DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 11 Aug 14 - 01:07 PM

MGM Lion, do you want to volunteer to do it?

A thankless job that takes large chunks of time (corrections must be checked for accuracy, etc.).
I wouldn't want to do it, and I don't think you will do it, either.

Many of the songs in the DT were taken from threads and are versions from various singers selected by the poster.

I don't believe that "definiteness" was considered; that would require researching each one.

I raised the question a while back, but I have since realized the magnitude of the problem.
I don't like some of the DT entries either.
Just make sure that your version of the one true lyric is in a thread.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Aug 14 - 01:35 PM

I might if I were a bit younger, Q. But your remark about it not happening 'in my lifetime' was not so much of a hyperbole, as I am now 82; so I just don't have that much energy any more. Still; I take your point.   

Even so: seriously; if an attribution is posted here that is missing from the DT entry, or a single error drawn to attention, would it be so onerous to emend that one page? I ask, genuinely, for information; without checking every single DT entry from cold, surely a page can be opened and emended as a fairly brief task. How long can it take to do one? Can't be that difficult of access, surely?

≈M≈

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 11 Aug 14 - 02:53 PM

Talk to Joe when he gets back.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 11 Aug 14 - 04:41 PM

The Clifton tune is nothing like the Folk Scene tune. Is the midi not available on the Harry Clifton thread? I thought Artful did all the midis.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Joe, at the Women's Center
Date: 11 Aug 14 - 06:33 PM

I'm here every day, but a little bit less because I've been part of the jury on a three-week trial.

I'll clean this thread up sometime this week, so the information will be ready for Susan of DT to harvest for the next edition of the Digital Tradition (we haven't had a new edition for a couple years or more).

This thread is NOT for discussion - it is for brief, factual submissions of changes to the Digital Tradition. Discussion and all that other stuff should be in the thread on the song. When stuff is posted here, it should contain only the changes, plus a link back to the discussion thread for documentation.

Don't post something here if you can't document it.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: OldPossum
Date: 30 Sep 14 - 02:08 PM

Death Come Easy, filename[ DEATHEZ, was written by Harvey Andrews.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 30 Sep 14 - 03:38 PM

Death Comes Easy- See "Index of Harvey Andrews' Songs" which will verify that he is the composer.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 16 Oct 14 - 01:53 AM

Three Ravens - filename[ THRERAVN
"Their lies a knight slain under his shield," in the second verse, really makes me cringe.

---

Hey, Good Lookin' appears twice in the database:

• Filename[ GOODLOKN
• Filename[ HEYGDLKN

Both are good transcriptions, but I think [ HEYGDLKN is slightly better. at (*tooken), I'd add [took in??]

Note in this thread, there are similar lyrics to a Cole Porter song of the same title. Different melody, though.

---

LADY ALL SKIN AND BONES - filename[ SKINBONE - appears twice in the online database, but with the same filename. The lyrics seem identical, but one entry has a tune file connected to it.
http://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=8819
http://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=10191

---

Night Rider's Lament, filename[ WHYRIDE - lyrics we have are truncated and make no sense. Correct lyrics are in this message.

---

San Antonio Rose, filename[ SANANTON - our text twice mentions a "moonlit pass" - that's a "moonlit path" - the Alamo is on flatland, no passes nearby - verified with Bob Wills recording.

---

Lani Herrmannn says her Pickle Carol filename[ PICKCARL - is actually titled "The Pickle Tree Carol," and she thanks you for getting the lyrics mostly right.

---

The Red Flag filename[ REDFLAG - songwriter is Jim Connell

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Feb 15 - 03:04 AM

Our lyrics for Cindy Kallet's "Wings to Fly" are way off. See correction here: /detail.cfm?messages__Message_ID=3690373
filename[ WINGSFLY

---

Several corrections to the lyrics of The Jeannie C. (Stan Rogers) here (click).
filename[ JEANNIEC

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OFF TO THE SUGARBUSH AGAIN (Bill Cameron & Gary Glover)
appears twice:

filename[ SUGRBUSH - http://www.mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=10223

filename[ SUGRBUSH - http://www.mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=8577

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Jun 15 - 12:08 PM

Please see my post on the 'Funny Songs With Colours In Titles' thread, re errors in DT notes on The Brown & Yellow Ale -- mistakenly given under title, from an error of hearing by an American singer once, as Brown & Yellow Earl [sic].

This error should be emended.

≈M≈

---

I think you are correct, Mike. We have two songs:

• The Brown and the Yellow Ale
• The Brown and Yellow Earl - which is the version by my neighbor and former boss, former topless folksinger Debby McClatchy. Apparently, she has acknowledged the error in recent years. We probably should add explanation or drop Debby's version.

