way that the little-uns could be carried around conveniently. Anybody else remember this?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: lady penelope
Date: 16 Nov 03 - 05:31 PM

I love these american kilt sites. The beach kilt even got Parker's attention and he claims to hate kilts ( but he does look great in a skirt......)

I shall repeat myself, more men should wear skirts, they do look good in them!

TTFN Lady P.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Jeri
Date: 16 Nov 03 - 11:06 AM

Oops. The image I tried to link to won't display on its own.
Click here ("view more styles") and click on "Beach Kilt." Clan MacCowabunga tartan.

I don't think kilts are either great looking or horrible. I prefer jeans. You can't get a good glimpse of somebody's bum in a kilt. There are some men who go to the dances at festivals who wear those light-weight brightly-colored rayon or cotton skirts, and I think they can look very nice. You sort of have to get used to seeing bearded, hairly-legged guys in tie-died swirly skirts though.
skirts are a lot airier and cool then trousers, and if you can't dance nude, you might as well decorate yourself outrageously!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 16 Nov 03 - 07:55 AM

A few years ago a gentleman was fined £100 for showing what a true Scot wears under the Kilt!



A young beautiful lady is walking along the road and sees a man in a kilt for the first time. She stops and talks with him about the garment and enquires what is worn beneath. The man says put your hand up and feel for yourself.
She does and and screams "its gruesome" as she quickly withdraws her hand.
"Do it again its grew some more" replies the man

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)
Date: 16 Nov 03 - 05:37 AM

It's a part of our national dress, normal.

Tom Frae saltcoats, even if it is a joke it's not funny.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Normal
Date: 16 Nov 03 - 03:56 AM

Perverted Scotch Skirt wearing Poofs

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Alaska Mike
Date: 16 Nov 03 - 01:56 AM

Jeri, I love it, got to have it, can't live without it. They even made it in my color. Thanks.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Celtaddict
Date: 15 Nov 03 - 07:15 PM

I have long maintained (and every woman I have ever discussed it with agrees) that overall, men look GOOD in kilts. Big men. Small men. Stocky men. Slender men. Kids and white beards. Sexy. Distinguished. Interesting. Bold. Many men who look ordinary (whatever that means; I think it means I would not notice them out of a group or remember them unless I had gotten acquainted) in ordinary contemporary attire, look great in the kilt. A kilt with casual cotton short-sleeve shirt and solid kneesocks with leather shoes is vastly superior to jeans and tee shirt. And full Highland dress is gorgeous; who would ever want to wear a tuxedo, much less a suit?
It delights me that I see kilts worn more and more in situations other than ceremonial occasions in the past few years.

When a friend of mine is asked the inevitable, he answers, "Just a touch of lipstick."

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Micca
Date: 15 Nov 03 - 04:17 PM

Jeri That is TRULY Scary!!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Jeri
Date: 15 Nov 03 - 04:04 PM

Aloha, Mike! You mean a kilt like this one?

Go here. They aren't cheap though!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Micca
Date: 15 Nov 03 - 03:38 PM

Mike the chances of "Good quality kilt " and "made with a bright, colorful, flowery Hawaiian print."occurring in the same universe never mind garment I would reckon as being fairly remote :o)

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Alaska Mike
Date: 15 Nov 03 - 03:33 PM

I would like to find somewhere I can purchase a good quality kilt made with a bright, colorful, flowery Hawaiian print. Can anyone help me out?

Mike

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)
Date: 15 Nov 03 - 05:17 AM

My name is Tom Hamilton and I can wear the Douglas or Hamilton tartan, and being a true scot I don't wear anything underneath my kilt (Not skirt), it's people who are true scots can do this.

PS
I hope France beat England in the semi finals.

Tom frae Saltcoats

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: smallpiper
Date: 15 Nov 03 - 05:04 AM

HuwG - wearing a kilt is a very liberating thing once you get over the initial fear! (and learn how to fend off the curious of both genders - I always find that, in answer to a female asking what I've got on under my kilt, an answer of "probably less than you" raises a few blushes and when a man asks I reply "what would a big strong lad like you want to know that for" I've never to my knowledge had a gay man ask so you can imagine the results!)