See this thread

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 17 Dec 15 - 03:03 PM

Coventry Carol, filename[ COVCAROL - first line of the fourth verse is Then woe is me, poor child for thee

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Dec 15 - 01:38 AM

Re Joe's note on my 11 jun 15 post, 2 above:-

Had never heard before that Debby McClatchy had introduced a topless element into folk performances.

Goody for her!

≈M≈

---

Yup. Her mom used to make her costumes, such as they were...
-Joe-

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 23 Jan 17 - 02:35 AM

"My Dame Had a Lame Tame Crane" appears twice:

Lame Tame Crane - filename[ LAMETAME

My Dame Had a Lame Tame Crane (round) - filename[ LAMECRN

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Susan of DT
Date: 23 Jan 17 - 06:09 AM

We have had no way to make corrections for a while, so I hav enot been watching this thread. Max is working on it.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Jul 17 - 02:22 AM

"No More, My Lord" appears in three near-identical iterations in the Digital Tradition:

• filename[ NOMYLORD
• filename[ MOMORLRD
• filename[ NOMOLORD

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Nov 17 - 05:18 PM

Note "The Buckskin Bag of Gold" [filename[ BUCKBAG] corrections are in this message: https://mudcat.org/detail.cfm?messages__Message_ID=3886453. There's a rest missing in the melody at the end of each verse, and there are three words to be corrected.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 08 Jun 18 - 01:18 AM

Please note that the songwriter name for Dancing at Whitsun is mixed up. The songwriter is Austin John Marshall. Filename [ DNCWHIT

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 19 Jul 20 - 07:06 AM

Some small corrections to Do You Think That I Do Not Know

1st stanza, line 7 "haunting" should be "halting"

2nd stanza, line 6 "dancer" should be "dancers" (and there shouldn't be an apostrophe after "row")

3rd stanza, line 3 "quavering" should be "quivering"

5th stanza, line 2 "scene was" should be "scenes were"; line 6 "She'll" should be "Shall"

My source is Poetical Works of Henry Lawson. There are a couple of other differences that are too small to mention.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Felipa
Date: 08 May 22 - 10:52 PM

GRACE the lyrics are in the Digital Tradition
https://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=2379 but the DT is lacking attribution to authors Frank and Seán Ó Meara

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Susan of DT
Date: 09 May 22 - 02:37 PM

It has not been possible to correct the DT for many, many years.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Felipa
Date: 09 May 22 - 02:45 PM

Susan, I was thinking this discussion thread could be used as a repository of attribution and minor corrections; even though the DT is not changed, people could check here for information.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Felipa
Date: 14 May 22 - 05:41 PM

The Orange and the Green https://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=4523 is lacking attribution to Anthony Murphy for the words.

I think the transcription given by Joe Offer in the discussion thread https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=80905 is better than that given in the DT/
Surely "Oh, my father was an Ulster man" (or even My father was an Englishman") for the first words fit the rest of the verse better than "Once there was an Irishman". As Tony Murphy was a Merseyside resident, perhaps he did write "My mother was a Catholic, from Kelsey town came she" I don't know; I would suggest "from Keady town came she", and Joe Offer wrote "from County Cork came she," as he heard that in recordings. A mother from Keady (in N Ireland) goes well with with the father and Englishman, while Cork goes better as a contrast with the father an Ulsterman. Does anyone know what Tony Murphy actually wrote, or if he perhaps had more than one version? In any case, he does deserve credit as author of the lyrics.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 14 May 22 - 08:26 PM

The lyrics I posted to The Orange and the Green in a more recent thread came from another website, but also have the Ulsterman, and Co Cork, which would be much more recognisable than Keady or Kelsey. The lyrics I use match Joe’s, and are also as sung by Paddy Reilly. There are a number of other lyrics websites that also use Ulsterman and County Cork.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 May 22 - 11:09 PM

The most recent full update of the Digital Tradition was 2002, and we have not been able to develop a system for updating the DT that was agreeable to all parties involved. I have been developing "origins" and DTStudy threads on new songs and all songs in the DT that require research, discussion, or correction. If you have corrections, they are best posted in the "origins" threads.

• Origins index (for trad songs): https://mudcat.org/songorigins.cfm
  
• Musicians index (by songwriter name): https://mudcat.org/songorigins.cfm

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Susanne (skw)
Date: 19 May 22 - 07:18 PM

I wish the DT could be transferred to a Wiki. It would make adding to and correcting so much easier, though I see the difficulties.

Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 May 22 - 11:40 PM

Hi, Susanne - how would a Wiki be superior to our Forum threads? We are updating and correcting the Digital Tradition in our Origins threads. Where would we get the software for a Wiki, and how would it be better?

-Joe-