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: HuwG
Date: 14 Nov 03 - 09:50 PM

Somewhat belatedly for GUEST, Scabby Doug's purposes, I believe that the quote about the kilt being ideal for bowel disorders and reproduction, occurs in "Bugles and a Tiger", by John Master, part of his autobiography, this one relating his experiences at Sandhurst and as a young officer in the Indian Army before World War II.

GUEST, Obie is probably right about the highlanders' "battle dress". A well known quote runs, "The highlander's first act in battle is to pull forward his bonnet over the eyes with an emphatic 'scrug', his second, to cast off or throw back his plaid ..." Presumably, merely throwing back the plaid would free the wearer's sword arm from encumbrance. Casting off the plaid would free the wearer from er, all restraints.


My father, whose first name is Lindsay, believes that he is entitled to wear Lindsay tartan, and therefore so am I. However, I don't think I will go further than the tie which he and my mother sent me for Christmas some years ago.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Snuffy
Date: 14 Nov 03 - 07:53 PM

Jockstrap?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: smallpiper
Date: 14 Nov 03 - 05:36 PM

I'm having a plain kilt made - due to not being scottish and a modern kind of fella - I'm all for going commando when wearing a kilt as its to damm hot on the old gonads otherwise.

As for the wodcuts and boxers I think they may have been added for delicate sensibilities.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: lady penelope
Date: 14 Nov 03 - 05:30 PM

The plaid is any piece of heavy woven cloth. Unlike today, they used to weave the cloth to either the maximum length they go get to or to the size they wanted.

Heavy material was rarely cut as it lasted longer that way. ( If you've ever had a go at weaving you'd understand how long it takes to make cloth.....)

Plaids were used for all sorts of articles of clothing, cloaks, shawls, bedding. The 'ben kilt' or great kilt was a kind of utility piece of clothing. It was worn however the wearer found it comfortable.

The most common way recorded was to lay the material on the ground and put in several pleats lengthways to gather the slack. Then the wearer lay along the pleats and folded the fabric across. A belt could then be slid underneath and then tied at the front. The remaining fabric hanging from the back was then worn like a cloak or brought over one shoulder and tucked in the belt to hold it in place.

The ben kilt was also used to roll up in to go to sleep. And probably anything else they could think of.

The tarten is definitely the pattern and not the fabric. Tartens came in all sorts of colours and were not affiliated to certain clans ( except by the fact that so and so had made 40 yards of the same pattern and every one from the chief to the latest bairn was wearing it ) until after the clearences, when it became almost a point of honour. The Victorians waded in with muted versions ( have you seen the Crawfor and Ogilvey tartens, talk about retina burning ) for the delicate sensibilities of the times and these were named 'Hunting' for the taylors who instigated them.

Frankly, wear what you like! It's nice if you pick an identafiable tarten to know something about it, but other than that go for it.

More men should wear skirts!

TTFN Lady P.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Dramatist
Date: 14 Nov 03 - 04:47 PM

I am a full-time wheelchair user and find a kilt a wonderful substitute for formal wear. (I am a Fraser, by the way). I wear dress Fraser wiht formal evening wear and Hunting Fraser with a tweed jacket for less formal occasions.

There are many designs you can wear without offending anyone. The new 'Flower of Scotland' is very nice or you can pick a Scottish Football Team to support and wear their tartan - all Scottish Premier Clubs have one. (Perhaps best to avoid Celtic/Rangers if you are going to wear it in Glasgow or Hibs/Hearts if you are going to Edinburgh but for a night in Whitby you should be OK!

Jonathan.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 14 Nov 03 - 04:43 PM

Back to the original question, if you can't track down a family tartan you can always sport Northumbrian tartan as Whitby was part of the ancient kingdom of Northumbria. It's black and white and sometimes called shepherd's tartan and it said to be far older than any of the more colourful clan tartans.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Gareth
Date: 14 Nov 03 - 04:13 PM

Or died laughing ! Actually a Scot aquaintaence once told that the advantage of a kilt and no underwear meant the sheep werent scared by the noise of a zip !!

Gareth

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Obie
Date: 13 Nov 03 - 05:56 PM

During battle the kilt was cast aside and men fought nekkid . the enemy usually fled or died from fright.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Jim McLean
Date: 13 Nov 03 - 01:21 PM

A long shirt with a safety pin joining the tail to the front, was very common in my day and a reminder for guest Garydon, plaid is a blanket not another name for tartan.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 13 Nov 03 - 01:07 PM

I just did a search through some SCA archives - and they do calim to have period woodcuts of kilts being blown in the wind exposing boxer like garments under the kilt. I cannot locate the SOURCE of the woodcuts - nor can I find the reference where I read that the tails of the shirts were wrapped between the legs and belted around the waist (Whcihc would be an alternative "underwear"

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 13 Nov 03 - 12:43 PM

if they rode horses I bet they wore something! Horsehair HURTS!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: CET
Date: 13 Nov 03 - 12:36 PM

I would like an authoritative opinion about not wearing underwear under the kilt. I know that's the ironclad rule for Highland regiments, but I have doubts about its authenticity. The pre-industrial highlanders didn't wear underwear for the simple reason that nobody did. They simply wore a long shirt. I suspect that if underwear had been available, they would have worn it. Comments?

Edmund

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Garydon
Date: 13 Nov 03 - 12:12 PM

My vote is for the MacDougall plaid. I being Gary McDowell of the MacDougall clan do support that decision. Further, may I suggest Onan Scotch from the home of the MacDougall's if you feel the dram will make the man. However, its not the dram, it is the man. I say always go the way you were born. With pride and honour.

Conquer or Die.


Gary®

Subject: RE: Folklore: Wearing of Kilts
From: Urbane Guerrilla
Date: 13 Nov 03 - 10:31 AM

Hoch aye -- the little kilt (the philibeg) runs about eight yards of fabric for an adult wearer. The great kilt, or belted plaid, is rather shorter at six yards of full-width tartan -- and is quite voluminous enough at six yards. It's the only tablecloth-cum-bedroll a man can wear all day and look good in, and throw over his head in the case of a sudden shower! The ends of the thing after you've pinned the front and back together with that big brooch, once tucked into the belt, make pockets as numerous as they are voluminous. The oddest thing I've ever carried there was a kitten. Kiltwearers also end up appreciating what the womenfolks go through -- they speedily learn the one-handed skirt-sweep as they go to sit on chilly metal folding chairs.

Women DO pay attention to you in a kilt. I think it gives them lubricious thoughts, speculating on "What would happen if I put my hand right... there?" Beyond the usual quip about "There's naething worn under the kilt, lass; it's a' in perfect working order..."

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Lood MacLood
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 01:46 PM

For years, I've been wearing a MacLeod tartan only to find out that my family is actually MacGregor( my apoloogies to all the Gregorachs out there). I've also seen advertised in a catalog to those unfamiliar as The Scottish Lion a tartan called Jaobitewhich, I have to say, is rather stylish(being theprudent Scottish expression for LOUD).

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:52 AM

this is a little crossover from the thread on the Christmas Truce of 1914, but appropriate here, and acoount of the spontaneous football (that's soccer to Americans) match that occurred the first day,

"Us Germans really roared when a gust of wind revealed that the Scots wore no drawers under their kilts - and hooted and whistled every time they caught an impudent glimpse of one posterior belonging to one of "yesterday's enemies." But after an hour's play, when our Commanding Officer heard about it, he sent an order that we must put a stop to it. A little later we drifted back to our trenches and the fraternisation ended. "

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: MMario
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:31 AM

it's possible that usage has changed since the book was published - (it was from the 1800's I remember - pre 1890 at least because I remember it was older then my grandfather)

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Scabby Doug
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:18 AM

"Join a Highland regiment, me boy. The kilt is an unrivalled garment for fornication and diarrhoea."

Can't remember whose quote this was, but it's so true...

Cheers

Steven

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: Peg
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 08:56 AM

My friend David has an authentic kilt and he puts it on that old-fashioned way, by laying it down and rolling in it then adjusting it. He is very good looking and has a great body so when he does this at camp every year we all love to watch!

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: gnu
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 06:23 AM

Boab... 8 yards of broadcloth was a kilt worn by the Highlanders of Scottei.

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: Mr Happy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 06:01 AM

Come where the hands are clapping
Come where the toes are tapping
Come where the jocks are strapping
Down in the glen

Land of inclement weather
Land of the prickly heather
So keep your knees together
Scotland the brave!

8-)

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: smallpiper
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 04:23 AM

Just let it all hang out !!!

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 03:28 AM

Dave---the plaid was part and parcel of the original "kilt". The garment was , they say, donned by laying out the [ 7 yards?] of material on the ground, lying down on it and rolling over two or three times, standing up and throwing the unused length over the shoulder---that final action creating the "forerunner' of the Plaid. As to the "anything underneath" blathers, if ye fancy wearin' something to cover your equipment, go ahead! Ive worn a kilt, on and off [pun time!] for over fifty years, and the handy garment has been used as a kilt [!] a cold-weather cycling cape, a pillow and a handy "courting groundsheet". An' if oney o' youse bare-bummed zealots expect me tae sit up on a stage facin' an audience playin' a squeezebox an' tryin' tae keep ma knees thigither at the same time ye've anither think comin'!

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 01:53 AM

Hey Big Mick, I'll wear my kilt this weekend at the Michigan irish Festival if you'll wear yours!

Seamus

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: katlaughing
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 12:40 AM

Yeah, Peg! Wait 'til you see the hunk who comes in later!

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: GUEST,Keevan6
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 12:10 AM

ok......"goin Commando" is the same thing as "regimental" meanin "no undies" i.e. no boxers, briefs, boxer-briefs, panties, panty-hose, or whatever yur furry little minds can come up with.

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: Peg
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 11:51 PM

kat; it is just starting here now from the beginning and I eat that stuff up like it's home-baked cookies. Funny how all these remote Celtic places have suhc attractive interesting people in them ain't it?

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: katlaughing
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 10:47 PM

Ah, that show was on BBC-America last year, Peg. Great show and the second season starts this month! And, I agree about the sexy part.

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: Peg
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 09:40 PM

There is nothing sexier than a man in a kilt! Ask the lass that has seen her share of men of all shapes, sizes, ages and shades of handsomeness in them...mind you, you need to make sure you have appropriate footwear! Not necesarily "proper" but appropriate...the fancy woolen socks and mocs are fine, but black combat boots look nice too. Just no boat shoes or sneakers!

There is something very manly about them; maybe because many of the men you see wearing them are Scots! And of course one needs to be secure in one's manhood to feel comfortable in one and you know what they say about self-confidence...

Those utili-kilts are growing quite popular among my male and female camping compadres...

There is a new show on PBS on weekends now called Monarch of the Glen; at least one dishy young man goes about in a kilt (he's a hired hand at a big Scottish estate). Yummy.

peg

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: The Walrus
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 07:31 PM

MMario,

Officers of the British Army, certainly at the begining of the 20th century, wore a "frock" (an unlined and unstructured jacket) in "tartan", these frocks were either scarlet or blue (depending on the arm of service), but were solid coloured and not patterned. I maintain that "tartan" is the cloth (Dress regulations refer to the pattern worn by The "Black Watch" as "Government sett" or "Government pattern" not "Government tartan").

Walrus

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 04:44 PM

And a plaid ("played") is a garment.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of Kilts
From: MMario
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 01:54 PM

If I recall correctly the Sett is actually the pattern that would PRODUCE the tartan; at least that is how it was described in the (very old) book I practically hand copied 30 years ago. the tartan is the pattern itself when woven; (but not the cloth. tartan would be the pattern ON the cloth.)